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Ending Rape On Campus[W 228]

Hard Truth said:
This post is an example of one of the major causes of the problem-the double standard and slut shaming.
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:thinking There is no double standard ... I and all men I know readily admit each are as 'slutty' as any woman could ever achieve.... I might suggest 'slutty-er' than any woman but that might sound as if I am a sexist promoting male superiority of accomplishment over equality.

It's a strange life, indeed

Thom Paine
 
Phys251 said:
You are a woman, right?
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Not that it's any of your business, but yes I am. An adult woman who KNOWS that I could not be coerced into sex unless there was some degree of force/threat involved.
 
Re: Ending Rape On Campus

opendebate said:
You are implying that you have a "right" to sex once someone has done it with you. You never have a "right" to sex. If only one person consents, it doesn't matter how many times you've done it already, it's rape.
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I quite agree. At what point does she have a responsibility to end a relationship that includes coercion?:peace
 
Phys251 said:
Ahh, finally some additional voices of reason are starting to show up and call out the blatant misogyny on this thread.
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There has been no misogony on this thread but blatent masandry abounds.
 
Re: Ending Rape On Campus

Jack Hays said:
Been married 45 years, thank you. And no, I did not condone rape, so knock off the phony PC police routine. Once is certainly rape. Twice might be rape. If she stays in the relationship after that she really can't claim that.:peace
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Hey, you should offer that as a defense against the next school shooting. One kid? Yeah, that was murder. The second one? Maybe. If the kids didn't get out of the school after they heard the first shots fired, then they weren't really murdered, they were asking for it.
 
ChrisL said:
Not that it's any of your business, but yes I am. An adult woman who KNOWS that I could not be coerced into sex unless there was some degree of force/threat involved.
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How do I know if you're a woman? Because you say so? Because of your gender icon?
 
Re: Ending Rape On Campus

Phys251 said:
Hey, you should offer that as a defense against the next school shooting. One kid? Yeah, that was murder. The second one? Maybe. If the kids didn't get out of the school after they heard the first shots fired, then they weren't really murdered, they were asking for it.
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False analogy. Juvenile, actually.

An adult takes responsibility for his/her choices.:peace
 
To be clear, because the typical tactic is to try to villanize those who disagree with a lot of "posters" here, I want to say that I have nothing but sympathy for any rape victims. One of my best friends was sexually molested when she was only 12 years old by her mother's boyfriend, and I have been her shoulder and her ear for YEARS.

I also feel for those who are involved in an abusive relationship and can't find the confidence and support to escape. It's sad that some people are able to take advantage of other people in that way and it's sad that they would do that to another person, but that is not "rape." If she was not held down or forced in some manner after saying no, beaten in some manner or threatened in some way, then she did willingly consent to have sex with the person. Maybe it's not what she really wanted to do, but that doesn't change the fact that she did it, and it doesn't make the other person a "rapist" either.
 
opendebate said:
My point is, you don't know the details of what she is calling psychological and physical coercion. So why dismiss her claims so easily?
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Because she ( and others here ) are pursueing an agenda and that agenda is based partly on believing any such accusations without credible details.

The fact is her accusation is serious but her support for the accusation is not.
 
Soupnazi630 said:
There has been no misogony on this thread but blatent masandry abounds.
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Phys251 said:
How do I know if you're a woman? Because you say so? Because of your gender icon?
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Hey, just because you have no valid argument, don't try to make this personal. Stick with the topic, and it is NOT me.
 
instagramsci said:
The article stated that she was psychologically and physically coerced.

Abusive people, such as the mentioned boyfriend, are masters of emotional manipulation. They use threats of violence, abandonment, etc to coerce people into sex.

As for physical, he could have made it so she couldn't say no. Sometimes its really not as easy to say no.
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Perhaps you can share your sources. if we are reading fromt he same article there is no way you can even BEGIN to make the claim about "abusive people, such as her boyfriend."

Theres a whole lot of projecting going on...
 
Phys251 said:
Why would she want to reveal that when she knows she would have to deal with attitudes like yours?
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you mean an attitude asking her to explain her seemingly contradictory words? That isn't an unreasonable level of scrutiny
 
Moderator's Warning:
Last time: no more personal attacks, no more baiting.
 
