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Obama's health promises backfire

TheNextEra said:
You have an open mind like the KKK has an open mind about blacks. and no, I'm not comparing YOUR thoughts to the KKK, only your closed mind. Sorry, but you are close minded and partisan as they get. Open mind? I about spit my coffee out this morning laughing at that. Thanks for the laugh.
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I am a partisan, and have said it often. I ended up as a partisan for the right because the philosophy works... everywhere. I can be partisan and open minded. It's how I ended up moving from the left to the right. I still listen to and read leftist press (it's tough to avoid ROTFLOL), but there is nothing endearing to that perverted ideology. It destroys.

I don't see Socialism working... anywhere over the long haul, and when the bottom falls out... it is misery city. Just ask the Greeks.

A perfect example is, I'm not a liberal, yet you continue to call me as such. I put up the challenge to you before to PROVE with my comments and you ran away and couldn't man up the challenge to do so. You deserve the government we have.
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You foment and defend Socialist legislation, and you're openly hostile to Conservatives. ROTFLOL... but you're not a lefty, though your public lean is left. You obviously don't know who you are.
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zimmer said:
I am a partisan, and have said it often. I ended up as a partisan for the right because the philosophy works... everywhere. I can be partisan and open minded. It's how I ended up moving from the left to the right. I still listen to and read leftist press (it's tough to avoid ROTFLOL), but there is nothing endearing to that perverted ideology. It destroys.

I don't see Socialism working... anywhere over the long haul, and when the bottom falls out... it is misery city. Just ask the Greeks.
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Then you aren't open minded and I am not for socialism. Nice try though, at least you admitted to not being open minded because you are partisan.

You foment and defend Socialist legislation, and you're openly hostile to Conservatives. ROTFLOL... but you're not a lefty, though your public lean is left. You obviously don't know who you are.
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Hmmm you'll have to show me where I defend Spocialist legislation. Let's see, I'm against bailouts, I'm against TARP, I'm against ACA, I'm against the welfare system as it stands (needs serious reforms), I'm against the gun control that is being crammed down atm, and I'm against Obama's foreign policies and domestic policies. Yet, you say I'm a liberal.

Now care to show WITH FACTS AND POSTS where I do those things you listed. Balls in your court son, care to play or run away as usual?
 
TheNextEra said:
Then you aren't open minded and I am not for socialism. Nice try though, at least you admitted to not being open minded because you are partisan.



Hmmm you'll have to show me where I defend Spocialist legislation. Let's see, I'm against bailouts, I'm against TARP, I'm against ACA, I'm against the welfare system as it stands (needs serious reforms), I'm against the gun control that is being crammed down atm, and I'm against Obama's foreign policies and domestic policies. Yet, you say I'm a liberal.

Now care to show WITH FACTS AND POSTS where I do those things you listed. Balls in your court son, care to play or run away as usual?
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ROTFLOL... you just defended Obama's blatant and repeated lying, the lies necessary for him to get ObamaKrap passed, and you called those who call him out on it... what was that again... frothing at the mouth partisan hacks... or some such nonsense?

Defending a liar who shoved through a Socialist scheme using blatant lies, and then lying about his lies... ROTFLOL...
 
zimmer said:
ROTFLOL... you just defended Obama's blatant and repeated lying, the lies necessary for him to get ObamaKrap passed, and you called those who call him out on it... what was that again... frothing at the mouth partisan hacks... or some such nonsense?
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I didn't defend his comments, I said I don't think he was INTENTIONALLY lying. It's clear the ACA is a trainwreck and THAT'S what I commented on. Just because I don't buy into YOUR rhetoric, does not mean I'm automatically FOR Obama and his policies. I also don't think he is a super secret Muslim, does that make me for Obama's policies too? Jesus man, learn some logic.

Defending a liar who shoved through a Socialist scheme using blatant lies, and then lying about his lies... ROTFLOL...
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So because I don't buy into your rhetoric that he intentionally lied, that somehow is agreeing with everything Obama does?

You need to work on your logic a bit there son.
 
TheNextEra said:
Anti-gay marriage.
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that's not what you said. You said anti gay, which is not so. Even Bill Clinton signed the Defense of marriage Act, which was not intended as anti Gay but instead was pro traditional marriage. Liberals like yourself deliberately make these false arguments rather than deal with the truth.

