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Drug Agency Lowers Age For Next-Day Birth Control [W:297]

Deuce said:
Should children need parental permission to buy a soda? Tylenol? Condoms? Is your "huge problem" because of an emotional aversion to the idea that teenagers have sex, or is there some medical reasoning behind your treating condoms and morning after pills differently?
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Um, Buying contraception and buying a soda are two different concepts entirely.
 
jmotivator said:
Hmmm... protected my not be the right phrase here. The existence of the morning after pill all but ensures that young girls will be less likely to have protected sex on the assumption they can fix it later.
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ugh.

"Hmmm... "protected" may not be the right word here."

Translated that for me.
 
Deuce said:
Should children need parental permission to buy a soda? Tylenol? Condoms? Is your "huge problem" because of an emotional aversion to the idea that teenagers have sex, or is there some medical reasoning behind your treating condoms and morning after pills differently?
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So many logically fallacies in this attempted spin to make things personal, it's quite amazing.

Believe it or not, there are parents out there that are involved in the lives of their children, that have good and trusting relationships, and do not feel (as some seem to) that government needs to take over. Lord knows just about anything government touches turns to crap. So they can stay away from our children, and quit trying to remove the rights and responsibilities of parents.
 
Deuce said:
Why doesn't it make sense? You don't need a doctor to buy tylenol. On what medical basis do you make this statement?



... why on earth would people shoplift this product, of all things? It's not like there's going to be a black market for morning after pills.
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There probably will be.
 
These pills are powerful hormones allowing abuse and I am concerned of them using as pranks or to covertly force chemical abortion a girl/female may not want to have.
 
Northern Light said:
I don't support giving parents that authority. My own parents were pro-life and I'm pro-choice. I wasn't sexually active as a teenager, but if I was and needed my parents' permission to get the morning after pill, I can guarantee you they'd say no. Same goes for an abortion. Besides which, my parents finding out I had pre-marital sex would lead to great shame and potential disownment. My reproductive status is none of their business.

If they're mature enough to be having sex and maybe get pregnant, then they're mature enough to use the morning after pill.

My only concern is the lack of research about this pill for girls at age 15. But the FDA has been wreckless in recent years, so they'll just let the public experiment until something goes wrong and then modify the drug policy, as usual.
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Did they pay for the health insurance that covered you? If something had gone wrong, whose insurance would have paid for it....yours or your parents'? There's nothing like being 15 and smarter than everyone around you.
 
I have a daughter, and I would sure have liked to know if my daughter was having sex at age 15. I wonder how many people without daughters or any children are piping up in here as a bunch of know-it-alls, trying to tell us how parents shouldn't know if their daughters are taking a pill. You have no idea how it feels to be a parent. I've been a teen, and frankly even the most level-headed teens are stupid about life. It's easy to be a parent-hater until you are one.
 
danarhea said:
Um, Buying contraception and buying a soda are two different concepts entirely.
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Yes feel free to dodge the rest of the post.

Arbo said:
So many logically fallacies in this attempted spin to make things personal, it's quite amazing.

Believe it or not, there are parents out there that are involved in the lives of their children, that have good and trusting relationships, and do not feel (as some seem to) that government needs to take over. Lord knows just about anything government touches turns to crap. So they can stay away from our children, and quit trying to remove the rights and responsibilities of parents.
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The government hasn't taken over anything. They made a product more available. In what universe is that a government takeover of anything? They REMOVED restrictions.
 
Deuce said:
The government hasn't taken over anything. They made a product more available. In what universe is that a government takeover of anything? They REMOVED restrictions.
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Do you have children?
 
joko104 said:
There probably will be.
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Why would there be a black market for a product you can buy at any pharmacy? There's no black market for snickers bars, dude.

joko104 said:
These pills are powerful hormones allowing abuse and I am concerned of them using as pranks or to covertly force chemical abortion a girl/female may not want to have.
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They don't cause abortions and nobody is going to prank anyone with morning after pills, what the hell? Anything can theoretically be used as a prank, I think laxatives are going to be a more popular choice.
 
American said:
Did they pay for the health insurance that covered you? If something had gone wrong, whose insurance would have paid for it....yours or your parents'? There's nothing like being 15 and smarter than everyone around you.
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Yeah, the support for this decision fails miserably when you realize that they are attributing clear thinking and maturity to 15 year olds. One has to wonder if the people making this argument were ever 15 years old.
 