Phys251 said:
You are out of your mind if you think I am going to divulge ANY info about that. You have not established any credibility, let alone trust, on the matter of rape and sexual assault.
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nothing requires you to divulge anyone's personal details while giving a general account of it ...
 
Well, since no one can come up with a form of "physical coercion" that doesn't involve holding a person down, threatening a person, drugging a person, or violence, then the only kind of physical coercion I can think of would be sexual touching.

Now, there is a segment of feminists out there who DO believe that once they say "no" that word is final and if a man so much as lays a HAND on her after that, she might consider that rape or attempted rape. THAT is a very extremist and rigid point of view though IMO, and I personally don't consider trying to coax your girlfriend into having sex as rape at all.
 
Goshin said:
Sure, people get their **** confused... in the immediate aftermath of a traumatic incident.

This is, apparently, YEARS later, and she's saying something that doesn't make sense to me.
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Again, it depends on where you are in the recovery process, and that's not something you can put on a schedule. People recover from trauma in their own way at their own pace, with as little or as much help as they can tolerate. It's not so cut and dried.

Goshin said:
I was wondering if anybody could explain it. Apparently the answer to that is no.
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That's why I've been looking for details -- not so much because it's a confusing story but because it's light on information. Also, it might be a good idea to keep in mind that the portion of her story we're most hotly contesting wasn't a direct quote, maybe that's the ultimate source of the misunderstanding.
 
ChrisL said:
Well, since no one can come up with a form of "physical coercion" that doesn't involve holding a person down, threatening a person, drugging a person, or violence, then the only kind of physical coercion I can think of would be sexual touching.

Now, there is a segment of feminists out there who DO believe that once they say "no" that word is final and if a man so much as lays a HAND on her after that, she might consider that rape or attempted rape. THAT is a very extremist and rigid point of view though IMO, and I personally don't consider trying to coax your girlfriend into having sex as rape at all.
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You are correct. That same segment would consider reasonable positions such as yours to be that of a rape apologist.

I have yet to hear of a court case in the last 50 years where rape was defended in such a fashion as claiming the victim inticed the criminal or did not resist enough. On the other hand many people raise very reasonable considerations and criticisms as you are doing here and of course you are called an apologist.
 
Thom Paine said:
:thinking There is no double standard ... I and all men I know readily admit each are as 'slutty' as any woman could ever achieve.... I might suggest 'slutty-er' than any woman but that might sound as if I am a sexist promoting male superiority of accomplishment over equality.

It's a strange life, indeed

Thom Paine
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I don't recall a nation wide campaign to label a particular man as a slut or making fun of his appearance because he advocated for more access to contraceptives.
 
TacticalEvilDan said:
That's why I've been looking for details -- not so much because it's a confusing story but because it's light on information.
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there seems to be absolutely none.
 
Hard Truth said:
I don't recall a nation wide campaign to label a particular man as a slut or making fun of his appearance because he advocated for more access to contraceptives.
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Where is the nation wide campaign to label a woman a slut in this fashion?

I have heard individuals call women sluts for whatever reason but never a nationwide campaign.
 
Dr. Chuckles said:
there seems to be absolutely none.
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I've been puzzled by that. Maybe it's because she filed a complaint with the university rather than following-through with the police, for all I know that means the record of the investigation isn't available to the public.
 
Re: Ending Rape On Campus

Jack Hays said:
I quite agree. At what point does she have a responsibility to end a relationship that includes coercion?:peace
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She has a responsibility to herself but it stops there and in noway negates the greater responsibility of the person imposing himself on her.
 
Soupnazi630 said:
Because she ( and others here ) are pursueing an agenda and that agenda is based partly on believing any such accusations without credible details.

The fact is her accusation is serious but her support for the accusation is not.
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Yes her accusation is serious and again, you and others (including myself) may not currently have enough details to determine if it was in fact rape but neither do we have enough details to determine that it wasn't. It's like any other case. You keep an open mind until you have enough details to take a position that is informed by facts rather then your own preconceived ideas about the accused OR the accuser.
 
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