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On gay marriage, America's house may not stay divided for long [W:29, 210]

Re: On gay marriage, America's house may not stay divided for long

How long have you been a member of NAMBLA? Myself, I think it's sick and disgusting for 10 or 12 year old to be able to legally consent to marriage to say a 30 year old even though that's "who they love". Why don't you?

Excuse me? Please show me where I supported NAMBLA. Do you have a reading comprehension problem? YOU were the one asking how these people could be twisted and allowed to marry the ones they love (Hence why I quoted you).

I asked if you understood legal consent, you clearly do not. 10-12 year olds cannot give legal consent, so their relationship with an adult is ILLEGAL. Your slippery slope argument is a lousy one in regards to gay rights.
 
Re: On gay marriage, America's house may not stay divided for long

Excuse me? Please show me where I supported NAMBLA. Do you have a reading comprehension problem? YOU were the one asking how these people could be twisted and allowed to marry the ones they love (Hence why I quoted you).

I asked if you understood legal consent, you clearly do not. 10-12 year olds cannot give legal consent, so their relationship with an adult is ILLEGAL. Your slippery slope argument is a lousy one in regards to gay rights.

No, no, It is you that has the reading comprehension problem. I asked a question to Captain Adverse about a statement he made. My question was in reference to what he wrote. You jumped in, quick on the trigger trying to make your point. I responded to your smart a**ed answer in relation to the context of the question I asked Captain Adverse. You never bothered to separate anything in the smart a** answer you sent to me so my reply to you was likewise.
 
Re: On gay marriage, America's house may not stay divided for long

I give it 10 years before Democrats start trying to normalize pedophilia. I've already posted an article that sets the groundwork for it.

They'll pump out the propaganda science articles, claiming it "might be genetic" or "chemical". Pedophiles can't help it. They are wired that way. We must have tolerance. They are victims. Gays apparently are "more equal" than polygamists, pedophiles, transgender (changing soon. They will be the next angels we have to adore. We will start to see transgendered characters in sitcoms. It will be taught in school as special and wonderful. It's already happening now)

We've gone from gays demanding right to Christians now being targeted and harassed for their beliefs. Freedom of Speech is a one way street on Authoritarian Ave.
 
Re: On gay marriage, America's house may not stay divided for long

38 pages in and nobody can say what the factual NEGATIVE consequences of equal rights for gays is

weird, i wonder why
 
Re: On gay marriage, America's house may not stay divided for long

38 pages in and nobody can say what the factual NEGATIVE consequences of equal rights for gays is

weird, i wonder why

I've certainly given a number of examples of what people are experiencing in their states after the passage of same sex marriage. From Religious run adoption organizations who in rights of conscience believe a child needs to be in a home with a mother and a father and a federal judge ruled they will have to accept same sex couples for adoption. The adoption organization could not do that so are now closed.

Parents suing a school board over elementary children being introduced to homosexual curriculum and wanted their children exempted from the classes. Federal judge ruled no and told the parents if they don't like it go start their own school.

There have been cases as of late where federal judges have trampled the right of conscience over not willing to supply services in relation to weddings to gays and being charged with discrimination for it.

Same-sex marriage is a new family form. Same-sex marriage and marriage alternatives are producing more change in family law, laws in discrimination, and these new laws are affecting traditional families not just by law but in culture. It's still unknown what the total affects of it will be but what has changed for traditional families, socially, economically, and in religious freedoms has been a real negative. Enough of a negative for those who have not yet passed gay marriage in their state, should think long and hard.
 
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Re: On gay marriage, America's house may not stay divided for long

I've certainly given a number of examples of what people are experiencing in their states after the passage of same sex marriage. From Religious run adoption organizations who in rights of conscience believe a child needs to be in a home with a mother and a father and a federal judge ruled they will have to accept same sex couples for adoption. The adoption organization could not do that so are now closed.

Parents suing a school board over elementary children being introduced to homosexual curriculum and wanted their children exempted from the classes. Federal judge ruled no and told the parents if they don't like it go start their own school.

