• This is a political forum that is non-biased/non-partisan and treats every person's position on topics equally. This debate forum is not aligned to any political party. In today's politics, many ideas are split between and even within all the political parties. Often we find ourselves agreeing on one platform but some topics break our mold. We are here to discuss them in a civil political debate. If this is your first visit to our political forums, be sure to check out the RULES. Registering for debate politics is necessary before posting. Register today to participate - it's free!

Occupy Wall Street movement has hit a wall

wbcoleman

wbcoleman

DP Veteran
Joined
Jun 13, 2012
Messages
1,833
Reaction score
431
Location
Chicago
Gender
Male
Political Leaning
Libertarian - Right
Dana Milbank reports in WaPo that OWS has hit the wall. The left's answer to the Tea Part it's not.

Occupy Wall Street movement has hit a wall

In October, when liberal activists gathered in Washington, they had hopes that the nascent Occupy Wall Street movement would become the left’s answer to the tea party.

But this time around — the annual Take Back the American Dream Conference was moved up to June this election year — the Occupy encampments are gone, and participants in the conference were pondering what went wrong. Or, as activist Van Jones put it to them, what has become of “the voice that is missing.”

Jones, an Obama administration official who resigned under pressure because of his far-left positions, is a fixture at the annual gatherings and a fiery orator. But this version of his yearly pep talk was laced with disappointment. “I’m watching that movement that inspired the world . . . that stunned the world, in the moment of maximum peril now sit down,” he lamented at the opening session, where half of the 500 seats were filled.
 
Becaus such heavy fervor can wear people the hell out if you expect them to maintain it forever. All the homeless people are tuckered out and crawled back into their cardboard boxes for some peace and quiet.
 
Aunt Spiker said:
Becaus such heavy fervor can wear people the hell out if you expect them to maintain it forever. All the homeless people are tuckered out and crawled back into their cardboard boxes for some peace and quiet.
Click to expand...
Gee, the Tea Party activists have managed to keep things going for three years! Not to mention gaining control of the House of Representatives.
 
wbcoleman said:
Gee, the Tea Party activists have managed to keep things going for three years! Not to mention gaining control of the House of Representatives.
Click to expand...

Tea Party and the Occupy Wallstreet are two very different systems for getting their mission done. . . OWS required people to abandon their lives and fly in the face of public scrutiny and law enforcement.

The Tea Party didn't expect or ask anyone to give up anything and move into a shack downtown to be supportive of the cause.

Obviously - when you don't require people to become the estranged fringe in society - there's more of a chance that you'll have lasting support.
 
Aunt Spiker said:
Tea Party and the Occupy Wallstreet are two very different systems for getting their mission done. . . OWS required people to abandon their lives and fly in the face of public scrutiny and law enforcement.

The Tea Party didn't expect or ask anyone to give up anything and move into a shack downtown to be supportive of the cause.

Obviously - when you don't require people to become the estranged fringe in society - there's more of a chance that you'll have lasting support.
Click to expand...
In other words, the Tea Party model works and the Occupy model doesn't. I'll buy that!
 
There's a very big difference between a group whining that it has to pay a few taxes and a group that is upset by the massive concentration of wealth and power in private corporate hands.

But yeah, I'm sad to say that OWS didn't make a whole lot of difference. For once, I actually do think the media is to blame. They made the conversation about trying to prove that OWS didn't have a message, when they clearly did. And so that message didn't get out. OWS had a lot of good things to say, but no one listened. And as a result, there's still plenty of profiteering and warmongering, still plenty of jobs being shipped overseas, still the legal ability by corporations to bribe elected leaders with campaign contributions, still massive transfer of wealth from the middle class to the upper class, and still a shrinking middle class and a growing lower class. But no, it's very important that the old white people who wear teabags on their hats stop paying taxes so the next generation can't go to school.

wbcoleman said:
In other words, the Tea Party model works and the Occupy model doesn't. I'll buy that!
Click to expand...

