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Teens in Asia dominate global test; US stagnant

trfjr

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WASHINGTON (AP) — Teens from Asian nations dominated a global exam given to 15-year-olds, while U.S. students showed little improvement and failed to reach the top 20 in math, science or reading, according to test results released Tuesday.

American students scored below the international average in math and about average in science and reading
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Teens in Asia dominate global test; US stagnant

And we spend more per child on education then any other country. in 2011 we spent $7,743 per child two times as much as the Asian countries do
U.S. Education Spending & Student Performance vs. The World Infographic | MAT@USC | USC Rossier Online

so I don't want to hear any solutions that is about wasting more money on a broken system

First and for most we need to get rid of the teachers unions they are more concerned about stuffing their pockets then educating our children

second we need to pay teachers based on performance and not on tenure like they do every where else in the private sector

third we need to implement school choice let the schools compete for students and when there is competition there is improvement
 
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Teens in Asia dominate global test; US stagnant

And we spend more per child on education then any other country. in 2011 we spent $7,743 per child two times as much as the Asian countries do
U.S. Education Spending & Student Performance vs. The World Infographic | MAT@USC | USC Rossier Online

so I don't want to hear any solutions that is about wasting more money on a broken system

First and for most we need to get rid of the teachers unions they are more concerned about stuffing their pockets then educating our children

second we need to pay teachers based on performance and not on tenure like they do every where else in the private sector

third we need to implement school choice let the schools compete for students and when there is competition there is improvement

So, if we pick the schools and filter out the underachievers, like China does, we will be #1! ;)
 
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Teens in Asia dominate global test; US stagnant

And we spend more per child on education then any other country. in 2011 we spent $7,743 per child two times as much as the Asian countries do
U.S. Education Spending & Student Performance vs. The World Infographic | MAT@USC | USC Rossier Online

so I don't want to hear any solutions that is about wasting more money on a broken system

First and for most we need to get rid of the teachers unions they are more concerned about stuffing their pockets then educating our children

second we need to pay teachers based on performance and not on tenure like they do every where else in the private sector

third we need to implement school choice let the schools compete for students and when there is competition there is improvement

It's been my observation that these "international" tests are rather meaningless in terms of what is needed by those who haven't met the grade. As the article points out, Shanghai's results are absurd to point of being meaningless.

However, one thing is very certain, families in most Asian countries make education a prime objective for their children, a concept far removed in the average US family. No amount of money will every overcome that deficit.
 
It's been my observation that these "international" tests are rather meaningless in terms of what is needed by those who haven't met the grade. As the article points out, Shanghai's results are absurd to point of being meaningless.

However, one thing is very certain, families in most Asian countries make education a prime objective for their children, a concept far removed in the average US family. No amount of money will every overcome that deficit.

as long as we have a dependent culture we wont. as long as an education is not a requirement to exist. not a requirement for food clothes and shelter some don't seam to see a need. hunger or the threat of going hungry is one of the biggest motivating factors in life if you take that threat away you take away motivation in many
 
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So, if we pick the schools and filter out the underachievers, like China does, we will be #1! ;)
:roll:
so what excuses are you going to give for the other 20 plus countries ahead of us
 
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:roll:
so what excuses are you going to give for they other 20 plus countries ahead of us

None. Do these other countries put up with gangs, drugs and all of the other nonsense that we permit in our schools? How much do they spend on having a special police force simply to maintain order in their schools?
 
as long as we have a dependent culture we wont. as long as an education is not a requirement to exist. not a requirement for food clothes and shelter some don't seam to see a need. hunger or the threat of going hungry is one of the biggest motivating factors in life if you take that threat away you take away motivation in many

Exactly. For example, here in Southern California, the Los Angeles Unified School District is so desperate to remove the impediment of parents in the "education" of the children, they provide year round meals, 7 days a week to students throughout the district.

Here is an article from a local newspaper outlining the program.


