• This is a political forum that is non-biased/non-partisan and treats every person's position on topics equally. This debate forum is not aligned to any political party. In today's politics, many ideas are split between and even within all the political parties. Often we find ourselves agreeing on one platform but some topics break our mold. We are here to discuss them in a civil political debate. If this is your first visit to our political forums, be sure to check out the RULES. Registering for debate politics is necessary before posting. Register today to participate - it's free!

Pope Francis on gays: `Who am I to judge?'[W:65,239]

Bronson said:
If you want to bash The Bible and call it a book of fairy tales, feel free to create another thread.

That isn't the topic of this thread
Click to expand...

You're not a moderator and you don't play one on TV.
 
Bronson said:
Huh? This is exactly what I'm talking about. Stop trying to make this thread about me. You are projecting motivations and intentions onto me without a shred of evidence. I have never once condemned anyone in this thread. I'm merely quoting scripture and explaining what The Church's teaching are. As a practicing Catholic who grew up in The Church, I probably know a lot more about Catholicism than you do. The only condemnation that's happening in this thread is from the Bible bashers who have tried to derail it with mockery. Their hate speech allowed to continue unchecked.

What is The Bible's definition of a sodomite? Tell me
Click to expand...

Haven't heard a "no true Scotsman" in a while. Good for you.
 
First this...

Bronson said:
Huh? This is exactly what I'm talking about. Stop trying to make this thread about me.
Click to expand...


followed by this...

As a practicing Catholic who grew up in The Church, I probably know a lot more about Catholicism than you do.

te only condemnation that's happening in this thread is from the Bible bashers who have tried to derail it with mockery. Their hate speech allowed to continue unchecked.
Click to expand...
What is The Bible's definition of a sodomite? Tell me
Click to expand...

The hits just keep coming. I do believe the condemnation you refer to came from that book of fairy tales you hold dear.
 
Bronson said:
Huh? This is exactly what I'm talking about. Stop trying to make this thread about me. You are projecting motivations and intentions onto me without a shred of evidence. I have never once condemned anyone in this thread. I'm merely quoting scripture and explaining what The Church's teaching are. As a practicing Catholic who grew up in The Church, I probably know a lot more about Catholicism than you do. The only condemnation that's happening in this thread is from the Bible bashers who have tried to derail it with mockery. Their hate speech allowed to continue unchecked.

What is The Bible's definition of a sodomite? Tell me
Click to expand...

You're doing making it about you, not me.

Bible, people definition is people who live in Sodom. Nothing more.
 
No where in the bible is the term "sodomite" ever used as a synonym for homosexual.

The definition of sodomy is simply an anal or oral sex act.
Something the VAST majority of all humans have done, thought about doing, and/or will do.

Even heterosexual married couples are guilty of the biblical definition of sodomy.


Truth in fact that a "Sodomite" is only used to define a person who lived and died in the city of Sodom.

Now surely there was a gay person or three who was a resident of Sodom.

Gigantic hypocritical and ignorant leap to suggest that straight people were not also Sodomites.

That of course is all based on the concept that the biblical city of Sodom ever really existed.

However, to connect the dots, if gay people are "sodomites" because they engage in anal and/or oral sex, then the majority of all humans are "sodomites" for the very same reasons.
 
Bronson said:
What is The Bible's definition of a sodomite?
Click to expand...

If you've ever given or received oral sex - YOU are guilty of sodomy, which based on your chosen definition make YOU a sodomite.
Based on biblical definitions.

Or are you seriously going to sit there and state that you've never given or received oral sex?
And that you were a virgin until you got married?
 
Dragonfly said:
If you've ever given or received oral sex - YOU are guilty of sodomy, which based on your chosen definition make YOU a sodomite.
Based on biblical definitions.

Or are you seriously going to sit there and state that you've never given or received oral sex?
And that you were a virgin until you got married?
Click to expand...

May not be his choice. Just saying. Be kind.
 
