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Indiana Republican: When life begins from rape, "God intended" it [W:266]

RabidAlpaca said:
Glad to see we agree on that.

Rape is already a really tricky thing to prove in court. Too many cases happen where a guy has sex with a willing woman, the woman gets pregnant, then turns around and calls it rape to save face. On no planet can that be considered murder.
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well we do agree

but theres lots of false cases out there including murder charges right now, that wouldnt stop me from calling it murder id be fine with a murder charge also. Id actually like the death penalty as an option for rape.

what you are talking about is the broken system, the charge is fine but the system needs some fixing and i agree with that.
 
Henrin said:
I don't agree with criminalizing for two reasons.

1. The government hasn't shown me it understands proper restraints and an issue like this dictates that it not only understands them, but practices them.

2. I'm not convinced it will make much of a positive difference, but I'm more than convinced it will result in many negative consequences. While I want to protect human life at the maximum of my abilities I'm not sold this is the way to do it.

Still, I can not join in with people that say it should be a choice. That implies there is nothing wrong with it and its just a matter of choice if that is what people want. That would mean that certain right violations are just a matter of choice if you want to take part in them. I can not agree with such a premise.
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You will get no road rash from me if you oppose abortion but do not seek to criminalize it. I think folks such as you can make a tremendous quality of life contribution, enhancing adoption laws, etc. and I'd be happy to join in such efforts.
 
Objective-J said:
well we do agree

but theres lots of false cases out there including murder charges right now, that wouldnt stop me from calling it murder id be fine with a murder charge also. Id actually like the death penalty as an option for rape.

what you are talking about is the broken system, the charge is fine but the system needs some fixing and i agree with that.
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Jesus, death penalty for rape? I could maybe understand if it were an extremely violent one. That's a question for another thread though.
 
Pinkie said:
Whether the woman consented is certainly key to determining that a rape occurred, but there's no "accidental" sex act that could leave her pregnant.

If she did consent to sex but not to being infected with a deadly STI, and she dies, it's Murder One.
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I don't know why you keep quoting me over and over again saying the same thing that "it's murder one".

I tend to rely on evidence and legal definitions. You can really stop wasting your time if you're not going to provide either of those.
 
RabidAlpaca said:
Jesus, death penalty for rape? I could maybe understand if it were an extremely violent one. That's a question for another thread though.
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yes absolutely its a despicable crime that most certainly should have the death penalty on the table, and I believe it already is for repeat offenders.
 
Pinkie said:
It's a big deal to me -- our loved ones should be off-limits in trash talk about abortion.
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To be fair, he was the one who mentioned his daughter and what he originally wanted done about the situation. If I remember correct Jay said something about it and Objective said he was wrong. I took offense to that because what Jay said was in fact correct and Objective was being dishonest about the entire thing.

Perhaps I shouldn't have said anything on it, but it felt like the right thing to do at the time.
 
Henrin said:
To be fair, he was the one who mentioned his daughter and what he originally wanted done about the situation. If I remember correct Jay said something about it and Objective said he was wrong. I took offense to that because what Jay said was in fact correct and Objective was being dishonest about the entire thing.

Perhaps I shouldn't have said anything on it, but it felt like the right thing to do at the time.
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this is simply a lie LMAO

heres my original comment to JayDubya

JayDubya said:
No, it really didn't. If you abandon your principles the moment they become inconvenient, you never had principles. We weren't ready and we had some hard times making ends meet.

How awesome is my unplanned kid? So awesome.
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and I said:
Objective-J said:
my unplanned kid is awesome too and i got full sole custody.

guess what, i still wanted her (my Girlfriend) to get an abortion at the time and would never ever think its ok to force my views on others and make abortion illegal :shrug:
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whats dishonest about my post? NOTHING lol
 
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RabidAlpaca said:
I don't know why you keep quoting me over and over again saying the same thing that "it's murder one".

I tend to rely on evidence and legal definitions. You can really stop wasting your time if you're not going to provide either of those.
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Murder One is a premeditated, criminal act that causes death.

I hope to God for your sake that you are not in law school.
 
Henrin said:
To be fair, he was the one who mentioned his daughter and what he originally wanted done about the situation. If I remember correct Jay said something about it and Objective said he was wrong. I took offense to that because what Jay said was in fact correct and Objective was being dishonest about the entire thing.

Perhaps I shouldn't have said anything on it, but it felt like the right thing to do at the time.
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IMO, it is never the right thing to do. I myself have said such things as "I want my daughter to have reproductive rights".

That's not an opening for some jackass to demand I deny I considered aborting my daughter, Henrin.
 
Pinkie said:
Murder One is a premeditated, criminal act that causes death.

I hope to God for your sake that you are not in law school.
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Yep, the murder is premeditated. Thank you for regurgitating the definition I already gave you. Next topic.
 
Objective-J said:
yes absolutely its a despicable crime that most certainly should have the death penalty on the table, and I believe it already is for repeat offenders.
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No, no state provides the death penalty for rape.

I oppose the death penalty on somewhat complicated grounds, so I would oppose any move to add new crimes to those eligible for it now. I get your point about rape being as morally repugnant as murder in some cases, though, especially if the victim is a child.
 
