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Appeals Court Upholds Arizona's Voter ID Requirement

muciti said:
Oh I must have missed where he brought up irrelevant incidents from the 70's. Can you point me to that? I missed it.
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Do you have anything else to say on the topic? Otherwise you might just run along. :roll:
 
TurtleDude said:
Its amazing-we are constantly told how smart democrat voters are and how stupid republican voters tend to be yet the deems are the ones who cannot figure out how to get an id. In all fairness, the dem party is a schizo bunch, small number of loud mouthed elites pretending to speak for the interests of millions of low wattage or dependent pawns but still its funny and let truth be told, people too stupid to have or need an ID are ones who really aren't people able to make an informed decision
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And there you have the right wind ideology in a nutshell -- if they deem you as having failed to meet their standards, then you deserve no rights (to vote, in this instance).
 
Karl said:
So, you're saying that the world is flat. Interesting. . . . :2razz:

However, you have correctly illustrated the major fault in your right wing brethrens' argument: namely, that there is no need to prove voter fraud because common sense tells them that it is happening. Which is exact same fault that I was pointing out, but perhaps in an insufficient number of monosyllabic words.
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Exactly. This perfectly encapsulates the "well duh"-it-just-makes-sense argument from the right. In truth, however, what may appear to make sense on the surface often does not make sense when you look below the surface.
 
TurtleDude said:
what idiocy coming from a supporter and perhaps paid activist for the party that brought us the civil war, Pearl Harbor, Korean war, Vietnam war, the Iranian hostage fiasco, the new deal rape of the constitution, Jimmy carter and Obama
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Wow. The irony . . . . . .
 
AdamT said:
Exactly. This perfectly encapsulates the "well duh"-it-just-makes-sense argument from the right. In truth, however, what may appear to make sense on the surface often does not make sense when you look below the surface.
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I have come to the conclusion that the GOP is not interested in common sense. They, and their leaders, simply say too much stupid stuff (like Mitch McConnell pontificating about the price of gasoline doubling under Obama)... only a moron or a party fanatic could swallow such stuff, and the leaders are bound to know that, so they are quite simply propagandists who knowingly have no intention of 'making sense'.

David Byrne even wrote a song/album/movie about it ;)



 
Karl said:
I have come to the conclusion that the GOP is not interested in common sense. They, and their leaders, simply say too much stupid stuff (like Mitch McConnell pontificating about the price of gasoline doubling under Obama)... only a moron or a party fanatic could swallow such stuff, and the leaders are bound to know that, so they are quite simply propagandists who knowingly have no intention of 'making sense'.

David Byrne even wrote a song/album/movie about it ;)



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people on this site tend to be far more informed than the average voter, who's every day concerns are what they care about. also people tend to validate data on trust over logic (again avg voter) so stuff not making sense doesn't matter because if they trust the source than the info is taken at face value.

so yeah, smart politics has figured this flaw in humanity out and exploits it.
 
muciti said:
Does that mean you are not going to quote where he did what you said he did?
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It means that you should run along if you don't have anything to say on the thread topic. Was I unclear about that?
 
AdamT said:
It means that you should run along if you don't have anything to say on the thread topic. Was I unclear about that?
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I'll take that as you cannot support your own statement once again. You brought it off topic talking about the Iran Contra and Watergate. Stop making stupid comments if you dont want to discuss them.
 
Eighty Deuce said:
Democrats and liberals are, on average, of far lower ethical standards than Conservatives. They cheat. They obfuscate. They whine and moan. And they shun accountability.
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:lamo :lamo :lamo :lamo :lamo
 
AdamT said:
Exactly. This perfectly encapsulates the "well duh"-it-just-makes-sense argument from the right. In truth, however, what may appear to make sense on the surface often does not make sense when you look below the surface.
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Yep: "Well, duh...if you want to vote in the United States of America, you should actually be able to prove you're who you say you are." Well. Duh.
 
MaggieD said:
Yep: "Well, duh...if you want to vote in the United States of America, you should actually be able to prove you're who you say you are." Well. Duh.
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Exactly. Sounds obvious, but since there isn't actually a problem with voter impersonation, it's quite idiotic to waste millions of dollars on these unnecessary laws.
 
AdamT said:
Exactly. Sounds obvious, but since there isn't actually a problem with voter impersonation, it's quite idiotic to waste millions of dollars on these unnecessary laws.
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Your repeated and only complaint that one should have to prove a problem before requiring something as simple as identification is absurd.

Prove there's a problem that justifies having to identify one's self as a worker in the control room of a nuclear reactor.
Prove there's a problem that justifies having to show one's identification to use a pool pass.

You guys are incredible.
 
MaggieD said:
Your repeated and only complaint that one should have to prove a problem before requiring something as simple as identification is absurd.