Dragonfly said:
No where in the bible is the term "sodomite" ever used as a synonym for homosexual.

The definition of sodomy is simply an anal or oral sex act.
Something the VAST majority of all humans have done, thought about doing, and/or will do.

Even heterosexual married couples are guilty of the biblical definition of sodomy.


Truth in fact that a "Sodomite" is only used to define a person who lived and died in the city of Sodom.

Now surely there was a gay person or three who was a resident of Sodom.

Gigantic hypocritical and ignorant leap to suggest that straight people were not also Sodomites.

That of course is all based on the concept that the biblical city of Sodom ever really existed.

However, to connect the dots, if gay people are "sodomites" because they engage in anal and/or oral sex, then the majority of all humans are "sodomites" for the very same reasons.
Click to expand...

Sodomites was a term used to collectively describe the "detestable acts", debauchery and sin going on at Sodom and Gomorrah. Engaging in homosexual sex is specifically referred to as a "detestable act" in the bible. A mortal sin. You know what God did to that city right? If you have a problem with Christians describing sodomites as sinners than take it up with God. It's his law.

Leviticus 20:13

If a man also lie with mankind, as he lieth with a woman, both of them have committed an abomination: they shall surely be put to death; their blood shall be upon them.
Click to expand...

Meaning if they don't repent and stop the behavior they will be denied entry into God's Kingdom. God destroyed Sodom and Gomorrah because the city had become San Francisco on steroids. "Do what thou wilt" was the culture. There was nobody left in the city (after Lot and his family fled) who wasn't engaging in homosexual sex, gambling, incest and all kinds of other "detestable acts". It was a Godless city.

Whether YOU believe that or not is your business. I'm just telling you what The Bible and The Catholic Church teach about it because obviously you and a handful of other posters are ignorant on the subject. This thread is about The Pope's views on homosexual sex. The Pope's views are The Church's views. Stop trying to tell Christians what their churches teach. You are not a Christian. None of you bashing the religion know anything about it.
 
Bottom line here is that the bible never used the word sodomite to define a homosexual or a homosexual act.

It described sex acts between any and all sexes as well as a whole lot more.

So that means "sodomite" can be used to describe billions upon billions of adults all across the globe regardless of who they have sex with.

To limit using the term to define gay people, or gay acts is ignorant and silly.
 
Moderator's Warning:
Attacks from this point on will result in thread bans and points. Probably a good idea to stick to the topic.
 
Bronson said:
If you have a problem with Christians describing sodomites as sinners than take it up with God. It's his law.
Click to expand...

I have a problem with you limiting the term "sodomite" to just the one select group of people you detest.
 
Bronson said:
Read The Bible. You're wasting my time. This is not open to debate. You can google and link some dumb WAPO piece all you want. It doesn't matter.
The Bible is very clear.
Click to expand...
That's the source. Read Lev. 18:22, Lev. 20:13, ect. Engaging in homosexual sex is a sin and an abomination. This is what The Pope believes. This is what The Catholic Church teaches. This is directly from the mouth of Jesus Christ/God who are one in the same. You and a few others have completely derailed this thread into bible bashing. If you want to do that, fine, go create a thread and do that. You're not the authority (and neither are these "bible scholars") and what parts of The Bible Christians adhere to and what they don't however. The Bible is the moral textbook to living a Christian life. Living your life by God's Laws. God's rules. Not a life where you live by your own rules. That's why these Left Wing Collectivist "utopias" always turn out to be Hell on Earth. When Government has all the power, the only morality and rules it plays by are it's own. If homosexuals want to do whatever they want and engage in gay sex, fine, but when you die you always pay the wages of sin. That's what The Bible says. That's what The Catholic Church teaches. If you want to create your own religion where gays and everyone can do what they want, then go do that.

You're the same poster who defends every lie that comes out of Obama's mouth. You're not an authority on The Bible. You're certainly not a believer. I love these phonies who don't believe in The Bible and mock God trying to tell Christians what's in The Bible and what God's Laws are. Homosexual sex IS a sin and an abomination. Don't like it? Not my problem.
Click to expand...