RabidAlpaca said:
Yep, the murder is premeditated. Thank you for regurgitating the definition I already gave you. Next topic.
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The act that caused death was a premeditated crime. In this hypothetical, that act is a rape.

It does not matter, in laying charges, whether the death of the victim was the criminal's ultimate goal -- if she dies, it's Murder One.
 
Pinkie said:
IMO, it is never the right thing to do. I myself have said such things as "I want my daughter to have reproductive rights".

That's not an opening for some jackass to demand I deny I considered aborting my daughter, Henrin.
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You know what, lady?

a) I'm not a jackass, and Henrin's not a "jackass," and neither are we "fools" or "assholes" because we both disagree with your political opinions and we can read and repeat what other people say accurately. Knock off the namecalling.

b) Captain Courtesy said to stop talking about personal things even though Objective-J explicitly brought it up, said it directly, and continues to say it and you and he continue to reassert and continue to talk about his comment. If you're truly "offended" by it, maybe you should try being happy we've been asked to stop talking about it and move on?
 
JayDubya said:
You know what, lady?

a) I'm not a jackass, and Henrin's not a "jackass," and neither are we "fools" or "assholes" because we both disagree with your political opinions and we can read and repeat what other people say accurately. Knock off the namecalling.

b) Captain Courtesy said to stop talking about personal things even though Objective-J explicitly brought it up, said it directly, and continues to say it and you and he continue to reassert and continue to talk about his comment. If you're truly "offended" by it, maybe you should try being happy we've been asked to stop talking about it and move on?
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Henrin's not a jackass.

You?

You are speshell kind of woman hater, Jay. I'm not the least bit fooled as to why you are so hyper on this subject, and I doubt anyone else is, either.
 
Kal'Stang said:
So by denying women the ability to get abortions you are effectively condemning women to death.
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I dunno if you are asking us or telling us, Kal'Stang, but I was a teenager when Roe v. Wade was decided and yes, if abortion is a crime, women die. The rusty coathanger is not just a metaphor.
 
Pinkie said:
Henrin's not a jackass.

You?

You are speshell kind of woman hater, Jay. I'm not the least bit fooled as to why you are so hyper on this subject, and I doubt anyone else is, either.
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Cool, more lies and personal attacks.
 
JayDubya said:
Cool, more lies and personal attacks.
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And how do you characterize YOUR conduct on DP? You drool over every anti-abortion rights news item and demonize all of us who support reproductive rights.
 
Pinkie said:
Henrin's not a jackass.

You?

You are speshell kind of woman hater, Jay. I'm not the least bit fooled as to why you are so hyper on this subject, and I doubt anyone else is, either.
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the vast majority here arent fooled at all, its maybe 4-5 people that are fooled
 
There are other places available to behave like a hooligan if that is your wish. There is no evidence to support your naked defamation.

Please refrain from trolling and personal attacks and try to post on-topic.
 
Kal'Stang said:
So by denying women the ability to get abortions you are effectively condemning women to death.
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Well honestly women will abort and cause themselves miscarriages any way, so all that is really being denied is a legal way to do it. In that way making it illegal would indeed lead to women killing themselves.
 
Hey, stop it right now! This has nothing to do with God but with free will. Some people will attempt to rationalize what they want to do by atrributing it to God.
 
Kal'Stang said:
So by denying women the ability to get abortions you are effectively condemning women to death.
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On the other front, women will have health problems and could very well die because of them if not treated. I have no reason to deny it.
 
varium103 said:
I didn't say you needed the Bible to not steal or commit sins. What the Bible can do is change how you feel about sinning.

You say you are moral. A business man who kills someone affecting his business is also moral. Because he feels inside that its just business not personal. Everyone is moral if they feel they are a "good" person. If you have read the bible it talks a lot more then just believing God is real. Even the demons believe and fear him...if you aren't even on their level then you are in extremely bad shape according to the Bible.

Study and Exposition of Romans 1:18-32 | Bible.org - Worlds Largest Bible Study Site

this talks about people suppressing the truth with their sin.

Having sex before you are married is considered immoral since the beginning of time, so are you telling me you waited? You said you are moral. But you are just saying you are moral based on what YOU think is moral. In that case everyone is some what moral and no one is wrong. Killing people is moral if you are killing only bad people. Stealing from major companies is moral because they rip off people. The list goes on.

As far as God's plans. I mean we shouldn't be trying to figure that out and question it. But rather do what he says so he can use us in it. God will get done what he wants done. If not through you, then he will find some one else who will obey him. This has happened to me many times, as I did not step up to the plate and before my very eyes, some one else did.
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You're definitely reaching.

You know - I was a stupid teen and did stupid **** but I was also religious at that time - extremely - and back then I ended my ways and through my belief, back then, I asked for forgiveness - all that.

It was only later that I really quit the whole belief thing.

So - I no longer believe in the whole 'sin marring your soul' and what not.
 
JayDubya said:
There are other places available to behave like a hooligan if that is your wish. There is no evidence to support your naked defamation.

Please refrain from trolling and personal attacks and try to post on-topic.
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Honey, calling you a woman hater is not trolling. It's observation.

 
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