• This is a political forum that is non-biased/non-partisan and treats every person's position on topics equally. This debate forum is not aligned to any political party. In today's politics, many ideas are split between and even within all the political parties. Often we find ourselves agreeing on one platform but some topics break our mold. We are here to discuss them in a civil political debate. If this is your first visit to our political forums, be sure to check out the RULES. Registering for debate politics is necessary before posting. Register today to participate - it's free!

Republicans Lose Ground vs. Obama in the Shutdown Blame Game

Fenton said:
Obama-Care > E=MC2...

You're right.

The Libs, even if they "win" this have nothing left to fall back on.

I meam how many times can you listen to someone tell you " the econonic recovery is right around the corner" before you finnaly chalk up their rhetoric to the ravings of a meth addict high on paint thinner and Peyote ?

I think the Website is "down" for a damn good reason.

The Democrats don't exactly want everyone to know just how much they've gotten screwed by the most "compassionate " political party in the whole Universe.

Not yet anyway. I expect after the mid terms it will be up running like a well oiled machine.....built by liars and crack head ideologist.

Well as well as a machine could run that was built by liars and glue heads
Click to expand...

That's an interesting take on this, and it wouldn't surprise me if they did make it difficult on purpose right now. I've seen some facebook posts with people not happy because it wasn't what they expected. This mousy tippy toe admin that panics after any kind of criticism always trying to stick to their retarded script is entertaining at least.
 
Grendel said:
Dubya also doubled it. Reagan tripled it. I'm sure you were outraged. Especially since Dubya inherited a surplus to work with and chose to throw it away.
Click to expand...

Another liberal posting what he/she is told by the liberal elite for you see return on investment is a foreign term to people like you. Still trying to locate that Clinton surplus and wonder why that so called surplus didn't reduce the national debt? Hmmm, you really need to do some research as it would help your credibility.
 
Verax said:
Its good to see more people in the U.S. "get it" than don't. Perhaps this is an indication the tide is turning in the U.S. against conservative extremism.

Republicans Lose Ground vs. Obama in the Shutdown Blame Game - ABC News

At this point I'm pretty puzzled. You really have to question the logic behind the GOP's behavior. They're taking damage all for nothing. What could they possibly get out of this? The only positive I see so far is they have riled up their ever shrinking base of extremists, everyone else is shaking their head. Obama can't negotiate anything or else he'd be legitimizing the GOP's hostage tactics, it would be a terrible blunder.

The only possible outcome I see is for Boehner to throw in the towel and for the GOP to walk away in shame. Should be interesting to see how this plays out. I fear something nasty and unexpected is going to happen.
Click to expand...

Hmm, gee, why ever would they embark on something that is potentially politically damaging to themselves?

Why, I wonder?
 
The elections are far enough away that the shutdown will be forgotten in the heartland. Most people aren't affected by the shutdown except by the pettiness coming from the Spite House. Inside the Beltway it's big news because lots of government blood suckers live there. In the heartland people hear about Park service workers shutting veterans in wheel chairs out of war memorials or local park workers shutting down parks or taking handles off water fountains. Obama has shown himself to be petty, small minded, vindictive and closed minded. These will be the lasting memories of he shutdown, not the lay off of non essential workers in Washington.

As a bonus question, why do non essential workers exist in government?
 
Why do you suppose the Senate Repubs had to ask the White House yesterday for what the House Repubs were proposing??
And that from Sen. Cornyn no less..
House Dear Leader Paul 'TEAt' Ryan said 'nope" to the lastest 'float' by Senate Repubs.
Conservative said:
Another liberal posting what he/she is told by the liberal elite for you see return on investment is a foreign term to people like you. Still trying to locate that Clinton surplus and wonder why that so called surplus didn't reduce the national debt? Hmmm, you really need to do some research as it would help your credibility.
Click to expand...
 
Conservative said:
How about adhering to the principles of the 2011 debt ceiling deal? You continue to believe what you are told and ignore history. Why is that? You want a debt ceiling increase, then support spending cuts.
Click to expand...

