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Steubenville High School football players found guilty of raping 16-year-old [W:245]

Re: Steubenville High School football players found guilty of raping 16-year-old girl

PS where do you live? I don't lock my doors either, but I live in the boonies. And if someone wanted to break in, they could just smash a window without it being heard. But when I go into the city, I don't leave money sitting on my care seat, or my car doors unlocked
I lived in New Orleans for most of my life, and now I live in Stockton. :}

No, I am not. I am pointing out bad people exist in the world, and the first line of defense from such people starts with their potential victims.
The first line of defense is teaching 17 year old boys that rape isn't acceptable behavior.

Nope, there is a difference in blaming her and pointing out that everyone has an individual responsibility for guranteeing their own safety.

Honestly, the idea that people are taking offense to common sense practices, and seeing them as an attack on the victim, is about as absurd as you can get.
Among the most-repeated "rules" of young drinking are to drink around those you are familiar with because if something happens (like blacking out because you drank too much) then you are safe because you are not around strangers. She was at a party with a lot of people she considered friends and classmates, with people who have the ability to take pictures and video with the click of a button. Literally the only other option she could have taken was to not drink at all, and in that case we should just tell all women not to drink because rapists exist.

She: drank among friends and classmates and in a public place (ie not in a back alley where nobody can see what happens). Those are common sense practices for keeping yourself safe.

I don't know about you, but I never got to pick my classmates and surely being such never guaranteed moral character
No, but you do have friends, and friends typically tend to not let you get raped.

actually some kids do aim for such
No, I'm pointing to the fact that she got blacked out drunk. Unless she was forced into such a state, the responsibility for that falls on her shoulders
She was drugged, according to leaked documents, her own statements, and the statements of others.
 
Re: Steubenville High School football players found guilty of raping 16-year-old girl

She should not have to act intelligently to be safe in this regard. It should be a valid assumption that if you get drunk, your classmates will not rape you.

There are a lot of things that should be that never can be and never will be. It is never going to be safe to drink yourself into a stupor in a crowd full of people you don't trust intimately.

There's no doubt that rape culture contributed to this situation-- everything about this case screams that the perpetrators thought what they were doing was perfectly socially acceptable, that they were entitled to do whatever they wanted with a young woman who was under their power. But there's also no doubt that she was directly personally responsible for putting herself under their power; that's neither blaming her nor shaming her, that is simply acknowledging the facts of the situation. Saying that other young women should avoid making the same mistakes is likewise not promoting rape culture, it is simply acknowledging the reality that rape is a thing that happens and the reality of the circumstances under which the vast majority of rapes do happen.
 
Re: Steubenville High School football players found guilty of raping 16-year-old girl

Among the most-repeated "rules" of young drinking are to drink around those you are familiar with because if something happens (like blacking out because you drank too much) then you are safe because you are not around strangers.


She: drank among friends and classmates and in a public place (ie not in a back alley where nobody can see what happens). Those are common sense practices for keeping yourself safe.

Wait, so you are saying there are a set of unspoken rules that kids should follow to prevent themselves from becoming victims?!? ....No ****, genius.I'm pointing out the same thing. Yet, for some reason, you're accusing me of blaming the victim.

Also, getting passed out drunk in a public space isn't a good idea either. And none of these points change if she was drugged. They still apply, just not to this particular case

The first line of defense is teaching 17 year old boys that rape isn't acceptable behavior.

well we can pointlessly argue over what element is more important, but the fact is, you can run every kid through a 100 hours of sensitivity training and you will still be stuck with the fact that some people are still going to commit rape. So, you still need to focus on the type of rules you cite above
 
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Re: Steubenville High School football players found guilty of raping 16-year-old girl

Yet, for some reason, you're accusing me of blaming the victim.

I never said that; in fact, I said that what you are saying simply contributes to the culture that makes 17 year old boys think it's okay to rape a drugged girl. I apologize if you thought otherwise.
 
Re: Steubenville High School football players found guilty of raping 16-year-old girl

I never said that; in fact, I said that what you are saying simply contributes to the culture that makes 17 year old boys think it's okay to rape a drugged girl.

