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5 dead, suspect in custody in classroom shooting at Oikos University in California

Re: 5 dead, suspect in custody in classroom shooting at Oikos University in Californi

Boo Radley said:
I think we're founded on a certain ideaology and not on the gun. The gun merely played a role, and contributed to a mythology that we love. But it was not the founding principle we were founded on.
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with that, i agree.... but it was an instrumental and valuable tool eh? ;)
 
Re: 5 dead, suspect in custody in classroom shooting at Oikos University in Californi

Wake said:
There's no need for the in-thread squabbling.

So a Korean man killed 5 supposedly Christian students.

I wonder if the partisans infuriated over the Martin/Zimmerman issue will overlook this one?

Better yet, both should be treated as tragedies, and not used for political gain, imho.
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Speaking to partisan attitudes. Let's see, there's a shooting by a Korean student in a Christian college started by a Korean. Why would the students of a small Christian college be anything but Christian, and why is the Korean killer not presumed to be neither a student nor Christian?
 
Re: 5 dead, suspect in custody in classroom shooting at Oikos University in Californi

Manc Skipper said:
Speaking to partisan attitudes. Let's see, there's a shooting by a Korean student in a Christian college started by a Korean. Why would the students of a small Christian college be anything but Christian, and why is the Korean killer not presumed to be neither a student nor Christian?
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Because nobody knows nuttin' yet?
 
Re: 5 dead, suspect in custody in classroom shooting at Oikos University in Californi

I'm going to ignore the thread hijack currently in progress since this is not about politics, Trayvon Martin or America's gun laws.

What we have here is another tragic incident of a confirmed ex-student in a Christian/Korean school specializing in, among other things, Asian medicine going postal on faculty and fellow classmates. A variant of workplace pay-back where fired employee comes back armed to the teeth and seeking revenge. It's absolutely tragic. Seven people are dead. I, for one, want to know why.

I'm waiting for more information on the shooter which will hopefully include what his motives and mental state might be. I'm hoping no more of his victims die.
 
Re: 5 dead, suspect in custody in classroom shooting at Oikos University in Californi

Manc Skipper said:
Speaking to partisan attitudes. Let's see, there's a shooting by a Korean student in a Christian college started by a Korean. Why would the students of a small Christian college be anything but Christian, and why is the Korean killer not presumed to be neither a student nor Christian?
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Honestly don't know. Viewing it as a tragedy, I'm not poring too deeply into what the details are, or planning to use them as a political tool.
 
Re: 5 dead, suspect in custody in classroom shooting at Oikos University in Californi

How about we all leave the politics out of it and focus on the situation at hand? Just askin'.
What would be a solution to this problem, because it IS a problem. This is not the Zimmerman case so let's try to not bring that one in. This is a school shooting...again.

It could be a post office. Or a business office. How do we stop this?
 
Re: 5 dead, suspect in custody in classroom shooting at Oikos University in Californi

Enola said:
How about we all leave the politics out of it and focus on the situation at hand? Just askin'.
What would be a solution to this problem, because it IS a problem. This is not the Zimmerman case so let's try to not bring that one in. This is a school shooting...again. How do we stop this?
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Ahhh, cooler heads prevail. Ha!

I think there should be a protocol for identifying these at-risk students, if that's possible. Sometimes it seems bullying is the trigger. Other times? Well, I don't know, actually. But maybe that's what we really desperately need to find out. I also don't think they're acting in a vacuum. There's warning signs...threats...promises. To their friends...on social network sites...etc. Maybe we all need to be enlightened as to what to watch out for -- and, when we perceive a problem, be taught what to do about it -- who to report it to...how it'll be handled, etc.
 
Re: 5 dead, suspect in custody in classroom shooting at Oikos University in Californi

MaggieD said:
Thanks for the links, Tim. Five years ago. Maybe it's time for more to bring these shootings front-and-center.
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What more do you think Congress can do in situations like mass shootings in schools/on campuses? If someone, seemingly normal to people he/she encounters daily, flies off the deep end and is bent on causing harm to others by planning and carrying out a mass shooting spree on a college campus, what do you think would have been the best way to prevent he/she from doing it?

