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Cruz, Palin join protesters at WWII Memorial[W:793:1010:1190]

Re: Cruz, Palin join protesters at WWII Memorial

Gimmesometruth said:
You have no idea what the argument was.

The argument was:



Which I argue is false. The bagger ideology is RWA which is inherently racist. Baggerism is extremely reactionary. Most bagger groups have slowly abandoned their libertarian roots and have become more socially conservative, focusing more and more on "traditional values":




Conclusion

The present paper examined possible causes and consequences of identification with the Tea Party movement. We measured longitudinal change in Tea Party identification and an array of constructs relevant to three approaches to the relationship between racial thinking and political judgment–namely, the outgroup-focused, ingroup-focused, and ideological perspectives.

Broadly, the data support claims that the Tea Party is–for some White supporters, at least–a racially motivated movement. Anti-Black sentiment was associated with Tea Party identification across time points. This relationship, however, appeared to be masked by assertions of national decline and the embrace of libertarian ideology.

The findings also suggest that identification with the Tea Party movement is related to racial identity, but not in the manner suggested by traditional models of racialized politics. Rather than causing affiliation with the Tea Party, White identity appears to be a product of immersion in the movement [41]. This phenomenon, which we term political racialization, merits further study to reveal the precise mechanisms by which identification with a political movement can shape racial attitudes and identities.

Our findings concerning libertarianism and social conservatism shed light on the ideological dynamics of the Tea Party movement during an important time in its history. Although support for the Tea Party movement tended to fall over the study period–from June 2010 to April-May 2011–the movement retained greater appeal for social conservatives than for libertarians. Thus, it may be that Republican attempts to exploit enthusiasm for the Tea Party succeeded in shifting the movement (in popular perception, at least) from economic to culturally conservative themes.
PLOS ONE: Race, Ideology, and the Tea Party: A Longitudinal Study


The argument was not whether there are racist elements within Democrats, the argument was whether the bagger ideology contains racist elements.

It does.
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It's an interesting research product, although I suspect the authors found the conclusions very congenial. The fact remains that despite agglomerations of non-TP elements over time (probably attracted by TP success) TP ideology per se remains colorblind.
 
Re: Cruz, Palin join protesters at WWII Memorial

Jack Hays said:
It's an interesting research product, although I suspect the authors found the conclusions very congenial.
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By all means Jack, show how the authors personal preferences influenced not only the research but the conclusion.

You are becoming famous here for your seeds of doubt argument.



The fact remains that despite agglomerations of non-TP elements over time (probably attracted by TP success) TP ideology per se remains colorblind.
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Um, in and of itself, baggerism is extremely reactionary and the rise and influence of social conservatives has molded it into a more racist organization. A person can try to argue (falsely) what it was, but sadly for your argument, the movement is going South, literally and figuratively.
 
Re: Cruz, Palin join protesters at WWII Memorial

Gimmesometruth said:
The argument was not whether there are racist elements within Democrats, the argument was whether the bagger ideology contains racist elements.
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Well if you want to play games, here's mine. The part of the quote I replied to was this:
12. Prejudice. Studies have found that authoritarian followers are among the most prejudiced
people in society. It is the nastiest aspect of their ethnocentrism, and one they insistently deny—to
others and to themselves. And they really do not realize how prejudiced they are, compared with
others, because they associate so much with other prejudiced people. So their prejudices seem
normal and perfectly justified to them.
 and the Democrats actions.

So, I've show my words to be tied directly to the topic. Feel free to comment on the "inherently racist" Democrats as you did on the Tea Party using your same standards of evidence.
 
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Re: Cruz, Palin join protesters at WWII Memorial

Michael66 said:
It's as phony and disingenuous as is Palin's death panels. Miserable lowlife cow!
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Funny. A person claiming to be from Canada (maybe he is) pretends to be an expert on the IPAB and the Sec of Health and Human services in America in as far as what they can do. But then wouldn't you know it, this very morning this article shows up about death panels in the Canadian heath system. Canada has death panels, and that’s a good thing.

Granted it is sugar coated because of the mag it is in but it points out what government can and will do. Pretty much like what Palin was talking about here in the USA. Nothing like having a nameless, faceless government employee decide who lives and dies, here or in Canada.
 
