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NZ tops global human freedom list

Somerville

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NZ tops global human freedom list

New Zealand leads the way in human freedom according to an international index that ranks 123 countries.

The Canadian Fraser Institute has released its report evaluating how each country measures in security and safety, movement, expression and relationship freedoms.

New Zealand topped the index as offering the highest level of human freedom worldwide, followed by the Netherlands and Hong Kong.

Australia came in fourth. The US ranked seventh.

Interesting that Hong Kong was ranked ahead of the US.

For those not familiar with the Fraser Institute, here's a link and here's the Wiki explanation

The Top Ten Freest Nations as of 2012
1. New Zealand

2. Netherlands

3. Hong Kong

4. Australia

4. Canada

4. Ireland

7. United States of America

7. Denmark

9. Japan

9. Estonia
 
I would seriously debate Australia's ranking, with some of the intense censorship issues they've got going on. They still also have a lot of sexism issues, and while that may not be legally visible, I think it's disingenuous to discount social limitations of freedom.

Based on that, I'd seriously debate New Zealand as well. I lived there for quite a while. They have some of the most intense racial problems I've seen in the West, matched only by the American south, France, and northern England, in my opinion. In some of the smaller towns, they've still got race riots. Even in the cities, I saw people make openly racist statements. Even workers towards their own patrons.

New Zealand is also a pretty horrible place to be as an immigrant. They really scam the hell out of you. It's practically robbery, what they do. And I think that needs to be taken into consideration as well, because immigrants are as much a part of the economy and the culture as anyone else.

It would be one thing if they were just honest and said they don't want immigrants. But that's not what they do. They ENCOURAGE immigration, and then abuse the people who come.

If you're a born citizen and you're white, Maori, or some other islander, things aren't so bad. Legally, for born citizens, New Zealand is very free.

But if you're Asian, life is hell. If you're an immigrant (even if you're a citizen) life is pretty tough socially, and if you're a non-citizen, it's borderline unbearable.
 
Idiotic list. Hong Kong is a freaking dictatorship.
 
Idiotic list. Hong Kong is a freaking dictatorship.

You did read the Wiki article on the Fraser Institute, didn't you? I believe the phrase "right-libertarian" was in there. Most Canadians think of the Fraser Institute as a shill for corporate interests, particularly the petroleum industry, so their definition of 'freedom' for some reason includes that whole "corporations are people" meme.
 
Idiotic list. Hong Kong is a freaking dictatorship.

While still "ruled" by the PRC government, Hong Kong is unique and designated as special administrative zone. Under this designation, they nearly have full autonomy to govern themselves. This includes laws, enforcement and even judiciary.
 
You did read the Wiki article on the Fraser Institute, didn't you? I believe the phrase "right-libertarian" was in there. Most Canadians think of the Fraser Institute as a shill for corporate interests, particularly the petroleum industry, so their definition of 'freedom' for some reason includes that whole "corporations are people" meme.

Do you have any evidence to this claim regarding what "most Canadians think"?
 
You did read the Wiki article on the Fraser Institute, didn't you? I believe the phrase "right-libertarian" was in there. Most Canadians think of the Fraser Institute as a shill for corporate interests, particularly the petroleum industry, so their definition of 'freedom' for some reason includes that whole "corporations are people" meme.
They focus on something that in their mind is “economic freedom”, which really about which government is giving out the best deal for the economic upperclass. Some people would use the term corporatists I guess? It is not so much petroleum industry, as resource industry in general because that represents a sizable chunk of the big money movers and shakers in Canada. One of its founders was an executive at the biggest forestry company in the country at the time.
 
New Zealand is also a pretty horrible place to be as an immigrant. They really scam the hell out of you. It's practically robbery, what they do. And I think that needs to be taken into consideration as well, because immigrants are as much a part of the economy and the culture as anyone else.

But if you're Asian, life is hell. If you're an immigrant (even if you're a citizen) life is pretty tough socially, and if you're a non-citizen, it's borderline unbearable.
No it isn't. I am a non-citizen living in New Zealand, except for the time being I am in China. Life is not tough, it's easy. Also, none of the asians I know have any problems.

