• This is a political forum that is non-biased/non-partisan and treats every person's position on topics equally. This debate forum is not aligned to any political party. In today's politics, many ideas are split between and even within all the political parties. Often we find ourselves agreeing on one platform but some topics break our mold. We are here to discuss them in a civil political debate. If this is your first visit to our political forums, be sure to check out the RULES. Registering for debate politics is necessary before posting. Register today to participate - it's free!

Gun attack at Batman film premiere in Denver [W:120]

Status
Not open for further replies.
Higgins86 said:
Have to admit though I find it interesting that people are going after guns rather than the violent society we live in! In films like Batman dont we glorify bad guys who kill innocent people? Dont get me wrong Im not blaming the Batman films but we do live in a violent society with video games, films and TV all adding to it.
Click to expand...

So do other society's and they aren't grieving their nations tonight...
 
pbrauer said:
Is there a Constitutional right to own an AK-47?
Click to expand...

of course there is

its a common weapon that is not extraordinarily dangerous

read Heller

and an AK 47 is not relevant to this discussion
 
Higgins86 said:
even with training you cant say for certain that shooting back could of improved the situation. Dark cinema, gas flying around, people running screaming etc even a trained shooter could of hit an innocent and with several guns going off how would you know for sure who to shoot. In the army I saw some of the best marksmen miss the target under pressure situations, with the sun beating down on you, dust, sand, smoke and people running/screaming sometimes the worst thing you could do was to start shooting.
Click to expand...

And that was in a pub in Earl's Court! ;)
 
Jryan said:
So do other society's and they aren't grieving their nations tonight...
Click to expand...



That doesn't make much sense but Norway was grieving a few months ago
 
TurtleDude said:
of course there is

its a common weapon that is not extraordinarily dangerous

read Heller

and an AK 47 is not relevant to this discussion
Click to expand...

Well, in a weird sort of way, we could not consider ak-47 a gun and then gg ak-47... (gg good game)
 
LaMidRighter said:
Interestingly, it wasn't as much of a problem when families watched together and parents took the time to explain to their children that it was not real, and that there are lots of consequences to real violence.
Click to expand...

I agree with that kids and familes are much different today, I mean how many kids under the age of 16 own video games like Grand Theft Auto even though its R rated and how many of those kids had the game bought by their parents?
 
My son and I are going to see the movie tomorrow. I don't plan on doing anything different; I will be armed as usual whenver I leave the house, and don't plan on being any more paranoid than I normally am.
 
the Chief of police is saying that there appears to be live MORTAR rounds in the apartment of the sicko

I really wouldn't have a problem if the police made the shooter go in and defuse the bombs

if he decides to go out with a bang so be it
 
Jryan said:
So do other society's and they aren't grieving their nations tonight...
Click to expand...

gun crime isnt just exclusive to America. Look at Norway last year and even in the UK a guy went on a rampage in the countryside with a shotgun not long ago. You only have to look at the knife crime statistics in the UK to know that guns are not the problem, Humans will find a way to kill eachother guns or no guns! We are good like that.
 
Problem with this sort of dis-CUSS-ion is it becomes highly personal.

Well that and highly theoretical. I remember classroom training on infantry tank killer teams with sand table exercises. In a perfect world our smoke masked us until the T62's got within 200 yards, the artillery wasn't too busy so they could drop a few HE on 'em to button them up, oh the wind would cooperate, not so strong it flattened and dispersed the smoke plume but not so light it is capriciously variable. Goes without saying the Roosian artillery probing fire would miss us because we have mad Ingin skills and Gawd is on our side.

All that is to say reality and what we think would happen and how we will deal with it is quite often four different things. How does that old saying go? Want to make God laugh, tell Her what you are planning...

Not knocking those who think they would rush fearlessly forward, use mad ninja skills, or just carrying would have halted the murder spree, more power to you, I doubt you will ever be in the wrong place at the right time and do hope if you ever are your encounter doesn't end your life. My opinion is you would add to the death count for the bad guy but heroes don't consider that. Is part of the hero thing.

Brings us to an overlooked fact, 3-4 folks here say they have low fear, mad skills, or pack 24/7 to be the angel of good in a hellish situation, you have to ask where were the Colorado counterparts who were actually on the scene as it unfolded? Surely we are not a nation of 3-4 heroes just? Where was the fearless one, the mad ninja creeper or the 24/7 shootist? Colorado is a 'shall issue' state, where were the self-described sheepdogs that protect us all from the rabid wolves?

Perhaps the big picture is rarely are those who are ready to face certain death coz of any combination of no fear, great VC skills, nice concealed carry weapon where they need to be when they need to when it comes to facing a mass murderer.