Re: Cruz, Palin join protesters at WWII Memorial

upsideguy said:
I find it hard to believe many people would the Palin/Cruz would be improvement over the sitting president. Many do not like the president or his policies, but few would endorse the dynamic duo of nutjobs to be his replacement. Why don't you run a poll as see how badly that combo does?
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The sitting President has a record, one that you want to ignore. Palin had a record in Alaska, one that you want to ignore. Cruz is a reformer and stands on principles, again something you want to know. I don't care what the polls say because the polls have a way of brainwashing people which you show ever day especially the ones you want to accept, i.e. Congressional approval ratings which mean nothing and Obamacare polling so low which you ignore.
 
Re: Cruz, Palin join protesters at WWII Memorial

Conservative said:
The sitting President has a record, one that you want to ignore. Palin had a record in Alaska, one that you want to ignore. Cruz is a reformer and stands on principles, again something you want to know. I don't care what the polls say because the polls have a way of brainwashing people which you show ever day especially the ones you want to accept, i.e. Congressional approval ratings which mean nothing and Obamacare polling so low which you ignore.
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Alaska is a state with no people and plenty of land (much of it federally owned), bear, moose, deer, salmon and misquitoes. The population of Alaska is about 700,000, which makes it about the size of El Paso, Texas. Sorry, Sarah Palin is little more than a glorified park ranger. (BTW. Did we mention she couldn't even complete her term managing this tiny state?). She quit that just like she quit 4 pedestrian colleges enroute to a degree in communications....

Feel free to tell us who good leaders are (Obama has his shortcomings); but if you think Palin is a leader, you have no credibility on the subject. If she is your idea of leadership, then human resources may have been your profession, but it was not your forte.
 
Re: Cruz, Palin join protesters at WWII Memorial

upsideguy said:
Alaska is a state with no people and plenty of land (much of it federally owned), bear, moose, deer, salmon and misquitoes. The population of Alaska is about 700,000, which makes it about the size of El Paso, Texas. Sorry, Sarah Palin is little more than a glorified park ranger. (BTW. Did we mention she couldn't even complete her term managing this tiny state?). She quit that just like she quit 4 pedestrian colleges enroute to a degree in communications....

Feel free to tell us who good leaders are (Obama has his shortcomings); but if you think Palin is a leader, you have no credibility on the subject. If she is your idea of leadership, then human resources may have been your profession, but it was not your forte.
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What exactly is your point, Alaska regardless of size has people, a state govt, a budget that has to be managed. It has an economy and relationships that have to be managed. Those 700,000 people are more people than Obama had ever managed and is lack of executive experience and leadership skills are evident. I still don't understand why the Obama record and resume was never vetted by people like you who profess to be in business?

You voted for Obama because of what he said in 2008 and again in 2012 for what he said. He had no record in 2008 so you took a chance. He had a record in 2012 and you ignored it. Palin was never running against Obama but rather Biden but that doesn't seem to matter for all you want to do and everyone else that supports Obama wants to do is divert from that Obama record.

I wasn't in human resources, I was in management and operations. I would put my resume up against everyone else here. My human resources expertise however came from college and actual business experience which led me to managing over 1200 employees and a 200 million dollar a year business. Obama would never have been hired in any management position in my company.

Yes, Obama has his shortcomings and the American people are paying for that incompetence now
 
Re: Cruz, Palin join protesters at WWII Memorial

Sarah Palin is back in the news with a book review, explaining what many have grown to suspect.

Exclusive
 
Re: Cruz, Palin join protesters at WWII Memorial

Conservative said:
What exactly is your point, Alaska regardless of size has people, a state govt, a budget that has to be managed. It has an economy and relationships that have to be managed. Those 700,000 people are more people than Obama had ever managed and is lack of executive experience and leadership skills are evident. I still don't understand why the Obama record and resume was never vetted by people like you who profess to be in business?

You voted for Obama because of what he said in 2008 and again in 2012 for what he said. He had no record in 2008 so you took a chance. He had a record in 2012 and you ignored it. Palin was never running against Obama but rather Biden but that doesn't seem to matter for all you want to do and everyone else that supports Obama wants to do is divert from that Obama record.