And I never got scammed. No one has even tried scamming me in New Zealand. Scamming is way worse in China, and even there it doesn't matter. The worst I got scammed over here is $2 from a taxi driver. He drove wrong way.

Idiotic list. Hong Kong is a freaking dictatorship.
If Hong Kong is a dictatorship, then so is the EU. In both places you can vote, in both places your vote means pretty much nothing.
 
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If Hong Kong is a dictatorship, then so is the EU. In both places you can vote, in both places your vote means pretty much nothing.

Horse****. Your ignorance on how the EU works shows again.

Hong Kong has its leader appointed by dictators in Beijing. The EU "leader" is appointed too, but by democratically elected officials from the 27 member nations. On top of that, the Parliament of the EU is elected and has considerable powers over legislation in the EU.

Calling Hong Kong "free" is an insult to the other countries on the list who actually have free and open elections. Why not put Singapore up there? Oh yea, same situation as Hong Kong..
 
Ireland fourth...whu?

God the rest of the world must be in pretty bad straits.
 
No it isn't. I am a non-citizen living in New Zealand, except for the time being I am in China. Life is not tough, it's easy. Also, none of the asians I know have any problems.

And I never got scammed. No one has even tried scamming me in New Zealand. Scamming is way worse in China, and even there it doesn't matter. The worst I got scammed over here is $2 from a taxi driver. He drove wrong way.

Well, I guess at some point I was bound to run into someone. You're literally the first person I've ever even heard of who hasn't had a bad experience immigrating to NZ. Even people I know who like it there and want to stay permanently have had nothing positive to say about that aspect of it. I certainly don't.

Are you familiar with the culture in a lot of the countries these Asians are coming from? Of course they don't say anything about it. But I've seen enough really over-the-top examples that no amount of silence from them can convince me it just "isn't happening." I also wonder where you're staying. The only place I can think of where you might not experience it is possibly Auckland, the biggest and thus most culturally generic city in NZ. But even her next biggest sibling, Wellington, is pretty bad for it in my experience.
 
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It's disingenuous to refer to this index as the global human freedom index when it is called the economic freedom index by the institute itself. What it measures is the freedom of corporations to do as they please which is hardly surprising considering the neo-liberal slant of this think tank. It's quite obvious from the countries that are positioned in the top ten that actual human freedom isn't a consideration in establishing this index. Anyone observing the world not suffering from oxygen deprivation due to having their head in the clouds of economical ideology will have noticed by now that corporate freedom is antithetical to individual freedom more often than not.
 
When you read studies like the OP, you're supposed to pretend not to know that there isn't a country on the list that would be free at all without the power and might of the United States.

Little facts like that infuriate the America hating loons because it doesn't fit in with their agenda of constantly blaming the United States, i.e. White People, for all of the world's problems.
 
When you read studies like the OP, you're supposed to pretend not to know that there isn't a country on the list that would be free at all without the power and might of the United States.

Little facts like that infuriate the America hating loons because it doesn't fit in with their agenda of constantly blaming the United States, i.e. White People, for all of the world's problems.

NZ, Australia, Canada and Ireland.

But you're great anyway America, land of the free and home of the white people!
 
NZ, Australia, Canada and Ireland.

But you're great anyway America, land of the free and home of the white people!

Actually the countries you mentioned are more White than the United States.

And although there were groups of Irish fighting alongside the Nazis, Americans saved their sorry asses anyway.
 
Actually the countries you mentioned are more White than the United States.

And although there were groups of Irish fighting alongside the Nazis, Americans saved their sorry asses anyway.

No **** Grant. Ray brought up white people (which you "Liked").

And no, America didn't save Ireland. Did they save Canada?
 
No **** Grant. Ray brought up white people (which you "Liked").

And no, America didn't save Ireland. Did they save Canada?

I liked that the Americans have saved much of the world at various times and yet get little credit for it.