There have been cases as of late where federal judges have trampled the right of conscience over not willing to supply services in relation to weddings to gays and being charged with discrimination for it.

Same-sex marriage is a new family form. Same-sex marriage and marriage alternatives are producing more change in family law, laws in discrimination, and these new laws are affecting traditional marriages and traditional families not just by law but in culture. It's still unknown what the total affects of it will be but what has changed for traditional families, socially, economically, and in religious freedoms has been a real negative. Enough of a negative for those who have not yet passed gay marriage in their state, should think long and hard.


Like Agent J said....nothing negative.

Unless of course you're a bigoted religious nut filled with hatred and hypocrisy...


The vast majority of us are feeling secure and happy with the "changes".
 
Re: On gay marriage, America's house may not stay divided for long

1.)I've certainly given a number of examples of what people are experiencing in their states after the passage of same sex marriage. From Religious run adoption organizations who in rights of conscience believe a child needs to be in a home with a mother and a father and a federal judge ruled they will have to accept same sex couples for adoption. The adoption organization could not do that so are now closed.

2.) Parents suing a school board over elementary children being introduced to homosexual curriculum and wanted their children exempted from the classes. Federal judge ruled no and told the parents if they don't like it go start their own school.

3.)There have been cases as of late where federal judges have trampled the right of conscience over not willing to supply services in relation to weddings to gays and being charged with discrimination for it.

4.)Same-sex marriage is a new family form. Same-sex marriage and marriage alternatives are producing more change in family law, laws in discrimination, and these new laws are affecting traditional families not just by law but in culture.

5.) It's still unknown what the total affects of it will be but what has changed for traditional families, socially, economically, and in religious freedoms has been a real negative. Enough of a negative for those who have not yet passed gay marriage in their state, should think long and hard.

1.) yes i read this and that was the adoptions centers choice, the adoption center has no right to discriminate based on those things no matter who owns it just like a hospital.
SO again thats not negative thats positive

2.) sounds right depending on the homosexual "curriculum" and class, no consequences.

if it was a single class called homosexuality and it was mandatory id agree with you by something tells me it wasnt

3.) again another positive judges enforcing the laws on the books and protecting peoples rights

4.) what every your OPINION of traditional family is isnt not effect in reality

5.) religious freedom is still intact

nothing you brought up is a negative consequence of equal rights for gays in fact they arent even anything new lol

people said the same thing when women and minorities were granted rights

the law is doing the same it always has, protecting rights.

so again i sake and try to focus on the words

do anybody have any FACTUAL NEGATIVE consequences

you not liking wanting them to have rights and be equal to the rest of us is not a consequence
 
Re: On gay marriage, America's house may not stay divided for long

Like Agent J said....nothing negative.

Unless of course you're a bigoted religious nut filled with hatred and hypocrisy...


The vast majority of us are feeling secure and happy with the "changes".

din ding ding

all his concerned are pest on his hurt feelings and not on realty facts and peoples rights

people think they should have to serve whites, blacks, asians, lations, women, men, chrisitians, jews etc and dont want their kids learning in school that those people exists and are just people either but guess what, to freaking bad

get home schooled then or simply tell you kid what you want them to learn while they are hime
 
Backup link: http://www.nytimes.com/2013/08/30/u...l-gay-marriages-regardless-of-state.html?_r=0

another victory for equal rights, slowly but surely discrimination is losing and equality is winning!!!
Definitely a victory for equal rights .. except the part about allowing SS-couples to check the "married" box -- there should be a "homarried" box to check or the like, separate, obviously, from "married", as OS-couples (married) are a definitive propriety different entity from SS-couples (homarried), and thus these two civil union domestic partnerships should not rightly be called the same thing any more than a cat show should be called a dog show.
 