I wasn't in human resources, I was in management and operations. I would put my resume up against everyone else here. My human resources expertise however came from college and actual business experience which led me to managing over 1200 employees and a 200 million dollar a year business. Obama would never have been hired in any management position in my company.

Yes, Obama has his shortcomings and the American people are paying for that incompetence now
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It seems remarkable that people would attack Sarah Palin and then defend Barrack Obama!

Here's an outline of her experience. Notice how she was investigated while Obama's past was carefully hidden, and anyone wanting to take a closer look at his history was ridiculed, and often called racist.

Palin: Schweizer Book a 'Slap Upside the Head' to Media's Blindness to D.C. Corruption
 
Re: Cruz, Palin join protesters at WWII Memorial

upsideguy said:
Alaska is a state with no people and plenty of land (much of it federally owned), bear, moose, deer, salmon and misquitoes. The population of Alaska is about 700,000, which makes it about the size of El Paso, Texas. Sorry, Sarah Palin is little more than a glorified park ranger. (BTW. Did we mention she couldn't even complete her term managing this tiny state?). She quit that just like she quit 4 pedestrian colleges enroute to a degree in communications....

Feel free to tell us who good leaders are (Obama has his shortcomings); but if you think Palin is a leader, you have no credibility on the subject. If she is your idea of leadership, then human resources may have been your profession, but it was not your forte.
Click to expand...

In fact Sarah Palin was a leader and had a very high approval rating among the electorate. Who did Barry Obama ever lead? What administration experience did he have? What corruption has he ever exposed?
 
Re: Cruz, Palin join protesters at WWII Memorial

Jack Hays said:
I have never made any claim of any kind about those carrying signs. I have said that public attendance at a public event proves nothing about the beliefs of a specified group. You don't handle nuance well, and you've already demonstrated a propensity to leap to conclusions. I indeed have no affiliation, but I have an aversion to unfairness.:peace
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You can wiggle all around the fact that you have admitted that there are racists amongst the baggers Jack, but I'm quite satisfied that I and others on this board have established that you're one of them.

The only question remaining is why you would want to hide it? But that's not uncommon for a lot of people who are baggers and are ashamed of being so.

Undoubtedly you will continue to strengthen that belief among others as you have been notorious for doing on this board.
 
Re: Cruz, Palin join protesters at WWII Memorial

Grant said:
Sarah Palin is back in the news with a book review, explaining what many have grown to suspect.

Exclusive
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Scary, isn't it but notice how the Obama supporters will ignore it and continue to spout the party line. People wonder why "good", "quality" candidates don't run for public office. This is why. Thus we end up with the govt. we deserve because we will not enact the policies necessary to clean up D.C. starting now with term limits.
 
Re: Cruz, Palin join protesters at WWII Memorial

Jack Hays said:
It's an interesting research product, although I suspect the authors found the conclusions very congenial. The fact remains that despite agglomerations of non-TP elements over time (probably attracted by TP success) TP ideology per se remains colorblind.
Click to expand...

Here's Jack Hays again, the guy who argues vigorously that he isn't a bagger, again up to his neck trying to defend them.

If it walks like a duck and talks like a duck, ...................
 
Re: Cruz, Palin join protesters at WWII Memorial

Conservative said:
Scary, isn't it but notice how the Obama supporters will ignore it and continue to spout the party line. People wonder why "good", "quality" candidates don't run for public office. This is why. Thus we end up with the govt. we deserve because we will not enact the policies necessary to clean up D.C. starting now with term limits.
Click to expand...

It seems that teabaggers like you won't be happy until the grand wizard of the Klan is president and Palin is the VP. You need to be aware that supporting a circus barker such as Palin destroys any credibility you ever had.
 
Re: Cruz, Palin join protesters at WWII Memorial

Conservative said:
Scary, isn't it but notice how the Obama supporters will ignore it and continue to spout the party line. People wonder why "good", "quality" candidates don't run for public office. This is why. Thus we end up with the govt. we deserve because we will not enact the policies necessary to clean up D.C. starting now with term limits.
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Absolutely, and that is a tragedy for the United States. Anyone who tries to fight the corruption in Washing will be defamed by the media and, oddly, by many of the American people as well. It is a very odd age we live in when people actually support government corruption.
 
