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GM Suspending Chevy Volt Output Due To Slow Sales

First rule of sales, don't lie. Calling the Volt an electric was an outright lie and I would say consumers reacted in kind to that, secondly, hybrids have their market, but the Prius isn't the star that people say it is, though it isn't a bust for Toyota either. I'm not a fan of hybrids because their maintenence costs are a gigantic timebomb, in ten years when the battery goes the car is totaled because that's 10K, then there's the brake system that has a friction recharge, because of the extra sensors and gear that can't be cheap. etc.

Stock tip of the day. Invest in container ships. In a few years, hybrids currently on the market will be toast, and the same greenies that insisted we needed them, will now be insisting that the wrecks cannot be recycled in the US to environmental issues. The batteries brakes, etc will be shipped to China and other third world countries for disposal.
 
Stock tip of the day. Invest in container ships. In a few years, hybrids currently on the market will be toast, and the same greenies that insisted we needed them, will now be insisting that the wrecks cannot be recycled in the US to environmental issues. The batteries brakes, etc will be shipped to China and other third world countries for disposal.
I tend to think so. General mechanics as a rule won't touch hybrids due to a combination of liability and concern for their own health, they know something's up.
 
If you drive over 15k a year the prius is a better value than the new civic...I would think anyway

When we bought our Cruze, people asked us why we didn't get the Eco, the hybrid version. For one thing, it costs more than the top of the line version, the LTZ, which we got, fully stocked, with every option available. The Eco is based on the lowest-end model, the 1LT with very few options. Secondly, in our first year of ownership, we drove less than 6k miles. We still haven't done 8k miles. The mileage difference between the top-of-the-line LTZ and the bare-bottom Eco is only 4 MPG.

I'll take my LTZ.
 
Remember when cell phones first came out?


They were pretty expensive, right?

Remember when the Iphone was 600 bucks?
 
Remember when cell phones first came out?


They were pretty expensive, right?

Remember when the Iphone was 600 bucks?


Ok but whats your point kevin...that the volt will get cheaper ?
 
Your numbers are skewed. The Ford loyalty number of 46% is the number of current Ford owners who would repurchase a Ford. The hybrid number of 25% is the number of other than Prius owners that would repurchase a hybrid of any make. A direct comparison would be Ford owners who would not repurchase a gasoline powered vehicle.

The sports car analagy is a different animal. There is always a market for a niche item, be it a high grade kitchen appliance or a a vehicle. As long as the item can be produced in a sufficient quantity and with a price agreeable to the typical consumer of that vehicle, and all this can be done at without subsidies, than the vehicle will succeed. The direct comparison here is sports car vs sports car, and some will fail, some will succeed.

What this shows us is that people are not particularly loyal to any car type. So you may buy an SUV one time, then want change, so you buy a sports car, then want another change, and you buy a hybrid, then want another change, ad infinitum. The numbers I show indicate buyers are fickle. They change their mind at the same time they change their cars. The 35% retention rate for hybrids is actually better than sports cars which shows greater loyalty. This point about retention is an empty point. It only works in a vacuum. When compared with other cars it absolutely loses relevance.
 
Ok but whats your point kevin...that the volt will get cheaper ?

Not just the Volt, all hybrids will get cheaper. Either that, or it's a sort of fad, no one will buy them, and the concept itself will die out.

Or better yet, get replaced by the next better thing.


Remember pagers? Or better yet, car phones, lol?
 
What this shows us is that people are not particularly loyal to any car type. So you may buy an SUV one time, then want change, so you buy a sports car, then want another change, and you buy a hybrid, then want another change, ad infinitum. The numbers I show indicate buyers are fickle. They change their mind at the same time they change their cars. The 35% retention rate for hybrids is actually better than sports cars which shows greater loyalty. This point about retention is an empty point. It only works in a vacuum. When compared with other cars it absolutely loses relevance.


I agree auto buying goes in trends...Dealers couldnt keep minivans on the lots..there were waiting lists for them in the 90s now they sell very very few... Suvs flew off lots for years...ford explorers made ford rich in the 90s they sold so many...now the trend is changing....there will always be a hot item in the auto industry and then theres their constants...like pickup trucks..
I think it will be good while before hybrids and electrics really grab the mass's it takes along time to ween americans off the stuff they love
 
What I'm saying is, how many of you would buy a hybrid, of any brand, if they cost, say, 16K?
 