So, again, what makes you citing the same type of unspoken rules any different?

FYI: there is no difference and citing such common sense rules does nothing to facilitate "rape culture"
 
Re: Steubenville High School football players found guilty of raping 16-year-old girl

She isn't guilty for getting raped. How about instead of telling women that they need to do X, Y, and Z to not get raped, we just tell men to not rape women?

How about you tell lions and sharks not to attack humans while you're at it? :roll:
 
Re: Steubenville High School football players found guilty of raping 16-year-old girl

I think we already make it pretty clear that rape is bad. The problem is that some people just don't care.

There's a lot more than just rape that we teach as wrong and people can't obey worth a darn.
 
Re: Steubenville High School football players found guilty of raping 16-year-old girl

If you read the article, you see that Westlake took his friends keys because he was too drunk to drive safely. He then walked right by a girl being raped without lifting a finger. Somehow, our societies push to stop drunk driving got through to that kid. The problem is that we have no such societal pressure against rape. The perpetrators clearly bought into the "rape is only a violent stranger holding a knifes to girls throat" nonsense. Its possible that the crime could have prevented if somebody had put out a hokey PSA with a "Having sex with someone who is unconscious is a rape" and "Friends don't let friends commit felony sex offenses" line.

Our society has been blaming rape victims for centuries without much result. Its time that we focus on something else. We obviously can't prevent all rapes, but we can do much better than a culture where victims are too ashamed to report crimes and bystanders will ignore sexual assault happening right in front of them.
 
Re: Steubenville High School football players found guilty of raping 16-year-old girl

If you read the article, you see that Westlake took his friends keys because he was too drunk to drive safely. He then walked right by a girl being raped without lifting a finger. Somehow, our societies push to stop drunk driving got through to that kid. The problem is that we have no such societal pressure against rape. The perpetrators clearly bought into the "rape is only a violent stranger holding a knifes to girls throat" nonsense. Its possible that the crime could have prevented if somebody had put out a hokey PSA with a "Having sex with someone who is unconscious is a rape" and "Friends don't let friends commit felony sex offenses" line.

Our society has been blaming rape victims for centuries without much result. Its time that we focus on something else. We obviously can't prevent all rapes, but we can do much better than a culture where victims are too ashamed to report crimes and bystanders will ignore sexual assault happening right in front of them.
Friends don't let friends rape drunk girls.

Maybe this verdict will help get that message out.
 
Re: Steubenville High School football players found guilty of raping 16-year-old girl

The girl was in a "drunken stupor". I'm not saying she had it coming but if a 16 year old girl gets drunk and passes out in the midst of drunk 16 year old boys she has to take partial responsibility for the results. The boys were drunk and stupid and so was she.

C'mon dude, that's no excuse for these clowns to rape her. You're smarter than that, my friend.
 
Re: Steubenville High School football players found guilty of raping 16-year-old girl

Friends don't let friends rape drunk girls.

Maybe this verdict will help get that message out.

If my kids found themselves in a situation where they witnessed something like this and didn't stop it, or get their ass kicked trying to stop it, they would get one hell of a message when I got my hands on them.
 
Re: Steubenville High School football players found guilty of raping 16-year-old girl

How about you tell lions and sharks not to attack humans while you're at it? :roll:

...yes, because, you know, humans have the intellectual and moral capacity of wild predatory animals. :roll:

Rape culture is why the people testifying in this case didn't think it was rape because the girl was unconscious.
Rape culture is why these boys joked with each other about the "dead girl" being "so raped" and didn't think there would be any consequences.
Rape culture is why people see rape as being a less violent crime if the victim is too weak, incapacitated, or terrified to fight back.
Rape culture is why the victim in this case is being harassed on twitter and getting death threats.

Education to combat rape culture isn't JUST telling men not to rape women. It's teaching men to respect women's bodies. It's teaching them that the rule isn't "no means no"; the rule is "only consent given when NOT incapacitated means yes, and that person reserves the right and any time to retract that consent". It's teaching men that women are not a conquest to be taken and bragged about, that men are fully capable of controlling their actions no matter what a woman looks like, no matter what she is wearing, and no matter what state she is in.

