• This is a political forum that is non-biased/non-partisan and treats every person's position on topics equally. This debate forum is not aligned to any political party. In today's politics, many ideas are split between and even within all the political parties. Often we find ourselves agreeing on one platform but some topics break our mold. We are here to discuss them in a civil political debate. If this is your first visit to our political forums, be sure to check out the RULES. Registering for debate politics is necessary before posting. Register today to participate - it's free!

Pastor Rick Warren's son commits suicide

The National Institute of Mental Health is saying: "Eliminate access to firearms or other potential tools for suicide, including unsupervised access to medications."

Would you leave a gun around a son with "severe depression and suicidal thoughts"?

No, but the same paragraph you quoted also said to not leave the person alone, presumably until they get admitted to a mental health facility or hospital for an evaluation. My understanding is the son committed the act in his own home. It remains to be seen where, when, and under what circumstances he obtained the gun. Until then, I'll reserve judgment concerning Rick Warren.
 
No, but the same paragraph you quoted also said to not leave the person alone, presumably until they get admitted to a mental health facility or hospital for an evaluation.

So by your reasoning, if you can't do that, there is no point in limiting access to guns and other potential tools for suicide???

My understanding is the son committed the act in his own home.
It remains to be seen where, when, and under what circumstances he obtained the gun. Until then, I'll reserve judgment concerning Rick Warren.

Fair enough, but we do know that Warren was aware his son suffered from severe depression and suicidal thoughts.
 
So by your reasoning, if you can't do that, there is no point in limiting access to guns and other potential tools for suicide???

No, you can limit access to guns and everything else, like knives, tools, glass, bed sheets, shoelaces, rope, pills, household cleaners, nail clippers, etc. The only realistic way I see to do that indefinitely is to lock the person up in a mental hospital. What's your plan?
 
The Southern California church headed by popular evangelical Pastor Rick Warren says his 27-year-old son has committed suicide.

Warren's Saddleback Valley Community Church said in a statement that Matthew Warren had struggled with mental illness and deep depression throughout his life.

"Matthew was an incredibly kind, gentle and compassionate young man whose sweet spirit was encouragement and comfort to many," the statement said.

"Unfortunately, he also suffered from mental illness resulting in deep depression and suicidal thoughts. Despite the best health care available, this was an illness that was never fully controlled and the emotional pain resulted in his decision to take his life."

Read more: Pastor Rick Warren's son commits suicide | Fox News
One of the problems with fundamentalist Christianity is its combination of aversion to secular psychology and its tendency to inculcate false guilt.

That combination can definitely contribute to sad situations like this.

And, when it comes to creating a situational depression that never seems to end, there's nothing like having one's father so busy and concerned with the "souls" of others that he doesn't have time to spend with the heart of his own son.

Not saying that happened here .. but I know it's happened plenty of times elsewhere, with similar results.

Parents need to give their kids healthy attention .. or those kids might be compelled to unintentionally seek it by other tragic means.
 
Fair enough, but we do know that Warren was aware his son suffered from severe depression and suicidal thoughts.

Right. And mental health professionals counsel people daily who have those same characteristics but, nonetheless, enter their offices for a session and leave the same way they came in. Unless you're willing to lock them up in padded rooms indefinitely, I don't see how you can prevent some of them from becoming statistics. But, then again, living in a padded room indefinitely under a 24-hour suicide watch would be depressing.
 
Thanks for your unsubstantiated opinion there Mr. anonymous internet poster! I'll go with the studies by the National Institute of Mental Health.

And did the National Institute of Mental Health explain WHY people commit suicide?
 
No, you can limit access to guns and everything else, like knives, tools, glass, bed sheets, shoelaces, rope, pills, household cleaners, nail clippers, etc. The only realistic way I see to do that indefinitely is to lock the person up in a mental hospital. What's your plan?

Following the precautions recommended by the National Institute of Mental Health - "Eliminate access to firearms or other potential tools for suicide, including unsupervised access to medications."
 
And did the National Institute of Mental Health explain WHY people commit suicide?

"Research shows that risk factors for suicide include:

* depression and other mental disorders, or a substance-abuse disorder (often in combination with other mental disorders). More than 90 percent of people who die by suicide have these risk factors.2
* prior suicide attempt
* family history of mental disorder or substance abuse
* family history of suicide
* family violence, including physical or sexual abuse
* firearms in the home,3 the method used in more than half of suicides
* incarceration
* exposure to the suicidal behavior of others, such as family members, peers, or media figures"

NIMH · Suicide in the U.S.: Statistics and Prevention
 
Clearly this was not written for people who have been battling suicidal thoughts their entire life, it seems to be more of a guide for when you first recognize them. Are you saying they shouldn't have ever left him alone, and that they should have sought immediate help or called 911 daily?

They are recommending the part you didn't highlight in what you are responding to here - "Eliminate access to firearms or other potential tools for suicide, including unsupervised access to medications."
 
They are recommending the part you didn't highlight in what you are responding to here - "Eliminate access to firearms or other potential tools for suicide, including unsupervised access to medications."

They recommend all of it, the bolded part was a clear giveaway that it wasn't really applicable to this situation.
 
Following the precautions recommended by the National Institute of Mental Health - "Eliminate access to firearms or other potential tools for suicide, including unsupervised access to medications."

OK, but if the person is living independently in his own home it's kind of hard to do that, don't you think? I mean, let's get real and out of the fantasy realm.
 
OK, but if the person is living independently in his own home it's kind of hard to do that, don't you think? I mean, let's get real and out of the fantasy realm.

You think his Dad did not have access to his house to check for guns? I certainly would if I had a son I knew was "severely depressed with suicidal thoughts."
 
They recommend all of it, the bolded part was a clear giveaway that it wasn't really applicable to this situation.

No firearms used in this suicide, right?
 
No firearms used in this suicide, right?

Yes, but they also left him alone. That seems like the biggest factor to me. He could have found plenty of other ways, but if he wasn't alone the is a very good chance that he would have been stopped.
 
Yes, but they also left him alone. That seems like the biggest factor to me. He could have found plenty of other ways, but if he wasn't alone the is a very good chance that he would have been stopped.

Yes, they also left him alone.
 
You think his Dad did not have access to his house to check for guns? I certainly would if I had a son I knew was "severely depressed with suicidal thoughts."

Once again, without knowing the facts I don't really care to speculate on this. How do we know Rick Warren didn't check Mathew's home? We don't.
 
Back
Top Bottom