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Judge strikes age restrictions for "morning after" pill

CanadaJohn said:
If your comment isn't nonsense, ask yourself this. Currently, the morning after pill is a mandated coverage for insurance policies under the regulations under Obamacare. After this court rules that the drug can be provided OTC to young teens, do you honestly believe that HHS is going to change the regulations to remove the morning after pill from the mandate or are you suggesting that adult women will still have to get a prescription but young teens won't?
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The purchase would be reported on the EOB that the parent receives, so a teen wishing to keep this hidden from their parent will not have the insurance company pay for it.
 
roguenuke said:
Except for a couple of things that are only talked about for those who find out that have issues, which is why we have to get a prescription for birth control from a doctor. One such risk is blood clots. If you have certain blood disorders, that risk can increase a little to significantly depending on which one. Most girls don't know they have those blood disorders, particularly not as teens, because there really aren't any major complications related to them except for reproductive issues, such as heavy periods/cramping, increased risk of blood clots, and increased risk of having a miscarriage if pregnancy occurs. The hormones in birth control, including Plan B, are what cause the increase risk of blood clots.
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You are mistaken Plan B will NOT cause blood clots.

It is the estrogen in birth control pills that can cause blood clots but there is no estrogen in plan. Please read my link on post
# 227 of this thread which explains that is why Plan B is very safe.
 
sangha said:
IOW, the "evidence" of abuse is:

1) a post on a blog from some anonymous poster on the internet
2) your anecdote

Excuse me while I :roll:
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There are more than just a couple of personal stories behind this.

Misconceptions and misuse of contraception lead to high risk among college students - Features - Tufts Daily - Tufts University

The women who use the morning after pill as everyday contraception | Mail Online

This is stuff that needs to be looked into prior to giving unlimited access to teenagers who are even more irresponsible. If its found to be legitimately isolated incidents, fine, I'm wrong. But it likely isn't the case. And we really don't know what longterm effects would be of overusing Plan B because they really haven't been studied that much.
 
sangha said:
I'm not sure of this, but I suspect that the risk of blood clots results from daily use of BC, not irregular use.
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Plan B does not have estrogen and so it does not cause blood clots.
 
sangha said:
Another dishonest claim. Quelle surprise!

HIPAA does not prevent insurance companies from reporting what it has paid for. In fact, insurance companies are required to report this on their EOBs
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And again, your inability to stick to the truth is breathtaking. I did not claim they won't be able to, I said they may not be able to without breaking the provisions of HIPAA. You'll forgive me if I wait to see how it plays out rather than accept your brilliant legal opinion as fact.

They say that people tend to lash out at others for what they hate in themselves. The way you constantly claim that anyone who doesn't agree with you is dishonest says more about you than me.
 
roguenuke said:
There are more than just a couple of personal stories behind this.

Misconceptions and misuse of contraception lead to high risk among college students - Features - Tufts Daily - Tufts University

The women who use the morning after pill as everyday contraception | Mail Online

This is stuff that needs to be looked into prior to giving unlimited access to teenagers who are even more irresponsible. If its found to be legitimately isolated incidents, fine, I'm wrong. But it likely isn't the case. And we really don't know what longterm effects would be of overusing Plan B because they really haven't been studied that much.
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Your first link says nothing about regular use of MAPs, and your 2nd is a rag with no credibility. Please stop wasting time with your nonsense
 
joko104 said:
I have a bad feeling about this one.

My concern is someone else putting it in a woman's food to cause losing a ZEF she wants or to prevent pregnancy to begin with - her not even knowing. People not only can go crazy to try to prevent an abortion, other people also can go crazy trying to terminate someone else's pregnancy.

I'd prefer it be 1.) be behind the counter and 2.) limited to sales to females and 3.) a record kept of anyone who buys it.

There also needs to be INTENSELY harsh laws passed about giving this to someone without the person's knowledge. Some men and some parents totally freak out learning their girlfriend, mistress or daughter is pregnant. I see potential problems. A women likely wouldn't even known why she lost the ZEF thinking it just a miscarriage. In regards to ZEFs, its like selling cyanide pills OTC. Just slip one to any woman and end a pregnancy she wants, but you don't, in the learn stage. Or even routinely without her knowledge to avoid it happening in the first place. There also is the question of what happens if someone takes a lot of them or slips someone a lot of them at the same time.

For those reasons I'm not fond of that ruling. Those all are not only very legitimate health concerns, but also assault concerns.
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Only two people know that she was engaged in unprotected carnal knowledge the previous night. I don't know how many days afterward the birth control works, but I cannot fathom someone even thinking about putting this in her food. Well, except for you of course.

I don't think they should sell to males.

The judge is correct. Being at an age where pregnancy could occur, is old enough to buy the morning after pill.
 
