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Super rich hold $32 trillion in offshore havens

TurtleDude said:
after claiming that those who filled most of the pool aren't giving their fair share of water

anything that keeps this government from taking more money is good

the US government needs to prove it can live on a diet for a century or so before it talks about spending more
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I could not agree more!

Obama is a fool. He does not understand or appreciate the free-enterprise system.

He is nothing more than a "community organizer" who knows absolutely nothing about what it takes to run a successful business or a for-profit neighborhood lemonade stand!

Obama sincerely believes the "government" is the "be-all" and the "end-all" of everyone's success!

Are you aware the Democrats believe in and support "trickle down" economics?

The Democrats believe if you tax the middle class at a sufficiently high rate, some of the money they collect will "trickle down and help the poor!
 
James Cessna said:
Why is it sitting in 32 trillion buckets in some other country?

There has to be a reason!

Why are wealthy Americans afraid to bring this wealth back to the United States?

Could their decisions have anything to do with Barack Obama's very foolish “tax the rich" policies?

When property taxes go up in one state, what do the wealthy people do? They just move to a state with lower taxes.

International finance works no differently.
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Is it time for the new world order, where countries don't have such disparate taxing schemes that encourage fleeing capital? It seems to me that to avoid total economic collapse, it will have to happen. The loopholes must be closed. A modern day Magna Carta...the rich cannot be above the law.
 
TurtleDude said:
after claiming that those who filled most of the pool aren't giving their fair share of water

anything that keeps this government from taking more money is good

the US government needs to prove it can live on a diet for a century or so before it talks about spending more
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They didn't fill the pool. The pool -- in this metaphor -- is the economy at large. The idea that all economic activity flows from isolated wealth is nonsense.
 
Hatuey said:
I don't get it. Somedays Obama is a lackey of business interests. Other days they're afraid of him. You can't have it both ways VanceMack. Which is it?
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You REALLY don't get it? Why do you think bankers and brokers donate to both parties? But if you really can't understand why businesses are hesitant to invest in today's climate, well, you are a lot more idiotic than I could have ever imagined.

No...wait...I'm sure it's because they are racist. Isn't THAT your pat excuse for EVERYTHING?
 
Essentially, this is Atlas shrugging.
 
Goshin said:
Hm. Just out of curiosity I did some math...

There are about 115 million households in the USA. 32 Trillion / 115 million = $278,260

That would mean they are holding $278,260 for every household in the USA.


Any way you slice it that seems excessive.
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Well that's the estimated market value, not the liquid value.
If all those assets were sold, for cash (which I don't think there is enough dollars in existence to pay out for all that), it's liquid value would be substantially less.
 
ChuckBerry said:
The government doesn't need to take money away from the rich, the rich need to release it back into the economy in the form of better wages for workers. We seem to be caught in a vicious circle...businesses are hanging on to cash because there is no demand, workers are not creating demand because they are trying to pay down debt or aren't making any money at all because they are out of work.

Maybe the rich don't care...demand is increasing in emerging markets, so they don't care if the U.S. and Europe's markets become moribund.
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They don't care because they are clueless. Most of their money has been made in bubble after bubble not from real growth in the economy. They are now reduced to making money trading money, no consumers or salaries or goods needed. They have in effect written the majority of us out of the equation. They now see us as a liability that must be squashed .They are wrong, their money is worthless without a society to spend it in and that society is quickly crumbling under the weight of their greed. The only good news is that even "conservatives" are starting to see that income distribution matters and the socking away of $40 trillion by the 5% is a HUGE drag on the economy that must be reversed before it is too late. Consumer economys depend on having a nation of consumers, not a nation of a few investors who save 80% of their income with the rest just struggling to get by with less to spend every year.

I'de like to see a temporary tax holiday for income spent in the economy while taxing ALL income not spent at 50%. Can you imagine what a boom that would be for business?
 
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James Cessna said:
I could not agree more!

Obama is a fool. He does not understand or appreciate the free-enterprise system.

He is nothing more than a "community organizer" who knows absolutely nothing about what it takes to run a successful business or a for-profit neighborhood lemonade stand!