Definitely a victory for equal rights .. except the part about allowing SS-couples to check the "married" box -- there should be a "homarried" box to check or the like, separate, obviously, from "married", as OS-couples (married) are a definitive propriety different entity from SS-couples (homarried), and thus these two civil union domestic partnerships should not rightly be called the same thing any more than a cat show should be called a dog show.
The only people who feel the need to separate them are people who have issues with LGBT Americans. There isn't a practical reason to separate as they are entering the same contract. By your logic, we should also separate interracial marriages because they're different. My point being, yes a cat show, and dog show are different, but we still call them both shows. In you wanna throw the words "same sex" in front of some peoples marriages that's fine by me, but marriage is marriage.
 
Re: On gay marriage, America's house may not stay divided for long

Like Agent J said....nothing negative.

Unless of course you're a bigoted religious nut filled with hatred and hypocrisy...


The vast majority of us are feeling secure and happy with the "changes".

From your own words, you prove you are the bigoted one. And no the vast majority doesn't agree with you, 32 states have added amendments banning gay marriage.
 
Re: On gay marriage, America's house may not stay divided for long

I give it 10 years before Democrats start trying to normalize pedophilia. I've already posted an article that sets the groundwork for it.

They'll pump out the propaganda science articles, claiming it "might be genetic" or "chemical". Pedophiles can't help it. They are wired that way. We must have tolerance. They are victims. Gays apparently are "more equal" than polygamists, pedophiles, transgender (changing soon. They will be the next angels we have to adore. We will start to see transgendered characters in sitcoms. It will be taught in school as special and wonderful. It's already happening now)

We've gone from gays demanding right to Christians now being targeted and harassed for their beliefs. Freedom of Speech is a one way street on Authoritarian Ave.


Since the definition of marriage is being changed, I'm going to place my bet on incest to be the next frontier.... after all the gay activists claim “Life comes down to who you love and who loves you back — government has no place in the middle.”


Shouldn’t that include committed incestuous relationships? If love and commitment are now the justification for marriage, why exempt this? The reason we don't allow incest relationships is because of the deformity in the children it can cause. But wait! Gay couples can't have children! So what's stopping them? A father with a son/step-son or a mother and a daughter/step daughter can't produce children.

I can see a real tax advantage to this also for If that were so, if I wanted to pass on my estate without death [taxes], I could marry my daughter and pass on my estate to her. After all if life comes down to who you love and who loves you back, if a father and son love each other so much they want to get married, there is little moral difference between two people of the same sex getting married who are not related and want to be and two people of the same sex who already are related becoming closer.
 
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Re: On gay marriage, America's house may not stay divided for long

Yes it is a valid point to include the history of organizations that were part of the gay rights movement in the beginning. I have never claimed all agreed with NAMBLA but that NAMBLA was part of their organizations for decades. To deny that is being intellectually dishonest.



http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/North_American_Man/Boy_Love_Association

This article shows certain organizations within the gay movement putting pressure on other organizations within the gay movement with ties to NAMBLA to break them at the same time connecting the ties to NAMBLA with certain gay rights organizations nationally and internationally.

Now you and others continue to go back to my NAMBLA statement as not being valid. Well clearly the organization had ties to the gay rights movement. Deal with it. It seems you all are using the NAMBLA issue to avoid discussing how laws on discrimination and Gay marriage are affecting us now and the affects they will have in the future.

You really aren't getting the concept of an association fallacy.
 
Re: On gay marriage, America's house may not stay divided for long

Since the definition of marriage is being changed, I'm going to place my bet on incest to be the next frontier.... after all the gay activists claim “Life comes down to who you love and who loves you back — government has no place in the middle.”


Shouldn’t that include committed incestuous relationships? If love and commitment are now the justification for marriage now, why exempt this? The reason we don't allow incest relationships is because of the deformity in the children in can cause. But wait! Gay couples can't have children! So what's stopping them? A father with a son/step-son or a mother and a daughter/step daughter can't produce children.

I can see a real tax advantage to this also for If that were so, if I wanted to pass on my estate without death [taxes], I could marry my daughter and pass on my estate to her. After all if life comes down to who you love and who loves you back, if a father and son love each other so much they want to get married, there is little moral difference between two people of the same sex getting married who are not related and want to be and two people of the same sex who already are related becoming closer.