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Northern Light said:
I get it, I really do. We want what's best for our children. We see them as precious and vulnerable. But as teenagers they tend to see themselves as invincible, and want to test the waters of independence.

My issue is this. We don't really have totally control over our kids once they reach a certain age. I mean, on paper we do. But they're going to do things against our will. One of those things could be having sex and maybe getting pregnant. If a young woman has to wait for her mother's permission to get the morning after pill, the fertilized egg could implant and then it will be abortion territory.

If a 15 year old even has the wisdom to know she should seek the morning after pill, then she would spare her parents a lot of agony by quietly dealing with. If she needs an abortion then she would definitely need parental permission, and that's when the can of worms really gets opened, whether her parents say yes or not.
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Up until she can't afford the MAP because she thinks it is a convenient form of birth control, that unlike other forms of birth control, she doesn't have to get a prescription for. Teens don't think ahead, they don't think about the consequences of what they do, which is why we shouldn't be allowing them to have the easy way out.

I understand the other side, I really do, but this is going to turn into birth control on demand rather than the emergency birth control it is designed for. Many young college age women already use it that way.
 
Deuce said:
Have you taken a morning after pill?
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So you do not have any children, thanks for the indirect answer via failed diversion from the question.
 
joko104 said:
These pills are powerful hormones allowing abuse and I am concerned of them using as pranks or to covertly force chemical abortion a girl/female may not want to have.
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Not to mention that these drugs will not really be tracked in any meaningful way if they are over the counter, so a kid as young as 15 can buy boxes of them and sell then to kids who are 11, 12 years old.
 
Arbo said:
So you do not have any children, thanks for the indirect answer via failed diversion from the question.
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Let me stop you right there. You're blatantly attempting to avoid discussion of the issue by declaring that someone who doesn't have children has no valid opinion on the subject.

If you have no point to make, don't post.
 
Deuce said:
Let me stop you right there. You're blatantly attempting to avoid discussion of the issue by declaring that someone who doesn't have children has no valid opinion on the subject.

If you have no point to make, don't post.
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I am avoiding nothing, I asked a question, and rather than answer it you diverted by asking a non-related question. And yes, there is a difference in validity of opinions on the subject between those that are currently or have already, raised children and those that have not. It's called experience. Those that have not, do not know the daily in's and out's of what a child at that age is like, at home, with personal issues. It's a simple fact.

Your last line is amazingly funny. Hi pot.
 
Deuce said:
Why doesn't it make sense? You don't need a doctor to buy tylenol. On what medical basis do you make this statement?



... why on earth would people shoplift this product, of all things? It's not like there's going to be a black market for morning after pills.
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It would move up on a shoplifter's list because many shoplifters are young women looking for things they need or want, and either can't afford or don't feel like paying for. Plus, since these pills are around $40-$50 a piece, there is no reason why young women and even men wouldn't try to snatch them rather than pay for them since many young people cannot afford that price, not without help from their parents or another adult anyway.
 
Dragonfly said:
Isn't that the issue though? You're expecting parents to actually parent.

Since obviously most don't know how, or don't care to... the alternative is...
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I wouldn't say that "most" don't. That's kind of pushing the envelope, don't you think? Anyway, this takes it completely out of the hands of parents, whether they are responsible parents or not. 15 years old is pretty young IMO.
 
roguenuke said:
Teens don't think ahead, they don't think about the consequences of what they do, which is why we shouldn't be allowing them to have the easy way out.
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YEs, we must punish children who have sex!!!

Thanks for demonstrating why parents should not be informed
 
roguenuke said:
It would move up on a shoplifter's list because many shoplifters are young women looking for things they need or want, and either can't afford or don't feel like paying for. Plus, since these pills are around $40-$50 a piece, there is no reason why young women and even men wouldn't try to snatch them rather than pay for them since many young people cannot afford that price, not without help from their parents or another adult anyway.
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This is true of literally any item on any store shelf anywhere. Yes, some things get stolen. But morning after pills are not some hot commodity that will be rampantly stolen.

Arbo said:
I am avoiding nothing, I asked a question, and rather than answer it you diverted by asking a non-related question. And yes, there is a difference in validity of opinions on the subject between those that are currently or have already, raised children and those that have not. It's called experience. Those that have not, do not know the daily in's and out's of what a child at that age is like, at home, with personal issues. It's a simple fact.

