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SCOTUS LIVEBLOG - Obamacare Mandate Survives [W:125, 384, 635, 652, 758, 1205]

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Re: SCOTUS LIVEBLOG - Obamacare Mandate Survives [W:125]

AdamT said:
You read part of the bill and you've drawn a conclusion about the whole bill.... Mkay.
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KEYWORD is FAMILIES, as usual John Q. Public needs a dependent to get Uncle Sugar to give him some "love" money.
 
Re: SCOTUS LIVEBLOG - Obamacare Mandate Survives [W:125]

AdamT said:
You read part of the bill and you've drawn a conclusion about the whole bill.... Mkay.

The Patient Protection and Affordable Care Act will require premium rate reviews to track any arbitrary
premium increases and will crack down on excessive insurance overhead by applying standards on how much insurance companies can spend on non-medical costs, such as bureaucracy and advertising. It will also provide sliding scale premium tax credits for families that still cannot afford quality health insurance.
http://dpc.senate.gov/healthreformbill/healthbill30.pdf
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That's the funniest thing I've ever read. A family that cannot afford health insurance isn't going to benefit from tax credit as they probably have no federal tax burden to begin with.
 
So I take it with 800+ replies we get conservatives who are lambasting the Justices for getting the constitution or the shape of government wrong while they hailed the sense of the decisions coming beforehand like campaign finance. Then liberals here must be praising the court for its sensibility over the shape of government after calling into question their legitimacy regarding such matters as campaign finance.
 
Re: SCOTUS LIVEBLOG - Obamacare Mandate Survives [W:125]

Thunder said:
and should my insurance company be able to opt-out of covering cancer treatment?
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You really do not understand private property do you?

You are entering into a contract with a private company to buy a service they are selling. The service, if this was insurance, would be a transfer of some of your risk to the insurance company in return for a small fee. Instead it is pre-paid health care. And you now have the government telling you that you must buy a government mandated policy with coverage a bureaucrat has decided you must have. And further the government is mandating that a private company must sell you a policy that they have no control over at a price some bureaucrat says they must charge.

There is no more right to private property. We are doomed.
 
Re: SCOTUS LIVEBLOG - Obamacare Mandate Survives [W:125]

AdamT said:
Uh, Exxon pays around 15%.
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I see you have been using progressive spin sites for sources again.

When It Comes To Paying Taxes, Big Oil Takes The Biggest Hit - Forbes
ExxonMobil in 2011 made $27.3 billion in cash payments for income taxes. Chevron paid $17 billion and ConocoPhillips $10.6 billion. And not only were these the highest amounts in absolute terms, when compared with the rest of the 25 most profitable U.S. companies (see our slideshow for the full rundown of who paid what), the trio also had the highest effective tax rates. Exxon’s tax rate was 42.9%, Chevron’s was 48.3% and Conoco’s was 41.5%. That’s even higher than the 35% U.S. federal statutory rate, which is already the highest tax rate among developed nations.
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Re: SCOTUS LIVEBLOG - Obamacare Mandate Survives [W:125]

clownboy said:
That's the funniest thing I've ever read. A family that cannot afford health insurance isn't going to benefit from tax credit as they probably have no federal tax burden to begin with.
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Yep, free money from suckers like you and me.
 
Re: SCOTUS LIVEBLOG - Obamacare Mandate Survives [W:125]

clownboy said:
That's the funniest thing I've ever read. A family that cannot afford health insurance isn't going to benefit from tax credit as they probably have no federal tax burden to begin with.
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Why don't you read the entire post - clownboy?

Why do you cherry pick things out of context and then attack them?

Try some honest debate for once.
 
Re: SCOTUS LIVEBLOG - Obamacare Mandate Survives [W:125]

Neocon shill shows you that the government owns your soul, and can get away with anything as long as they make you pay for whatever it is you are forced to do, let's just call it "a chain", er, i mean "a tax".
 
Re: SCOTUS LIVEBLOG - Obamacare Mandate Survives [W:125, 384, 635, 652]

Fiddytree said:
So I take it with 800+ replies we get conservatives who are lambasting the Justices for getting the constitution or the shape of government wrong while they hailed the sense of the decisions coming beforehand like campaign finance. Then liberals here must be praising the court for its sensibility over the shape of government after calling into question their legitimacy regarding such matters as campaign finance.
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Well, Fiddy, I dont like it, but I see the way out as a political solution. They voted it in, we vote it out. Its really that simple.
 
Re: SCOTUS LIVEBLOG - Obamacare Mandate Survives [W:125]

akyron said:
"IRS may need to hire as many as 16,500 additional
auditors, agents and other employees to investigate and
collect billions in new taxes from Americans"

http://republicans.waysandmeans.house.gov/UploadedFiles/IRS_Power_Report.pdf

Its a house ways and means official report. You do not need a crystal ball to read the writing on the wall.


Leaving all that out...What do you think 15k+ IRS agents will sit around doing in the next ten years?

An expansion of 100 is enough to be concerned about.
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The House? I thought they moved that body to Mars, most who are there are not from this planet.
80% of Americans are already exempt from the tax and many more will purchase insurance now that they can afford it. There won't be many that pay.
 
vendur said:
Neocon shill shows you that the government owns your soul, and can get away with anything as long as they make you pay for whatever it is you are forced to do, let's just call it "a chain", er, i mean "a tax".
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Who is the neocon shill?
 
