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Walmart workers demand better wages

randel said:
no, the union IS THE PEOPLE IN THE PLANT, WHO ELECT THEIR BARGAINING COMMITTEE. they negotiate a binding contract....do you have a problem with contracts? businesses use contracts with each other....
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If a union were strictly between a business and its workers you would be correct.
 
Born Free said:
And how smart are they to loose 18,000 jobs at Hostess. Union management failure at it's worst.
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Not sure. We'll see how it shakes out. But the guy paid a bundle to run a company lost it.
 
TurtleDude said:
the worked for Sam Walton?
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Faded%20Glory2.jpg
 
ReformCollege said:
Yet, productivity in the long run produces jobs.
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Bingo, and not that long of a run, either. Switching from the horse and buggy to the automobile wiped out the buggy/whip industry, the blacksmith industry, the farrier industry.... and gave us the auto industry, the drive-through industry, and a dozen others only possible because of automation. Modern Luddites are no wiser than their forebears.
 
randel said:
no, the union IS THE PEOPLE IN THE PLANT, WHO ELECT THEIR BARGAINING COMMITTEE. they negotiate a binding contract....do you have a problem with contracts? businesses use contracts with each other....
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Within the freedom to contract there is the freedom not to contract--something Walmart is availing itself of. Unions are not opposed to freedom are they?
 
Boo Radley said:
No, that doesn't explain it. Not remotely.
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Umm... yes it does as demonstrated by the increase in compensation not only to CEO's but to knowledge workers across many industries?

If a Widget Inc stock shelfer really did a great job in the 1980's and really did a great job in 2012; the effects haven't really changed that much. His value added to the company hasn't dramatically increased. In Contrast, the CEO's value-added (or detracted) has increased substantially.

To draw out a still-shot; that excellent stock shelfer maybe brings the company an additional $25,000 than if they had not had a stock shelfer, which is $5,000 higher than if they had had a poor one. Ergo, it is meet that his compensation should be greater than $20K but less than $25K. A good CEO's competence, decision-making, and work, however, makes the company an additional $800 million, which is $250 million higher than they would have made with a poor one. By the same measure as we applied to the stockman, his compensation should be greater than $550 million and less than $800 million.


Why isn't it fair for the stock shelfer and CEO to both be compensated commiserate with their value added?
 
cpwill said:
Umm... yes it does as demonstrated by the increase in compensation not only to CEO's but to knowledge workers across many industries?

If a Widget Inc stock shelfer really did a great job in the 1980's and really did a great job in 2012; the effects haven't really changed that much. His value added to the company hasn't dramatically increased. In Contrast, the CEO's value-added (or detracted) has increased substantially.

To draw out a still-shot; that excellent stock shelfer maybe brings the company an additional $25,000 than if they had not had a stock shelfer, which is $5,000 higher than if they had had a poor one. Ergo, it is meet that his compensation should be greater than $20K but less than $25K. A good CEO's competence, decision-making, and work, however, makes the company an additional $800 million, which is $250 million higher than they would have made with a poor one. By the same measure as we applied to the stockman, his compensation should be greater than $550 million and less than $800 million.


Why isn't it fair for the stock shelfer and CEO to both be compensated commiserate with their value added?
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No, it doesn't. What you speak of would raise employee salaries, skilled workers, and not CEO pay, not at the level we're speaking of.

They are largely over rated and need a sound work force, without show we've seen them fail. Interesting though that you'd try and make excuses for the foolish practice of overpaying them.
 
haymarket said:
feel free to elaborate .....

tell us how working at Wal Mart and getting a root canal is an enjoyable experience.
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Conflating the two makes his point. Congratulations.
 
There's a great barrack-room lawyer's response!
Maybe if companies were required to do due diligence on their suppliers to ensure that the the same health and safety standards were applied as if they were in-country, then these things wouldn't happen.
 
OpportunityCost said:
Respectfully disagree. Corporate social responsibility dictates that eventually any policy that is viewed neagtively by the public will cost sales and profit. I would say it has reached that point with Wal-Mart. They could engage in a pay step scale that doesnt leave employees in danger of losing raises faster than the minimum wage is raised in states. Wage compression is a very real issue in Wal-Mart and they ought to address it.

Better employee wages also tend to make for better employee customers---something to consider.

Last note: Wal-Mart is not the same company it was under Sam Walton and any employee that has been there since he was the boss will say as much. The company has changed considerably and while it is the largest employer in the US, its days are numbered---internet sales are going to dent Wal-Mart just as hard as they are other retail outlets. The reasons why someone shops will have as much to do with service and environment as they do with convenience and price in as little as 10 to 15 years. Wal-Mart would do well to examine their employment model closely, it wont last as it is forever.
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well the ultimate question is, that its up too walmart to choose,...not the workers, or government, and if walmart makes the wrong decision, and they lose shoppers and money, that is how the market works.

but anybody who seeks to intimidate their employer, and make demands, will not find a friend in the most of the American people.
 
Manc Skipper said:
There's a great barrack-room lawyer's response!
Maybe if companies were required to do due diligence on their suppliers to ensure that the the same health and safety standards were applied as if they were in-country, then these things wouldn't happen.
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how is that going to happen? does the USA have jurisdiction over working conditions in Bangladesh?

maybe if those workers all had wings they could have flown away from the fire
 
Boo Radley said:
Never met a union boss. Instead, I see high CEO salaries and worker pay being stagnet or decreasing. Benefits decreasing. Not sure how you scape out an argument that unions are destorying things under these conditions.
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Ask the 18,000 people that lost thier jobs due to Hostess having to liquidate. Hostess warned them that if they didn't get back to work then Hostess would be forced to liquidate the entire company. Yet the union bosses continue on ignoring the warning.