Republicans are hell bent on using government to stop it.
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To stop Gay marriage? When was it started?
They also like using the FCC to ban things THEY deem so called "immoral". Also, I will agree that the Dems go to far on things like the ACA and gun control. I haven't said Dems are better than Reps. BOTH the Dems and GOP use big government for things THEY want. My point was that there are things that are liberally acted on and conservatively acted on and neither is ALL good or ALL bad when it comes to liberal and conservative.
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Okay
Yes, there are some that want progression in bad ways. Hence why I have said that conservatism and liberalism are needed. In the case of gun control, conservatism is needed to protect that right just as I believe liberalism is needed to protect gays for SSM.
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Being anti SSM is not the same as being anti Gay and most Gays understand that. Many Gays feel that civil ceremonies would be sufficient and simply want some public and personal recognition of their commitment to their relationship, just as heterosexuals do. I'm for this myself but don't call those who feel otherwise anti Gay. They are just anti Gay marriage, which is the honest way to put it. It is also their right to feel that way without being demonized.

Since many conservatives claim the founding fathers were Christians, they AGREED to allow slavery. Sorry, but again, those religious folks were acting liberally when they freed slaves and gave rights to blacks and women to vote. You do understand that religious people can act liberally right?
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You seemed locked in a space where only Liberals can do good, not apparently understanding what Conservatism really means. You think you know what it means, of course, but you really don't. Read some books on the subject, written by Conservatives, and you'll get a better idea of what it's about and the values contained in the philosophy.
 
Grant said:
You seemed locked in a space where only Liberals can do good, not apparently understanding what Conservatism really means. You think you know what it means, of course, but you really don't. Read some books on the subject, written by Conservatives, and you'll get a better idea of what it's about and the values contained in the philosophy.
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I have read about conservatism and you seem to be locked in a space where only conservatives can do good. I even commented how this country needs BOTH conservatism and liberal so your comments are not about me since I never said ONLY liberalism is good.

I even commented above how liberalism (in the form of gun control) was bad, so you can't pigeon hold me to your statement. Try reading what I actual said, not what you want me to say.
 
TheNextEra said:
I didn't defend his comments, I said I don't think he was INTENTIONALLY lying. It's clear the ACA is a trainwreck and THAT'S what I commented on. Just because I don't buy into YOUR rhetoric, does not mean I'm automatically FOR Obama and his policies. I also don't think he is a super secret Muslim, does that make me for Obama's policies too? Jesus man, learn some logic.



So because I don't buy into your rhetoric that he intentionally lied, that somehow is agreeing with everything Obama does?

You need to work on your logic a bit there son.
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So you don't believe he lied but was instead misinformed continually over a period of years? I think it's more flattering to Obama to just call him a liar and be done with it.
 
Grant said:
So you don't believe he lied but was instead misinformed continually over a period of years? I think it's more flattering to Obama to just call him a liar and be done with it.
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No, I think he was thinking his comments would be correct. I could care less what you think is better.

Regardless, just because I don't think he was intentionally lying does not mean I automatically support Obama and his policies as some have said.
 
TheNextEra said:
No, I think he was thinking his comments would be correct. I could care less what you think is better.

Regardless, just because I don't think he was intentionally lying does not mean I automatically support Obama and his policies as some have said.
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Just pointing out the alternatives. He was either repeating false information for a few years, in which case he should fire those responsible for making him a public ass, or he could admit to lying. Admitting to lying would seem to be the better option then having to face the fact his staff made a fool of him for all that time. Maybe they were just having a good laugh at his expense.
 
Grant said:
Just pointing out the alternatives. He was either repeating false information for a few years, in which case he should fire those responsible for making him a public ass, or he could admit to lying. Admitting to lying would seem to be the better option then having to face the fact his staff made a fool of him for all that time. Maybe they were just having a good laugh at his expense.
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There is more than your two choices, but if you must feel that way, nothing I say will stop you. But I will continue to refute the lies being told about me that becuase I don't think Obama intentionally lied, that I somehow agree with all his policies. That's just silly to accuse someone of that.
 
TheNextEra said:
There is more than your two choices, but if you must feel that way, nothing I say will stop you. But I will continue to refute the lies being told about me that becuase I don't think Obama intentionally lied, that I somehow agree with all his policies. That's just silly to accuse someone of that.
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What other choices are there? He was lying or he was misinformed over the years seems to be the only two that immediately comes to mind. \What others can you add?
 