CanadaJohn said:
And again, your inability to stick to the truth is breathtaking. I did not claim they won't be able to, I said they may not be able to without breaking the provisions of HIPAA.
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And again, you are lying. There is no "may not be able to". HIPAA does not prevent insurers from reporting the purchase of MAPs on their EOB.
 
minnie616 said:
You are mistaken Plan B will NOT cause blood clots.

It is the estrogen in birth control pills that can cause blood clots but there is no estrogen in plan. Please read my link on post
# 227 of this thread which explains that is why Plan B is very safe.
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Funny how they say they don't really know if there is an increased risk of blood clots from Plan B. In fact, they say that all of the same risks of birth control are present in Plan B.

Is Plan B 'Unsafe'?

And this is because it is supposed to be used as emergency contraceptive, and I am contending that this isn't how many are currently using it. As emergency contraceptive, sure it wouldn't likely cause any problems. But many are using it as a primary contraceptive, which means taking it around once every month or two or more often. That isn't emergency contraception, but main contraceptive.

And blood clots are listed as a rare side effect of Plan B.

http://www.webmd.com/drugs/mono-1347-LEVONORGESTREL+15+MG+-+ORAL.aspx?drugid=17838&drugname=Plan+b&pagenumber=6

http://www.drugs.com/cdi/plan-b-one-step.html

From the site above:

you have had a stroke or history of bleeding of the brain, known or suspected breast cancer, or a blood clotting disorder
 
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sangha said:
Your first link says nothing about regular use of MAPs, and your 2nd is a rag with no credibility. Please stop wasting time with your nonsense
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You simply don't like that there is evidence out there that it is being misused.

And yes, the first one does mention Plan B as being used when college students don't use their birth control properly, which is often.

Many other students cited birth control pills as a particularly problematic method due to the constant commitment. "I have sex a lot, which is fun. I've forgotten to take the pill a lot, which is not so fun," one student said. "I've had to use Plan B [morning-after emergency contraception]. I try to be more careful now, but I think the pill is an inconvenient method and it's hard for me to remember to take it every day, let alone at the same time every day."
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Pretty much talking about what I said. Oral contraceptives are considered inconvenient and Plan B is the backup used often. If college students have issues using their birth control properly, pretty sure high school students would have even more problems, if they are on it at all.
 
CanadaJohn said:
If your comment isn't nonsense, ask yourself this. Currently, the morning after pill is a mandated coverage for insurance policies under the regulations under Obamacare. After this court rules that the drug can be provided OTC to young teens, do you honestly believe that HHS is going to change the regulations to remove the morning after pill from the mandate or are you suggesting that adult women will still have to get a prescription but young teens won't?
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Yep that is exactly what happens every time a prescription drug becomes over the counter.
The insurance no longer pays for it unless a person gets a script from the doctor for a name brand perscrition drug that only available with a prescription then it is covered by the insurance usually with a co pay.
 
roguenuke said:
Funny how they say they don't really know if there is an increased risk of blood clots from Plan B. In fact, they say that all of the same risks of birth control are present in Plan B.

Is Plan B 'Unsafe'?

And this is because it is supposed to be used as emergency contraceptive, and I am contending that this isn't how many are currently using it. As emergency contraceptive, sure it wouldn't likely cause any problems. But many are using it as a primary contraceptive, which means taking it around once every month or two or more often. That isn't emergency contraception, but main contraceptive.
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The link you posted said nothing about Plan B posing a risk of blood clots

Please stop wasting time with your nonsense
 
roguenuke said:
You simply don't like that there is evidence out there that it is being misused.

And yes, the first one does mention Plan B as being used when college students don't use their birth control properly, which is often.



Pretty much talking about what I said. Oral contraceptives are considered inconvenient and Plan B is the backup used often. If college students have issues using their birth control properly, pretty sure high school students would have even more problems, if they are on it at all.
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It is dishonest to use an article that states that it is "often used" by a group of people in order to mislead people into thinking that it is "often used" by an individual
 
sangha said:
It is dishonest to use an article that states that it is "often used" by a group of people in order to mislead people into thinking that it is "often used" by an individual
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No. It is evidence that at least some people are misusing it. It has never been studied whether it is being misused, and it should be. We don't have to stick our heads in the sand and pretend that this couldn't be a problem just because some want to push something through for political reasons. And that is what this is, a political push.
 
roguenuke said:
No. It is evidence that at least some people are misusing it. It has never been studied whether it is being misused, and it should be. We don't have to stick our heads in the sand and pretend that this couldn't be a problem just because some want to push something through for political reasons. And that is what this is, a political push.
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The article presented no evidence of anyone misusing it.
 
CanadaJohn said:
If your comment isn't nonsense, ask yourself this. Currently, the morning after pill is a mandated coverage for insurance policies under the regulations under Obamacare. After this court rules that the drug can be provided OTC to young teens, do you honestly believe that HHS is going to change the regulations to remove the morning after pill from the mandate or are you suggesting that adult women will still have to get a prescription but young teens won't?
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I'll say it one more time:

I don't think any insurance company will pay for OTC drugs - ever.