Slippery slope fallacy.

Fallacious arguments.
 
Re: On gay marriage, America's house may not stay divided for long

Slippery slope fallacy.

Fallacious arguments.

Yes I have been told that by others in this thread, you sound like a parrot. And just like all the other parrots you fail to acknowledge sometimes there really are slippery slopes. And just like the rest you come to the fight armed with a spoon.
 
Re: On gay marriage, America's house may not stay divided for long

Like Agent J said....nothing negative.

Unless of course you're a bigoted religious nut filled with hatred and hypocrisy...


The vast majority of us are feeling secure and happy with the "changes".

The stuck broken record syndrome. Don't agree with me? Automatically I'll call them bigots, haters, hypocrites and such. Over and over. LOL.

You get no mileage out of that anymore . It's been way over played.

Here's a snip from sociologist Mark Regnerus study that was published in Social Science Research, Volume 41, Issue 4 July 2012 as it relates to children of gay couples:
"Although the findings reported herein may be explicable in part by a variety of forces uniquely problematic for child development in lesbian and gay families—including a lack of social support for parents, stress exposure resulting from persistent stigma, and modest or absent legal security for their parental and romantic relationship statuses—the empirical claim that no notable differences exist must go."

He found kids raised by gays have more problems than by straight parents. Now he doesn't make any claim that gays can't do a good job just that overall he found their kids had more problems. That runs counter to many previous reports and he explains why. Pretty common sense stuff if a person takes the time to read it instead of the attack machine that went out of control when he published the report. The thought police hit the melt down mode on this one.

So as vesper has been saying, a lot of thought should go into any gay marriage decisions. Marriage sets the standards for the family unit even though that unit has been under attack from the left as well for years already. Sorry ladies but single women usually make poor daddies. Not always, but usually. So now if we start adding even more strain on kids with gay parents, which the research shows higher numbers will have, what's tomorrow look like?
 
Re: On gay marriage, America's house may not stay divided for long

That's complete BS.

Straight people have so FUBAR'd marriage it's not even funny.

Don't tell me you support Kim K getting married to Kanye, but two "real" people in love who happen to be of the same sex can't do the same thing.

Society isn't going to radically change because a small sub-set of something less than 5% of the overall population is allowed to get married.

If you don't like the idea, don't do it, but don't try to prevent others from doing it.

Kinda like drinking beer or smoking cigarettes.
 
Re: On gay marriage, America's house may not stay divided for long

The fail is you not willing to recognize how much NAMBLA was associated with the modern gay rights movement. Up until just recently gays started distanting themselves from the group. Up until recently they marched in gay pride parades.

Harryhaysignnambla2.jpg


Meet Harry Hay the founder of the Mattachine Society, the first gay rights organization in the country. The problem with Harry for gays is his support for NAMBLA. Though there has been an effort to sanitize this knowledge, NAMBLA is very open about Harry's relationship with the organization.

Harry Hay on Man/Boy Love
And today Harry Hay is recognized at the LGBTH history. His day is October 8th.
Harry Hay | LGBTHistoryMonth.com

So for you or anyone else to deny the history of the gay movement that welcomed the support of NAMBLA up until recently is revising history.

And as we see the redefinition of marriage unfolding before our eyes under "civil rights" there is no reason to believe that other sexual preferences will not follow.

And ****ing KKK members marched in Tea Party rallies. You want to take responsibility for them? Voting Republican leads to deportation of non-whites? "Theres no reason to believe" that such things wont follow?

No, because that would be silly.

By the way, there are heterosexual pedophiles. Therefore you shouldn't have the right to get married, yes? Slippery slope, man.
 
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Re: On gay marriage, America's house may not stay divided for long

The stuck broken record syndrome. Don't agree with me? Automatically I'll call them bigots, haters, hypocrites and such. Over and over. LOL.