Re: Cruz, Palin join protesters at WWII Memorial

Michael66 said:
It seems that teabaggers like you won't be happy until the grand wizard of the Klan is president and Palin is the VP. You need to be aware that supporting a circus barker such as Palin destroys any credibility you ever had.
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You shouldn't worry yourself over Conservative's credibility, Michael. He's easily handled and discarded uniformed twerps like yourself many times.
 
Re: Cruz, Palin join protesters at WWII Memorial

Michael66 said:
Here's Jack Hays again, the guy who argues vigorously that he isn't a bagger, again up to his neck trying to defend them.

If it walks like a duck and talks like a duck, ...................
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Your quacking never seems to cease, Michael. Why not give it a rest?

You're only speaking fr yourself here, btw.
 
Re: Cruz, Palin join protesters at WWII Memorial

Michael66 said:
It seems that teabaggers like you won't be happy until the grand wizard of the Klan is president and Palin is the VP. You need to be aware that supporting a circus barker such as Palin destroys any credibility you ever had.
Click to expand...

I don't have a lot of respect for people like you who call the T.E.A. Party teabaggers. I would gladly be a part of the T.E.A. Party if I didn't live in a highly conservative District so if you think you are embarrassing me, forget it. I would proudly be a member of the T.E.A. Party and would be proud to vote again for Sarah Palin if that meant getting rid of Obama, Pelosi, Reid, Biden, and all the other leftwing kooks in the WH creating policies that are destroying our economy.

I wonder if Robt. Byrd will be coming back to take over the Klan or maybe we ought to vote for those non racists Al Sharpton and Jesse Jackson. Yes, see your point, racism only exists on the right and in your mind.
 
Re: Cruz, Palin join protesters at WWII Memorial

Conservative said:
I don't have a lot of respect for people like you who call the T.E.A. Party teabaggers. I would gladly be a part of the T.E.A. Party if I didn't live in a highly conservative District so if you think you are embarrassing me, forget it. I would proudly be a member of the T.E.A. Party and would be proud to vote again for Sarah Palin if that meant getting rid of Obama, Pelosi, Reid, Biden, and all the other leftwing kooks in the WH creating policies that are destroying our economy.

I wonder if Robt. Byrd will be coming back to take over the Klan or maybe we ought to vote for those non racists Al Sharpton and Jesse Jackson. Yes, see your point, racism only exists on the right and in your mind.
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No, racism exists on all sides of the political spectrum. And most likely you will find your kooks on all sides too.
As for Palin though, you won't have to concern yourself about voting for her ever again. She's chosen to be a media sideshow as is Glenn Beck. She knows she is incapable of a political debate with any politician, one on one and that's why you won't ever see her try.

Your lack of respect for me is mutual. Only mine goes so far as to complete disdain for the political hatefest of racism that has engulfed your country ever since Obama took over. People on the outside are not fooled one bit about what it's all about. You can take that to the bank!
 
Re: Cruz, Palin join protesters at WWII Memorial

Grant said:
Your quacking never seems to cease, Michael. Why not give it a rest?

You're only speaking fr yourself here, btw.
Click to expand...

No, there have been others voicing their suspicions that Jack is a bagger. If every bit of his agenda is in sync with baggerism then don't you have to wonder why he isn't honest about supporting it? Maybe you and I should challenge him to show us one aspect in which he disagrees with the bagger ideology?
 
Re: Cruz, Palin join protesters at WWII Memorial

Michael66 said:
No, racism exists on all sides of the political spectrum. And most likely you will find your kooks on all sides too.
As for Palin though, you won't have to concern yourself about voting for her ever again. She's chosen to be a media sideshow as is Glenn Beck. She knows she is incapable of a political debate with any politician, one on one and that's why you won't ever see her try.

Your lack of respect for me is mutual. Only mine goes so far as to complete disdain for the political hatefest of racism that has engulfed your country ever since Obama took over. People on the outside are not fooled one bit about what it's all about. You can take that to the bank!
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Good, then we have a mutual disrespect for each other, keep whining and complaining about the outcome and doing nothing about it. Anytime someone disagrees with you it is racism. You and others will never get it, it isn't racism to be against policies but it is easy to claim racism to divert from the policies implemented.
 