Look at these boys. They were not ASHAMED of what they did. It's a culture which allows men to do that to a woman without feeling ashamed of themselves that contributes to rape. This never would have happened if they had been taught that trying to shoved your dick in an unconscious girl's mouth, taking off her clothes, fingering her, and ejaculating on her is a shameful thing for them to do. Instead, they were taught that they have a free license do what they want, to whomever they want (especially if they are too incapacitated to remember your assault) because they are good at sports. That. Is. Rape. Culture.

This case was made into a big deal precisely because this kind of thing happens all the time, is tolerated all the time, goes unpunished all the time, and that plenty of young men think it is a perfectly acceptable thing to do, document, and brag about right up until the point at which they actually suffer consequences.
 
Re: Steubenville High School football players found guilty of raping 16-year-old girl

...yes, because, you know, humans have the intellectual and moral capacity of wild predatory animals. :roll:

Rape culture is why the people testifying in this case didn't think it was rape because the girl was unconscious.
Rape culture is why these boys joked with each other about the "dead girl" being "so raped" and didn't think there would be any consequences.
Rape culture is why people see rape as being a less violent crime if the victim is too weak, incapacitated, or terrified to fight back.
Rape culture is why the victim in this case is being harassed on twitter and getting death threats.

Education to combat rape culture isn't JUST telling men not to rape women. It's teaching men to respect women's bodies. It's teaching them that the rule isn't "no means no"; the rule is "only consent given when NOT incapacitated means yes, and that person reserves the right and any time to retract that consent". It's teaching men that women are not a conquest to be taken and bragged about, that men are fully capable of controlling their actions no matter what a woman looks like, no matter what she is wearing, and no matter what state she is in.

Look at these boys. They were not ASHAMED of what they did. It's a culture which allows men to do that to a woman without feeling ashamed of themselves that contributes to rape. This never would have happened if they had been taught that trying to shoved your dick in an unconscious girl's mouth, taking off her clothes, fingering her, and ejaculating on her is a shameful thing for them to do. Instead, they were taught that they have a free license do what they want, to whomever they want (especially if they are too incapacitated to remember your assault) because they are good at sports. That. Is. Rape. Culture.

This case was made into a big deal precisely because this kind of thing happens all the time, is tolerated all the time, goes unpunished all the time, and that plenty of young men think it is a perfectly acceptable thing to do, document, and brag about right up until the point at which they actually suffer consequences.

Good post but I would quibble with your claim that "It's a culture which allows men to do that to a woman without feeling ashamed of themselves that contributes to rape"..

I'm a man and feel as strongly about rape as any woman would do, and believe that the great majority of men feel the same way.. It's as unfair to lump all men together as it is to lump all women together.
 
Re: Steubenville High School football players found guilty of raping 16-year-old girl

If my kids found themselves in a situation where they witnessed something like this and didn't stop it, or get their ass kicked trying to stop it, they would get one hell of a message when I got my hands on them.

I was totally disgusted by that college student joking about how messed up that girl was while his friends were molesting her. THe only upside to it is him making a video of his rant is what broke this case wide open. I understand that he was one of the key witnesses against the defendants.
 
Re: Steubenville High School football players found guilty of raping 16-year-old girl

...yes, because, you know, humans have the intellectual and moral capacity of wild predatory animals. :roll:

Rape culture is why the people testifying in this case didn't think it was rape because the girl was unconscious.
Rape culture is why these boys joked with each other about the "dead girl" being "so raped" and didn't think there would be any consequences.
Rape culture is why people see rape as being a less violent crime if the victim is too weak, incapacitated, or terrified to fight back.
Rape culture is why the victim in this case is being harassed on twitter and getting death threats.