The Democrats agreed to the spending levels demanded by the GOP. What, Fox News didn't tell you that?
 
NIMBY said:
Why do you suppose the Senate Repubs had to ask the White House yesterday for what the House Repubs were proposing??
And that from Sen. Cornyn no less..
House Dear Leader Paul 'TEAt' Ryan said 'nope" to the lastest 'float' by Senate Repubs.
Click to expand...

Don't know, but what I do know is that each side has its talking points many of which you see posted here. I don't care about the talking points, I care about the end result and the lies and distortions created by the Obama Administration. The fact remains we had a 14.7 trillion dollar debt the last time a govt. shutdown was threatened and we approached the debt ceiling at that time. Promises and commitments were made to get our financial house in order. So here we are 2011 all over again but this time 16.7 trillion debt. Where does it end?

Congress has the ability to fund the govt. piece meal and stave off default but you don't see the media reporting that.
 
Conservative said:
elite
Click to expand...
That would be the Repub bankers/Kochs trying to reel in their wayward TEAts..
for you see return on investment is a foreign term to people like you.
Click to expand...
Kochs lost millions overnight Tuesday while the cost of doing business for the USA lost billions also due to Treasury bills' interest rising
Still trying to locate that Clinton surplus and wonder why that so called surplus didn't reduce the national debt? Hmmm, you really need to do some research as it would help your credibility.
Click to expand...
Should I put this Clinton surplus denial with today's debt deniers, etc.
 
Deuce said:
The Democrats agreed to the spending levels demanded by the GOP. What, Fox News didn't tell you that?
Click to expand...

No, they didn't but then again I haven't had Fox on for a long time. Spending more time here trying to educate people like you but it is a lost cause. Apparently since the Democrats Agreed with the House bill the govt. is no longer shutdown. Must have missed that even on Fox News.
 
NIMBY said:
That would be the Repub bankers/Kochs trying to reel in their wayward TEAts..Kochs lost millions overnight Tuesday while the cost of doing business for the USA lost billions also due to Treasury bills' interest risingShould I put this Clinton surplus denial with today's debt deniers, etc.
Click to expand...

Love the focus on the Koch brothers, whoever they are but wonder why there isn't the same focus on Think Progress, Moveon.org, big financial liberal supporters. Seems too much emphasis on others and not enough focus on individual responsibility. I don't recall the Koch Brothers influencing my vote or the actual results the Obama Admin. has generated.

By the way wonder who is buying the most votes, the Koch Brothers or the Democrat Senate and President?
 
Last edited:
Conservative said:
The fact remains we had a 14.7 trillion dollar debt the last time a govt. shutdown was threatened and we approached the debt ceiling at that time.
Click to expand...

Being the learned Businessman you are, you know that the yearly deficit includes interest on the Total accumulated Debt..
In the beginning, none of that interest was Obama's..
You would probably agree that about $2 Trillion interest on previous TAD is not on Obama.
 
NIMBY said:
Being the learned Businessman you are, you know that the yearly deficit includes interest on the Total accumulated Debt..
In the beginning, none of that interest was Obama's..
You would probably agree that about $2 Trillion interest on previous TAD is not on Obama.
Click to expand...

Yes, I do understand that just like there was less interest on the 10.6 trillion Obama inherited than the 16.7 trillion we have today. Just like Bush before him who wasn't responsible for the 5.7 trillion debt he inherited and the interest on that debt, Obama isn't responsible for the interest on the 10.6 he inherited but is for the additional 6.4 trillion added.

Seems that you don't understand that the 2 trillion isn't charged yearly. Approximately 250 billion is the interest on the debt, some of that is Obama's most of it is charged to all other Presidents but it is a line budget item
 
Whoever they are..LOL..Think progress didn't wipe the smirk off of cantor's face, the Koch brothers letter did that on Tuesday..
Cantor was a different guy to the press on Wednesday after the WH 'conversation', stopping the market bleeding he had started last week..
You didn't notice the Koch influence due to Citizens United.
Conservative said:
Love the focus on the Koch brothers, whoever they are but wonder why there isn't the same focus on Think Progress, Moveon.org, big financial liberal supporters. Seems too much emphasis on others and not enough focus on individual responsibility. I don't recall the Koch Brothers influencing my vote or the actual results the Obama Admin. has generated.