Remember when cell phones first came out?


They were pretty expensive, right?

Remember when the Iphone was 600 bucks?

Cell phones and smart phones did something other technology didn't do, and had a wider reaching market. Hybrids do the same thing other vehicles do, but are terrible to drive and far more expensive to purchase and maintain. Hybrids are a transitional technology. a compromise, and they do it terribly.
 
Remember when cell phones first came out?


They were pretty expensive, right?

Remember when the Iphone was 600 bucks?

And things got cheaper because they were popular, Apple could mass produce the iPhone at a much cheaper price than they had to pay when very few people bought them. Popularity brings the price down. The Volt is not popular.
 
Not just the Volt, all hybrids will get cheaper. Either that, or it's a sort of fad, no one will buy them, and the concept itself will die out.

Or better yet, get replaced by the next better thing.

Remember pagers? Or better yet, car phones, lol?




Ok I gotcha...but I think something other than gas engines has to be the future...batteries have to get better...electric cars have to go alot further and be more responsive and the real key is...not have to be plugged in every 30 miles....its going to be a good while yet
 
Cell phones and smart phones did something other technology didn't do, and had a wider reaching market. Hybrids do the same thing other vehicles do, but are terrible to drive and far more expensive to purchase and maintain. Hybrids are a transitional technology. a compromise, and they do it terribly.

Exactly...well put.
 
Cell phones and smart phones did something other technology didn't do, and had a wider reaching market. Hybrids do the same thing other vehicles do, but are terrible to drive and far more expensive to purchase and maintain. Hybrids are a transitional technology. a compromise, and they do it terribly.

A compromise to what, 100% electric?

Have you driven ALL hybrids to say so? Did you know ford makes a hybrid Explorer, that looks, and drives, the same as a reg explorer?

Have you tried driving the Honda CR-Z?

Don't get me wrong, I'm not a gung ho hybrid fan. I still see issues with them, from an environmental standpoint, and from a utilitarian. But sometimes, in order to get to the next step, you gotta build one between the one you're on, and the one you wanna get to.
 
GM is reported to have a cost advantage of $1000 per vehicle over Ford. Provided GM can continue to bring out competent vehicles that sell well (GM is number 1 or 2 for world wide sales) it should not need a bailout. Lets not mention the fact it is making as much money as Ford is.

Thank you....while people are spiking the ball and doing a victory dance over an article spelling doom to a company that employees millions of American's diretion or via suppliers....they don't seem to realize that in actually GM is doing fine.
 
And we still have to figure out how to generate "clean" electricity. Personally, that's my biggest concern. I feel like electric cars are just trading one devil for another, unless the public all of a sudden embraces the idea of more nuclear power plants, which I highly doubt.

Even hydrogen powered cars come with real issues, far beyond safety. What happens to, say, FL, if everyone started driving cars who's byproduct was moisture?
 
Since enviros are so stupid that they'd expect us to buy ecobuggies, shouldn't we question the competence of their scientific theories too? These are really B students jealous of A students, whose glory is the products they invented for industrialization.
 
Since enviros are so stupid that they'd expect us to buy ecobuggies, shouldn't we question the competence of their scientific theories too? These are really B students jealous of A students, whose glory is the products they invented for industrialization.

Are you saying that you believe that oil is an infinite product?
 
I agree auto buying goes in trends...Dealers couldnt keep minivans on the lots..there were waiting lists for them in the 90s now they sell very very few... Suvs flew off lots for years...ford explorers made ford rich in the 90s they sold so many...now the trend is changing....there will always be a hot item in the auto industry and then theres their constants...like pickup trucks..
I think it will be good while before hybrids and electrics really grab the mass's it takes along time to ween americans off the stuff they love

What I'm saying is, how many of you would buy a hybrid, of any brand, if they cost, say, 16K?

Cell phones and smart phones did something other technology didn't do, and had a wider reaching market. Hybrids do the same thing other vehicles do, but are terrible to drive and far more expensive to purchase and maintain. Hybrids are a transitional technology. a compromise, and they do it terribly.