Education to combat rape culture isn't JUST telling men not to rape women. It's teaching men to respect women's bodies. It's teaching them that the rule isn't "no means no"; the rule is "only consent given when NOT incapacitated means yes, and that person reserves the right and any time to retract that consent". It's teaching men that women are not a conquest to be taken and bragged about, that men are fully capable of controlling their actions no matter what a woman looks like, no matter what she is wearing, and no matter what state she is in.

Look at these boys. They were not ASHAMED of what they did. It's a culture which allows men to do that to a woman without feeling ashamed of themselves that contributes to rape. This never would have happened if they had been taught that trying to shoved your dick in an unconscious girl's mouth, taking off her clothes, fingering her, and ejaculating on her is a shameful thing for them to do. Instead, they were taught that they have a free license do what they want, to whomever they want (especially if they are too incapacitated to remember your assault) because they are good at sports. That. Is. Rape. Culture.

This case was made into a big deal precisely because this kind of thing happens all the time, is tolerated all the time, goes unpunished all the time, and that plenty of young men think it is a perfectly acceptable thing to do, document, and brag about right up until the point at which they actually suffer consequences.

You're preaching to the choir. My point was that even a lion raised in captivity and handled with care can't be guaranteed to not attack those who care for it. Analogously, a kid raised to have the best morals can go wrong by negative influence of poorly raised kids, or even stupid curiousity.

Best of luck to the liberals who want to try to blame "rape culture" while simultaneously supporting freedom of the "rap culture" where people sing about their *itches, hoes and baby mamma. They complain this crap is tolerated and then try to paint Treyvon Martin as a good kid. Nice mixed messages you send.
 
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Re: Steubenville High School football players found guilty of raping 16-year-old girl

...yes, because, you know, humans have the intellectual and moral capacity of wild predatory animals. :roll:

Rape culture is why the people testifying in this case didn't think it was rape because the girl was unconscious.
Rape culture is why these boys joked with each other about the "dead girl" being "so raped" and didn't think there would be any consequences.
Rape culture is why people see rape as being a less violent crime if the victim is too weak, incapacitated, or terrified to fight back.
Rape culture is why the victim in this case is being harassed on twitter and getting death threats.

Education to combat rape culture isn't JUST telling men not to rape women. It's teaching men to respect women's bodies. It's teaching them that the rule isn't "no means no"; the rule is "only consent given when NOT incapacitated means yes, and that person reserves the right and any time to retract that consent". It's teaching men that women are not a conquest to be taken and bragged about, that men are fully capable of controlling their actions no matter what a woman looks like, no matter what she is wearing, and no matter what state she is in.

Look at these boys. They were not ASHAMED of what they did. It's a culture which allows men to do that to a woman without feeling ashamed of themselves that contributes to rape. This never would have happened if they had been taught that trying to shoved your dick in an unconscious girl's mouth, taking off her clothes, fingering her, and ejaculating on her is a shameful thing for them to do. Instead, they were taught that they have a free license do what they want, to whomever they want (especially if they are too incapacitated to remember your assault) because they are good at sports. That. Is. Rape. Culture.

This case was made into a big deal precisely because this kind of thing happens all the time, is tolerated all the time, goes unpunished all the time, and that plenty of young men think it is a perfectly acceptable thing to do, document, and brag about right up until the point at which they actually suffer consequences.

Not evidence of rape culture. These kids are dumb jerks who believed they can do whatever they want because they're local sports stars. I had to deal with the same kinds of arseholes in high school who loved to torment the "nerds". You still have not produced proof that we live in a culture that gives tacit approval to rapists. That some punk athletes think it's ok to rape women, as well as pick on other people they perceive as weak or inferior, is not an example of rape culture; it's an example of jock culture.
 
Re: Steubenville High School football players found guilty of raping 16-year-old girl

Actually, most states have an agreement regarding the sexual offense registry. If you move to Texas from a state in which you were on the registry, you must also register with Texas. Michigan did/does the same thing. Moving from Texas to Kentucky, Tennessee, Colorado, Ohio, Michigan, Florida, and Alabama (just the ones I've seen first hand) requires re-registering in that state.

I think you're speaking on something you might not fully understand. I get the frustration w/the sentence, but assuming something that isn't legally possible will happen to justify your anger just doesn't move the discussion forward all that much.

