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Chicago Teachers Union Gives 10-Day Strike Notice

ecofarm said:
I don't see how being a certified teacher makes one particularly authoritative on the subject.
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Being educated in a subject, tested to make sure you know isn't being an authority? I susppose we could go with only someone not educated is an authority. Doctorates would cost more btw.

State employees unionizing to pressure the state into paying them more isn't exactly capitalism.
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Like all other workers. Yep. And like all employers, the state doesn't have to give in. And if they do, you can vote them out. You're wasting your energy where you have no say. Try focusing on where you do. Instead of making excuses for them, act.
 
It never ceases to amaze me how a special interest group can influence a political party to the point where not only do the politicians do their bidding, but the rank-and-file members of the party actually start peddling their ridiculous talking points. Democrats do it with unions; Republicans do it with corporations and rich people. Stockholm Syndrome is alive and well on both sides of the aisle. :(

Teacher's unions (like other public sector unions) are an archaic institution that need to go the way of the dinosaur to make way for the 21st century. They are absolutely a force for mediocrity and the status quo. Not only do they stand in the way of their students' progress and overcharge the state relative to the market value of their services, but they actively push for policies that HARM society. They fully deserve all the criticism they receive.
 
criticism of the strike... Do you have an actual argument beyond the vague snark?
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the teachers mustn't strike because the state is bankrupt

hello
 
The interests of teachers and the interests of students often reinforce each other
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not when the incompetent are protected at the expense of the untenured young

not when plum perks like pensions and 100 minutes of prep per day are vouchsafed ahead of talent and youth

chris christie has demonstrated manifest leadership in dark blue trenton, has effected almost miraculous reform

Sweeping N.J. teacher's tenure bill passes Legislature, heads to Gov. Christie's desk | NJ.com

louisiana's bobby jindal goes two farther---he would free up all kids in failing schools to use vouchers to exodus out of failure and incompetence, he would also do away with "last in, first out"

Jindal Pushing Vouchers, Changes to Teacher Performance - State EdWatch - Education Week

they are under no obligation to consider student interests in their activities
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i'd watch who i said that to if i were you, but i'm not, so help yourself

I hope that clears things up for you
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so much arrogance, so much empty arrogance
 
ecofarm said:
What does one need for that, a 2 year degree?
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in california, k6, a 4 year degree in any subject and a fifth year to get the credential

humboldt state has one of CA's busiest teacher education programs

ucsh, cal state hayward, also produces a lot of teachers

in higher grades a subject-specific degree or passage of subject nte is required, plus the fifth year

we also had to do another quarter (mainstreaming, tech in classroom and health---dang, my memory! i'm surprised) to earn the "clear"

they then made me do four four semester unit classes about half way into my career to get a clad---CA language arts development (bics and calps, basic intercommunication skills and i-forget) about half way into my career, no one ever used it, the fad immediately faded away

i had to pay for all these classes but they automatically moved me over columns on the pay scale

the classes, by the way, were a joke, i did clad in front of the tv, it was essentially just a lot of paper work for a guy like me

are they state employees?
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my check is made out by contra costa county supt of schools, but of course most the money comes from the state
 
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Boo Radley said:
Being educated in a subject, tested to make sure you know isn't being an authority?
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on teaching? knowledge of subject matter is NOT the emphasis of teacher education

i remember when you used to pass yourself off as a small college dept chair which was always impossible because of your inability to spell
 
They fully deserve all the criticism they receive.
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gallup yesterday: 31% say private school is the best place to get an excellent education, 21 cite parochial school, 17 prefer charters, 13 home schools, and only 5% aver that public school is the best place to go

Gallup: Americans Rate Public Schools the Worst Place to Educate Children | cnsnews.com

furthermore, 83% of the ADULTS surveyed by america's most prestigious pollster are consumers of, that is, they're trapped in those very failed institutions of paralysis they so overwhelmingly disapprove of

if the poll were of likely voters instead of adults, the numbers for public schools would be significantly lower
 
cognitive academic language proficiency---calps

bics transfer, calps don't

the theory, probably true, is that bics, basic intercommunication skills, the daily exchange of language outside the classroom, transfers

that is, lep students (limited english proficient) will find that their limited mastery of their new, second language---english---will allow them to use what they know about L1, their native language, in basic intercommunication in their new L2, english, pretty well

