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Quinn: I’d Consider Using National Guard, State Police To Help Chicago

ChezC3

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Quinn: I’d Consider Using National Guard, State Police To Help Chicago « CBS Chicago

Gov. Pat Quinn says he would consider using state resources to help combat Chicago street violence.

Speaking about this week’s mass shooting in the Back of the Yards neighborhood, Quinn says he’s open to talking with Mayor Emanuel about supplementing Chicago law enforcement with state police or the Illinois National Guard.


The rise of the Police State begins...

Is this guy a complete moron?

You send IL National Guard to places like Iraq and Afghanistan and then you want to put them in an American city???? Are you out of your rabid ass mind?!?!?!?!?
 
One of biggest problems with this approach is the National Guard might end up on a permanent assignment. That's because as long as the federal government insists on trapping people in a near escape proof web of government handouts, nothings going to change.
 
I do believe it is illegal for the military to take up arms against its own citizens.

Is the gov. saying his swat teams are not enough?
 
I do believe it is illegal for the military to take up arms against its own citizens.

Is the gov. saying his swat teams are not enough?

The National Guard ordered by Gov. Romney and the Army ordered by LBJ came to Detroit as a result of the '68 riots.
 
Unfortunately, the most effective rule these inner cities have is probably the no snitch rule. That way, a law abiding citizen probably has a better chance at justice than what the politicians are offering.
 
Chicago is as bad or worse than Kabul. They have to restore law. Either that or loosen gun ownership laws so that the law abiding have a chance.

The latter works pretty good everywhere else.
 
Chicago is as bad or worse than Kabul. They have to restore law. Either that or loosen gun ownership laws so that the law abiding have a chance.

But still not as bad as Ciudad Juarez
 
Quinn: I’d Consider Using National Guard, State Police To Help Chicago « CBS Chicago




The rise of the Police State begins...

Is this guy a complete moron?

You send IL National Guard to places like Iraq and Afghanistan and then you want to put them in an American city???? Are you out of your rabid ass mind?!?!?!?!?

I don't see a problem with it as long as it's part of a larger strategy to clean up the neighborhoods. Things are out of control and it has been shown in several ways that presence deters crime. But, it should not be a long term thing. The National Guard or state police would supplement current law enforcement, not take up arms against citizens.
 
I don't see a problem with it as long as it's part of a larger strategy to clean up the neighborhoods. Things are out of control and it has been shown in several ways that presence deters crime. But, it should not be a long term thing. The National Guard or state police would supplement current law enforcement, not take up arms against citizens.

This not the function of the national guard. With it becoming nothing but a reserve unit for our standing army, you don't want to put those types of soldiers in this kind of situation. State Police, I'm not that concerned about. They as a supplemental force is fine, but the NG? no way in hell...
 
I don't see a problem with it as long as it's part of a larger strategy to clean up the neighborhoods. Things are out of control and it has been shown in several ways that presence deters crime. But, it should not be a long term thing. The National Guard or state police would supplement current law enforcement, not take up arms against citizens.

If its short term, as soon as they pull out, the **** starts all over again. And if one of them got shot during their "policing" they would take up arms against citizens. The problem will be solved when they reverse the decision to make the city a gun free zone, because in fact it's not gun free, right.
 
It would never end. Eventually the National Guard would be in every ghetto city and barrio in the United States. Why should law abiding decent people have to give up their rights because of animals like this? Wall off their portion of the city and let them achieve their own destiny.

Don't make the United States like Mexico where there are three different types of police patrolling every block and crime is still out of control.
 
This not the function of the national guard. With it becoming nothing but a reserve unit for our standing army, you don't want to put those types of soldiers in this kind of situation. State Police, I'm not that concerned about. They as a supplemental force is fine, but the NG? no way in hell...

Agree that the state police would be a better choice. National Guard could fill the role too, though. They are used during crises and emergencies. What's happening on the south side of Chicago qualifies. But, it is not a solution. It is only a way to attempt restoring order while a real plan is put into effect. There is precedent for NG being used in similar power vacuums. Are you concerned that the soldiers would do something rash?
 