Grant said:
What other choices are there? He was lying or he was misinformed over the years seems to be the only two that immediately comes to mind. \What others can you add?
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Combinations of the two in varying degrees, misinformation from the people he put in charge, etc. You are just wanting to pigeon hold everything in YOUR two choices. Life is not black and white, neither are decisions.

Again, that doesn't mean Obama isn't responsible for this mess, afterall he put those people in charge.
 
TheNextEra said:
Combinations of the two in varying degrees, misinformation from the people he put in charge, etc. You are just wanting to pigeon hold everything in YOUR two choices. Life is not black and white, neither are decisions.

Again, that doesn't mean Obama isn't responsible for this mess, afterall he put those people in charge.
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So he was misinformed and he was also lying. Yes, that is another choice and you may be right.
 
Grant said:
So he was misinformed and he was also lying. Yes, that is another choice and you may be right.
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I didn't say either of those things, but hey, whatever floats your boat. You have fun and rage on!
 
TheNextEra said:
I didn't say either of those things, but hey, whatever floats your boat. You have fun and rage on!
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You said "Combinations of the two in varying degrees, misinformation from the people he put in charge, etc." I agree with you about your 'combination' theory of lying and being misinformed also.

The debate is over and you win. Congrats!
 
Grant said:
You said "Combinations of the two in varying degrees, misinformation from the people he put in charge, etc." I agree with you about your 'combination' theory of lying and being misinformed also.

The debate is over and you win. Congrats!
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The combination could have included his people lying, not necessarily the president. A combination. But hey, whatever floats your boat, rage on.
 
TheNextEra said:
The combination could have included his people lying, not necessarily the president. A combination. But hey, whatever floats your boat, rage on.
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Yes, yes, a combination of lying and being misinformed. We agree. No need to go on.
 
Navy Pride said:
Yes and it cost Bush 1 reelection...........What has Obama's iies cost him?????
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Barrack Obama doesn't really matter. He will soon be gone and remembered only as the first Black president and worst president in US history, including Jimmy Carter.

The bigger question is what he has cost America in financial terms, the reintroduction of corruption and crony capitalism on a grand scale, the demeaning of the office he held, as well as the damage to American credibility throughout a dangerous world.

Had Barrack Obama done what he did in private industry he would have been tried and convicted for fraud on a grand scale but because he is in the government he will get away with it, ghost write a book or two and retire in splendour, with armed security always around him. The American people will be stuck with the tab.
 
TheNextEra said:
Do you think it was conservatism that gave blacks and women the right to vote? No, it was liberalism.
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You have drunk the from the poisoned chalice too many times. These comments illustrate a deep level of ignorance about the subject at hand... but that is the beauty of debatepolitics.com... it allows for education. But to be educated requires an open mind. The student must be prepared for the teacher. So the test is threefold.

Good Luck!

Republicans were instrumental in liberating Blacks and Women. It is the Demokrats that stood in opposition.

Women's rights... do you think a party that held down Blacks was eager to liberate women? Does it make sense? Not really. I believe you should sit down before reading the entire article. If you're open minded enough to accept such a source that is.

the number of people who know anything about the forty-year legislative war that preceded that victory is smaller than the audience of MSNBC. That war began in 1878, when a California Republican named A.A. Sargent introduced the 19th Amendment only to see it voted down by a Democrat-controlled Congress. It finally ended four decades later, when the Republicans won landslide victories in the House and the Senate, giving them the power to pass the amendment despite continued opposition from most elected Democrats — including President Woodrow Wilson, to whom the suffragettes frequently referred as “Kaiser Wilson.”
The American Spectator : Republicans and Women's Rights: A Brief Reality Check
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Now... take a little test and show us your ignorance or lack thereof:
HistoryTest | National Black Republican Association
 
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TheNextEra said:
I didn't defend his comments, I said I don't think he was INTENTIONALLY lying...
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Here is what you stated...

TheNextEra said:
... I just find it funny how foaming at the mouth partisan hacks will automatically gravitate to "He LIED" without rational thinking.
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Seems like you have employed the Slippery School of ObamaSpeak. But, let's give you the benefit of the doubt and assume you have been in a coma for the past 5-years.

Now... let's have a stab at "rational thinking" shall we?