One of the sad paradigms of school violence is that you can be 100% prepared and educated on being aware of signs and how to behave in a situation as such but it still happens. As cynical as it sounds, a lot of people need to realize that our government can spend all the billions and educate every child in every public school about the risks/prevention methods and yes, that may make these tragedies less likely. But it will not prevent this from ever happening again because, frankly, nothing will.

Also, I don't know how old everyone is on here but...when I was in high school in the early 2000s we had a number of activities from schoolwide assemblies to in-class discussions/education relating to prevention of school violence, what do if something like this happens when you're in school, and how to recognize signs that someone is at risk to commit violent behavior. I think this is a great thing but, again it may be cynical, I don't think there really is anything else we can do other than post a police officer in every classroom in America.
 
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Re: 5 dead, suspect in custody in classroom shooting at Oikos University in Californi

Enola said:
It could be a post office. Or a business office. How do we stop this?
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Not sure about highschool, but colleges should allow schoolmates to own guns.

If I were at the school and had my gun on me, and saw such a disturbance, I'd aim for his torso and end it.
 
Re: 5 dead, suspect in custody in classroom shooting at Oikos University in Californi

GoTim1985 said:
What more do you think Congress can do in situations like mass shootings in schools/on campuses? If someone, seemingly normal to people he/she encounters daily, flies off the deep end and is bent on causing harm to others by planning and carrying out a mass shooting spree on a college campus, what do you think would have been the best way to prevent he/she from doing it?

One of the sad paradigms of school violence is that you can be 100% prepared and educated on being aware of signs and how to behave in a situation as such but it still happens. As cynical as it sounds, a lot of people need to realize that our government can spend all the billions and educate every child in every public school about the risks/prevention methods and yes, that may make these things more rare. But it will not prevent this from ever happening again because, frankly, nothing will.
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I'm not sure nothing can be done, though I understand anyone who thinks it's a tough problem. If you read my post above yours, you'll see that I think most of these people send out signals of one sort or another. I mean, let's face it, these people have a problem. One that could be addressed, at an early-enough stage, by counseling perhaps.

We're doing that with bullying now. And with domestic violence. "Here's what to watch out for" kinds of things. Seems like if we put school violence front and center, we could do the same thing with kids killing kids in school.
 
Re: 5 dead, suspect in custody in classroom shooting at Oikos University in Californi

Enola said:
How about we all leave the politics out of it and focus on the situation at hand? Just askin'.
What would be a solution to this problem, because it IS a problem. This is not the Zimmerman case so let's try to not bring that one in. This is a school shooting...again.

It could be a post office. Or a business office. How do we stop this?
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unfortunately, we don't.

it's an engrained mentality in society... it's guaranteed infamy...it's a guaranteed media frenzy with ends with that persons 15minutes of fame..... gunning folks down when you have a problem with them is "gangsta", thus "cool"

the worst that happens ( in most states) is a guaranteed 3 hots and a cot for the rest of their life....
an effective deterrent is unacceptable to reasonable ,civil people ( we don't want to become that which we hate)

so yeah, we are pretty much stuck with these types of tragedies... but they'll die out in time, hopefully.
 
Re: 5 dead, suspect in custody in classroom shooting at Oikos University in Californi

On a tv show last night, I watched a program about bullying. The Phoebe Snow situation. She was bullied until she hung herself. But she also had some mental issues. However, the teachers and staff didn't seem concerned.

Perhaps any public place where this can happen by a disgruntled fruitcake that got hold of a gun is for all such places have machines one has to pass to enter such establishments. Which would cost a ton of money and most would complain about it.

Awareness doesn't seem to be working in the case of school staff. Teachers have so much already on their minds...adding shrink capabilities seems to be adding to the burden.
Does anyone know if the people killed today were children or teens or were they all adults?
 
Re: 5 dead, suspect in custody in classroom shooting at Oikos University in Californi

MaggieD said:
Ahhh, cooler heads prevail. Ha!