Free Food for Kids and Teens During the Summer

The school year is over, but that doesn't mean children and teens should go hungry if they don't have food at home.

The Los Angeles Unified School District (LAUSD), under its after-school program "Beyond the Bell," began offering a free breakfast and lunch program this week to all kids ages 1 to 18, regardless if they are LAUSD students or not.

"Many of our students, who rely on school breakfast and lunch during the school year, cannot maintain that energy during the summer if they do not receive the proper nutrition. That's where we come in, by providing nutritious meals to keep kids nourished and healthy during the long summer months," said LAUSD Food Services Director David Binkle.

More than 100 district schools offer the summer meal services program, which runs until Aug. 1. Among them are Arminta Elementary in North Hollywood, Broadous Elementary in Pacoima, Canoga Park Elementary in Canoga Park, O'Melveny and San Fernando Elementary in San Fernando, Van Nuys Middle School, Sun Valley Middle School and Sylmar High School.​

Gee, parents don't even have to worry about feeding their children any more. Add in the clothes program, and what the heck, parents are only needed to provide the DNA for future minions of the Progressive Machine. Well, in fairness, they are also needed as a means to coodinate state provided shelter for the future minions as well.
 
None. Do these other countries put up with gangs, drugs and all of the other nonsense that we permit in our schools? How much do they spend on having a special police force simply to maintain order in their schools?

In fact, the kids from the schools you refer know almost nothing. They're "graduating" at about a 4th-grade level. And yet, we throw as much or more money at those schools as anywhere else.

Where Asia is superior is in their overall parenting, not their schools. There's a huge swath of kids in America that don't get five minutes of real parenting or discipline at home.
 
Gee, parents don't even have to worry about feeding their children any more. Add in the clothes program, and what the heck, parents are only needed to provide the DNA for future minions of the Progressive Machine. Well, in fairness, they are also needed as a means to coodinate state provided shelter for the future minions as well.

Wow. So, our schools have become little more than day care centers. No surprise that our collective educational level and scholastic success rates are declining. I think I'm glad I won't be around in 50 years to see what we have become.
 
Wow. So, our schools have become little more than day care centers. No surprise that our collective educational level and scholastic success rates are declining. I think I'm glad I won't be around in 50 years to see what we have become.

Yes, it would seem the plan here in the land of the Progressive Machine, is that schools are the family, and parents are just in the way.

When one considers the union manpower required to fulfill all the programs the "rich" are required to pay for, the plan becomes quite clear.

What we hear, is despite spending more per student than just about any school district in the country, including D.C., the answer to the almost 50% drop out rate is, surprise, more spending.
 
In fact, the kids from the schools you refer know almost nothing. They're "graduating" at about a 4th-grade level. And yet, we throw as much or more money at those schools as anywhere else.

Where Asia is superior is in their overall parenting, not their schools. There's a huge swath of kids in America that don't get five minutes of real parenting or discipline at home.

This discipline problem is not limited to just a few schools. It only takes 3 or 4 morons to disrupt the entire class and with our "rights" it is difficult to expel anyone, short of a felony. If a school district naturally lacks these morons then they are often bused in, making it even harder to "target" them. We must maintain "diversity" at all costs.

Student diversity through busing: Not as easy as it sounded - CSMonitor.com
 
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Teens in Asia dominate global test; US stagnant

And we spend more per child on education then any other country. in 2011 we spent $7,743 per child two times as much as the Asian countries do
U.S. Education Spending & Student Performance vs. The World Infographic | MAT@USC | USC Rossier Online

so I don't want to hear any solutions that is about wasting more money on a broken system

First and for most we need to get rid of the teachers unions they are more concerned about stuffing their pockets then educating our children

second we need to pay teachers based on performance and not on tenure like they do every where else in the private sector

third we need to implement school choice let the schools compete for students and when there is competition there is improvement

I don't know all about that. But I do know we have dumbed down our curriculum. I graduated from High School in the very early 60's and I found out once my youngest daughter went to college, much of what she was learning in the her freshman and sophomore years in college, I learned back in my high school days. We as a country I think are teaching down to the lowest student rather than trying to teach up to the best. This is why other countries have over taken us.
 