Re: Cruz, Palin join protesters at WWII Memorial

Conservative said:
Good, then we have a mutual disrespect for each other, keep whining and complaining about the outcome and doing nothing about it. Anytime someone disagrees with you it is racism. You and others will never get it, it isn't racism to be against policies but it is easy to claim racism to divert from the policies implemented.
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My original claim with Jack was that there is a racist element within the bagger party, non-party, whatever they want to call themselves. Jack has agreed with that but only after first disagreeing. Go back and find the applicable posts if you doubt me.

Jack used an example of NAMBLA being supported by Democrats didn't make them pedophiles. I agreed that was true but I tolk him that in the case of the tea baggers, they haven't in any way shown that they desire to distance themselves from racism. In fact, it's so prevalent in their street demonstration that one could mistake them for Klan members out of costume.

Baggerism was born out of libertarianism and that's a point that Jack made and I agree with. The resurgence in baggerism has been completely because of Obama and it's the racist element that has found sympathy from the ranks of libertarians. Rand Paul being one of the foremost of course. That's not saying that all libertarians are racists but they need to be scrutinized carefully because many will let their guards down in the heat of passionate debate. And many baggers just don't even try to hide it!
 
Re: Cruz, Palin join protesters at WWII Memorial

Michael66 said:
My original claim with Jack was that there is a racist element within the bagger party, non-party, whatever they want to call themselves. Jack has agreed with that but only after first disagreeing. Go back and find the applicable posts if you doubt me.

Jack used an example of NAMBLA being supported by Democrats didn't make them pedophiles. I agreed that was true but I tolk him that in the case of the tea baggers, they haven't in any way shown that they desire to distance themselves from racism. In fact, it's so prevalent in their street demonstration that one could mistake them for Klan members out of costume.

Baggerism was born out of libertarianism and that's a point that Jack made and I agree with. The resurgence in baggerism has been completely because of Obama and it's the racist element that has found sympathy from the ranks of libertarians. Rand Paul being one of the foremost of course. That's not saying that all libertarians are racists but they need to be scrutinized carefully because many will let their guards down in the heat of passionate debate. And many baggers just don't even try to hide it!
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The resurgence of "baggerism" as you call it couldn't have anything to do with the 6.4 trillion added to the debt, 22 million unemployed/under employed/discouraged workers, stagnant economic growth, and massive dependence being created. Of course not thus it has to be classified as racism. T.E.A. stands for Taxed Enough Already so any time you want to talk about the issues I will be happy to respond but not anymore to diversions and your personal opinions about racism. Cries of racism is a typical liberal ploy to appeal to emotions and divert from reality. I am not going to let that happen.
 
Re: Cruz, Palin join protesters at WWII Memorial

Conservative said:
The resurgence of "baggerism" as you call it couldn't have anything to do with the 6.4 trillion added to the debt, 22 million unemployed/under employed/discouraged workers, stagnant economic growth, and massive dependence being created. Of course not thus it has to be classified as racism. T.E.A. stands for Taxed Enough Already so any time you want to talk about the issues I will be happy to respond but not anymore to diversions and your personal opinions about racism. Cries of racism is a typical liberal ploy to appeal to emotions and divert from reality. I am not going to let that happen.
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Well then I guess we won't discuss, because I will continue to make the claim that racism is indeed behind the large majority of your country's problems. The disjointed negativism of your GOP has been mainly caused by the bagger influence. That has been largely successful because of the baggers putting up primary challenges to mainstream Repubs who have just recently shown that they need to put an end to it before it destroys the GOP brand.

Your country's problems nearly all are contributable to GOP negativism and contrariness toward Obama. In a close and careful analysis, it is evident that no specific charge can be levelled at Obama but instead innuendo which remains unspecific. Obama is opposed because he's a black president. And in fact, even as he regrettably accepts Republican policy as is plainly evident with his health care initiative which is a carbon copy of Republican wishes with Romney care, the baggers still are controlling the GOP in opposing him. No amount of Obama's compromising will make it any better. The die has been cast and that is to destroy him.

In a nutshell, the bagger movement is destroying your country's economy and preventing any kind of real economic recovery. The recent failure of the bagger efforts with Cruz is substantial proof of where the problem lies.

American counterspin is only partially effective within your country. The rest of the world isn't fooled.
 
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