BUT---and here's the point---their ACADEMIC literacy in L2, english, will NOT transfer from their ACADEMIC mastery of L1, spanish, WITHOUT the help of the professionally trained educator in "sheltered academic instruction"

the whole point of clad was to teach MATH teachers, and history and science and pe, how to TEACH new english learners how to transfer---most specifically in reading---their academic skills in spanish into functioning academic communication skills in english

we had to teach new english learners how to READ their TEXTBOOKS in english, that's what it was mostly about

it was more---how to teach native spanish speakers new to english how to LISTEN and UNDERSTAND english instruction in MATH or whatever academic subject---as well as how to SPEAK it

like i said, after mandating we all go there, the state almost immediately abandoned the whole program

the whole thing was a waste, i paid uc san diego about 1200 dollars in tution, spent about 10 hours filling out dittos in front of fox news, and got about a 1200 dollar a year raise for the rest of my career (and also effecting upwards my retirement)

a win-win-win for the education establishment, not much for the taxpayers or kids

no spin, wynn

http://www.unco.edu/doit/resources/Model_Courses/EDI 112_PPT.pdf

by the way, i became quite the expert in clad, i was able and very happy to help many of my fellow teachers under the gun who had to pass to keep admin off their backs, i'm not sure that the curriculum was well presented to my colleagues

it was very easy for me, i've always been really good at all academic subjects

as if anyone but my nonagenarion mom cares, she's a saint
 
The Prof said:
my check is made out by contra costa county supt of schools, but of course most the money comes from the state
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The money comes from property taxes which are usually collected by the state and then some portion is given back to particular school districts.
 
For most teachers in this country the profession is no longer an honorable profession, it is just a job. They protect themselves as best they can. I am not sure the unions are the best form of protection for them anymore. The unions are only preserving their owns interests. Only a few of the teachers I have known still feel a calling to teach. Most are only going through the motions because their hands are tied on what they can do to maintain class discipline.
 
The teachers are going on strike when the state is broke. There isn't any money to pay them a 12% a year raise. And people in Chicago already pay pretty high taxes, don't they?

Calvin Coolidge made a name for himself by firing striking policemen. "There is no right to strike against the public safety by anyone, anywhere, any time." he said. That was enough to boost him to the Presidency.

Some brave leader needs to enunciate a corollary: There is no right to strike against the welfare of our children by anyone, anywhere, any time. Will it be Rahm who does that?
 
LowDown said:
The teachers are going on strike when the state is broke. There isn't any money to pay them a 12% a year raise.
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The Chicago School Board and Rahm Emmanuel shouldn't have decided to increase the length of the school day without any demonstrable benefit if it couldn't pay for it. Don't blame the teachers for the city's irresponsibility. That's nonsensical.
 
Cephus said:
Come on, you don't actually think they care about the students, do you? They just want to line their own pockets. The only thing the students are good for in this is as pawns.
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So it's ok for politicians to do this (with millions of dollars), but it's not ok for teachers to want an increase in salary? Because I do believe we have career GOP (as well as Dem) politicians that do this and get voted back in over and over again.
 
Kandahar said:
It never ceases to amaze me how a special interest group can influence a political party to the point where not only do the politicians do their bidding, but the rank-and-file members of the party actually start peddling their ridiculous talking points. Democrats do it with unions; Republicans do it with corporations and rich people. Stockholm Syndrome is alive and well on both sides of the aisle. :(

Teacher's unions (like other public sector unions) are an archaic institution that need to go the way of the dinosaur to make way for the 21st century. They are absolutely a force for mediocrity and the status quo. Not only do they stand in the way of their students' progress and overcharge the state relative to the market value of their services, but they actively push for policies that HARM society. They fully deserve all the criticism they receive.
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1. Chicago is a Democratic city. Therefore, it's Democrats against Democrats and has nothing to do with a special interest group influencing a political party.
2. Do you have any evidence that teacher's unions "are a force for mediocrity and the status quo." I'm interested particularly in light of the fact that the union that is the topic of this thread has put art, music, phys ed. and science in addition to counseling services necessary for high-risk kids as things they are fighting for in their contract. That doesn't sound like it HARMS society, it sounds like it HELPS society.

It never ceases to amaze ME how people consistently make statements that are contrary to the facts. It's confirmation bias overload. I wish I knew how to combat such confirmation bias effectively, but if it continues, then people will unknowingly harm society and students by working against the very people who are trying to help both. I find that discouraging and sickening.
 
69,000 for ~9 months of work is good pay.

If they truly want smaller classroom sizes, then they should trade the offered 2% pay increase for additional teachers.
 
Cephus said:
Fire them all.
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No politician has that type of balls. And realistically, if its done in Chicago. The teachers can be replaced rapidly cause there are a lot of unemployed teachers out in the city and surrounding area. So they would have jobs that these teachers don't want.
 
Teachers are already over paid and under worked, their are plenty of educated people looking for work that would be all over the deal teachers already have. Maybe Romney will do for them what Reagan did for the air traffic controllers, bye bye.
 