Obama sincerely believes the "government" is the "be-all" and the "end-all" of everyone's success!

Are you aware the Democrats believe in and support "trickle down" economics?

The Democrats believe if you tax the middle class at a sufficiently high rate, some of the money they collect will "trickle down and help the poor!
Click to expand...


Obama is pandering to those who believe their lot in life is the fault of those who are more prosperous and successful

Its all about getting power from winning elections

no one can honestly say that the middle class is paying too much for what they use and the rich aren't paying their fair share

its nothing more than pandering to those who resent more successful people
 
Neomalthusian said:
You referenced $32 Trillion dollars, so wheredja get that number from? You said "the" government wants to take some of it. Which government, if the money belongs to citizens of 139 different countries? Just admit you, like a bunch of the others, including the originator of this thread, aren't even reading the article you're commenting on.
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Oh gawd. Please excuse my momentarily imprecise use of language. The 32 trillion figure is irrelevant to my point, but yes, I was referencing a global measure while responding to a post about -- in part -- American politics. I don't suppose you'd like to apply the same standard of diction to the post to which I was initially responding?
 
GhostlyJoe said:
Oh gawd. Please excuse my momentarily imprecise use of language. The 32 trillion figure is irrelevant to my point, but yes, I was referencing a global measure while responding to a post about -- in part -- American politics. I don't suppose you'd like to apply the same standard of diction to the post to which I was initially responding?
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Sorry, you just got the brunt of my sense of annoyance. Several other people walked right into that error too, and then repeatedly did so after being redirected. :peace
 
Goshin said:
You'll probably recall I've said more than once, that government policy is leaving business afraid of their own shadow and unsure which way to jump.

But somewhere around 32 TRILLION in untaxed offshore accounts is.... incredible.
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If there is indeed illegal activity that lands that money there, then by all means people should be prosecuted. If not, its their money and who can blame them for sheltering it. And for all the people here that claim more than an EZ return, do you honestly want to pretend you dont claim every exemption and deduction you can to get every dime back? Scale...magnitude...thats all we are talking about. Damn them for wanting to keep more of what they earned.
 
VanceMack said:
If there is indeed illegal activity that lands that money there, then by all means people should be prosecuted. If not, its their money and who can blame them for sheltering it. And for all the people here that claim more than an EZ return, do you honestly want to pretend you dont claim every exemption and deduction you can to get every dime back? Scale...magnitude...thats all we are talking about. Damn them for wanting to keep more of what they earned.
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No, damn the politicians for letting them put it all there. Of course they probably own those politicians so...........
It's about the attitude too, hiding money is hoarding. Hoarding is not compatible with capitalism.
 
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VanceMack said:
What makes it 'right' or 'not right'? Many businesses have admitted to holdin off on hiring and to curtailing spending because they don't trust the government or what is coming next. And can you blame them? It's one thing if they are breaking into poor peoples houses and stealing their pennies. Thats not what is happening. They are amassing wealth legimately and choosing to not reinvest a significant portion at this time. I dot blame them.
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You do realize this gives them the functional ability to extort the entire nation by the simple expedient of withholding their capital from the economy at large.

And the losses they sustain by sitting on their money can be offset by concessions obtained from a desperate populace.

"I'm not confident enough to risk my money, but I deserve a favorable tax rate for taking risks.
 
iguanaman said:
No, damn the politicians for letting them put it all there. Of course they probably own those politicians so...........
It's about the attitude too, hiding money is hoarding. Hoarding is not compatible with capitalism.
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The Taker Class' constant seeking to grab more of it, based on the argument that the owners don't need it, is what leads to the incentive to hide it in the first place.

Had there never been any government promising to take care of its needy, then 1) the government would be less apt to need to be seeking wealth to confiscate to pay for all its promises, and 2) it would be left to the owners of wealth to decide (voluntarily) that philanthropy and resolving social problems was something they could do with all their free time (since they don't have to work anymore), and might even be in their best interests to do (because the public perception of them would improve), and there would be no need for coercion in a system like this.
 
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Goshin said:
Hm. Just out of curiosity I did some math...

