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AP: VP of Venezuela Has Announced Hugo Chavez has Died

No, details (among others) like his somehow becoming a billionaire in the process. How did he do that? Enlighten us.

Because it's irrelevant even if is it is true and not based on some right-wing hate site. Either way another desperate attempt by the obedient Chavez haters to discredit him that has nothing to do with his policies.
 
"far left" "looney left" What devastating
arguments. I see this webboard is a cut above the others!

Well, as Venezeula under Cahvez turned back the ideological clock and devolved into a socialist country his neighbors are going towards free enterprise.

He devalued their dollar and made the poor even poorer as goods and services increased in cost.

He nationalized the oil industry and his manipulation of it drove up oil prices all over the world.
 
Because it's irrelevant even if is it is true and not based on some right-wing hate site. Either way another desperate attempt by the obedient Chavez haters to discredit him that has nothing to do with his policies.

It's hardly "irrelevant" that a hero of socialist revolution made himself a billionaire off the public teat. It makes him a criminal and exactly the kind of evil man you credit him for vanquishing.

What's hilarious is that you give him a pass for it. You don't even want to talk about it.
 
Because it's irrelevant even if is it is true and not based on some right-wing hate site. Either way another desperate attempt by the obedient Chavez haters to discredit him that has nothing to do with his policies.

Yeah, it's only irrelevant if a socialist dictator gets rich off his people.

But when a greedy capitalist conservative does it, that's when you have a problem with it.

Typical leftist. Thankfully, socialism is on it's way out. Once Venezuela cuts Cuba off the teet, they'll be on their way back to sanity as well. Thank God.
 
The lives of the poorest in Venezuela improved a hell of a lot under Chavez thanks to the Bolivarian missions.

infant mortality fell by 18%
poverty was cut by 50%, extreme poverty was cut from 21% to 10%
more than 1 million Venezuelans became literate

and of course, he was democratically elected and elections met all international standards.

Have you heard the term "to give a man a fish"? All he has done is confiscated Venzuela's oil reserves and used the money to finance anti poverty programs. Which is noble, except that Venezuela has taken longer then any other Latin American country to recover from the economic crisis, they below average economic growth in the region despite running enormous deficits over the last few years (much bigger then ours proportionately), and above average inflation. If things continued under Chavez, once that oil money runs out it would've been a heap of hell considering its seen close to zero foreign investment and Chavez routinely strong armed small local businesses into selling products as a loss in order to keep prices low.
 
Because it's irrelevant even if is it is true and not based on some right-wing hate site. Either way another desperate attempt by the obedient Chavez haters to discredit him that has nothing to do with his policies.

:2party::2party::2party::2party:
 
:lamo
Yes he "raped their economy" but drastically improving it and the people of the countries lives!
http://www.cepr.net/documents/publications/venezuela-2009-02.pdf

-"The current economic expansion began when the government got control over the national oil company in the first quarter of 2003. Since then, real (inflationadjusted) GDP has nearly doubled, growing by 94.7 percent in 5.25 years, or 13.5 percent annually."
-"During the current economic expansion, the poverty rate has been cut by more than half, from 54 percent of households in the first half of 2003 to 26 percent at the end of 2008. Extreme poverty has fallen even more, by 72 percent. These poverty rates measure only cash income, and does take into account increased access to health care or education."
-"
Over the entire decade, the percentage of households in poverty has been reduced by 39 percent, and extreme poverty by more than half."
-"
Inequality, as measured by the Gini index, has also fallen substantially. The index has fallen to 41 in 2008, from 48.1 in 2003 and 47 in 1999. This represents a large reduction in inequality."
-"
The labor market also improved substantially over the last decade, with unemployment dropping from 11.3 percent to 7.8 percent. During the current expansion it has fallen by more than half. Other labor market indicators also show substantial gains."
-"
Over the decade, the government's total public debt has fallen from 30.7 to 14.3 percent of GDP. The foreign public debt has fallen even more, from 25.6 to 9.8 percent of GDP."



Welcome to reality.. Not that anti-venezuela dictator "terrorist supporter" **** the used to play on the media day in and day out on TV

That's quite the cherry picking you've done there. Your "study" shows the statistics since the government took over the oil sector, but it oh so conviently leaves out the circumstances under which the government took over the oil sector. I'm sure you're well aware that in the year 2002, Venezuela saw a coup d'état, three general strikes by the public, and a oil lockout. In the first four months of 2003 alone, their GDP fell by 26%. Most of this "94.7% growth came in the subsequent recovery from that 26% contraction, as well as the 8.9% contraction in 2002. Your own study even shows says that when you start at the pre-recession peak, the growth was only 37.2%.

However your source falsely claims that "it could be argued that this was difficult" because there was "considerable sabotage" in the oil industry. Baloney. Production had been halted, not damaged, and if there was "considerable sabotage" then why did it take only two months for oil to reach pre-strike levels? Further more, your study's cut off point is 4th quarter of 2008, conveniently before their GDP in current U.S. dollars by nearly 20% from 2010-2011. That's according to the World Bank by the way.


If one simply looks at Chavez's full term from 1998-2009, instead of cherry picking the difference between the highs and the lows, one finds that the economy grew 4.3% per year, or nearly a third of what you are claiming. And you know where I got that? Your own source.

The fact of the matter is this. While yes, Venezuela has had growth rates that would be considered exception here in the U.S., overall, their growth rates are not so impressive when compared to other in the region. In fact, from 2004-2012, their growth rates were a mediocre 6th out of 11 comparable countries ~@4.7% per year. Economic Growth in Venezuela | The Americas Blog
Certainly not the outperformer you claim it to be.
 