Re: SCOTUS LIVEBLOG - Obamacare Mandate Survives [W:125, 384, 635, 652]

Fiddytree said:
So I take it with 800+ replies we get conservatives who are lambasting the Justices for getting the constitution or the shape of government wrong while they hailed the sense of the decisions coming beforehand like campaign finance. Then liberals here must be praising the court for its sensibility over the shape of government after calling into question their legitimacy regarding such matters as campaign finance.
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I missed where conservative here were hailing the campaign finance decision.
 
Re: SCOTUS LIVEBLOG - Obamacare Mandate Survives [W:125]

PerfectStorm said:
Yep, free money from suckers like you and me.
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You don't complaint about giving money to corporate farms or oil companies in the form of tax credits... why do you far-rigties bitch so much about giving a few of pennies your taxes to help provide a standard of living for poor families?

Seems all backwards if you ask me.

It's really f--ked up morals, IMO. Give to the rich and successful and let the poor die.
 
Re: SCOTUS LIVEBLOG - Obamacare Mandate Survives [W:125, 384, 635, 652]

OpportunityCost said:
Well, Fiddy, I dont like it, but I see the way out as a political solution. They voted it in, we vote it out. Its really that simple.
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Or not. That depends on the American voters.
 
OpportunityCost said:
Well, Fiddy, I dont like it, but I see the way out as a political solution. They voted it in, we vote it out. Its really that simple.
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It's not really simple. If you try to vote the bill out (a difficult proposition) you would have to contend with what ought to stay and what one wants to replace it with. Neither is simple.
 
Re: SCOTUS LIVEBLOG - Obamacare Mandate Survives [W:125]

Thunder said:
I understand that you disagree with this decision, but there's no need to insult Obama like that.
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I know. I should always use the whole phrase, one term Marxist flexible president Barrack Hussein Obama.

There. Fixed. Did you have a response to my comments? Here is what I wrote:

Originally Posted by Misterveritis
It's purpose is to eliminate private health insurance. The one term Marxist did not want this monster to really begin until after he is securely elected for a second term. In 2015 we should begin to see the big insurers getting out of the health insurance business. Some have gotten out already.
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Originally Posted by Misterveritis
Oh goody. Now you will have a death panel of bureaucrats who will get to decide. If your spouse didn't vote for the one term Marxist you don't get the care. Cool. But you won't be denied insurance, just care.
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Re: SCOTUS LIVEBLOG - Obamacare Mandate Survives [W:125]

hazlnut said:
Why don't you read the entire post - clownboy?

Why do you cherry pick things out of context and then attack them?

Try some honest debate for once.
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We're into page 86 and growing by the second. But where have I cherry-picked? And it's not out of context. Adam made an assertion that there was a sliding scale involved. He even posted proof. I pointed out that the sliding scale in the bill was a chimera, an illusion.

Take your own advice. Try some honest debate for once.
 
Re: SCOTUS LIVEBLOG - Obamacare Mandate Survives [W:125, 384, 635, 652]

Fiddytree said:
Who is the neocon shill?
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Roberts. i remember when he was nominated that he was very "pro government". Now we find out just how pro government he is.
 
clownboy said:
I missed where conservative here were hailing the campaign finance decision.
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That money=free speech, including corporations? That was and is a big one here. Heck, I joined in with the belief it was a good ruling.
 
hazlnut said:
It's really f--ked up morals, IMO. Give to the rich and successful and let the poor die.
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"Give" to no one and let adults be adults.

What's effed up is your insistence upon thinking of adults like they're helpless infants.
 
Re: SCOTUS LIVEBLOG - Obamacare Mandate Survives [W:125]

Thunder said:
is that a bad thing?
health-insurance companies will now be required to pay for the treatment of all illnesses. how can this be seen as anything but good?
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Because a wide variety of very expensive medical treatments are a result of lifestyle choices.
Good drivers get benefits, bad drivers get penalties and eventually dropped. Seems reasonable right?

In this case, people who abuse their bodies (no exercise, obese, smoker, risk takers, etc.) may then be subsidized by the people who are not that way.

I do like subsidizing someone who has an illness, that's what insurance is for. I don't like incentivizing poor health lifestyle choices, nor do I like actually paying for that incentive.
 
Re: SCOTUS LIVEBLOG - Obamacare Mandate Survives [W:125]

roughdraft274 said:
Great day for the country. The more people that we have insured the better off we all are.
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Next we will make sure everyone has a job, then make sure everyone has a car to drive to that job, then a house to live in, then food to eat all paide for by the tax payer.....our republic will be gone and its called socialism....Exactly what the socialist Hussein Obama wants.....
 
Re: SCOTUS LIVEBLOG - Obamacare Mandate Survives [W:125]

iguanaman said:
Those "death panels" are a myth made up by idiots. Don't throw your hat in with them.
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Really? There are 150 new bureaucracies waiting to be created. Among them are panels of bureaucrats who will determine the levels of care that are appropriate for groups and individuals. Their purpose is to ration care. Death panels. Vote for democrats or die.
 
vendur said:
Roberts. i remember when he was nominated that he was very "pro government". Now we find out just how pro government he is.
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I would suggest you look at National Affairs as well as The Weekly Standard to see where the pulse of neoconservatives and their friends/allies is. They have for the most part have been pretty critical of the Act and it's possible/probably unintended consequences.
 
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