And of course had the Nazis not been defeated, largely with the help of the Americans, the Irish would have had greater problems that just religion and borders. And of course the IRA were on the side of the Nazis..
 
I liked that the Americans have saved much of the world at various times and yet get little credit for it.

And of course had the Nazis not been defeated, largely with the help of the Americans, the Irish would have had greater problems that just religion and borders. And of course the IRA were on the side of the Nazis..

Good thing they don't synomise their country with "white people", as much as you'd "like" they would.
 
When you read studies like the OP, you're supposed to pretend not to know that there isn't a country on the list that would be free at all without the power and might of the United States.

Little facts like that infuriate the America hating loons because it doesn't fit in with their agenda of constantly blaming the United States, i.e. White People, for all of the world's problems.


I can see that you label yourself "Conservative", maybe that is why you and so many others on your side seemingly refuse to acknowledge that change happens. What was done in the past does not mean that the same actions would take place in today's world.

And what does military power have to do with political freedom?

And there are nations which could argue with historical basis that United States actions actually destroyed freedom for their people.

As others have noted, the Fraser Institute is not really looking at "political freedom" but rather at "economic freedom", which just might be the reason Hong Kong is ahead of the US on their list.
 
Well, I guess at some point I was bound to run into someone. You're literally the first person I've ever even heard of who hasn't had a bad experience immigrating to NZ. Even people I know who like it there and want to stay permanently have had nothing positive to say about that aspect of it. I certainly don't.
Really, everyone I know have had a good experience immigrating to NZ and that includes Asians. Most Asians I have talked to are happy they are in New Zealand and don't want to move back. Of course they call themselves kiwis.

They think I am crazy to go to China.

Are you familiar with the culture in a lot of the countries these Asians are coming from? Of course they don't say anything about it. But I've seen enough really over-the-top examples that no amount of silence from them can convince me it just "isn't happening." I also wonder where you're staying. The only place I can think of where you might not experience it is possibly Auckland, the biggest and thus most culturally generic city in NZ. But even her next biggest sibling, Wellington, is pretty bad for it in my experience.

I stay in Auckland of course. Auckland is the biggest and most conservative city in New Zealand, pluss it got good weather. However, I have met people from/in Christchurch, Wellington, Hamilton, Tauranga, Dunedin, etc. You wouldn't like Auckland either if you don't like Wellington. Wellington is the most progressive city in New Zealand and not very racist. You will find racists people in Auckland too. I have met people who don't like Maories or Asians and I also met a gay black guy who got annoyed because I dated outside my race, but they are just some individuals.

There are Asians who don't like white people in China too, but why should I care?

I really don't care about cultural diversity, and I think that is your problem. You care too much. Kiwis are laid back, they generally don't care about progressive issues. They don't care if a few people are racist, just ignore them. They normally don't care about politics at all. They don't like people who get angry about small insignificant issues and they certainly don't like people who dislike their country. If you want to have fun in New Zealand, invite kiwies over for BBQ and stop talkng politics.

A lot of liberals came to New Zealand thinking it would be a green, progressive paradise. It isn't. And it's not even that rich due to its location and history. They should have checked the economic freedom rankings and GDP per capita (PPP) and got a clue.
 
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FreeNZ.ORG

Democracy

Democracy, whether it is direct or representative is a failure. Always has been and always will be, for one simple reason...it is unrestrained.
What the majority decides today becomes law tomorrow...until the next majority takes it away or amends it the day after. Legislations are driven by emotions rather than logic and he who controls the information flow (government education and mainstream media), controls the emotions. In a democracy the emotionally charged citizens will demand “justice” by punishing the criminal, which is fair, but then take it a step further by punishing the freedom (through legislation) that the criminal abused to commit the crime.

As Benedict LaRosa wrote in Democracy or Republic, Which is it? You punish the abuser of the freedom, not the freedom itself.

There are no rights in a democracy, only privileges. Privileges that can be taken away by 51% of the eligible voters in a direct democracy or 51% of the elected politicians in a representative democracy. In our case here in New Zealand, 62 of the 122 parliamentarians are all that is required for Bills to pass into law.

