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Hostess threatens to lay off 18,000 employees unless strike ends[W:521]

So unions aren't always this democratic utopia? They can and do act tyrannically?

Well I'll be damned. Maybe there should be better oversight of unions. There is obviously not enough regulations on unions if they are allowed to put a company out of business and affect the layoff of 18,500 people.
 
MaggieD said:
Well, if you opened my link you would.
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I opened both links and read both thoroughly. The reference to the 25% stake is ambiguous and I know from previous stories relating to this matter that the Baker's Union was not offered the 25%. I read the last paragraph of the pertinent link more than once. It infers that the 25% was offered to all, but does not state so specifically.
 
DaveFagan said:
I opened both links and read both thoroughly. The reference to the 25% stake is ambiguous and I know from previous stories relating to this matter that the Baker's Union was not offered the 25%. I read the last paragraph of the pertinent link more than once. It infers that the 25% was offered to all, but does not state so specifically.
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Hostess also reduced its pension obligations and its contribution to the employees' health care plan. In exchange, the company offered concessions, including a 25% equity stake for workers and the inclusion of two union representatives on an eight-member board of directors.
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Hostess Brands closing for good due to bakers strike - Nov. 16, 2012

The bakers union, which represents about 5,000 of the bankrupt company's 18,000 workers, is on strike to protest a new contract imposed by the bankruptcy court that calls for an immediate 8% salary cut, along with reductions in pension obligations and company contributions to employee health-care plans. In exchange, the Wonder Bread maker would begin to bump up salaries after one year and give workers a 25% equity stake in the company. Hostess filed for bankruptcy protection in January.
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Hostess: Company toast if bakers strike continues - MarketWatch

Hostess also reduced its pension obligations and its contribution to the employees' health care plan. In exchange, the company offered concessions, including a 25% equity stake for workers and the inclusion of two union representatives on an eight-member board of directors
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Hostess Brands closing for good due to bakers strike - Yahoo! Finance

What's ambiguous?
 
Sheik Yerbuti said:
What I've been sayingis that Hostess' executive's greed is what got in the way of reaching a deal with the union.
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And that is why they are liquidating the company.

It's union greed that killed Hostess, and you wonder why union membership has been decreasing over the years. All this BS that it's Hostess management's fault is just that, "BS". It's union management that is a fault and that have been shown time and time again. Which is why union shops have lost membership over the years. Their only place left is in the public sector where whey they keep their high compensation packages in exchange for their vote.
 
Born Free said:
And that is why they are liquidating the company.

It's union greed that killed Hostess, and you wonder why union membership has been decreasing over the years. All this BS that it's Hostess management's fault is just that, "BS". It's union management that is a fault and that have been shown time and time again. Which is why union shops have lost membership over the years. Their only place left is in the public sector where whey they keep their high compensation packages in exchange for their vote.
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Government doesn't have to make a profit or even break even. Therefore those union jobs are secure.
 
MaggieD said:
Interesting that this guy didn't mention that they were also going to get a 25% stake in the company...just like the Teamster's got and two union representatives on the eight-member board of Directors.

Now, who's right here because this link says this employee's understanding of the wage agreement is totally incorrect:



I suspect the link is correct, and the employee is wrong.

Hostess Brands closing for good due to bakers strike - Nov. 16, 2012

Edit: Combine this information with the fact that the Teamsters negotiated their own contract down and recommended the bakers union accept the concessions, and I suspect the workers were poorly informed. Who is more supportive of unions than Teamsters?

Teamsters: Bakery Workers Should Hold Secret Ballot Vote at Hostess | International Brotherhood of Teamsters (IBT)
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I did some more research and you are correct. All the unions were offered the 25%'

"The proposed new labor deal consists of an immediate 8% wage cut and work rules more favorable to the company. Employer contributions for health insurance would decrease 17%. Hostess contributions to multi-employer pension plans would cease until 2015, at which point the current required level of funding would plummet from $100 million to $25 million. According to Rayburn, the proposal has been endorsed by Hostess’s key secured lenders, which are led by hedge funds Silver Point Capital and Monarch Alternative Capital. One estimate put cost savings for Hostess in the neighborhood of $200 million.

For their part, the unions would receive two seats on a restructured nine-member board of directors and 25% of equity. That would make the unions part of Hostess’ capital structure for the first time."


Twinkies – and 18000 jobs – fall victim to union-management dispute; Update: Teamsters throw bakers union under the bus? « Hot Air
 
MaggieD said:
Interesting that this guy didn't mention that they were also going to get a 25% stake in the company...just like the Teamster's got and two union representatives on the eight-member board of Directors.