In fact, the kids from the schools you refer know almost nothing. They're "graduating" at about a 4th-grade level. And yet, we throw as much or more money at those schools as anywhere else.

Where Asia is superior is in their overall parenting, not their schools. There's a huge swath of kids in America that don't get five minutes of real parenting or discipline at home.

Very accurate assessement.

My son spent a year in South Korea teaching English in a private "after school" academy. The entire focus of the family, and for that matter South Korean society, is on education in preparation for the College entrance exams giving at the end of High School. Kids go to school 6 days a week, and according to my son, they typically attend class from 8am to around 8pm, with breaks for lunch and dinner. This is for kids 8 years old and beyond.

On the down side, these kids have very little imagination, again according to my son. Apparently the focus on precise answers year after year, removes much thought in the abstract.
 
Where are the liberal apologists for the failed status quo?

This is boring hearing nothing but common sense.
 
I don't know all about that. But I do know we have dumbed down our curriculum. I graduated from High School in the very early 60's and I found out once my youngest daughter went to college, much of what she was learning in the her freshman and sophomore years in college, I learned back in my high school days. We as a country I think are teaching down to the lowest student rather than trying to teach up to the best. This is why other countries have over taken us.

this is what affirmative action and PC has gotten us
 
Where are the liberal apologists for the failed status quo?

This is boring hearing nothing but common sense.

with liberals its all about the intention it is never about the results
 
It's been my observation that these "international" tests are rather meaningless in terms of what is needed by those who haven't met the grade. As the article points out, Shanghai's results are absurd to point of being meaningless.

However, one thing is very certain, families in most Asian countries make education a prime objective for their children, a concept far removed in the average US family. No amount of money will every overcome that deficit.

there is a reason why Cornell Engineering has tons of Asian kids and Harvard Law is far more than 2% Jewish
 
Very accurate assessement.

My son spent a year in South Korea teaching English in a private "after school" academy. The entire focus of the family, and for that matter South Korean society, is on education in preparation for the College entrance exams giving at the end of High School. Kids go to school 6 days a week, and according to my son, they typically attend class from 8am to around 8pm, with breaks for lunch and dinner. This is for kids 8 years old and beyond.

On the down side, these kids have very little imagination, again according to my son. Apparently the focus on precise answers year after year, removes much thought in the abstract.

12 hours a day, six days a week, of schooling, seems so unfair to those children, who never get a chance to be children! I don't blame the parents, who are aware of the intense competition their child faces, but surely something better could be tried. Ironically, I just read an article the other day where women are turning down marriage proposals simply because the man does not make enough money, and it's an accepted practice! :shock: Apparently, even their adulthood is affected. I don't recall if this was in South Korea, though..

Greetings, ocean515. :2wave:
 
I don't know all about that. But I do know we have dumbed down our curriculum. I graduated from High School in the very early 60's and I found out once my youngest daughter went to college, much of what she was learning in the her freshman and sophomore years in college, I learned back in my high school days. We as a country I think are teaching down to the lowest student rather than trying to teach up to the best. This is why other countries have over taken us.

That is the difference between no child left behind, and no behind left unmarked on an unruly child. ;)
 
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Teens in Asia dominate global test; US stagnant

And we spend more per child on education then any other country. in 2011 we spent $7,743 per child two times as much as the Asian countries do
U.S. Education Spending & Student Performance vs. The World Infographic | MAT@USC | USC Rossier Online

so I don't want to hear any solutions that is about wasting more money on a broken system

First and for most we need to get rid of the teachers unions they are more concerned about stuffing their pockets then educating our children

second we need to pay teachers based on performance and not on tenure like they do every where else in the private sector

third we need to implement school choice let the schools compete for students and when there is competition there is improvement

Actually....teachers unions exist in countries that do better (S Korea, Finland, Japan etc). In fact their unions have more power.....

