• This is a political forum that is non-biased/non-partisan and treats every person's position on topics equally. This debate forum is not aligned to any political party. In today's politics, many ideas are split between and even within all the political parties. Often we find ourselves agreeing on one platform but some topics break our mold. We are here to discuss them in a civil political debate. If this is your first visit to our political forums, be sure to check out the RULES. Registering for debate politics is necessary before posting. Register today to participate - it's free!

Gun attack at Batman film premiere in Denver [W:120]

Status
Not open for further replies.
apdst said:
If the bad guy gets hit a few times, he might not get that shot off.

You can argue against action all you want, but history has proven that doing something beats the hell out of doing nothing.
Click to expand...

I don't think that history ever proves what MIGHT have happened if what actually happened had happened differently.
 
apdst said:
If the bad guy gets hit a few times, he might not get that shot off.

You can argue against action all you want, but history has proven that doing something beats the hell out of doing nothing.
Click to expand...
Reminds me of a discussion a while back about a college co- ed that was stabbed to death in a busy college cafeteria while everyone froze and watched in shock. Had even one or two people stepped up she would have lived.
 
AdamT said:
I don't think that history ever proves what MIGHT have happened if what actually happened had happened differently.
Click to expand...

Yeah...ok...:rofl
 
LaMidRighter said:
Yep. That really is the most important question which will not have a quick answer.
Click to expand...

But the shooter already appears to fit the profile--loner, socially "off," and etc.
 
apdst said:
The other side of that coin is, the bad guy might rethink his intentions when he's taking pot shots from a .45.
Click to expand...

Holms is a Ph.D student and he knew that there was no security at the movie theatre at all and metal detectors should be installed to ramp up theatre security.
 
MaggieD said:
I really do disagree with you here. This guy got off at least 71 deliberate shots. His weapon apparently wasn't firing on automatic. My common sense tells me that people who conceal carry are probably better than average shots and carry a weapon because they subliminally or overtly plan to use it if they have to.

As another poster mentioned, if this guy had quickly found he was taking gun fire, he wouldn't have been casually walking up and down the aisles firing at people. Even with body armor, I "think" a couple rounds to the chest is going to take ya' down. (I don't know that for sure, though.)
Click to expand...
I completely agree with your disagreement. I'm simply dumbfounded by the number of people saying "Thank goodness the shooter was the only one armed, otherwise it would have been much worse." Shake. My. Head. Stupidity on a stick.

Yes, the shooter had armor. No, not everyone with a CCW is a crack shot with a pistol. However, if some madman is shooting at me, I'm liking my chances a bit more if I have something to defend myself with. If he's returning fire at me (assuming he's able, I am a good shot), he's not killing some little 6-year old girl, and I'm buying time for the cops.

You're right, depending on the caliber of the weapon, body armor is only partially effective. I saw a guy in a state-of-the-art BPV get knocked on his arse by a relatively small caliber weapon. I saw another guy in Kevlar get knocked unconscious by one round from a .45 to the chest.

I have my CCW, and I'm carrying it everywhere from now on.
 
LaMidRighter said:
Reminds me of a discussion a while back about a college co- ed that was stabbed to death in a busy college cafeteria while everyone froze and watched in shock. Had even one or two people stepped up she would have lived.
Click to expand...

We live in a, "don't get involved", society. Look what's happening to George Zimmerman, because he, "got involved".

Remember that dude in Baon Rouge about 15 years ago that went to jail--or damn near went to jail--because he shot/killed a car thief with a compound bow? I can't find the story and I'm not going to look for it, but the point is, when you get involved and the bad guy gets hurt, or killed, there's always some asshole(s) that think you should be punished.
 
ThirdTerm said:
Holms is a Ph.D student and he knew that there was no security at the movie theatre at all and metal detectors should be installed to ramp up theatre security.
Click to expand...

Holmes didn't bring his weapons in through the front door, so in this case, metal detectors would have been useless.
 