And the only reason that you keep hearing about CEO's salaries is because of the sense of entitlement that so many people have now adays. The belief that they are owed something that they do not deserve or work for.

And this is coming from someone who gets paid $9.25/hr. Wife makes 7.75/hr (even after 12 years of working in the same place) and has a boss that doesn't give her full time hours just so he can get a bigger bonus every quarter. Yet you don't see me demanding that my boss pay me more or I will strike do you? (i don't strike) And while I was on foodstamps for awhile as soon as I got a job I got off of them. Just called them and told them to cancel without even checking to see if I could still qualify for them. And yet despite all this I am STILL living quite comfortably. Got a roof over my head, food on the table, heat, clothing and a fully insured car.

These people and those like them don't need more money. They need to start taking responsibility for thier own actions and attempt to make themselves worth more instead of just demanding what they think they are owed.

Sorry but I have no sympathy for anyone that demands more and expects it to be given for no real reason.
 
ernst barkmann said:
well the ultimate question is, that its up too walmart to choose,...not the workers, or government, and if walmart makes the wrong decision, and they lose shoppers and money, that is how the market works.

but anybody who seeks to intimidate their employer, and make demands, will not find a friend in the most of the American people.
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Agree. CSR is a combination of factors and societal pressure is one of them in the form of bad PR. As values change, so does CSR. Its not the easiest concept and it can be local, county, state and national. There are tons of ways to implement it, whether its volunteerism, charity drives or even eco friendly moves.

It can be very costly. But the overall goal is to increase profit and business by making investments that are "the right thing" before they are actually needed by law.
 
Kal'Stang said:
Ask the 18,000 people that lost thier jobs due to Hostess having to liquidate. Hostess warned them that if they didn't get back to work then Hostess would be forced to liquidate the entire company. Yet the union bosses continue on ignoring the warning.

And the only reason that you keep hearing about CEO's salaries is because of the sense of entitlement that so many people have now adays. The belief that they are owed something that they do not deserve or work for.

And this is coming from someone who gets paid $9.25/hr. Wife makes 7.75/hr (even after 12 years of working in the same place) and has a boss that doesn't give her full time hours just so he can get a bigger bonus every quarter. Yet you don't see me demanding that my boss pay me more or I will strike do you? (i don't strike) And while I was on foodstamps for awhile as soon as I got a job I got off of them. Just called them and told them to cancel without even checking to see if I could still qualify for them. And yet despite all this I am STILL living quite comfortably. Got a roof over my head, food on the table, heat, clothing and a fully insured car.

These people and those like them don't need more money. They need to start taking responsibility for thier own actions and attempt to make themselves worth more instead of just demanding what they think they are owed.

Sorry but I have no sympathy for anyone that demands more and expects it to be given for no real reason.
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The entitlement meme is merely a tactic to avoid a discussion on worker rights. When a company closes, both sides failed. But my problem is that so many attack the workers and not management. They also failed, and did so while paying a huge some of money to someone to make it work. You can whine abut unions all you want, but stock holders paid the CEO and not the union to make it work.
 
Manc Skipper said:
Like the 114 dead non-union Bangla Deshi's who worked for him?
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Wow...he went over and killed 114 bangladeshians? :lamo

OF COURSE thats all you can see. OF COURSE.
 
The Man said:
Why do no-skill workers "deserve" more? Average of $10.50/hour sounds pretty damn good to round up carts and say 'Welcome to Wal mart!" to people as they enter the store. How much do you think they should make? Should they make an engineer's salary?
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Half the time they don't even get that right, carters end up dinging vehicles by half assing the job, and greeters don't greet, hell, they just stare most of the time. I mean, when you have a single facet job it should be impossible to suck at it. Yet these "deserving" employees "shine" on through.
 
ReformCollege said:
I'm sure he purposely killed them, himself, barehanded, just because he was having a bad day.
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nah...it was a game of sport. Rich guys got to go over once a month and hunt them down and kill them. had a banquet afterward. Yeaahaw!!!
 
VanceMack said:
nah...it was a game of sport. Rich guys got to go over once a month and hunt them down and kill them. had a banquet afterward. Yeaahaw!!!
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yeah I guess old Sam rose from the dead after resting peacefully for 20+ years and went over there and lit the fire
 
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Boo Radley said:
The entitlement meme is merely a tactic to avoid a discussion on worker rights. When a company closes, both sides failed. But my problem is that so many attack the workers and not management. They also failed, and did so while paying a huge some of money to someone to make it work. You can whine abut unions all you want, but stock holders paid the CEO and not the union to make it work.
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When it comes to pay the only "right" that a worker has is to get paid $7.25/hr. I have no problem with workers demanding a safer environment because they DO have that right. But when it comes to pay higher than the minimum wage? They had better be worth it. Not only in skill but also in work ethic, experiance, and attendence. No worker has a right to get paid more than $7.25/hr unless the minimum wage gets raised via Congress.
 
I can't believe I read this thread, do any of you realize that Wal-Mart is basically an indoor flea market selling yard sale items five years from now? I haven't been in one in 5 years+ and don't understand that support their crap.
 
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