I think there should be a protocol for identifying these at-risk students, if that's possible. Sometimes it seems bullying is the trigger. Other times? Well, I don't know, actually. But maybe that's what we really desperately need to find out. I also don't think they're acting in a vacuum. There's warning signs...threats...promises. To their friends...on social network sites...etc. Maybe we all need to be enlightened as to what to watch out for -- and, when we perceive a problem, be taught what to do about it -- who to report it to...how it'll be handled, etc.
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A common thread flowing throughout many school shootings is months or years of noted mental disturbance, without anyone taking any action.

I do not know if that is the case for this particular shooting. But it was the case with most school shootings in the last decade, and several other shootings, including the Tucson shooting last winter. This has already come into the open at Congressional hearings and other outlets.

We don't need another Congressional hearing. We know what causes most of these shootings. We need to actually ADDRESS the problem that has already been identified over and over and over again. That requires feet on the ground, better reporting, and more accessible mental health resources. Congress can't do that by itself. It certainly can't do that by holding more hearings.

How many times do we need to re-state the problem before anyone does anything about it?
 
Re: 5 dead, suspect in custody in classroom shooting at Oikos University in Californi

MaggieD said:
I'm not sure nothing can be done, though I understand anyone who thinks it's a tough problem. If you read my post above yours, you'll see that I think most of these people send out signals of one sort or another. I mean, let's face it, these people have a problem. One that could be addressed, at an early-enough stage, by counseling perhaps.
We're doing that with bullying now. And with domestic violence. "Here's what to watch out for" kinds of things. Seems like if we put school violence front and center, we could do the same thing with kids killing kids in school.
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I agree with you but also acknowledge that a lot of schools already have (and have had, for a long time) programs to aid students in violence-prevention and emotional-social skills development. This will help several students learn to cope whom otherwise couldn't but it's not going to prevent violent acts towards others in school 100% of the time. Anti-bullying programs are fantastic and teach kids a lot more about bullying and being bullied than I learned when I was young. There are still bullies in school and probably always will be. How long has domestic violence prevention been an issue at the forefront of American society? Decades, it seems. How many organizations and programs are there dedicated to preventing it and helping those who have suffered? Countless. Does it still happen? Yes. There's a lot that can be done but nothing that will cause the problem to go extinct.

If anything, I think the focus on social-emotional skills development is probably what should be stressed the most, especially in the younger levels.
 
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Re: 5 dead, suspect in custody in classroom shooting at Oikos University in Californi

This has a feel like the Virginia Tech shootings... mentally unstable student with a history of mental disorders who was able to legally purchase a weapon in a state where folks with mental disorders were not supposed to be able to legally buy weapons.

So, how do we put folks with mental disorders on a "do not sell gun" list without violating constitutional and privacy concerns? Would it even be possible?
 
Re: 5 dead, suspect in custody in classroom shooting at Oikos University in Californi

DiAnna said:
I'm going to ignore the thread hijack currently in progress since this is not about politics, Trayvon Martin or America's gun laws.

What we have here is another tragic incident of a confirmed ex-student in a Christian/Korean school specializing in, among other things, Asian medicine going postal on faculty and fellow classmates. A variant of workplace pay-back where fired employee comes back armed to the teeth and seeking revenge. It's absolutely tragic. Seven people are dead. I, for one, want to know why.

I'm waiting for more information on the shooter which will hopefully include what his motives and mental state might be. I'm hoping no more of his victims die.
Click to expand...

Stress/anxiety may have been a factor. Has anyone ever seen any statistics on the psychological effects of studying and having careers in medicine? I read some long ago and they weren't so good.
 
Re: 5 dead, suspect in custody in classroom shooting at Oikos University in Californi

Not only is it shootings..it is now happening on airplanes. That stewardess..and then the captain. I read somewhere that there is fuel leakage in some of the planes that are not fixed...hence breathing in the fumes (captains cabin is small), hence going bonkers. No guns. Just a big assed plane that can kill by someone either mentally unstable...or poisoned by fumes.
 