Your last line is amazingly funny. Hi pot.
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I know what children are like. And you are avoiding my point: other than your emotional aversion to the idea of a 15 year old girl having sex, there's no real reason to separate the morning after pill from cough drops or condoms. Yes, parents would like to be informed that their child is having sex. I have this incredible idea: ask them, rather than having that conversation forced upon you at a doctor's office, because by then you're too late and have already failed them.

Restricted access to birth control leads to greater frequency of unwanted pregnancy and abortion. Why would you want that for your child?
 
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Deuce said:
Your children are already sexualized. Access to this pill doesn't change that in any way. Nobody is going to go "Oh, I can get morning after pills? Forget abstinence, I'm totally having sex now!"

Teenagers have sex. They always have and always will. You can accept that and try to educate and protect them, or let them get pregnant or sick.



Nobody is going to deliberately forgo using protection just because the morning after pill exists. A teenager actually thinking about protection beforehand is going to get real protection. The trouble is that they usually don't think about it beforehand. The statistical reality is that the best way to reduce teen pregnancy and disease is comprehensive sexual education and easy access to protection. Not only do abstinence-only programs not work, they actively make things worse.
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What about STDs?

What about the ability to buy this drug for girls even younger than 15?

What about the parents right to raise their children as they see fit.

What about these side effects?: Morning-after pill: Risks - MayoClinic.com



What about this little history precedent?

"Hitler saw children as “clean slates” on which barbarism could be written, but only if they are removed from the influences of their parents. Kitty Werthmann, a living witness to life under the Nazi boot, describes how pre-Hitler Austria abounded with compassionate and respectful youth. Post Hitler brought hideous changes. Public school teachers encouraged the children to disregard their parents' “fuddy-duddy” ways. Mandatory Youth Day was designated on Sundays at the time of Catholic Mass. Parents who took their children to church instead of youth day faced capital punishment. By firmly holding the children in their hands, Nazis successfully paved the road to the Holocaust."
 
roguenuke said:
Teens don't think ahead, they don't think about the consequences of what they do, which is why we shouldn't be allowing them to have the easy way out.
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So the easy way out is to let them get pregnant? *confused*

American said:
Did they pay for the health insurance that covered you? If something had gone wrong, whose insurance would have paid for it....yours or your parents'? There's nothing like being 15 and smarter than everyone around you.
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What does your question have to do with OTC emergency contraception?

If it's OTC, they don't need to see a doctor and thus no insurance is required.

Arbo said:
Or she will be missing a 'learning moment' that could have come from her parents knowing about it.
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Maybe a better policy then would be to let her get the morning after pill, but the pharmacist has to place a call to the legal guardian?

I'm just looking at it from the standpoint of preventing an unwanted pregnancy. The more bureaucracy means the less time there is to implement the MAP.

Blue_State said:
Question is, are they mentally mature enough to be having sex? I hope we aren't hurting the next generation by assuming they are mentally mature enough.
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I don't think this question is relevant given that they ARE having sex and thus they are exposing themselves to the potential consequences. It only makes sense to give them access to some tools to deal with those consequences as well.

Girls are hitting puberty more and more early as time passes, likely because of the synthetic estrogens now in all the packaged and processed food people are eating. We're going to have to start getting used to the fact that girls are going to start being sexually active younger and younger because of our society's lifestyle.
 
WCH said:
What about STDs?

What about the ability to buy this drug for girls even younger than 15?

What about the parents right to raise their children as they see fit.

What about these side effects?: Morning-after pill: Risks - MayoClinic.com



What about this little history precedent?

"Hitler saw children as “clean slates” on which barbarism could be written, but only if they are removed from the influences of their parents. Kitty Werthmann, a living witness to life under the Nazi boot, describes how pre-Hitler Austria abounded with compassionate and respectful youth. Post Hitler brought hideous changes. Public school teachers encouraged the children to disregard their parents' “fuddy-duddy” ways. Mandatory Youth Day was designated on Sundays at the time of Catholic Mass. Parents who took their children to church instead of youth day faced capital punishment. By firmly holding the children in their hands, Nazis successfully paved the road to the Holocaust."
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Birth control linked to Nazis. Thread over.
 
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