They are also generally centralized federal systems ran by the national government not a decentralized system that hands out vouchers.

So you basically have somehow looked at that list and decided that in order to compete with countries that out perform us we need to do the complete opposite of what their doing.

I do take issue with some of the results (as mentioned in the article). For one China is a horrible country to even have on that list. It's by no means insight into how the nation performs as a whole. The US scores are an average. There's no doubt that better US schools in wealthier neighborhoods (yes poverty is also a problem in the US and not a large problem in Finland/Japan etc) the US is very competitive.
 
12 hours a day, six days a week, of schooling, seems so unfair to those children, who never get a chance to be children! I don't blame the parents, who are aware of the intense competition their child faces, but surely something better could be tried. Ironically, I just read an article the other day where women are turning down marriage proposals simply because the man does not make enough money, and it's an accepted practice! :shock: Apparently, even their adulthood is affected. I don't recall if this was in South Korea, though..

Greetings, ocean515. :2wave:

My son shares your sentiment. After a year teaching in a private school in Changwon, South Korea, he was ready to get back to Southern California.

Let me see if I can put this in a few words. My son once asked his class to write down what they did with their friends in their free time. After several minutes of explanation, and lots of questions, the response was something like, "what's free time?". It wasn't a complaint, it was complete confusion over the concept of "free time".

I'm not sure what the balance is. I don't think it's the extreme as seen in many parts of industrialized Asia.
 
So, if we pick the schools and filter out the underachievers, like China does, we will be #1! ;)

Rarely does anyone mention the changing demographics in America.

With the IRA of 1965 America shut off immigration of skilled and educated immigrants and now it's mostly third world uneducated and unskilled immigrants. With them they brought their culture and that culture is looking down upon education, that getting an education isn't that important.

It's a cultural thing. And starting in the mid 1970's immigrants were told not to assimilate in the name of PC. They were told to hold unto their culture, language and customs.

Now if you look at Chinese immigrants, education is one of the most important things in their culture and their children do above average in school in America. Where as Hispanic immigrants children don't succeed in school and have close to a 50% dropout rate in high school.

By 2040 America's dropout rate will be 40 % or even higher.
 
My son shares your sentiment. After a year teaching in a private school in Changwon, South Korea, he was ready to get back to Southern California.

Let me see if I can put this in a few words. My son once asked his class to write down what they did with their friends in their free time. After several minutes of explanation, and lots of questions, the response was something like, "what's free time?". It wasn't a complaint, it was complete confusion over the concept of "free time".

I'm not sure what the balance is. I don't think it's the extreme as seen in many parts of industrialized Asia.

but if you look at the article it is more then just the Asian countries that are kicking our ass Poland is kicking our ass
 
.

Teens in Asia dominate global test; US stagnant

And we spend more per child on education then any other country. in 2011 we spent $7,743 per child two times as much as the Asian countries do
U.S. Education Spending & Student Performance vs. The World Infographic | MAT@USC | USC Rossier Online

so I don't want to hear any solutions that is about wasting more money on a broken system

First and for most we need to get rid of the teachers unions they are more concerned about stuffing their pockets then educating our children

second we need to pay teachers based on performance and not on tenure like they do every where else in the private sector

third we need to implement school choice let the schools compete for students and when there is competition there is improvement

First, we need to have a single language education system... like they do.
Second, when they have the divorce rates that we do... then we will see better results.
Third, we need to get rid of gangs, thugs and cure cullying... like they don't have.
Fourth, we need to stop illegal immigration... like they do.
Fifth, we need families to prioritize education as a value over the mass media, sports and video games,.. like they do.
I can go on and on...
 
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