Re: 5 dead, suspect in custody in classroom shooting at Oikos University in Californi

DiAnna said:
This has a feel like the Virginia Tech shootings... mentally unstable student with a history of mental disorders who was able to legally purchase a weapon in a state where folks with mental disorders were not supposed to be able to legally buy weapons.

So, how do we put folks with mental disorders on a "do not sell gun" list without violating constitutional and privacy concerns? Would it even be possible?
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I'm all for guns rights, save for letting people with mental disorders own them.

Who knows when some person who hasn't been taking its meds decides to take his/her gun to work and take care of the Death Eaters.
 
Re: 5 dead, suspect in custody in classroom shooting at Oikos University in Californi

GoTim1985 said:
Stress/anxiety may have been a factor. Has anyone ever seen any statistics on the psychological effects of studying and having careers in medicine? I read some long ago and they weren't so good.
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I don't really think studying acupuncture and Asian herbal remedies qualifies as a stressful career in medicine. ;)
 
Re: 5 dead, suspect in custody in classroom shooting at Oikos University in Californi

Having been a Tacti-cool Instructor might I suggest you plan on a double tap to the chest at the very least before concluding you could end it with your 'gun'.

This is my weapon, this is my gun. This is for killing, this is for fun.

We practice two to the chest, one to the head. First two get his attention, last makes sure he is dead.

Anywho, every mass public shooting brings out the same call for something to be done. Arm more people, evaluate better, take everyone's firearm, open carry, better violence reporting and active gun seizure from those deemed predisposed to violence....

I don't think it is possible in a liberal democracy to end all mass shootings. I do however think information is missed or not passed on properly. You can't reduce it to a rigid formula nor can humans always catch that one sign that in hindsight was a huge red flag.

The Right to Keep and Bear is predicated on rational cool heads holding those Arms. Just how do you ensure only the rational level headed citizens keep the 2nd A safe?
 
Re: 5 dead, suspect in custody in classroom shooting at Oikos University in Californi

DiAnna said:
This has a feel like the Virginia Tech shootings... mentally unstable student with a history of mental disorders who was able to legally purchase a weapon in a state where folks with mental disorders were not supposed to be able to legally buy weapons.

So, how do we put folks with mental disorders on a "do not sell gun" list without violating constitutional and privacy concerns? Would it even be possible?
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I don't think it'd be possible but, even if it could happen, someone would still leak through the cracks. My uncle has been a sheriff for years and has told me for some time that we could make any number of laws to stop or help prevent crime but, if someone is hell bent on doing it, they will figure out how to get around the system.

The system can only take you so far when it comes to stuff like this and I think a lot has been done in the way of education that has probably helped to prevent crimes before they were even thought of, let alone carried out. In the end, I think the best way to help lower school violence is to admit that it will probably never be 100% preventable, continue open discussion inside schools so students have a voice and education on the topic, and give students the tools and resources they need that will help them learn how to cope with ALL of their troubles including those that may lead one to commit an act of violence like this.
 
Re: 5 dead, suspect in custody in classroom shooting at Oikos University in Californi

DiAnna said:
I don't really think studying acupuncture and Asian herbal remedies qualifies as a stressful career in medicine. ;)
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Ha, so that's what "Asian medicine" means...LOL. Clearly, I'm not too scientific!
 
Re: 5 dead, suspect in custody in classroom shooting at Oikos University in Californi

GoTim1985 said:
Ha, so that's what "Asian medicine" means...LOL. Clearly, I'm not too scientific!
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That's basically what was listed on the university site, but it could be an oversimplification. :lol:
 
Re: 5 dead, suspect in custody in classroom shooting at Oikos University in Californi

Enola said:
Not only is it shootings..it is now happening on airplanes. That stewardess..and then the captain. I read somewhere that there is fuel leakage in some of the planes that are not fixed...hence breathing in the fumes (captains cabin is small), hence going bonkers. No guns. Just a big assed plane that can kill by someone either mentally unstable...or poisoned by fumes.
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add some Americans use/demand for drugs (concaine, herion, etc). Some may have fried their brains for the all mighty high.
 
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