Yes, it's much easier to be a selfish prick and already be comfortable than it is to have almost nothing, and work to actually make this a better country.
 
Paschendale said:
There's a very big difference between a group whining that it has to pay a few taxes and a group that is upset by the massive concentration of wealth and power in private corporate hands.

But yeah, I'm sad to say that OWS didn't make a whole lot of difference. For once, I actually do think the media is to blame. They made the conversation about trying to prove that OWS didn't have a message, when they clearly did. And so that message didn't get out. OWS had a lot of good things to say, but no one listened. And as a result, there's still plenty of profiteering and warmongering, still plenty of jobs being shipped overseas, still the legal ability by corporations to bribe elected leaders with campaign contributions, still massive transfer of wealth from the middle class to the upper class, and still a shrinking middle class and a growing lower class. But no, it's very important that the old white people who wear teabags on their hats stop paying taxes so the next generation can't go to school.
Click to expand...
Oh, please! The media MADE Occupy. Their insignificant little campouts would never have attracted anyone's attention had not the media built them up as the left's answer to the Tea Party.
 
Its wonderful to use all the little morons as protestors..but hey...the election drive is about to kick off and they need their loyal mindless democrat voters back in the fold. Not to worry...it will crank up again after the election.
 
I think you need to fix the link. It's not attached to the hyperlink. Make sure it is an actual news piece too. I don't believe they really take editorials.
 
wbcoleman said:
In other words, the Tea Party model works and the Occupy model doesn't. I'll buy that!
Click to expand...

Tea Party Model? They became a political party. . . not a protest extravaganza. Tehy followed the model of other political parties - sure enough; that's how you make real change happen. Or at least; that's hwo you become stable (I don't know how much 'influence' they've had - afew people elected here and there isn't realy heavy, either)
 
Aunt Spiker said:
Tea Party Model? They became a political party. . . not a protest extravaganza. Tehy followed the model of other political parties - sure enough; that's how you make real change happen. Or at least; that's hwo you become stable (I don't know how much 'influence' they've had - afew people elected here and there isn't realy heavy, either)
Click to expand...

What a shame that they didn't change anything, only made the current problems worse. The already obstructionist congress became even more obstructionist. Policy centered around draining the middle class for the benefit of the wealthy continued. And unconstitutional religious morality laws have gained even more steam. What a wonderful job the Tea Party has done...
 
the OWS never had a chance... it was doomed to failure from it's inception.

America, as a whole, enjoys a lil rocking of the boat from time to time... it will not tolerate a capsizing of the ship, though.
 
Paschendale said:
What a shame that they didn't change anything, only made the current problems worse. The already obstructionist congress became even more obstructionist. Policy centered around draining the middle class for the benefit of the wealthy continued. And unconstitutional religious morality laws have gained even more steam. What a wonderful job the Tea Party has done...
Click to expand...
You believe in democracy, don't you? The point to the Tea Party was to stop the Obama/Pelosi/Reid legislative program, and it succeeded brilliantly. The grassroots rose up. You ought to admire that, even if you oppose their political platform.
 
wbcoleman said:
You believe in democracy, don't you? The point to the Tea Party was to stop the Obama/Pelosi/Reid legislative program, and it succeeded brilliantly. The grassroots rose up. You ought to admire that, even if you oppose their political platform.
Click to expand...

I should admire people who selfishly want to sacrifice the future of my entire generation for the benefit of theirs? The people who squandered all the wealth of the last thirty years, trapped millions of young people in debt, and have no respect for the religious equality guaranteed in the constitution. These are the people who espoused the phrase "whoever dies with the most toys wins". Well, their toys are going to be paid for by me and mine over the next forty years of our lives. These Tea Partiers are the first generation leave their children worse off than they were. They created a political party out of nothing but their own selfishness.

The point to the Tea Party was to take everything that wasn't nailed down for their own selfish gain. Remind me why I should admire that?
 