Especially The Book of Revelation, Eh?
 
Bronson said:
As I've been stating in this thread over and over

That's between me and God. Just like engaging in homosexual sex is between the sodomite and God.

Got it now? Good.
Click to expand...

Then keep it between you and god. Rather than rushing to judgement and condemn others for the sty in their eye you need to concentrate on the beam in your own.

Got it now? Good!
 
Bronson said:
Read The Bible. You're wasting my time. This is not open to debate. You can google and link some dumb WAPO piece all you want. It doesn't matter. The Bible is very clear. That's the source. Read Lev. 18:22, Lev. 20:13, ect. Engaging in homosexual sex is a sin and an abomination.
Click to expand...

Lev. also says that those who commit adultery shall be put to death, as well as those who commit bestiality. It says that if a man has sex with a woman and her mother, all 3 shall be burnt with fire......so, do you think we should follow those commands, too or do you pick and choose?
 
Scrabaholic said:
Lev. also says that those who commit adultery shall be put to death, as well as those who commit bestiality. It says that if a man has sex with a woman and her mother, all 3 shall be burnt with fire......so, do you think we should follow those commands, too or do you pick and choose?
Click to expand...

I already explained this in a previous post. By "all 3 shall be burnt in fire", God is referring to Hell. Everlasting damnation if you do not repent for your sins. Cheating on your wife is a sin. Having sex with children is a sin. Having sex with the same sex is a sin. By put to death, God is referring to true death. The soul being damned eternally in Hell. This debate is not about whether you agree with The Bible or not. This thread is about The Pope's views on homosexuality. No Christian is calling for gays to be murdered in the streets or something. Nice hyperbole. Is engaging in gay sex a sin, abomination and a detestable act in God's eyes? Yes Does it violate God's Laws. Yes.

disneydude said:
Then keep it between you and god. Rather than rushing to judgement and condemn others for the sty in their eye you need to concentrate on the beam in your own.

Got it now? Good!
Click to expand...

Quote me where I judge someone

You keep dangling this strawman around without offering any proof
 
Bronson said:
Evidence of what?

What is the topic of the thread? Do you even know what we are debating? You're obviously confused, since you have repeatedly tried to derail this thread with nonsensical gibberish. This thread is about The Pope's views on homosexuality. It's about the Catholic Church's views on homosexuality. You and a handful of other histrionics have tried to make this about me. It's silly.

The only thing I've been saying this entire thread is what The Catholic Church's view on homosexuality is. The Pope is not going to change The Bible. He doesn't have that power. Now I understand that you don't believe that. That we don't have the same views (which is fine). That you want The Catholic Church and The Bible to teach that homosexuality is cool, hip and trendy because that's what Pop Culture tells you what to think. This is why The Bible is hated by people who think anyone should be able to do what they want. The Bible is black and white. Cut and dry.

The Bible is VERY clear when it comes to engaging in homosexual sex. It is a sin and an abomination. That's right out of The Bible. I didn't make that rule. God did. I only follow it. I don't judge anyone for not following it. That's between that person and God.

This thread has been totally derailed into another Christian bashing fest which honestly is a shame.
Click to expand...

I'll address your point and stay on topic.

The pope seems to be contradicting the bible. The pope is supposedly the voice of god and infallible. The old testament has all sorts of diet restrictions, forbids working on the sabbath under penalty of death, requires a bride to be a virgin under penalty of death, and a host of other restrictions that have either fallen out of favor and been ignored or were lifted under the new testament. The conflicts between the new and old testament show that the bible can be changed, and if anyone is to do it, its the pope.