You get no mileage out of that anymore . It's been way over played.

Here's a snip from sociologist Mark Regnerus study that was published in Social Science Research, Volume 41, Issue 4 July 2012 as it relates to children of gay couples:
"Although the findings reported herein may be explicable in part by a variety of forces uniquely problematic for child development in lesbian and gay families—including a lack of social support for parents, stress exposure resulting from persistent stigma, and modest or absent legal security for their parental and romantic relationship statuses—the empirical claim that no notable differences exist must go."

He found kids raised by gays have more problems than by straight parents. Now he doesn't make any claim that gays can't do a good job just that overall he found their kids had more problems. That runs counter to many previous reports and he explains why. Pretty common sense stuff if a person takes the time to read it instead of the attack machine that went out of control when he published the report. The thought police hit the melt down mode on this one.

So as vesper has been saying, a lot of thought should go into any gay marriage decisions. Marriage sets the standards for the family unit even though that unit has been under attack from the left as well for years already. Sorry ladies but single women usually make poor daddies. Not always, but usually. So now if we start adding even more strain on kids with gay parents, which the research shows higher numbers will have, what's tomorrow look like?

Kids raised by gays have more trouble than other kids because of ****ing people like you downloading your **** onto your children. And because the system you are right now defending gives the parents that trouble.

The man is saying this is your fault.
 
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Re: On gay marriage, America's house may not stay divided for long

Kids raised by gays have more trouble than other kids because of ****ing people like you downloading your **** onto your children. And because the system you are right now defending gives the parents that trouble.

The man is saying this is your fault.

That tactic always amazed me. They care so much about the children, but yet it is people who are part of the anti-gay crowd who have made it an issue for children being raised by gays and caused the problem. there would be absolutely no problem with children of homosexual parents if there was not any homophobes who become vindictive against family members because the gay people don't care about their disapproval. If they do not like the children of homosexuals suffering abuse the religious right and the homophobe society need to STFU and stop abusing them for actions that are not theirs. Oddly these same people seem to be the ones who oppose anti-bullying laws so fervently because it takes away one of their larger arguments, and their biggest way of intimidating gays and making their lives more miserable.

One should also note that the damage done to children from failed straight marriages and mistakes with pregnancy are issues that right now do not effect gay parents. Without being forced into straight relationships out of fear of retaliation for looking gay, homosexuals have far less unintended unplanned pregnancies, and their marriages are presently more stable on average and last longer than straight marriages presently do. Being that a true homosexual couple has to plan for a child and does not just accidentally get pregnant from homosexual sexual activity they know they are at least starting in a prepared position for a child. Being that they have had to fight for marriage and it is not something they could do on a whim in vegas because they were drunk they have made far fewer mistakes in marriage as straights. now one of those issues will change as gay marriage becomes as accesible as straight marriage, but their unintended and unwanted children stats are dropping as sham straight marriages become less common because they are not necessary anymore. It may turn out that due to the fact gays need to chose to become pregnant and make an active choice in the matter their parenting may be better than straights who will always have accidental and unplanned pregnancies plaguing them. Only time will tell on that one.
 
Re: On gay marriage, America's house may not stay divided for long

well we are at 40 pages now

do anybody have any FACTUAL NEGATIVE consequences, any?
 
Re: On gay marriage, America's house may not stay divided for long

And ****ing KKK members marched in Tea Party rallies. You want to take responsibility for them? Voting Republican leads to deportation of non-whites? "Theres no reason to believe" that such things wont follow?

No, because that would be silly.

By the way, there are heterosexual pedophiles. Therefore you shouldn't have the right to get married, yes? Slippery slope, man.

Seems to me the darling of the KKK is the forever Robert Byrd, W. Va Senator of West Virginia,,,,,,,Democrat. And the rest of the Dixiecrats.

Your hyperbole shows the weakness in your argument
Someone points out the association of some with NAMBLA with the gay rights movement and you fall apart because you can't justify it.
So you attack the Tea Party? When the biggest arrogant bastards in promotion of the KKK were the friggin Democrats. (AKA Dixiecrats}
But hey when your losing a battle what better time than to play the f-ing race card!