I know criminal law, we are NOT talking about adults and these kids were NEVER tried as adults...

What do people NOT get about that?
 
Re: Steubenville High School football players found guilty of raping 16-year-old girl

Not evidence of rape culture. These kids are dumb jerks who believed they can do whatever they want because they're local sports stars. I had to deal with the same kinds of arseholes in high school who loved to torment the "nerds". You still have not produced proof that we live in a culture that gives tacit approval to rapists. That some punk athletes think it's ok to rape women, as well as pick on other people they perceive as weak or inferior, is not an example of rape culture; it's an example of jock culture.

I agree that society tends to overvalue athletes, including students, and let performance on the field shadow performance off the field. As I mentioned, "rap culture" is something liberals won't attack that quite commonly teaches the anti-morals, especially attitude towards women. Speaking of jerks, many women feed their behavior by choosing to date them over gentlemen.
 
Re: Steubenville High School football players found guilty of raping 16-year-old girl

Not evidence of rape culture. These kids are dumb jerks who believed they can do whatever they want because they're local sports stars. I had to deal with the same kinds of arseholes in high school who loved to torment the "nerds". You still have not produced proof that we live in a culture that gives tacit approval to rapists. That some punk athletes think it's ok to rape women, as well as pick on other people they perceive as weak or inferior, is not an example of rape culture; it's an example of jock culture.

I think national media outlets focusing on the pain and suffering of the rapists is an example rape culture.
I think people (who are not even part of sports culture) who are calling the victim a slut and saying she was asking for it is an example of rape culture.
The witness who saw them raping the unconscious girl and just left because it 'didn't look like rape' has nothing to do with sports culture, and everything to do with the belief in our culture that the only kind of rape is when you attack a woman, force her down, and take her against her will while she is screaming and fighting. I think that is also evidence of rape culture. I absolutely think they were overly arrogant about their immunity because of their sports program. But that is not all that was at play here.

Here are some other examples:

Heartbreaking: 7th Grade Girl Raped Twice, Blamed and Punished By School Officials Both Times | Alternet
7th grade girl in Springfield, MO reported being raped. No one believed her, she was forced to write an apology letter and deliver it to the boy who raped her. She was also expelled for the rest of the year. And was raped by the same boy again the following year. And before anyone calls her a liar as well, the boy plead guilty the second time, and the rape kit proved he did it.

Why rapists in military get away with it - CNN.com
Here’s an article about rape in our military. Interesting statistics, and cases like a CO telling a Marine who was raped that she shouldn’t get a rape kit done, superior officers using their authority to make women have sex with them, and superior officers telling women to essentially get over it when they are raped.

Do I need to say anything more than, “all of the people who protected Sandusky”?

How about congress nearly refusing to pass the Violence Against Women Act?

How about all of the statements on this thread and others about this case talking about how these boys are going to “get it” in jail. Drop the soap jokes, anyone? When was the last time you heard about a prison rape case going to court? Just because someone goes to jail does not mean it is legal or morally acceptable to rape them.

States treat spousal rape differently, but the extreme case is South Carolina, where spousal rape is only considered a crime if it is accomplished through aggravated force, and women have only 30 days to report such rapes.

That whole Todd Akin “legitimate rape” business.

When I say we have a rape culture here, I do not mean that across the board we uniformly tolerate and excuse rape, and I sure as heck don't mean that most men are rapists. What I mean is this. Victims are still commonly blamed here and many women don't report rape because they don't want to be "raped again" by the media. This girl was violated, and now she's getting threatened, being told she's a slut, and that she was asking for it. We have a culture that is permissive of prison rape. We have a culture in which a heck of a lot of people think men can't be raped, or that a woman can't rape a man. We have a rape problem in the military, where the behavior is sometimes tolerated and victims are shamed. And we also have people covering up for jocks and priests when they rape.
 
Re: Steubenville High School football players found guilty of raping 16-year-old girl

I think national media outlets focusing on the pain and suffering of the rapists is an example rape culture.