Now, who's right here because this link says this employee's understanding of the wage agreement is totally incorrect:



I suspect the link is correct, and the employee is wrong.

Hostess Brands closing for good due to bakers strike - Nov. 16, 2012

Edit: Combine this information with the fact that the Teamsters negotiated their own contract down and recommended the bakers union accept the concessions, and I suspect the workers were poorly informed. Who is more supportive of unions than Teamsters?

Teamsters: Bakery Workers Should Hold Secret Ballot Vote at Hostess | International Brotherhood of Teamsters (IBT)
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I did some more research and you are correct. All the unions were offered the 25%'

"The proposed new labor deal consists of an immediate 8% wage cut and work rules more favorable to the company. Employer contributions for health insurance would decrease 17%. Hostess contributions to multi-employer pension plans would cease until 2015, at which point the current required level of funding would plummet from $100 million to $25 million. According to Rayburn, the proposal has been endorsed by Hostess’s key secured lenders, which are led by hedge funds Silver Point Capital and Monarch Alternative Capital. One estimate put cost savings for Hostess in the neighborhood of $200 million.

For their part, the unions would receive two seats on a restructured nine-member board of directors and 25% of equity. That would make the unions part of Hostess’ capital structure for the first time."


Twinkies – and 18000 jobs – fall victim to union-management dispute; Update: Teamsters throw bakers union under the bus? « Hot Air
 
Born Free said:
And that is why they are liquidating the company.

It's union greed that killed Hostess, and you wonder why union membership has been decreasing over the years. All this BS that it's Hostess management's fault is just that, "BS". It's union management that is a fault and that have been shown time and time again. Which is why union shops have lost membership over the years. Their only place left is in the public sector where whey they keep their high compensation packages in exchange for their vote.
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I agree with you. Since the union just took a voice vote, I'm not sure the employees were even fully aware of the terms. One of the posts above shows an employee not understanding that, while he'd get an 8% pay cut for one year, in the 2nd, third and fourth years he'd get a raise. What's with that huge misunderstanding?

I think the union may have misled the employees about just what was offered....didn't give them time to really digest it....and jumped to scorched earth. I can't imagine what their motive was, but that's how it appears to me.

If Hostess is even successful in getting a company to take over their plants, these employees will most definitely lose their pension/healthcare/hourly rate. Unions like members. 6,000 union members losing their jobs over their recommendation just doesn't sound right. Yet. There it is.
 
Big Money details. Always good to know.

The Hostess Liquidation: A Curious Cast Of Characters As The Twinkie Tumbles | ZeroHedge

"The company was going to pieces -- again -- and Hostess filed for Chapter 11 protection -- again -- in January of this year. This time, though, the moneymen were no longer on the same page. As the majority equity holder, Ripplewood badly wanted to keep Hostess out of bankruptcy. It pleaded with the lenders to show flexibility, but they were not so inclined. They lenders held superior fiscal hands and had less downside if Hostess failed. In the event of a bankruptcy, given all the assets Hostess owned, the lenders would still walk away with millions."
 
DaveFagan said:
I did some more research and you are correct. All the unions were offered the 25%'

"The proposed new labor deal consists of an immediate 8% wage cut and work rules more favorable to the company. Employer contributions for health insurance would decrease 17%. Hostess contributions to multi-employer pension plans would cease until 2015, at which point the current required level of funding would plummet from $100 million to $25 million. According to Rayburn, the proposal has been endorsed by Hostess’s key secured lenders, which are led by hedge funds Silver Point Capital and Monarch Alternative Capital. One estimate put cost savings for Hostess in the neighborhood of $200 million.

For their part, the unions would receive two seats on a restructured nine-member board of directors and 25% of equity. That would make the unions part of Hostess’ capital structure for the first time."


Twinkies – and 18000 jobs – fall victim to union-management dispute; Update: Teamsters throw bakers union under the bus? « Hot Air
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:thinking Why would any one want 25% of that?
 
winston53660 said:
:thinking Why would any one want 25% of that?
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If they could save the company, it would be profitable, long term. When all is said and done, the secured lenders will profit handsomely from the forced sale. As bankruptcies are planned events by lawyers one should always see who profits from the bankruptcy. There were large money interests that profitted most from bankruptcy and their behind the scenes activities might be investigated. As Maggie D noted, the union employee's story did not note the 25% equity in his bio. I'm curious about that because everything else was exactly correct and timely. If I had been Monarch or Silver Point, I would have paid a bribe to a union leader to make sure there was a strike to guarantee my profits. Conjecture, but good business conjecture.
 