The Teaparties days are numbered too. Bush Tax cuts expire Dec. 31st. Tick tock, tick tock
 
wbcoleman said:
Oh, please! The media MADE Occupy. Their insignificant little campouts would never have attracted anyone's attention had not the media built them up as the left's answer to the Tea Party.
Click to expand...

Well, traditional media and new media did promote it. However, it was new media/social media that started it. So to a significant extent, it was social media that both created and propelled it forward to visibility by the mainstream press.

Whatever the case, the premise of the piece in my view is fairly on. I would caution against using Wisconsin as the prime exemplar of demoralization, as that process had begun months earlier with police breakdowns, public opinion becoming more critical, and a lack of embrace of politics by the protesters, as well as a distancing by the political establishment. To me, once the movement resists developing coherent public policy proposals and elected representatives with a chance for moderated success, your movement will falter sooner than later.
 
wbcoleman said:
You believe in democracy, don't you? The point to the Tea Party was to stop the Obama/Pelosi/Reid legislative program, and it succeeded brilliantly. The grassroots rose up. You ought to admire that, even if you oppose their political platform.
Click to expand...

Yea I guess there is a kind of arrogant brilliance in the founders of the teas. Those white men with the money to buy them even more money and hire a bunch of flunkies who don't know a thing about Govt. to throw a monkey wrench in the machine. Buy your way into Govt to get what you want...... what an American idea.
They have a December surprise coming and it going to cost them more money.
 
iguanaman said:
Yea I guess there is a kind of arrogant brilliance in the founders of the teas. Those white men with the money to buy them even more money and hire a bunch of flunkies who don't know a thing about Govt. to throw a monkey wrench in the machine. Buy your way into Govt to get what you want...... what an American idea.
They have a December surprise coming and it going to cost them more money.
Click to expand...
You REALLY don't remember the summer of 2009???
 
Good, OWS is gone and the Tea Party is gone. Now that we've gotten over the initial emotional overreaction of a recession, now we can get to work getting out of it.

TALLY HOOOOooooooo......!
 
iguanaman said:
The Teaparties days are numbered too. Bush Tax cuts expire Dec. 31st. Tick tock, tick tock
Click to expand...
You're joking, right? The Democrats are going to try and impose a massive tax increase on January 1?????
 
RadicalModerate said:
Good, OWS is gone and the Tea Party is gone. Now that we've gotten over the initial emotional overreaction of a recession, now we can get to work getting out of it.

TALLY HOOOOooooooo......!
Click to expand...

Don't be so quick. The Tea Party is more visible and influential than the OWS. Furthermore, those tendencies never vanish, it is just the organizations that may slow down. Further still, "getting over the initial emotional overreaction of a recession," does not mean that we have 1) actually "emotionally gotten over it" 2) Will then know how to proceed.
 
Fiddytree said:
Don't be so quick. The Tea Party is more visible and influential than the OWS. Furthermore, those tendencies never vanish, it is just the organizations that may slow down. Further still, "getting over the initial emotional overreaction of a recession," does not mean that we have 1) actually "emotionally gotten over it" 2) Will then know how to proceed.
Click to expand...

Yeah, but they are bogging down the GOP. They won't last long under the Republican tent. Populism and all of it's awful consequences always flourish right after an economic downturn, and it usually fades after some time and recovery. I didn't mean that both would vanish by next month, but both examples of extreme idiocy have had their 15 minutes, accomplished nothing and will soon be gone.
 
To me, OWS's lack of impact is not a surprise. First, the movement is far from representative of the "99%" it purports to represent. Its base is far narrower. Second, the narrow-based movement may not represent the broad priorities of Americans in general. Hence, it confronts barriers to growth. Third, it still lacks a clearly articulated, significant, and realistic agenda of change. Nebulous rhetoric and "catch-all" complaints do not constitute concrete and attainable policy goals and recommendations.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top Bottom