Oh just in the interest of facts, I don't know if this was addressed, the thread moves awfully fast, a Dr. Tiller was shot in his church where he was an usher. Two other men were threatened by the murderer, an anti-abortion zealot, but no one stopped the man and he drove away in a blue taurus. No one jumped the guy, he wasn't out to kill everyone like at the movie theater. Now a mass murderer starts using a shotgun at extremely close range in the packed TVUU Church during a kid's play, some do launch themselves at the mass murderer and subdue him. It is difficult to compare situations where the murderer isn't a mass murderer but a selected target one.

Difficult to know all the variables in each shooting and the outcome if one more hero was there or not. Good internet fodder but perhaps a bit too complex to have more than the haziest of ideas on what would happen.
 
pbrauer said:
Is there a Constitutional right to own an AK-47?
Click to expand...

It's cute when you try to answer a question with a question...it shows you can't actually answer the original question.

Owning a gun, any gun, is not what "allowed" this to happen.

An individual choosing to BREAK THE LAW allowed this to happen.
 
Jryan said:
Then why did he inform police of explosives?

Personalty I think he did it because he was expecting his loud music to explode causing a distraction and by his shooting he could claim the ULTIMATE confusion. (What I heard on ABC)
Click to expand...

Fair question. I don't know. There is actually a profile for this kind of twisted puke. Maybe it will come out and then again maybe for security reasons it won't. While bug**** crazy this guy was not stupid. Killing people in mass as the guy in OP did defies reason IMHO. Did he think everyone in the theater was schtupping his girlfriend? Probably not. Why would he tell the cops he wired his apartment with explosives? I don't know that either.
 
TurtleDude said:
the Chief of police is saying that there appears to be live MORTAR rounds in the apartment of the sicko

I really wouldn't have a problem if the police made the shooter go in and defuse the bombs

if he decides to go out with a bang so be it
Click to expand...

I share that sentiment but we both know this guy will not see one day in a prison. He will follow the same path as John Hinckley living in a psychiatric hospital.

If that had been my son or daughter to die in that theater I would find a way to properly penalize him.
 
Crosscheck said:
I share that sentiment but we both know this guy will not see one day in a prison. He will follow the same path as John Hinckley living in a psychiatric hospital.

If that had been my son or daughter to die in that theater I would find a way to properly penalize him.
Click to expand...

agree

I hope he ends up like Dahmer

and If I were on a grand jury and the father of some slain child were to cap that fool or better yet torture the killer to death I'd have a hard time signing a bill
 
Higgins86 said:
Have to admit though I find it interesting that people are going after guns rather than the violent society we live in! In films like Batman dont we glorify bad guys who kill innocent people? Dont get me wrong Im not blaming the Batman films but we do live in a violent society with video games, films and TV all adding to it.
Click to expand...

In the 1800's dime novels glorified the exploits of the Younger brothers, The Jameses and Billy The Kid. In the 30's it was Bonnie and Clyde, and John Dillenger, so that's nothing new.
 
in terms of US gun law what does "A well regulated Militia" mean today? Not trying to stir the pot just curious.
 
apdst said:
In the 1800's dime novels glorified the exploits of the Younger brothers, The Jameses and Billy The Kid. In the 30's it was Bonnie and Clyde, and John Dillenger, so that's nothing new.
Click to expand...

in terms of availablity and how much its regulated it is.
 
Higgins86 said:
in terms of US gun law what does "A well regulated Militia" mean today? Not trying to stir the pot just curious.
Click to expand...

it mean that the call for the muster (or the call up as they call it in the UK) had been given, the militia had been formed, officers elected and a mission embarked upon

as opposed to the unorganized militia-ie citizens with weaponry and skills who had not yet been asked to muster

well regulated meant the militia was in working order, with officers etc
 
I don't get the gun politics in this at all.

He was dressed in body armor so it isn't likely that other people having guns would have helped. So using this situation to argue against gun control makes no sense.

If he hadn't been able to buy guns then he would have simply used explosives. He apparently had the know-how given that he booby trapped his apartment. So using this situation to argue for gun control makes no sense.

Making this a gun control debate is pretty stupid.
 
haymarket said:
Yes, those innocents paid the ultimate price for a society with our particular freedoms. Unfortunately for you, the folks at MSNBC has nothing to do with it.
Click to expand...

It's a good thing that this wacko didn't fire bomb the place with homade napalm made from Tide, vasoline and gas. We would't be able to wash our clothes.
 
Higgins86 said:
in terms of US gun law what does "A well regulated Militia" mean today? Not trying to stir the pot just curious.
Click to expand...

It originally referred to "The Unorganized Militia", meaning all able-bodied armed free men. In the context of the time, in military terms "well regulated" meant properly armed, trained, disciplined and ready for combat.

Today it is assumed to refer to the citizenry in general.
 
Higgins86 said:
in terms of US gun law what does "A well regulated Militia" mean today? Not trying to stir the pot just curious.
Click to expand...

Pretty much what the SCOTUS says it means.
What does the term "arms" mean today? Certainly not muskets and cannon.
Not firearms only, either.
 
Status
Not open for further replies.
Back
Top Bottom