Apparently a Mexican bread company may buy twinkies

So they may now become a foreign import

lol
 
Bronson said:
Apparently a Mexican bread company may buy twinkies

So they may now become a foreign import

lol
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It's the same company that bought out Mrs. Baird's bread in Fort Worth, which had been a strong local business, a few years ago. Apparently, it's a pretty substantial business.
 
lizzie said:
It's the same company that bought out Mrs. Baird's bread in Fort Worth, which had been a strong local business, a few years ago. Apparently, it's a pretty substantial business.
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Dallas it was in Dallas. And when growing up over at my Grandmothers the smell of baking bread....oh man I miss that. There also use to be a train that ran along there. As kids we'd hop it and flatten pennies.

I also miss the Dr Pepper factory on Mockingbird.

Times change.
 
winston53660 said:
Dallas it was in Dallas. And when growing up over at my Grandmothers the smell of baking bread....oh man I miss that. There also use to be a train that ran along there. As kids we'd hop it and flatten pennies.

I also miss the Dr Pepper factory on Mockingbird.

Times change.
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They had a huge facility in Fort Worth as well- right off I-30 after passing through the mixmaster- I distinctly remember the smell. :lol:
 
lizzie said:
They had a huge facility in Fort Worth as well- right off I-30 after passing through the mixmaster- I distinctly remember the smell. :lol:
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The one in Dallas was at Central and Mockingbird. Use to go to the factory store as a kid with my mom. Took tours of the factory as a grade school kid.

Wasn't that smell GREAT!
 
Zalatix said:
He'd rather avoid hiring American workers while selling to American workers.

I personally would like to see free Traitors chased out of this country. Considering how much opposition there is to offshoring now, it may in fact happen.
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Business majors are inferior in intelligence. Glorifying such no-talent brown-noses with their generic degrees has filled them with the megalomania in which any simple-minded tactic is justified as long as it makes more money than doing it the honest way, which these low-IQ scum are incapable of. Putting inferior people in superior positions has forced them to get by the only way such ambitious imbeciles can. People as stupid as they aredo have to outsource to sweatshops; it's not just greed, it's incompetence. They are anti-American because they didn't get their jobs the old American Way, starting from the bottom and working their way up. Instead, they start out in management after spending four years in college learning nothing relevant to their job, and especially nothing that would make them more informed than someone who had worked at the company those four years. Rodney Dangerfield in Back to School was right on the money about how real businessmen doing it the American Way made money.
 
lizzie said:
They had a huge facility in Fort Worth as well- right off I-30 after passing through the mixmaster- I distinctly remember the smell. :lol:
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One time passing thru the Big D, there is a really cool little dinner club where they perform plays across the street from the old DP factory called "The Pocket Sandwich Theater." A lot of fun. Silly.
 
Grim17 said:
This isn't good... I guess the question for the union workers is:

Is a job with a cut in pay, better than no job at all?
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This right here are why unions are necessary. This is the same mentality company owners had before unions and still hold today. Is a ****ty paying job better than no job at all? Well depends. If I had 3 extra mouths to feed, then the options are somewhat like having the option of getting your head cut off by a lawnmower or a guillotine.
 
Hatuey said:
This right here are why unions are necessary. This is the same mentality company owners had before unions and still hold today. Is a ****ty paying job better than no job at all? Well depends. If I had 3 extra mouths to feed, then the options are somewhat like having the option of getting your head cut off by a lawnmower or a guillotine.
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I just read 11/19 @ 4:37 p.m. that Judge Drain ordered mediation between Hostess and the Baker's Union. Apparently the fat lady is in the wings waiting to sing, or not.
 
MaggieD said:
Just who do you think creates jobs?

Cart pushers are WalMart?
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Under the American Way, superseded by hiring no-talent brown-nosing Diplomaed Dumboes to run things, people started out as cart pushers and continually worked their way up to the top. In 1953, according to The Organization Man, one third of the CEOs had not gone to college. The rest were probably rich kids who had inherited their jobs. The rich didn't like such class-climbing and, for no other reason, imposed this class-biased indentured servitude in order to allow advancement only to those who would make a permanently damaging and unnecessary sacrifice to serve under their preppy classmates.
 
PrometheusBound said:
Under the American Way, superseded by hiring no-talent brown-nosing Diplomaed Dumboes to run things, people started out as cart pushers and continually worked their way up to the top. In 1953, according to The Organization Man, one third of the CEOs had not gone to college. The rest were probably rich kids who had inherited their jobs. The rich didn't like such class-climbing and, for no other reason, imposed this class-biased indentured servitude in order to allow advancement only to those who would make a permanently damaging and unnecessary sacrifice to serve under their preppy classmates.
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So, if I understand you correctly, you're saying that cart-pushers do create jobs . . . in 15 or 20 years. ;)
 
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