That was my original claim and I'll stick by it until proved different by actually seeing an insurance bill that has an OTC drug on it or reading from a very reliable source that such has occurred.
 
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sangha said:
The link you posted said nothing about Plan B posing a risk of blood clots

Please stop wasting time with your nonsense
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Or you could read better.

Any of the complications you can have [with birth control pills], you obviously could have with" Plan B, Wright said. She cites the need for a doctor to evaluate a woman's health and medical history before writing a prescription. Women should not take Plan B if they have undiagnosed, unusual vaginal bleeding or a sensitivity to progestin.
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One of the complications of birth control is blood clots. And it says that a woman should be evaluated prior to using Plan B.
 
sangha said:
The article presented no evidence of anyone misusing it.
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Considering the person you're responding to said "It has never been studied whether it is being misused, and it should be.", you get a gold sticker for effort for stating the same exact thing that she did.
 
roguenuke said:
Or you could read better.



One of the complications of birth control is blood clots. And it says that a woman should be evaluated prior to using Plan B.
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You're right. I missed that

But the person saying that is not a doctor. There is no evidence that it can cause blood clots
 
sangha said:
The article presented no evidence of anyone misusing it.
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If it is an emergency contraceptive, but is being used often, than that would indicate misuse. How often would you think misuse is for Plan B? To me, taking it more often than once every couple of months is misuse. It is supposed to be emergency contraceptive, not primary. Emergency to me is definitely less than 6 times a year.
 
roguenuke said:
If it is an emergency contraceptive, but is being used often, than that would indicate misuse. How often would you think misuse is for Plan B? To me, taking it more often than once every couple of months is misuse. It is supposed to be emergency contraceptive, not primary. Emergency to me is definitely less than 6 times a year.
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The article did not mention one individual who used it often or misused it in any way.
 
sangha said:
You're right. I missed that

But the person saying that is not a doctor. There is no evidence that it can cause blood clots
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I provided additional evidence that doctors say that it can cause blood clots. Granted it was after an edit, but it is there.
 
sangha said:
The article did not mention one individual who used it often or misused it in any way.
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Others do, including the one from England.

I am saying we need to look into this. It is stupid to allow teens unlimited access when we know there is a strong possibility that young adult women are misusing this, certainly not using it just for "emergencies". Just study it, what is the problem with doing this? It won't really prevent a whole lot of teen pregnancies in that time, not given the current evidence we have on this.
 
Since 2009 plan b pills have been estrogen free. From this website:
Safety
Can I use emergency contraception even if I've been told I shouldn't use daily birth control pills?

If your health care provider has said you should absolutely avoid estrogen, you can probably still use one of the three other types of emergency contraception: progestin-only emergency contraceptive pills (like Plan B One-Step, Next Choice One Dose, Next Choice or Levonorgestrel Tablets), ulipristal acetate (ella) or the Copper-T IUD.

Emergency contraceptive pills ("morning after pills" or "day after pills") have no long term or serious side effects although you might experience some minor side effects.
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Emergency contraception: Women who can’t use oral contraceptives

From this website:

Effectiveness

Plan B and Next Choice reduce the chance of pregnancy by 88 to 95 percent. If a hundred women have unprotected intercourse, about eight will become pregnant; if the one hundred women use Plan B, only one will become pregnant. Plan B is 89 percent effective for all women who take the pills within the first three days. Taking the pill within the first twenty-four hours may increase effectiveness to as much as 95 percent.

Combined estrogen and progestin pills are slightly less effective than progestin-only pills. They reduce the chance of pregnancy by 75 percent.

Ella reduces the risk of pregnancy by 98 percent. It is equally effective regardless of which day it is taken.



Side Effects

Progestin-only pills have few or no side effects.
Nausea and vomiting are the most common negative effects of taking emergency contraception pills that contain both estrogen and progestin; about half the women who take them feel nauseated, and about 20 percent vomit.
For this reason, some practitioners advise taking the pills with food or with an antinausea medication such as an over-the-counter remedy for motion sickness. Other negative effects include breast tenderness, dizziness, abdominal pain, and headaches. Using combination pills for emergency contraception may also change the timing of your next menstrual period: It may begin a few days earlier or a few days later than usual.
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http://www.ourbodiesourselves.org/book/excerpt.asp?id=44
 
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minnie616 said:
Yep that is exactly what happens every time a prescription drug becomes over the counter.
The insurance no longer pays for it unless a person gets a script from the doctor for a name brand perscrition drug that only available with a prescription then it is covered by the insurance usually with a co pay.
Click to expand...

I'll believe it when I see it. I'll be the first to apologize if HHS rewrites or rescinds its mandate and adult females now have to pay for their own morning after pills and insurance companies won't have to. I don't believe that day will ever come as long as Obama is President.
 
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