;.
 
Re: On gay marriage, America's house may not stay divided for long

That's complete BS.

Straight people have so FUBAR'd marriage it's not even funny.

Don't tell me you support Kim K getting married to Kanye, but two "real" people in love who happen to be of the same sex can't do the same thing.

Society isn't going to radically change because a small sub-set of something less than 5% of the overall population is allowed to get married.

If you don't like the idea, don't do it, but don't try to prevent others from doing it.

Kinda like drinking beer or smoking cigarettes.

its all nonsense the anti-equal rights and anti gay marriage posts getting destroyed in this thread are hilarious
 
Re: On gay marriage, America's house may not stay divided for long

well we are at 40 pages now

do anybody have any FACTUAL NEGATIVE consequences, any?


It doesn't matter if the consequences were reported through valid studies, through personal experiences, through statistics collected by the government You sure as hell ain't about to accept them cause your intolerant one minded self won't allow you to and instead of responding to such things it is easier to keep eluding that you have the "facts" and everyone else is full of ****. What a cop out. What a bogus façade you hide behind.
 
Re: On gay marriage, America's house may not stay divided for long

The stuck broken record syndrome. Don't agree with me? Automatically I'll call them bigots, haters, hypocrites and such. Over and over. LOL.

You get no mileage out of that anymore . It's been way over played.

Here's a snip from sociologist Mark Regnerus study that was published in Social Science Research, Volume 41, Issue 4 July 2012 as it relates to children of gay couples:
"Although the findings reported herein may be explicable in part by a variety of forces uniquely problematic for child development in lesbian and gay families—including a lack of social support for parents, stress exposure resulting from persistent stigma, and modest or absent legal security for their parental and romantic relationship statuses—the empirical claim that no notable differences exist must go."

He found kids raised by gays have more problems than by straight parents. Now he doesn't make any claim that gays can't do a good job just that overall he found their kids had more problems. That runs counter to many previous reports and he explains why. Pretty common sense stuff if a person takes the time to read it instead of the attack machine that went out of control when he published the report. The thought police hit the melt down mode on this one.

So as vesper has been saying, a lot of thought should go into any gay marriage decisions. Marriage sets the standards for the family unit even though that unit has been under attack from the left as well for years already. Sorry ladies but single women usually make poor daddies. Not always, but usually. So now if we start adding even more strain on kids with gay parents, which the research shows higher numbers will have, what's tomorrow look like?

REGNERUS: I got taken to task for leaning on young adults’ assessments of their parents’ relationships. I didn’t ask them whether they thought their mom was a lesbian or if their dad was gay. Because, in part, self-identity is a different kind of thing than behavior, and lot of people weren’t “out” in that era. I think we can all think of moms and dads when we were growing up that we either knew or suspected were gay or lesbian, but never “came out of the closet,” so to speak. So, I didn’t want to make the assumption that these young adults would identify their parents as gay or lesbian, so I kept the focus on relationship behavior. [...]
And when pushed, a lot of people who were critics of mine will say: “Yeah, we know that, obviously, family structure matters,” and then they’ll complain, “Why didn’t you find many stably coupled lesbians?” Well, they just were not that common in the nationally representative population. There were two cases where they said the mom and her partner lived together for 18 years. There was another several who lived together for 15 or 13 years. So, stability in the sense of long-term was not common. And frankly, it’s not all that common among heterosexual population. I take pains in the study to say this is not about saying gay or lesbian parents are inherently bad. [...]
I’d be more careful about the language I used to describe people whose parents had same-sex relationships. I said “lesbian mothers” and “gay fathers,” when in fact, I don’t know about their sexual orientation; I do know about their same-sex relationship behavior. But as far as the findings themselves, I stand behind them.
Mark Regnerus Admits His 'Family Structures' Study Wasn't About Gay Parenting | ThinkProgress
 
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