First a trip down memory lane:

Obama is the president of the United States.
Obama and his party desperately want single payer. (He's said it).
Obama has a window of opportunity to shove one up America's backside with Control of Congress.
The Demokrats write a bill.
Dead Kennedy exits the scene.
Americans do not want said bill, and even the Socialist State of MA is on board by electing Republican Scott Brown to stop ObamaKare.
ObamaKare is Passed using tricks.
Pelosi stated we have to pass it to find out what is inside it. It's an Amerikan Christmas gift.
...
Three years pass...
along the way Obama repeatedly tells the American public you can keep your plan and Doctor.
Friends of ObamaKare are given all manner of waivers.
ObamaKare is launched and America begins to realize the massive turd Obama sprung on the country with the aid of His party and ONLY his party.
The turd grows to massive proportions in 30-days.
People cannot keep their Dr. or their plan.
Costs increase.
Demokrats reveal they knew nobody running the show had a clue... 3 YEARS AGO. But of course Obama knew nothing about this or the realities of his plan. Is it because he is ignorant or a pathological liar on par with Felonious Bill Clinton?
Obamacare: Memo reveals health care adviser warned W.H. was losing control 3 years ago - CBS News

Top Democrat: Of Course We Knew 'You Can Keep Your Plan' Wasn't Actually True
Top Democrat: Of Course We Knew 'You Can Keep Your Plan' Wasn't Actually True - Guy Benson

Obama lied about Benghazi.
Obama tried to shift his Red Line comment onto the rest of the world.
Having been bailed out, and not really being challenged on either of these whoppers... is it surprising he would try the following bit of greasy lying?

NOOooooooo...

His lying is not intentional. He is only the President and does not know what members of his party knew, and what his advisers knew. I don't buy it... you might... ROTFLOL... but let's say he didn't... ROTFLMFAO... he didn't... ROTFLMFAO... he didn't Bwahhahahahahaha... he didn't know... (gasping for air)... isn't that worse?

The Real Slim Shady just stood up! What does that say about your judgement?
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TheNextEra said:
Sorry, but that simply isn't true. The Republican party is more interested in soving morality anti-gay, anti-choice. Hardly freedom.

Sorry, but that is a CONSERVATIVE mentality not a liberal one. Liberalism was going against the norm and giving the women and blacks the right to vote, it was conservatism that fought it. Parties change ideology, not ONE party is the same as when it was founded. That much is true and is in history. However, the concept of liberalism and conservatism remained constant. ONly the parties changed.
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That is historically objectively false. Liberalism as an ideology meant something very different prior to the early 20th Century. When Progressivism got a bad public flavor, they switched to calling themselves "Liberals" mostly because no one else was really using the name, and worked for them. Dewey, in particular, was a big advocate of redefining "Liberal" from its' previous arguments for minimal necessary government, free trade, and individual autonomy.
 
TheNextEra said:
Yes, just like the GOP was eliminated in 2006. :roll: No, liberalism won't be going away. No, we won't be putting gays back in the closet. No, we won't be eliminating the min wage and having children back in factories working. No, we won't be taking blacks and women's right to vote away. Sorry, but liberalism is not going anywhere and neither is conservatism. BOTH are needed in various degrees for a successful society to exist.

As much as I have seen and hated some liberal big government ideas (gun control, New York's insane bans, ACA), I have seen conservatives just as interested in using big government for THEIR needs as well. Morality control with the FCC, flag burning bans, and anti-gay marriage bans.
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Conservatives made kids work in factories? Are you for ****ing real? Really?
 
zimmer said:
You have drunk the from the poisoned chalice too many times. These comments illustrate a deep level of ignorance about the subject at hand... but that is the beauty of debatepolitics.com... it allows for education. But to be educated requires an open mind. The student must be prepared for the teacher. So the test is threefold.

Good Luck!

Republicans were instrumental in liberating Blacks and Women. It is the Demokrats that stood in opposition.

Women's rights... do you think a party that held down Blacks was eager to liberate women? Does it make sense? Not really. I believe you should sit down before reading the entire article. If you're open minded enough to accept such a source that is.



Now... take a little test and show us your ignorance or lack thereof:
HistoryTest | National Black Republican Association
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You again are making the falacy of thinking Dem = Liberal and Republican = conservatism. That is flat out false, we are talking liberalism and conservatism here. Conservatives fought to keep blacks and women from voting, liberals did not.

Keep up son, you're failing.
 
American said:
Conservatives made kids work in factories? Are you for ****ing real? Really?
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In the past yes, conservatism was what kept kids in the factories.
 
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