Well, as Venezeula under Cahvez turned back the ideological clock and devolved into a socialist country his neighbors are going towards free enterprise.

He devalued their dollar and made the poor even poorer as goods and services increased in cost.

He nationalized the oil industry and his manipulation of it drove up oil prices all over the world.

More lies. Actually South America has been voting left in country after country the last decade. But don't let the facts with your wild accusations.

Poverty and extreme poverty plummented under Chavez. 5% growth while the US economy is a basket. He stopped oil companies from exploiting Venezuela and used the oil money to fund his successful program. During the 70s oil boom most of country lived in extreme poverty. I guess factually challenged Chavez haters would prefer that people suffer under capitalism then prosper under socailism. Actually the Chavez haters don't care about South America at all. If did they would condemn Reagans' death squads, the murder of Allende in Chile, Columbia's Arias murdering of labor activists and the US drug war that has led to violence in Mexico and Columbia. They hate Chavez because he has the courage they lack in standing up to corporate fascism. He was far from perfect but his accompishments dwarf those of ciphers like Bush and Obama, who genuflect before corporate power.
 
as far as l know chavez was not a war criminal
l wish some real monsters were hated by many people too..
 
liberterian ;offical globalist lean:lol:
 
2013-02-15T152408Z_2046587183_GM1E92F1SSE01_RTRMADP_3_VENEZUELA-CHAVEZ-IMAGES.JPG


His Daughters don't look so grief Stricken.....today that is! ;)

I hope they don't precreate.
 
So when will Obama order flags lowered to half-staff?
 
That's quite the cherry picking you've done there. Your "study" shows the statistics since the government took over the oil sector, but it oh so conviently leaves out the circumstances under which the government took over the oil sector. I'm sure you're well aware that in the year 2002, Venezuela saw a coup d'état, three general strikes by the public, and a oil lockout. In the first four months of 2003 alone, their GDP fell by 26%. Most of this "94.7% growth came in the subsequent recovery from that 26% contraction, as well as the 8.9% contraction in 2002. Your own study even shows says that when you start at the pre-recession peak, the growth was only 37.2%.

However your source falsely claims that "it could be argued that this was difficult" because there was "considerable sabotage" in the oil industry. Baloney. Production had been halted, not damaged, and if there was "considerable sabotage" then why did it take only two months for oil to reach pre-strike levels? Further more, your study's cut off point is 4th quarter of 2008, conveniently before their GDP in current U.S. dollars by nearly 20% from 2010-2011. That's according to the World Bank by the way.


If one simply looks at Chavez's full term from 1998-2009, instead of cherry picking the difference between the highs and the lows, one finds that the economy grew 4.3% per year, or nearly a third of what you are claiming. And you know where I got that? Your own source.

The fact of the matter is this. While yes, Venezuela has had growth rates that would be considered exception here in the U.S., overall, their growth rates are not so impressive when compared to other in the region. In fact, from 2004-2012, their growth rates were a mediocre 6th out of 11 comparable countries ~@4.7% per year. Economic Growth in Venezuela | The Americas Blog
Certainly not the outperformer you claim it to be.

Excellent post.

Socialists on this board will likely be avoiding it.
 
perhaps that has something to do with reducing poverty by 66% and extreme poverty by more, increasing education and healthcare significnatly, bringing democracy into communities and starting a vibrant cooperative economy, as well as keeping the oil wealth FOR the country and actually bettering the country significantly.

I love you how assume Latin Americans are stupid and only respont to rhetoric, maybe its the actual outcomes of policies that make hiim popular.

Notice the word "populism". And the success of his "Bolivarian socialist revolution" is dubious at best. What successes that have been achieved are met with equal failures. Nothing is clear cut and his legacy will likely be akin to what the Perons are to Argentina.
 
Just got an update form the VP to my phone saying the VP of Venezuela has announced that Hugo Chavez has died.
Articles and link to come soon.

RIP Hugo Chavez. You were a great president and a great leader of Venezuela and did many great things for your country.

Yay, the thief has died.

What a POS clown...
 
I knew he was dead before it was ever announced.

His opposition claimed he was dead and the VP called bull**** and called them liars (opposition) and propagandists, then ironically confirmed that to be fact.

It's almost like democrats getting called on their bull**** but only after 5 hours and not a CBO report.
 
So when will Obama order flags lowered to half-staff?

Depends on what Hoops Valerie Jarrett has him jumping thru first....."oh," and after Obama gets done with another Round of golf. :2razz:

Although, I was surprised that Obama had no statement concerning what his mentor had to say. Do you think it means anything when Obama wont support nor acknowledge those remarks? Especially when it was one who he was taught by?
thinking.gif
 
Well his failure to diversify has led to their stagnation. All their inlays comes thru Petroleum Products and considering the Price of Oil is not the same when Chavez first came in he could have done more. Plus Rueters did a piece on the state corruption with Fonden which runs 1/3rd of all Venezuela's Investments.

The waste is everywhere. Just like when Chavez tried to work out his massive housing deal.

Thats nonsense.

owimage002-2.jpgowimage002-3.jpgowimage003.jpgowimage005.jpg
Investment and GDP Growth in Venezuela | venezuelanalysis.com

Manufacturing has increased, as has trade, as has capital formation.

I'd like to see the piece by Rueters.
 
Because it's irrelevant even if is it is true and not based on some right-wing hate site. Either way another desperate attempt by the obedient Chavez haters to discredit him that has nothing to do with his policies.

Yeah. Like those obedient Fox-News-Bots in Human Rights Watch :roll:
 
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