• This is a political forum that is non-biased/non-partisan and treats every person's position on topics equally. This debate forum is not aligned to any political party. In today's politics, many ideas are split between and even within all the political parties. Often we find ourselves agreeing on one platform but some topics break our mold. We are here to discuss them in a civil political debate. If this is your first visit to our political forums, be sure to check out the RULES. Registering for debate politics is necessary before posting. Register today to participate - it's free!

Wisconsin Gov. Scott Walker survives recall effort, NBC News projects

Do you understand what lobbying really is? Name for me one lobbyist that actually votes on a bill? Further you continue to miss the point, without taxpayers the govt. wouldn't have the funds to hire anyone. Without tax funds private business still can remain in business.

Probably the same number of union heads that vote on a bill. Of course I understand what lobbying is. Unions do it too. That's the game and how it's played.

There are many companies that would be forced to go out of business or scale way back without defense contracts, and would have to fire a lot of people. The funding for these contracts comes from taxes.
 
i've had this argument with him before, he seems to think that even though the state worker performs a service to earn that money, that the "state"(taxpayers) get to dictate to the individual how they are to spend their paycheck, he believes, even after the money has been paid, the 'taxpayer' has a claim on it.

Freedom freedom freedom.
 
Where did the money come from to pay those employees? DId the state print it?
what part of the money now belongs to the individual, who may do with it as they please, don't you understand....not that i expect a response, as you are trying to ignore me...lol
 
Would you care to post the link to the bls web pages comparing WI's job creation to all the other states?

Didn't think so.

Compare them to their neighbors IL and MI (woops MI has a GOP governor now too). ;-)
 
what part of the money now belongs to the individual, who may do with it as they please, don't you understand....not that i expect a response, as you are trying to ignore me...lol

I like how these same right wing zealots can talk about property rights on the one hand and then vomit up this sort of nonsense when it suits them. Damn hypocrities!!!!!
 
Probably the same number of union heads that vote on a bill. Of course I understand what lobbying is. Unions do it too. That's the game and how it's played.

There are many companies that would be forced to go out of business or scale way back without defense contracts, and would have to fire a lot of people. The funding for these contracts comes from taxes.

Pure speculation that ignores reality. You are so concerned about lobbyists and who they give money to yet ignore the public union money that they use to support politicians that support their causes. It works both ways but the bottomline s Walker won, union membership has dropped significantly and Wisconsin has moved from number 41 to 24 in business climate, 2011-2012.

http://chiefexecutive.net/best-worst-states-for-business
 
Last edited:
The MacIver Institute!?!??!?!!?!? :lamo:mrgreen::lamo

Considering some of the sources you have used.....

Besides any of that, the numbers used in that chart are verifiable from election commission filings so they are open to the public. All he did was put them into a chart.
Care to discuss or attempt to debunk the financials reported?
 
i've had this argument with him before, he seems to think that even though the state worker performs a service to earn that money, that the "state"(taxpayers) get to dictate to the individual how they are to spend their paycheck, he believes, even after the money has been paid, the 'taxpayer' has a claim on it.

Well, if it's a union employee...

Nobody is capable of the mental gymnastics that Con is to justify his beliefs. Even when he loses, he turns it into "Obama's results," and "I vote for results, not rhetoric." Even I could do his shtick at this point. He should be forced to change his user name to "Republican."
 
it is only freedom apparently if con gets to determine exactly what 'freedom' is...

He would do really well fitting in here in the Republican majority in the Michigan legislature. They have a big government solution to every little local community problem and it matters not to them that they have preached the total opposite for decades now.

"I am from the government and I am here to help" is their new mantra.
 
The MacIver Institute!?!??!?!!?!? :lamo:mrgreen::lamo

those figures seem pretty fair to me. certainly more then the numbers I see hacks such as Rachel Maddow trying to claim.
 
Considering some of the sources you have used.....

Besides any of that, the numbers used in that chart are verifiable from election commission filings so they are open to the public. All he did was put them into a chart.
Care to discuss or attempt to debunk the financials reported?

What sources of mine do you have trouble with? I went to the chart and saw no validation or support for anything on it.
 
So ya got no clothes.

All you can do is cite rhetoric. Its not the old governors fault but its Walkers fault jobs havent been created. No discussion on where the budget was headed, what the policies were, no discussion on if maintaining public contracts is the right thing or even economically feasible in the immediate, short, and long term. No discussions on funding of retirement program, no discussion on the education system, improvements, ways and means to enhance jobs growth. At the end of the day...Walker evil, Unions innocent victims...

If Obama can blame Bush, why can't Walker? He has been WI governor for 1.5 years and has yet to turn the state's economy around. I am turely SHOCKED, not! Please explain why he had over a $3 billion deficit when he statred and now has barely over $1 million deficit to deal with. Was WI in better shape BEFORE governor Walker? Hmm...
 
Pure speculation that ignores reality. You are so concerned about lobbyists and who they give money to yet ignore the public union money that they use to support politicians that support their causes. It works both ways but the bottomline s Walker won, union membership has dropped significantly and Wisconsin has moved from number 41 to 24 in business climate, 2011-2012.