Prove there's a problem that justifies having to identify one's self as a worker in the control room of a nuclear reactor.
Prove there's a problem that justifies having to show one's identification to use a pool pass.

You guys are incredible.
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I can't imagine what could more basic than requiring a problem to be shown before spending millions of dollars and passing new regulations to address the supposed problem. I think it's literally insane to suggest otherwise.
 
Karl said:
However, you have correctly illustrated the major fault in your right wing brethrens' argument: namely, that there is no need to prove voter fraud because common sense tells them that it is happening. Which is exact same fault that I was pointing out, but perhaps in an insufficient number of monosyllabic words.
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Just look at the facts, and then tell me what they say to you:

1. Does voter fraud happen? Yes
2. Is it proved and prosecuted very often? No.
3. Is voter fraud difficult to catch? Yes
4. Even if detected after the fact, is it difficult to catch the person(s) involved? Yes, very difficult.
5. Is it easy without having to show an ID, to vote under a name other than your own? Yes, as the latest hidden videos have shown.
6. Has there been wide spread cases of voter registration fraud in recent years? Yes, ACORN has faced legal action in at least 13 states since 2004.
7. When you combine #5 and #6, would it be easy and low risk to commit voter fraud? Yes.
8. Is a legal ID required to receive: legal employment, A Pell grant, student loan, college enrollment, welfare assistance, government housing, food stamps, SCHIP benefits, Medicare, Medicaid, ACCESS, subsidized prescription drugs and Social Security retirement/disability benefits? Yes
9. Does #8 apply to most elderly, poor and young people? Yes
10. Are those the same groups of people that the left argues will be disenfranchised? Yes


This is where common sense comes into play, and it says to me quite clearly that requiring a legal ID to vote would substantially protect the integrity of our election process... Something that every American, regardless of political affiliation or ideology, should whole heartedly support. It also tells me that since it's not a hardship requiring a legal ID for all of the benefits listed in #8, it's also not a hardship to require one to vote.

So using common sense, what does all that information tell you?
 
Karl said:
So, you're saying that the world is flat. Interesting. . . . :2razz:

However, you have correctly illustrated the major fault in your right wing brethrens' argument: namely, that there is no need to prove voter fraud because common sense tells them that it is happening. Which is exact same fault that I was pointing out, but perhaps in an insufficient number of monosyllabic words.
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i never said that,now you are using a strawman.

do you ever stop using logical fallacies?
 
Karl said:
However, you have correctly illustrated the major fault in your right wing brethrens' argument: namely, that there is no need to prove voter fraud because common sense tells them that it is happening. Which is exact same fault that I was pointing out, but perhaps in an insufficient number of monosyllabic words.
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Wrongo, Karl. It has nothing to do with voter fraud...whether it exists or does not exist. No one knows how much voter fraud exists. It has to do with common sense which, on this issue, the left is particularly and purposefully lacking.
 
MaggieD said:
Wrongo, Karl. It has nothing to do with voter fraud...whether it exists or does not exist. No one knows how much voter fraud exists. It has to do with common sense which, on this issue, the left is particularly and purposefully lacking.
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So in the cases where the poor can't afford the fees to obtain the required documents you would have no problem ponying up the money to pay those fees?
(Ed: Or better yet, just not charging them in the first place for the documents?)


Personally, I think we ought to throw the whole ID system out and go to biometrics but people would really start howling, then.
 
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MoSurveyor said:
So in the cases where the poor can't afford the fees to obtain the required documents you would have no problem ponying up the money to pay those fees?
(Ed: Or better yet, just not charging them in the first place for the documents?)

Personally, I think we ought to throw the whole ID system out and go to biometrics but people would really start howling, then.
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You show me someone who doesn't have a state I.D. or a driver's license, and I'll show you a probable illegal who more than likely has no business voting. Next we'll be saying we have to chauffeur voters to the polling booths because some of them can't afford the gas.
 
MaggieD said:
You show me someone who doesn't have a state I.D. or a driver's license, and I'll show you a probable illegal who more than likely has no business voting. Next we'll be saying we have to chauffeur voters to the polling booths because some of them can't afford the gas.
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god forbid they walk

im waiting for liberals to decipher the living constitution in their imagination that the constitution guarantees free gas and cars to low income.
 
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MaggieD said:
You show me someone who doesn't have a state I.D. or a driver's license, and I'll show you a probable illegal who more than likely has no business voting. Next we'll be saying we have to chauffeur voters to the polling booths because some of them can't afford the gas.
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Nice stereotyping, Mags. Good Lord.
 
beerftw said:
god forbid they walk

im waiting for liberals to decipher the living constitution in their imagination that the constitution guarantees free gas and cars to low income.
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Is that in the same part of the Constitution that calls for mandatory government-issued IDs? :lol:
 
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