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Valedictorian denied high school diploma for saying hell in speech

Guy Incognito said:
Very true. I feel bad for her, though, with all of these adults taking her side and defending her, she will never learn.

Why don't the people defending the valedictorian see that they are ultimately doing her a disservice?
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you claim that the "problem" is if more people were critical of the position she holds, she would learn her lesson

Why isn't this working on you? nearly nobody is defending you, yet you aren't learning "your lesson".
 
ARealConservative said:
That is what I am doing. I disagree with him, and explained why.

he doesn't have a monopoly on deciding what is acceptable behavior, and neither does the school administrator.

Group think decides these issues (which he ignorantly railed against earlier in this thread)
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No. I already posted a link where it says the school as a ZERO tolerance policy. She broke a rule and refuses to act like an adult about it. A written apology is NOT a punishment. I can just see it now, "Daddy!!! The school actually wants me to APOLOGIZE!!!!" Awwww, poor baby! Sometimes, you have to swallow your pride and act like and adult, realize that you may have offended SOME people. It happened on school property during a school ceremony. There is nothing wrong with apologizing when you make a mistake.
 
ARealConservative said:
you claim that the "problem" is if more people were critical of the position she holds, she would learn her lesson

Why isn't this working on you? nearly nobody is defending you, yet you aren't learning "your lesson".
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Why are you so emotional? Haven't you the capacity to hold a rational debate without becoming personally vindictive? You lack any substantive argument, that much is clear. Yet instead of sayin nothing, like a rational person without anything substantive to say would do, you insist on making histrionic ad hominem attacks over and over again. You need to calm down and chill out. You are wrong, your are defending an immoral and indefensible position. Perhaps you should examine your own conscience, since strong emotional reactions like yours can sometimes be the result of a guilty conscience.
 
ChrisL said:
No. I already posted a link where it says the school as a ZERO tolerance policy. She broke a rule and refuses to act like an adult about it. A written apology is NOT a punishment. I can just see it now, "Daddy!!! The school actually wants me to APOLOGIZE!!!!" Awwww, poor baby! Sometimes, you have to swallow your pride and act like and adult, realize that you may have offended SOME people. It happened on school property during a school ceremony. There is nothing wrong with apologizing when you make a mistake.
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Well said. It really is about acting like an adult. That shouldn't be too much to expect from a high school valedictorian. I am shocked that such a stubborn and disibedient kid could even achieve such a thing, typically the kids with the higher grades tend to be the mature ones who would not need it explained to them.
 
Guy Incognito said:
Why are you so emotional? Haven't you the capacity to hold a rational debate without becoming personally vindictive? You lack any substantive argument, that much is clear. Yet instead of sayin nothing, like a rational person without anything substantive to say would do, you insist on making histrionic ad hominem attacks over and over again. You need to calm down and chill out. You are wrong, your are defending an immoral and indefensible position. Perhaps you should examine your own conscience, since strong emotional reactions like yours can sometimes be the result of a guilty conscience.
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you are projecting.

I am rationally using your lack of critical thinking to point out the flaws in your stance, and the hypocrisy as well.
 
ChrisL said:
No. I already posted a link where it says the school as a ZERO tolerance policy. She broke a rule and refuses to act like an adult about it. A written apology is NOT a punishment. I can just see it now, "Daddy!!! The school actually wants me to APOLOGIZE!!!!" Awwww, poor baby! Sometimes, you have to swallow your pride and act like and adult, realize that you may have offended SOME people. It happened on school property during a school ceremony. There is nothing wrong with apologizing when you make a mistake.
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no what? you also don't have a monopoly on deciding what is acceptable.

your entire response is based on emotion.
 
Guy Incognito said:
Well said. It really is about acting like an adult. That shouldn't be too much to expect from a high school valedictorian. I am shocked that such a stubborn and disibedient kid could even achieve such a thing, typically the kids with the higher grades tend to be the mature ones who would not need it explained to them.
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I don't know if she is stubborn and disobedient with everything. She might be a very nice kid, but in this situation she is acting childish IMO. Hopefully, this will be a lesson in respect, civility and humility for her.
 