There are about 115 million households in the USA. 32 Trillion / 115 million = $278,260

That would mean they are holding $278,260 for every household in the USA.


Any way you slice it that seems excessive.
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Except if you slice it that it's their money. I don't blame them, I'd keep my money offshore too. Our gov't is the biggest cluster**** in history.
 
lol I knew this thread would bring out all the rich's cheerleaders and make heros out of them for avoiding their tax obligation....The real moral of this story of course is....THE RICH NEED ANOTHER HUGE TAX CUT the poor dears
 
lpast said:
lol I knew this thread would bring out all the rich's cheerleaders and make heros out of them for avoiding their tax obligation....The real moral of this story of course is....THE RICH NEED ANOTHER HUGE TAX CUT the poor dears
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Foreign investments doesn't mean that these people are necessarily avoiding taxes.
The article is said they could be loosing tax dollars, but I guess they didn't take the time to see.

Sounds like lazy reporting and rabble rousing.
 
Harry Guerrilla said:
Foreign investments doesn't mean that these people are necessarily avoiding taxes.
The article is said they could be loosing tax dollars, but I guess they didn't take the time to see.

Sounds like lazy reporting and rabble rousing.
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Could be Harry...but it still brought out the cheerleaders :)
 
Goshin said:
They didn't make all that wealth with their own lily white hands... I'd say they have some responsibility to share a little more with those who do the scutwork than they've been doing lately.
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If the worker was paid a wage that he excepted. Then no!

GhostlyJoe said:
Then why should the masses look out for the wealthy? Why should we respect their right to a large share of the wealth of a productive nation of people? Why should we be their keeper, if their guiding ethic is, "I am an island?"

You cling to a silly ideological paradigm in the face of clear contrary data. Unless the system can sustain the masses, there's no reason for the masses to sustain the system.
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Well I find your ideological paradigm silly.

The relationship is somewhat symbiotic as it should be, but the wealthy are the ones who support the masses and make the lives we lead possible.


What if...? said:
Actually, according to this, it would only take half of the money simply being sat on in offshore accounts to zero the national debt.
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As already pointed out, those funds belong to owners from like 139 different nations.


ChuckBerry said:
Is it time for the new world order, where countries don't have such disparate taxing schemes that encourage fleeing capital? It seems to me that to avoid total economic collapse, it will have to happen. The loopholes must be closed. A modern day Magna Carta...the rich cannot be above the law.
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I find that to be a "piss poor" reason for a NWO.


lpast said:
lol I knew this thread would bring out all the rich's cheerleaders and make heros out of them for avoiding their tax obligation....The real moral of this story of course is....THE RICH NEED ANOTHER HUGE TAX CUT the poor dears
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Which tax obligations were avoided again?
You know, actual obligations that if not carried through with, are punishable by law?




People are talking like those funds are not even in play.
 
lpast said:
Could be Harry...but it still brought out the cheerleaders :)
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And it is bringing out the anti-cheerleaders also. So what?
 
iguanaman said:
No, damn the politicians for letting them put it all there. Of course they probably own those politicians so...........
It's about the attitude too, hiding money is hoarding. Hoarding is not compatible with capitalism.
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Maybe they are tired of taking care of all the crippled dependent pets and figure its time for them to actually contribute SOMETHING rather than merely leech from the country. Its theirs...they earned it...and awww...bad news...you dont get to say what people do with their income. Perhaps if people worried a little less about what others made and focused on their own miserable pathetic lives their children and grandchildren wouldnt have to suffer.
 
What if...? said:
You do realize this gives them the functional ability to extort the entire nation by the simple expedient of withholding their capital from the economy at large.

And the losses they sustain by sitting on their money can be offset by concessions obtained from a desperate populace.

"I'm not confident enough to risk my money, but I deserve a favorable tax rate for taking risks.
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They ARE still taking risks...or dont you follow the markets at ALL. And if you and others want them to risk more (translation-do MORE to take care of your ass) then maybe you ought to insist the politicians work together with industry and labor to create more favorable environments for investing. Its not YOUR MONEY. You get that...right?
 
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