When the citizens demand a Binding Referendum, they are in fact asking the government to grant them the privilege of voting directly on various issues. This is direct democracy. The very first democracy was the Athenian direct democracy which failed miserably and never tried again for thousands of years! Many argue that direct democracy would be much more efficient with modern technology, but that simply ignores the absurd notion that the majority of one select group, can collectively impose their private law on those who disagree. Nothing is binding in a democracy because there are no rights, only privileges. If the will of the majority wants a binding referendum then it becomes law until the next majority repeals it, in which case it was never binding in the first place. This is the nature of democracy, unrestrained.

How is it fair that 122 politicians whose votes are influenced by various special interest groups can make their private law public law, forcing 4 ¾ Million kiwis to comply, including every kiwi born after the vote?

As kiwis we are encouraged to vote in the general election. One day in every 1095 days the citizens exercise their democratic right to vote for who gets to exercise their democratic right to vote for the next 1094 days!

For the 3 years between elections the citizens complain about lack of representation and the need to be heard. Citizens resort to polls with overwhelming majorities against the Auckland Supercity, against the Anti Smacking Bill and for Binding Referendums...yet the 122 politicians in parliament ignores these polls. Is this not prima facia evidence that the elected representatives are actually representing someone else’s interests?

Because it is unrestrained, anything goes. Bills are passed all day everyday, eventually so many laws are created that we all become criminals even though our behaviour hasn't changed from one day to the next.

However when it suits the agenda of control, the politicians will jump to the aid of any grieving victim who is calling for more restrictive laws. No law will return their loved ones but the new restrictive laws will only serve to help the healing of the victim’s families, but also punish the freedom of all those still alive, including the affected families themselves. In the long run, it is self defeating.

The most common complaint is that whichever party you elect they will often prove to be no different than the last if not worse! The frustration mounts.

Einstein defines insanity as "doing the same thing over again and expecting different results".

How often do we have to keep voting until we work out that we are insane for not realising that the system we are obsessed with fixing, is not even broken. It works exactly as it is designed to work.

Democracy is the illusion of control.
 
Horse****. Your ignorance on how the EU works shows again.

Hong Kong has its leader appointed by dictators in Beijing. The EU "leader" is appointed too, but by democratically elected officials from the 27 member nations. On top of that, the Parliament of the EU is elected and has considerable powers over legislation in the EU.

Calling Hong Kong "free" is an insult to the other countries on the list who actually have free and open elections. Why not put Singapore up there? Oh yea, same situation as Hong Kong..

You know that Hong Kong has elections? So no if the people of Hong Kong votes collectively against China, then China will lose the election and be unable to appoint anyone. That is quite similar like EU. Only if Europeans collectively went against the EU would they be able to get people like Rompuy out.

EU is undemocratic due to lack of information. Voters have no idea what they are voting for, pluss they can only vote for one body that has little power. Low turnout is a sign of democratic deficit.
 
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I think its ironic. The Fraser Institute, a right wing conservative think tank, rates all countries with gov ran healthcare systems more free than the US. I thought if we had gov ran healthcare it would not make us free. :confused:
 
You know that Hong Kong has elections? So no if the people of Hong Kong votes collectively against China, then China will lose the election and be unable to appoint anyone.

Horse****. They might have elections but their whole government is appointed by Bejing.

That is quite similar like EU. Only if Europeans collectively went against the EU would they be able to get people like Rompuy out.

Are you seriously trying to link the EU to a dictatorship? Come on.. that is below you and so far from the facts. For one, the people who appointed Rompuy were all elected by the people... not exactly what happens in China eh?

EU is undemocratic due to lack of information. Voters have no idea what they are voting for, pluss they can only vote for one body that has little power. Low turnout is a sign of democratic deficit.

More horse**** from you. The information is there.. not the fault of the EU that no one listens. And if low turnout is a sign of democratic deficit.. then god help the US.

And the EU parliament has a lot of power... maybe you should go and read up on it.
 
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