CNN is the only media outlet I've heard of that focused any attention on the rapists' suffering. If you ask me, it's appropriate this is mentioned, because while this girl may eventually move on with her life, these guys will find it difficult or impossible to find work or housing because of their criminal past. It wouldn't surprise me if they're living under a bridge or eating out of garbage cans in ten years, as many sex offenders do. If these guys had beaten some scrawny male student instead of raped a female student, they might have still gone to prison for a year, but they would have avoided the sex offender registry which is going to make life a living hell for them once they are released from prison.


I think people (who are not even part of sports culture) who are calling the victim a slut and saying she was asking for it is an example of rape culture.
The witness who saw them raping the unconscious girl and just left because it 'didn't look like rape' has nothing to do with sports culture, and everything to do with the belief in our culture that the only kind of rape is when you attack a woman, force her down, and take her against her will while she is screaming and fighting. I think that is also evidence of rape culture.

No, it's evidence of ignorance, not rape culture.


Why rapists in military get away with it - CNN.com
Here’s an article about rape in our military. Interesting statistics, and cases like a CO telling a Marine who was raped that she shouldn’t get a rape kit done, superior officers using their authority to make women have sex with them, and superior officers telling women to essentially get over it when they are raped.

I agree the military has a rape problem, but I think it's a stretch to call it "rape culture", since not everyone in the military supports rape.


How about congress nearly refusing to pass the Violence Against Women Act?

There already are laws on the books to prevent violence against women.

How about all of the statements on this thread and others about this case talking about how these boys are going to “get it” in jail. Drop the soap jokes, anyone? When was the last time you heard about a prison rape case going to court? Just because someone goes to jail does not mean it is legal or morally acceptable to rape them.

I agree.

States treat spousal rape differently, but the extreme case is South Carolina, where spousal rape is only considered a crime if it is accomplished through aggravated force, and women have only 30 days to report such rapes.

30 days seems reasonable to me. That prevents a lot of vindictive women from suddenly reporting false rapes after the marriage goes sour. As far as "aggravated force", that pretty much describes all rape except the passed out drunk kind. And honestly, how common do you honestly think it is for a husband to rape his wife while she's passed out? Many women wouldn't even consider that rape. The lack of consent doesn't always mean it's forced sex.

That whole Todd Akin “legitimate rape” business.

The "legitimate rape" statement is a term used in reference to false rape allegations. Rape has the highest false allegation rate of any crime. Akin was trying to differentiate between real rapes and women who claimed they were raped, but were not.
 
Re: Steubenville High School football players found guilty of raping 16-year-old girl

Good post but I would quibble with your claim that "It's a culture which allows men to do that to a woman without feeling ashamed of themselves that contributes to rape"..

I'm a man and feel as strongly about rape as any woman would do, and believe that the great majority of men feel the same way.. It's as unfair to lump all men together as it is to lump all women together.


2 teens charged with threatening victim in Ohio rape case

Read more: 2 teens charged with threatening victim in Ohio rape case | Fox News

The teens charged with threatening the victim are GIRLS.. They started on social media within an hour of the verdict. Now the authorities are going after the parents who hosted the party.
 
Re: Steubenville High School football players found guilty of raping 16-year-old girl

If you refuse to tell people how they can keep themselves safe than you are not helping them in making good choices to avoid situations like what happened to this young girl.

Of course you can tell girls how to keep themselves safe. That is not the same thing as evaluating this girl as "irresponsible." This girl was too trusting because she had been socialized to believe that her friends were caring and concerned and these boys were honorable. If there is anything that rape teaches a rape victim, it is that no human being on earth is really trustworthy - that you have only yourself to rely on as a friend and as an honorable person. That teaches you to take care of yourself by reserving your trust for yourself and God, not human others.
 
Re: Steubenville High School football players found guilty of raping 16-year-old girl

I do not like this. Three teens get rip roaring drunk. Those boys were wrong yet are they really rapists if a teen female their age gets plastered out of her minds and leaves with them holding hands? Were they drunk as well?