I'm not that concerned with lobbyists. I have no problem with them in general. You're the one who's obssessed with unions. Yes, they use their money to support politicians that support their causes. So does the NRA, so do hundreds of groups on both sides. Welcome to American politics.

The government employees are employees, and once the money is paid to them as salary, it is their money. The fact that you can't wrap your head around this is baffling. How dense can you be?

Nice try to change the subject at the end. You must realize your failure because you always change the subject when you lose.
 
He would do really well fitting in here in the Republican majority in the Michigan legislature. They have a big government solution to every little local community problem and it matters not to them that they have preached the total opposite for decades now.

"I am from the government and I am here to help" is their new mantra.

Get ready, Wisconsin results would indicate to me tht Illinois, then Michigan are next. You must be proud of your 46th ranking in business climate, which is better than the 48 number last year when Snyder took office. Say good bye to your union funding so you can keep your job
 
I'm not that concerned with lobbyists. I have no problem with them in general. You're the one who's obssessed with unions. Yes, they use their money to support politicians that support their causes. So does the NRA, so do hundreds of groups on both sides. Welcome to American politics.

The government employees are employees, and once the money is paid to them as salary, it is their money. The fact that you can't wrap your head around this is baffling. How dense can you be?

Nice try to change the subject at the end. You must realize your failure because you always change the subject when you lose.

You continue to miss the point, I have no problem with private sector unions, my issue is with public unions and funding for those unions. All pay and benefits since they come from the taxpayers should be determined by the taxpayers at the ballot box.

There also is no question that once the money comes from the taxpayer it becomes the union employee but that misses the point totally. Where does that money come from if not the taxpayer?
 
Get ready, Wisconsin results would indicate to me tht Illinois, then Michigan are next. You must be proud of your 46th ranking in business climate, which is better than the 48 number last year when Snyder took office. Say good bye to your union funding so you can keep your job
awwwww yes...the same ol' 'so you can keep your job' schtick...you are a broken record...
 
What sources of mine do you have trouble with? I went to the chart and saw no validation or support for anything on it.

Can the passive agressive faux outrage for someone that gives a damn Haymarket, your typical histrionics are not wanted or needed. Repudiate the numbers or shut up about it and accept it as data. Data that is certainly open to question but you havent begun to make a reasonable attempt at that as yet.

So quitcher cryin and give it a shot.
 
You continue to miss the point, I have no problem with private sector unions, my issue is with public unions and funding for those unions. All pay and benefits since they come from the taxpayers should be determined by the taxpayers at the ballot box.

There also is no question that once the money comes from the taxpayer it becomes the union employee but that misses the point totally. Where does that money come from if not the taxpayer?
again, maybe it will sink in this time, IT DOESNT MATTER where it came from, the 'taxpayer'(by the way, which these union members are) paid for a service...this money is now the individuals, and the 'taxpayer' has no claim over it, and does not get to direct how it is spent.
 
It is indeed and the stock market, as far as my stock anyway, has responded accordingly.

This should give the American people the confidence they need to start turning the country around, but with the real test coming in November. if they can win In November then investors everywhere will once again be bullish on America.
I hate to be a downer, but something tells me that investors weren't withholding capital awaiting the Wisconsin gubernatorial results.
 
I hate to be a downer, but something tells me that investors weren't withholding capital awaiting the Wisconsin gubernatorial results.

Why would that be a downer, you are absolutely correct as investors invest their own money to make a profit and the Wisconsin results indicate that a strong leader taking action against skyrocketing costs due to union benefits could be an indication that better days are coming. Now we get rid of Obama and really turn the economy around.
 
Get ready, Wisconsin results would indicate to me tht Illinois, then Michigan are next. You must be proud of your 46th ranking in business climate, which is better than the 48 number last year when Snyder took office. Say good bye to your union funding so you can keep your job

I have no idea what you have been doing to produce such a ridiculous belief. The funding for my job comes from the same sources that fund Republicans in the same positions. CLUE for the CLUELESS: it has nothing to do with unions or union money.
 
The Senate will not be in session again until after the November elections -- in which 16 of the 33 seats are up for grabs -- so who really cares?

That's a job I want to have.
 
Can the passive agressive faux outrage for someone that gives a damn Haymarket, your typical histrionics are not wanted or needed. Repudiate the numbers or shut up about it and accept it as data. Data that is certainly open to question but you havent begun to make a reasonable attempt at that as yet.

So quitcher cryin and give it a shot.

My bet is that liberals will also claim that the NY Times is lying as well

http://www.nytimes.com/2012/06/06/u...s-wisconsin-recall-effort.html?pagewanted=all
 
Can the passive agressive faux outrage for someone that gives a damn Haymarket, your typical histrionics are not wanted or needed. Repudiate the numbers or shut up about it and accept it as data. Data that is certainly open to question but you havent begun to make a reasonable attempt at that as yet.

So quitcher cryin and give it a shot.

How can one "repudiate the numbers" when all they are is numbers without sources to examine?
 
Back
Top Bottom