Running said:
No politician has that type of balls. And realistically, if its done in Chicago. The teachers can be replaced rapidly cause there are a lot of unemployed teachers out in the city and surrounding area. So they would have jobs that these teachers don't want.
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I suspect many of the unemployed teachers agree with the employed teachers if only because the employed teachers are fighting for the unemployed ones to be rehired, so I doubt that would solve any problems.

sawyerloggingon said:
Teachers are already over paid and under worked.
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What evidence do you have of this?
 
ThePlayDrive said:
1. Chicago is a Democratic city. Therefore, it's Democrats against Democrats and has nothing to do with a special interest group influencing a political party.
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Huh? Where is the inconsistency between an area being dominated by a political party, and that party's special interest groups having a lot of influence? That seems perfectly consistent with the way our political system works.

2. Do you have any evidence that teacher's unions "are a force for mediocrity and the status quo."
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Teacher's unions make it as difficult as possible to fire bad teachers, to where it can take years (if it ever happens at all). Teacher's unions are opposed to any sort of educational innovation that might possibly have any unwanted effect on any of their members (e.g. merit pay, online education, charter schools).

I'm interested particularly in light of the fact that the union that is the topic of this thread has put art, music, phys ed. and science in addition to counseling services necessary for high-risk kids as things they are fighting for in their contract. That doesn't sound like it HARMS society, it sounds like it HELPS society.
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If that's true it's just a coincidence because the needs of the students happen to match up with the goal of the teacher's union itself (e.g. hire more dues-paying art, music, physed, science teachers). And in any case, the strike itself harms students by depriving them of an education.
 
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ThePlayDrive said:
I suspect many of the unemployed teachers agree with the employed teachers if only because the employed teachers are fighting for the unemployed ones to be rehired, so I doubt that would solve any problems.
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I suspect a lot of unemployed people want to work especially if they just finished school. And earning 60k for almost doing nothing is really good money. You have to be an idiot to pass that up.
 
Running said:
I suspect a lot of unemployed people want to work especially if they just finished school. And earning 60k for almost doing nothing is really good money. You have to be an idiot to pass that up.
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Who is "almost doing nothing"? Teachers? If so, can you demonstrate that with evidence?
 
ThePlayDrive said:
Who is "almost doing nothing"? Teachers? If so, can you demonstrate that with evidence?
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You see that is the beauty of being a teacher. You show up, give them a worksheet you printed ten years ago. And now no one can accuse you of doing nothing. People like you eat it up and defend government incompetence cause you'd be just as bad if you were in a government position.
 
Kandahar said:
Huh? Where is the inconsistency between an area being dominated by a political party, and that party's special interest groups having a lot of influence? That seems perfectly consistent with the way our political system works.
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The topic of this thread has nothing to do with "a party's interest groups having a lot of influence."

Teacher's unions make it as difficult as possible to fire bad teachers, to where it can take years (if it ever happens at all).
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I agree that tenure, in some areas, could be more efficient. However, can you demonstrate the low efficiency of tenure is the fault of unions and not of the government or other groups?

Teacher's unions are opposed to any sort of educational innovation that might possibly have any unwanted effect on any of their members (e.g. merit pay, online education, charter schools).
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Please show what "education innovation" teacher's unions are opposed to, why they say they are against, what their counter proposals are and why the "educational innovation" they oppose is better for students than their counter proposals.

The reason I'm asking you to do this is because people often accuse teacher's unions of opposing things simply out of their own self-interest when, in fact, they oppose things because they believe that they have ideas that will help students more than the positions that they are opposing or because the things they are opposing are demonstrably negative in terms of how they affect students.

If that's true it's just a coincidence because the needs of the students happen to match up with the goal of the teacher's union itself (e.g. hire more dues-paying art, music, physed, science teachers). And in any case, the strike itself harms students by depriving them of an education.
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Well, actually, teacher's needs and student's needs match up the majority of time which is one of the reasons why opposing teacher's unions is a perplexing position. Teacher and students want safer schools. Teachers and students want/need a diverse types of classes. That said, can you please demonstrate how you know that "it's just a coincidence" and that the teacher's union doesn't genuinely want those things for students? I ask because people often say those things based on their own prejudices rather than genuine insight into the beliefs of those whom their criticizing.
 
Running said:
You see that is the beauty of being a teacher. You show up, give them a worksheet you printed ten years ago. And now no one can accuse you of doing nothing. People like you eat it up and defend government incompetence cause you'd be just as bad if you were in a government position.
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No, I asked to demonstrate this with evidence. You're just giving me your impressions of what teacher's do all day. Can you please provide evidence in the form of statistics or other hard data to demonstrate that teachers do "almost nothing"? If you cannot do that, then your argument has no legitimate foundations.
 
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