No doubt they were in the wrong yet ... if you get inebriated and naked around inebriated teen boys there is no good outcome.

I feel for everyone involved. Those boys should be in JV detention and educated and so should the girl!

Okay ... kill me people.

There were no reliable witnesses as they were all drunk ... before she drank herself to a comatose state ...did she say or do anything that led them to believe she was consenting to touching.

The electronic age and kids sext ... including the girl.

I have a teen son and had to educate him because teen girls often sent pictures of themselves nude. I told him to never respond to them as he would get in trouble and not the girl.

They were all drunk and there are no witnesses to declare those boys were rapists beyond a shadow of a doubt that in her inebriated state before she drank herself to semi comatose that she did not act out sexually herself.

Shame on all of them and ... however since they do not know ... why are the boys being tagged with convicted felonies and rape charges when no one knows what happened.

The girl was unconscious when they had sex with her. They knew it was rape, because on the video the expression "raped" was used about the girl. They knew perfectly well that they were raping her. The video showed that she was unconsciousness. I don't care if you have 100 sons. If you don't teach them that having sex with an unconscious girl is rape, you're a terrible mother. And shame on you for your victim blaming. Of course we know what happened - it was recorded.
 
Re: Steubenville High School football players found guilty of raping 16-year-old girl

Funny that my soc class is doing a unit on group-think right now. You can't just issue a statement "don't rape women" and expect that to stop the mob of drunk undisciplined local celebrities free of adult supervision or consequence zombies.

It doesn't work that way. The group will set aside moral judgement and standards, so asserting moral judgement and standards will only get you villanised and psychically assaulted just for voicing a contrary opinion. Worse if you act on it. In a way it's a blessing to this girl that she was unconscious, because if she resisted the mob likely would have beaten or killed her on top of it all.

You have to undermine the group:
  • There needs to be parental authority in their lives.
  • The celebrity status in the town for being an athlete needs to be taken down several notches.
  • The town needs more exposure to the rest of the world.

Fortunantly, this conviction serves to undermine the group-think by highlighting their faults and adding consequence.

But you can't just tell a group to not do a crime and expect that they will obey.

Gee, and here I thought that parents could teach boys not to rape people because: you would not want that done to you; you would not want to victimize another human being; you could get the girl pregnant; you would be committing one of the most heinous felony crimes in your country; you would be showing disrespect to your parents by humiliating them for bad parenting in the sight of God . . .

Most boys do not rape girls. Many boys are so angry when other boys do this that they go beat them up. It all depends on families that teach boys right and wrong and what hurts others and what doesn't. That girl may have done something stupid, but she did not hurt anyone. Those boys hurt someone, and they knew at the time they were doing it.
 
Re: Steubenville High School football players found guilty of raping 16-year-old girl

Here's an excerpt from the New Yorker.
Worse, one could take away the impression that a nice girl doesn’t press charges, rather than that nice boys do not, as was the case in Steubenville, take a girl who has drunk too much and bring her from party to party, assaulting her in a car on the way, until they end up in a basement where they strip and assault her again, and try to make her perform oral sex—except that she is not conscious enough—and then take photographs of her naked body. They do not text “yep” when asked if they had sex with her, or “I shoulda raped now that everybody thinks I did,” but “she wasn’t awake enough”—as Mays did, raising the question of whether he didn’t think it could be rape if she was passed out—and then text the girl to complain about being taken off the football team and tell her “I’ll just never do anything nice for you again.”

Nice—but nice people at a party watching all this can’t let it happen, let alone send around pictures and videos with brutal captions afterward, and then leave their friend to look at them as she frantically wonders what happened to her in the hours she can’t remember. And nice policemen and nice football coaches don’t act like they hope it will just go away until the pressure of bloggers and social media (and the hackers of Anonymous) pushes them to act. And all of these people cannot then carry on as though the one who caused the trouble was the sixteen-year-old girl who was raped—and who, according to testimony in the trial, has been dropped by her friends, ostracized,

Read more: Life After the Steubenville Rape Trial: Are the Defendants’ Lives Really Over? : The New Yorker
 
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