I don't think hybrids are ultimately the answer, but they are an important transitional technology. It has the effect of slowly getting consumers used to the idea. Ultimately, I think straight up electric is the answer. But as it stands now, they cost too much, have limited range, and the infrastructure is building but needs more development. So hybrids are handy for the time being because they function as a showcase for an emerging technology. Hybrids probably are a fad that will fade with time. If all goes well, a transition to strictly electric will follow. At the point, energy consumed in the US will be strictly American energy production insuring American jobs. For this too happen, emerging technology will be expensive as all are at the outset. But without people buying the existing technology, there is no push for independent manufacturers to develop the technology to make it better. Auto makers will do far more than a government research lab to develop electric vehicles, so it's important that the hybrid and EV market be supported as much as possible. If people buy the cars, the cars will get better, and they will get cheaper too.
 
I don't think hybrids are ultimately the answer, but they are an important transitional technology. It has the effect of slowly getting consumers used to the idea. Ultimately, I think straight up electric is the answer. But as it stands now, they cost too much, have limited range, and the infrastructure is building but needs more development. So hybrids are handy for the time being because they function as a showcase for an emerging technology. Hybrids probably are a fad that will fade with time. If all goes well, a transition to strictly electric will follow. At the point, energy consumed in the US will be strictly American energy production insuring American jobs. For this too happen, emerging technology will be expensive as all are at the outset. But without people buying the existing technology, there is no push for independent manufacturers to develop the technology to make it better. Auto makers will do far more than a government research lab to develop electric vehicles, so it's important that the hybrid and EV market be supported as much as possible. If people buy the cars, the cars will get better, and they will get cheaper too.

I dont know what the answer is...and after I read and posted the article in economics because I didnt know where else to put it..lol...about 54.5 mile per gallon standard by 2016 and thats for gas cars...WOW...I think lahood is using fuzzy math for a variety of reasons



Feds roll out details of 54.5 mpg standard
 
Are you saying that you believe that oil is an infinite product?

It certainly isn't, but far too many automakers are putting all their time and energy into an inferior product that is, at best, a stopgap measure, instead of finding an actually superior replacement for gas-burning engines.
 
A compromise to what, 100% electric?
Primarily, yes.

Have you driven ALL hybrids to say so? Did you know ford makes a hybrid Explorer, that looks, and drives, the same as a reg explorer?
I've driven the Prius, the Civic hybrid, and the Ford Escape hybrid. The Prius is just a giant piece of **** that I can't condemn enough. The hybrid models of the Civic and Escape drive considerably worse than the vehicles they were derived from, while offering a negligible boost in mpg. The hybrid version of my truck adds a whopping 3 extra miles per gallon.

Don't get me wrong, I'm not a gung ho hybrid fan. I still see issues with them, from an environmental standpoint, and from a utilitarian. But sometimes, in order to get to the next step, you gotta build one between the one you're on, and the one you wanna get to.
The goal is renewable energy, and honestly, there are better options than electric.
 
It certainly isn't, but far too many automakers are putting all their time and energy into an inferior product that is, at best, a stopgap measure, instead of finding an actually superior replacement for gas-burning engines.

Actually, I have a theory on that...


I think that they AREN'T putting much effort into hybrid, which is WHY they tend to suck. I think ALL the major companies are busy, in underground bunker style R and D labs, trying to make either hydrogen, or better all electric cars.

I think hybrids are here just to shut us up, so to speak.

Look up some of the stranger concepts released by GM over the last 20 years or so, and you'll see what I mean. They best minds are NOT focused on hybrids, I truly believe that.
 
Primarily, yes.


I've driven the Prius, the Civic hybrid, and the Ford Escape hybrid. The Prius is just a giant piece of **** that I can't condemn enough. The hybrid models of the Civic and Escape drive considerably worse than the vehicles they were derived from, while offering a negligible boost in mpg. The hybrid version of my truck adds a whopping 3 extra miles per gallon.

Try the Highlander Hybrid. It's actually faster than the V6 gas-only version, gets 10 mpg better in the city in about 5 mpg better on the highway. We've had one for six years and it's an excellent vehicle.
 
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