Should the United States ban Christianity?
Click to expand...

that would be just as silly as sodomy laws and DOMA
 
Bronson said:
Read The Bible. You're wasting my time. This is not open to debate. You can google and link some dumb WAPO piece all you want. It doesn't matter. The Bible is very clear. That's the source. Read Lev. 18:22, Lev. 20:13, ect. Engaging in homosexual sex is a sin and an abomination. This is what The Pope believes. This is what The Catholic Church teaches. This is directly from the mouth of Jesus Christ/God who are one in the same. You and a few others have completely derailed this thread into bible bashing. If you want to do that, fine, go create a thread and do that. You're not the authority (and neither are these "bible scholars") and what parts of The Bible Christians adhere to and what they don't however. The Bible is the moral textbook to living a Christian life. Living your life by God's Laws. God's rules. Not a life where you live by your own rules. That's why these Left Wing Collectivist "utopias" always turn out to be Hell on Earth. When Government has all the power, the only morality and rules it plays by are it's own. If homosexuals want to do whatever they want and engage in gay sex, fine, but when you die you always pay the wages of sin. That's what The Bible says. That's what The Catholic Church teaches. If you want to create your own religion where gays and everyone can do what they want, then go do that.

You're the same poster who defends every lie that comes out of Obama's mouth. You're not an authority on The Bible. You're certainly not a believer. I love these phonies who don't believe in The Bible and mock God trying to tell Christians what's in The Bible and what God's Laws are. Homosexual sex IS a sin and an abomination. Don't like it? Not my problem.
Click to expand...

Just had a few minutes. Thought t,o give you some readings to ponder:

The Holiness Code – Scripture Study
Leviticus 18:22 & 20:13
Christians today do not follow the rules and rituals described in Leviticus. But some ignore its definitions of their own "uncleanness" while quoting Leviticus to condemn "homosexuals." Such abuse of Scripture distorts the Old Testament meaning and denies a New Testament message. "You shall not lie with a male as one lies with a female; it is an abomination." These words occur solely in the Holiness Code of Leviticus, a ritual manual for Israel's priests. Their meaning can only be fully appreciated in the historical and cultural context of the ancient Hebrew people. Israel, in a unique place as the chosen people of one God, was to avoid the practices of other peoples and gods.
Hebrew religion, characterized by the revelation of one God, stood in continuous tension with the religion of the surrounding Canaanites who worshipped the multiple gods of fertility cults. Canaanite idol worship, which featured female and male cult prostitution as noted in Deuteronomy 23:17, repeatedly compromised Israel's loyalty to God. The Hebrew word for a male cult prostitute, qadesh, is mistranslated "sodomite" in some versions of the Bible.

http://mccchurch.org/?wpfb_dl=4
 
That's cool I guess. His view and opinion aren't nearly as significant if you consider that they have no bearing on the opinions or viewpoints of the Church. It's just one man being progressive, not the entire institution.
 
Boo Radley said:
Just had a few minutes. Thought t,o give you some readings to ponder:

The Holiness Code – Scripture Study
Leviticus 18:22 & 20:13
Christians today do not follow the rules and rituals described in Leviticus. But some ignore its definitions of their own "uncleanness" while quoting Leviticus to condemn "homosexuals." Such abuse of Scripture distorts the Old Testament meaning and denies a New Testament message. "You shall not lie with a male as one lies with a female; it is an abomination." These words occur solely in the Holiness Code of Leviticus, a ritual manual for Israel's priests. Their meaning can only be fully appreciated in the historical and cultural context of the ancient Hebrew people. Israel, in a unique place as the chosen people of one God, was to avoid the practices of other peoples and gods.
Hebrew religion, characterized by the revelation of one God, stood in continuous tension with the religion of the surrounding Canaanites who worshipped the multiple gods of fertility cults. Canaanite idol worship, which featured female and male cult prostitution as noted in Deuteronomy 23:17, repeatedly compromised Israel's loyalty to God. The Hebrew word for a male cult prostitute, qadesh, is mistranslated "sodomite" in some versions of the Bible.

http://mccchurch.org/?wpfb_dl=4
Click to expand...

Don't know who that is. Don't care.

They aren't the authority on what The Church believes/teaches anyways.

Not really sure what point you are trying to prove here.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top Bottom