If its short term, as soon as they pull out, the **** starts all over again. And if one of them got shot during their "policing" they would take up arms against citizens. The problem will be solved when they reverse the decision to make the city a gun free zone, because in fact it's not gun free, right.

I don't think gun availability would change much. The problems are caused by social and economic issues. Anyway, to address your first sentence: that's why I said there needs to be a strategy/plan implemented if they go with this idea, otherwise you're right and it's a waste. Let's not get carried away here with the arms against citizens argument. I'm sure the rules of engagement would be extremely restrictive and probably limited to self defense where a reasonable person would believe their life was in danger. Other than that, I'm sure they would act simply as extra eyes and ears and psychological deterrent.
 
This not the function of the national guard. With it becoming nothing but a reserve unit for our standing army, you don't want to put those types of soldiers in this kind of situation. State Police, I'm not that concerned about. They as a supplemental force is fine, but the NG? no way in hell...

Right, because we know what happens when the camel gets his nose under the rug. This should find NO support.
 
I don't think gun availability would change much. The problems are caused by social and economic issues. Anyway, to address your first sentence: that's why I said there needs to be a strategy/plan implemented if they go with this idea, otherwise you're right and it's a waste. Let's not get carried away here with the arms against citizens argument. I'm sure the rules of engagement would be extremely restrictive and probably limited to self defense where a reasonable person would believe their life was in danger. Other than that, I'm sure they would act simply as extra eyes and ears and psychological deterrent.

I'm talking about arms against citizens by your standards. It's still arms against citizens and the answer is a big fat NO.
 
Agree that the state police would be a better choice. National Guard could fill the role too, though. They are used during crises and emergencies. What's happening on the south side of Chicago qualifies. But, it is not a solution. It is only a way to attempt restoring order while a real plan is put into effect. There is precedent for NG being used in similar power vacuums. Are you concerned that the soldiers would do something rash?

No, lets get carried away with it here so they don't get carried away with it out there.
 
I do believe it is illegal for the military to take up arms against its own citizens.

Is the gov. saying his swat teams are not enough?

What do you mean "take up arms against its own citizens" if you mean conduct law enforcement activities than that's not illegal, it was done during the Rodney King riots and during Katrina. Although I should be careful about using the phrase law enforcement activities, because even during Katrina the Army could not "arrest" anyone but they could "detain" you if they thought you were a security risk or a criminal, then someone else would come along to officially arrest you.
 
Agree that the state police would be a better choice. National Guard could fill the role too, though. They are used during crises and emergencies. What's happening on the south side of Chicago qualifies. But, it is not a solution. It is only a way to attempt restoring order while a real plan is put into effect. There is precedent for NG being used in similar power vacuums. Are you concerned that the soldiers would do something rash?

I'm concerned with the blatant undermining of the Posse Comitatus. You don't use the Army, which is what the NG has turned into, for civilian policing. This is not the precedence you want to set.
 
Just as in the Middle East, the government would demand Rules of Engagement so that the National Guard could not win, only die trying.

Snipers from the nearby ghetto used to try to pick off the guards at the Hunter's Point Naval Shipyard in California. Political Correctness demands that this not be noticed.
 
I'm concerned with the blatant undermining of the Posse Comitatus. You don't use the Army, which is what the NG has turned into, for civilian policing. This is not the precedence you want to set.

It's already been set during crises and emergencies. It's up to the governor and mayor to determine if the crisis in south Chicago qualifies.
 
No, lets get carried away with it here so they don't get carried away with it out there.

Well, I guess we just have a good ole fashioned disagreement here. We probably both agree that the state police would be preferable, but disagree whether it is proper to use NG to help. You think it doesn't because IMO you have a very rigid interpretation of the limitation of military and civilian relationships though there is plenty of precedent to refer to indicating otherwise whether you personally agree or not.
 
Well, I guess we just have a good ole fashioned disagreement here. We probably both agree that the state police would be preferable, but disagree whether it is proper to use NG to help. You think it doesn't because IMO you have a very rigid interpretation of the limitation of military and civilian relationships though there is plenty of precedent to refer to indicating otherwise whether you personally agree or not.


Sure I agree with you on that. And I think all precedents contrary to law/constitution on this and every other subject applicable should be reversed. Having done things wrong before should not excuse doing them wrong again/still.
 
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