ThirdTerm said:
Holms is a Ph.D student and he knew that there was no security at the movie theatre at all and metal detectors should be installed to ramp up theatre security.
Click to expand...

Was. He was doing poorly and dropped out. This may be the source of his rage.
 
He beats Zimmerman by leaps and bounds. Any Zimmerman supporter want to start arguing his case?
 
LaMidRighter said:
Point 1: I've never been under fire before, but if god forbid that should ever happen there are two options, panic and get shot or find sufficient cover, fire back, and try to improve my odds.
Point two: Most people looking to do harm don't declare their intentions, there is no way to stop them ahead of time. All you can do is give your best effort to stop them when they attack.
Click to expand...

My problem is there lacks dialogue on causation and prevention and the root is Nationalism. These public shootings have been an epidemic for at least ten years but too many Americans want to pretend each one is an isolated incident.

It is disheartening the response revolves around the exact same solution the perps use: guns.
 
Come on--there's an entire forum devoted to Zimmerman. Please don't hijack this thread. Please.
 
nota bene said:
But the shooter already appears to fit the profile--loner, socially "off," and etc.
Click to expand...
True. I don't get it, there are plenty of people with no social skills that keep to themselves with no incidents, and then we get this type. It would be interesting to figure out what differentiates the loner from the dangerous loner.
 
LaMidRighter said:
True. I don't get it, there are plenty of people with no social skills that keep to themselves with no incidents, and then we get this type. It would be interesting to figure out what differentiates the loner from the dangerous loner.
Click to expand...

They're not nutjobs. I think the solution to the wacko factor will never be answered.
 
apdst said:
We live in a, "don't get involved", society. Look what's happening to George Zimmerman, because he, "got involved".

Remember that dude in Baon Rouge about 15 years ago that went to jail--or damn near went to jail--because he shot/killed a car thief with a compound bow? I can't find the story and I'm not going to look for it, but the point is, when you get involved and the bad guy gets hurt, or killed, there's always some asshole(s) that think you should be punished.
Click to expand...
I don't remember the BR incident but there was a similar case in Florida, same problem, the guy was almost killed while someone tried to drive away in his car, he injured the perp and it was argued he had to let the criminal escape.
 
LaMidRighter said:
I don't remember the BR incident but there was a similar case in Florida, same problem, the guy was almost killed while someone tried to drive away in his car, he injured the perp and it was argued he had to let the criminal escape.
Click to expand...

The guy in BR was at a sporting goods store, took a bow off the shelf and grabbed some arrows, then shot a guy that was breaking into his truck. He was put on trial, but don't remember if he was convicted, or not.

What about that dude that capped his son's kidnapper at the Lake Charles airport? He walked.
 
Horrible massacre! our thoughts and prayers are with the affected families.
 
MaggieD said:
He had on a ballistic helmet, ballistic throat protection, ballistic groin protection. This guy was the $6 million man. Well....then there's inflation.
Click to expand...



I teach my students that there are various targets of opportunity. Face and thigh works pretty well

shooting someone in the kneecap is going to put them down then you can go up and finish them with a shot to the back of the neck

btw a 45 to the groin-even with those ballistic cups is going to really hurt. anyone who has been a catcher in baseball knows what I mean
 
LaMidRighter said:
Point 1: I've never been under fire before, but if god forbid that should ever happen there are two options, panic and get shot or find sufficient cover, fire back, and try to improve my odds.
Click to expand...
Or the 3rd option, which ensured the majority of those people got out of the theater: panic, take cover, don't shoot back, don't get shot, leave and survive.
 
Phys251 said:
Dude. WTF. Even Jerry Sandusky has rights. I'm glad this shooter lived, for the sole reason that his being alive gives us a much better chance at understanding his motives.
Click to expand...
Yeah, I'm always pissed when they kill themselves or die in other ways because any hope of understanding goes (mostly) out of the window.
 
Status
Not open for further replies.
Back
Top Bottom