By the way wonder who is buying the most votes, the Koch Brothers or the Democrat Senate and President?
Click to expand...
 
Last edited:
Conservative said:
Yes, I do understand that just like there was less interest on the 10.6 trillion Obama inherited than the 16.7 trillion we have today. Just like Bush before him who wasn't responsible for the 5.7 trillion debt he inherited and the interest on that debt, Obama isn't responsible for the interest on the 10.6 he inherited but is for the additional 6.4 trillion added.
Click to expand...
Obama's 1st interest was close to 500 billion, which than came down to 400 billion..The interest on his inherited TAD INTEREST is over 2 trillion of 'his' total accumulated debt and is not on him..The deficit Obama inherited in his 1st budget is worth another trillion at least, and then there's more to take off with the inherited structural problems of the Bush budget..At least 45 straight months of private sector job growth have helped..Imagine the Nation with a 'loyal' opposition.

Seems that you don't understand that the 2 trillion isn't charged yearly. Approximately 250 billion is the interest on the debt, some of that is Obama's most of it is charged to all other Presidents but it is a line budget item
Click to expand...
Calling it a line budget item doesn't put it on Obama, and another bad blamoid.
 
Grendel said:
Dubya also doubled it. Reagan tripled it. I'm sure you were outraged. Especially since Dubya inherited a surplus to work with and chose to throw it away.
Click to expand...


The "surplus" lie continues. Never mind the facts or the truth or the bottom line, just keep repeating fiction to dummies and they will buy into it. LOL.



"If a corporation executive were to engage in such deceit, the Commissioners of the Securities and Exchange Commission (SEC), who are supposed to promote full public disclosure and protect the investing public against malpractice in the securities markets, would intervene with severity; when a president of the United States and his appointees engage in similar practices, all his men fall silent.

The surplus deception is clearly discernible in the statistics of national debt. While the spenders are boasting about surpluses, the national debt is rising year after year. In 1998, the first year of the legerdemain surplus, it rose from $5.413 trillion to $5.526 trillion, due to a deficit of $112.9 billion. Since then it has risen to $5.643 trillion today, October 15, 2000, with another deficit of $117 billion.

The federal government spends Social Security money and other trust funds which constitute obligations to present and future recipients. It consumes them and thereby incurs obligations as binding as those to the owners of savings bonds. Yet, the Treasury treats them as revenue and hails them for generating surpluses. If a private banker were to treat trust fund deposits as income and profit, he would face criminal charges."
The Surplus Hoax - Hans F. Sennholz - Mises Daily
 
ItAin'tFree said:
The "surplus" lie continues. Never mind the facts or the truth or the bottom line, just keep repeating fiction to dummies and they will buy into it. LOL.
Click to expand...

Rationalize it any way you want, but "conservatives" were silent throughout the Reagan/Bush/Bush years while the debt was being piled high, and only woke up when a Democrat got into office. It's partisan bickering and nothing more.
 
NIMBY said:
Whoever they are..LOL..Think progress didn't wipe the smirk off of cantor's face, the Koch brothers letter did that on Tuesday..
Cantor was a different guy to the press on Wednesday after the WH 'conversation', stopping the market bleeding he had started last week..
You didn't notice the Koch influence due to Citizens United.
Click to expand...

Your obsession with the Koch brothers shows how little respect you have for the individuals who actually vote and I also see that you ignored who was buying the most votes, the Koch Brothers or Obama?
 
Conservative said:
Your obsession with the Koch brothers
Click to expand...

You can't talk about the Tea Party without talking about the Koch brothers. It's their Tea Party. They own it. They made it, and they haven't sold it. It's like complaining about people mentioning Bill Gates while talking about Microsoft.
 