ChrisL said:
Obviously you have no argument here.
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none you can debate against anyway.

you two make a nice echo chamber, but the rest of the world has a different idea on what it means to be a grown up
 
ARealConservative said:
none you can debate against anyway.

you two make a nice echo chamber, but the rest of the world has a different idea on what it means to be a grown up
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Bring it on. :2razz:
 
ChrisL said:
I don't know if she is stubborn and disobedient with everything. She might be a very nice kid, but in this situation she is acting childish IMO. Hopefully, this will be a lesson in respect, civility and humility for her.
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It is impossible to judge the character of the valedictorian from this one incident, but I fear that she isn't going to learn anything from this because of the strong show of support she is getting. Her parents really are the ones to blame, because it seems pretty clear from the articles that the support of her parents is emboldening her.

You are so right about what you said earlier, people wonder why kids are out of control these days, it is because parents shield them from the consequences of their actions. Kid got in trouble for cursing at school? Why should she apologize when we could make a big quasi political stink about it and get our name in the paper? Who cares about basic politeness when we can have fifteen minutes of cheap fame?
 
ChrisL said:
Bring it on. :2razz:
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I already did.

you failed to bring any logical counter to my point.

Society will ultimately decide what is acceptable behavior. Fortunately for that community, our collective opinions mean squat (this includes you as well), but if this forum is any indication, you two need to wake up to reality. You carry on emotionally charged about how unacceptable this is, and you speak as if you have the rules on a stone tablet.
 
ChrisL said:
Bring it on. :2razz:
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Lol Yeah, seriously areal conservative, give us an actual substantive argument to debate against for crying out loud.

But there is a reason nobody has been able to present a rational defense of the valedictorian, it's because there is no rational defense. What she did in refusing to apologize is utterly puerile and indefensible.
 
ARealConservative said:
I already did.

you failed to bring any logical counter to my point.

Society will ultimately decide what is acceptable behavior. Fortunately for that community, our collective opinions mean squat (this includes you as well), but if this forum is any indication, you two need to wake up to reality. You carry on emotionally charged about how unacceptable this is, and you speak as if you have the rules on a stone tablet.
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I completely disagree with your assessment. Your argument is weak. It is up to the school. The school sets the rules whether you like it or not.
 
ChrisL said:
I completely disagree with your assessment. Your argument is weak. It is up to the school. The school sets the rules whether you like it or not.
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meanwhile, back in the real world, the school rules are based on the wishes of the community that pays for the school
 
Well, I have to get ready to go to work now, but I'll be back to later to see how the debate is going. Have a nice day! :)
 
ARealConservative said:
meanwhile, back in the real world, the school rules are based on the wishes of the community that pays for the school
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No, the school board (which is made up of members of the community) sets the rules.
 
ChrisL said:
No, the school board (which is made up of members of the community) sets the rules.
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holy hell, nobody is this dense.

the community votes for the board. If members of the board do not represent the will of the people, they are replaced.

meanwhile, back in the real world, the school rules are based on the wishes of the community that pays for the school
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ARealConservative said:
I do believe this. It can be a bit slow responding, but it is how the system works.
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No the system only works like that in theory, not in practice.

In practice, what you have are lame school board members who think they are trusting the professionals. The professionals are a bunch of gutless PC libs who can only stand up against someone or group that has real values. Example, here in DE ... ONE muzzie got his shorts tied in knots because sugar cane candy COULD be interpreted as a Christian symbol. Guess who won that one?:roll:

A L
 
Another Lurker said:
No the system only works like that in theory, not in practice.

In practice, what you have are lame school board members who think they are trusting the professionals. The professionals are a bunch of gutless PC libs who can only stand up against someone or group that has real values. Example, here in DE ... ONE muzzie got his shorts tied in knots because sugar cane candy COULD be interpreted as a Christian symbol. Guess who won that one?:roll:

A L
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What's a "muzzie"? Is it like a "macaca"?
 
ARealConservative said:
holy hell, nobody is this dense.

the community votes for the board. If members of the board do not represent the will of the people, they are replaced.
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The school board is elected by the people. They are the ones with the authority to make rules. The principal and his or her staff only enforce rules. Members of the board are NOT replaced if they don't represent the will of the people. They are only replaced during an election cycle. Therefore, the principal was only enforcing rules that were actually made by the community by proxy of elected representatives to their local school board.

Now what?
 
ARealConservative said:
holy hell, nobody is this dense.

the community votes for the board. If members of the board do not represent the will of the people, they are replaced.
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LOL! The school board are representatives of and actual members of the community. BTW, this really is a side issue.
 
digsbe said:
Um, saying hell isn't the problem here. The problem is that her speech was inspired by Twilight. For that she should be made to remediate her entire high school career.
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LOL

It took me a little while to figure out this was sarcasm :2razz:
 
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