NIMBY said:
Obama's 1st interest was close to 500 billion, which than came down to 400 billion..The interest on his inherited TAD INTEREST is over 2 trillion of 'his' total accumulated debt and is not on him..The deficit Obama inherited in his 1st budget is worth another trillion at least, and then there's more to take off with the inherited structural problems of the Bush budget..At least 45 straight months of private sector job growth have helped..Imagine the Nation with a 'loyal' opposition.

Calling it a line budget item doesn't put it on Obama, and another bad blamoid.
Click to expand...

Obama's interest is assisted by record low interest rates as debt is serviced at short term interest rates. The debt service on the debt isn't 500 billion, 400 billion, it is about 225 billion thanks to the low rates we have today. Compare that to the interest rates in the 80's

Interest expenses on the last five fiscal years

Net Interest 222.5 227.1 196.9 190.9 252.8
Click to expand...


Obama didn't inherit a budget deficit, he inherited a budget proposal that was never passed or signed until the Democrats along with Obama did it in March 2009 . What you apparently will never understand is that CBO made deficit PROJECTION, Obama spending made that deficit a reality.
 
Grendel said:
Rationalize it any way you want, but "conservatives" were silent throughout the Reagan/Bush/Bush years while the debt was being piled high, and only woke up when a Democrat got into office. It's partisan bickering and nothing more.
Click to expand...

You project a lot as if you know what ALL conservatives did. The reality is which you want to ignore is not one time during those so called excessive deficits did the debt ever exceed our yearly GDP like they are now. It was also easier accepting the 1.7 trillion dollar Reagan debt because of the great results he generated, 17 million jobs created, doubling of GDP, 60% growth in Federal Income Tax revenue, and a peace dividend left to GHW Bush and Clinton.
 
Grendel said:
You can't talk about the Tea Party without talking about the Koch brothers. It's their Tea Party. They own it. They made it, and they haven't sold it. It's like complaining about people mentioning Bill Gates while talking about Microsoft.
Click to expand...

Don't know why Koch Brothers is even an issue, it is the Obama policies that have generated the economic results that you want to ignore. Get out your liberal talking points on the Obama results so I can teach you a few things about those lies.

I proudly would be a member of the T.E.A. Party but there is no need here. The people of my District understand conservative values and I have a Representative that has a 70% JAR. Obviously you have no idea what the T.E.A. Party stands for, if you did the question would then be want aren't you a member?
 
Grendel said:
Rationalize it any way you want, but "conservatives" were silent throughout the Reagan/Bush/Bush years while the debt was being piled high, and only woke up when a Democrat got into office. It's partisan bickering and nothing more.
Click to expand...

Almost everything political in Washington D.C. all depends on which party holds the presidency. If you go back through history you will find the debt ceiling votes which is very unpopular to be raised by all members of congress, the party out of power almost always votes against it while the party in power votes for it. Here is an example of the senate vote in the senate during Bush.

BUSH THE 2ND TENURE
year Dem for Dem against Rep for Rep against
2003 3 45 50 1
2004 2 46 50 1
2006 0 44 52 3

The senate votes above reinforce your statement about republicans, but it also puts the democrats in the same boat. The Democrats are only for raising the debt ceiling if the president is of their own party, against it when a Republican holds the White House. Wars are the same way, when a republican is in office, democrats will vote against them, but when a democrat is in office, they are for them. Such is the nature of life in Washington.
 
Conservative said:
Your obsession with the Koch brothers shows how little respect you have for the individuals who actually vote
Click to expand...
You're absolutely right..It also shows how oblivious you are to what happened this past week in Repub circles..
and I also see that you ignored who was buying the most votes, the Koch Brothers or Obama?
Click to expand...
KOCH bros or Obama buying votes??didn't CU hide that for all concerned?
 
Conservative said:
Obama's interest is assisted by record low interest rates as debt is serviced at short term interest rates.
Click to expand...
His 1st interest rate was close to a Half TRILLION--Thanks..
Obama didn't inherit a budget deficit
Click to expand...
So Obama had one month to clean up from the 2008 collapse..
What you apparently will never understand is that CBO made deficit PROJECTION, Obama spending made that deficit a reality.
Click to expand...
Should Obama have ignored the CBO numbers?
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top Bottom