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73 arrested at Occupy protest

Is that your take?
No my take is that OWS is a Leftist movement that wants us to hate the bourgeoisie so that we will do their dirty work for them. And that those 73 arrested wanted to be arrested, so that they can claim police brutality to use in their propaganda to recruit more people. They are under the illusion that they can slowly turn America Leftist.

the hydra-headed Tea party movement has many different ideas on what they want. Much like the occupy movement. In fact you could say publicly both movements are leaderless. Neither have an definitive leader. There are leaders but with such different opinions floating around it would be impossible for either movement to get behind one leader on each side. Both movements are ground work operations to spread their propaganda. Both strategics are looking to the future and what can be done after the education process as trained enough idiots to have a voting base.

Many on the Right are using religion to gain power. Hence the insistence that only true Americans are Christians. ANd at the same time even though OWS is mostly Leftists (except those few Liberals that have no clue what they are supporting) the Right is lumping all Democrats in with the occupy movement even though it is obvious that the occupiers/Leftists hate Liberals. But reality does not matter as long as the message gets out that Liberals are all Leftists. Which in turn is just like the Liberals that portray all Republicans as Tea party supporters. Along with Making it appear that all Republicans are racists Etc i.e. Nazis.

News flash the problem with the country today is the Republicans, Democrats, Leftist radicals and Rightist radicals.

ANd here is what is sad, the Republicans have failed to muster anyone for the presidential race. Unfortunately come November Obama a president that is one of the worst in history will be reelected because the Republicans could only find radicals to run against him. Hell there are still idiots running around crying that Obama is not an American. Meanwhile Obamacare will run its course because the Republicans failed to do anything meaningful in 4 years. Meanwhile the Tea party are running around saying crazy **** like we are an Christian nation and denying the Separation of church and state. ANd when you call them on the obvious (as if no one knows their intent) they claim that they do not want an theocracy. Which in turn is just is just like the Occupiers running around saying that they only want to stop the bourgeoisie (1%) to stop using the so called Proletariat (99%) as slaves. While obviously since its all over the OWS sites and their signs that they aim for an take over.


So no that is not my take
 
So...what exactly are you 'fighting back' against? You pretty steamed at those multimillionaires in the democrat party...musicians...athletes...all those folks? Say you want a 'revolution'? Who has 'oppressed' you? Which rich man has stole your nickels and dimes? Which 'man' is keeping you down?

Really, who fights anything these days? Someone gets pissed at something and instead of protesting, they write a blog. Take that! LOL!

I like rich people. Hell, I'm working my ass off trying to get rich myself. My problem is the system that is in place is tilted towards the already rich and the snowball effect of the rich getting richer allows some who work no harder than others to take too much water from the well. I wish we could nip the system that allowed 34% of my retirement to get sucked away while the same system rewarded the baffoons who were behind it million dollar bonuses.

But I know you guys think that's awesome. I just disagree. But I don't have time to protest and fight. I have to go to work.
 
No my take is that OWS is a Leftist movement that wants us to hate the bourgeoisie so that we will do their dirty work for them. And that those 73 arrested wanted to be arrested, so that they can claim police brutality to use in their propaganda to recruit more people. They are under the illusion that they can slowly turn America Leftist.

They have already turned America strongly to the left over the last generation and it became inevitable when the left took over the universities and the media.. I agree with you that this protest is just a front.
the hydra-headed Tea party movement has many different ideas on what they want. Much like the occupy movement. In fact you could say publicly both movements are leaderless. Neither have an definitive leader. There are leaders but with such different opinions floating around it would be impossible for either movement to get behind one leader on each side. Both movements are ground work operations to spread their propaganda. Both strategics are looking to the future and what can be done after the education process as trained enough idiots to have a voting base.

The Tea Party ambitions are more straightforward. They believe in the values of traditional America while the OWS appear to have little idea what traditional America even is.

Many on the Right are using religion to gain power. Hence the insistence that only true Americans are Christians.

I think that's really overstating the case. There are many in the middle who just want responsible government.

News flash the problem with the country today is the Republicans, Democrats, Leftist radicals and Rightist radicals.
ANd here is what is sad, the Republicans have failed to muster anyone for the presidential race. Unfortunately come November Obama a president that is one of the worst in history will be reelected because the Republicans could only find radicals to run against him. Hell there are still idiots running around crying that Obama is not an American. Meanwhile Obamacare will run its course because the Republicans failed to do anything meaningful in 4 years. Meanwhile the Tea party are running around saying crazy **** like we are an Christian nation and denying the Separation of church and state. ANd when you call them on the obvious (as if no one knows their intent) they claim that they do not want an theocracy. Which in turn is just is just like the Occupiers running around saying that they only want to stop the bourgeoisie (1%) to stop using the so called Proletariat (99%) as slaves. While obviously since its all over the OWS sites and their signs that they aim for an take over. So no that is not my take

The middle, as usual, will decide the presidency but with the erosion of state rights, the enmeshed bureaucracy, the debt and the impossible entitlement programs, I doubt it will now make much difference. There will be a clashes, they will start in earnest this summer, and they will continue for a number of years. I'm not sure the republic can be saved.
 
Really, who fights anything these days? Someone gets pissed at something and instead of protesting, they write a blog. Take that! LOL!

I like rich people. Hell, I'm working my ass off trying to get rich myself. My problem is the system that is in place is tilted towards the already rich and the snowball effect of the rich getting richer allows some who work no harder than others to take too much water from the well. I wish we could nip the system that allowed 34% of my retirement to get sucked away while the same system rewarded the baffoons who were behind it million dollar bonuses.

But I know you guys think that's awesome. I just disagree. But I don't have time to protest and fight. I have to go to work.

The rich aren't doing anything wrong, it's the government,. It always has been.

People don't trust politicians or the bureaucracy but they are still willing to bet their health and their futures on government and, the real pity is, they insist others do so as well.

This is insane and eventually everyone will suffer. The rich will only watch from a respectable distance.
 
The rich aren't doing anything wrong, it's the government,. It always has been.

People don't trust politicians or the bureaucracy but they are still willing to bet their health and their futures on government and, the real pity is, they insist others do so as well.

This is insane and eventually everyone will suffer. The rich will only watch from a respectable distance.

Yeah, the government is the one who has failed to properly regulate corporate greed. You're right.

I don't blame them for sticking it up our collective asses when they can not only technically get away with it legally, but be rewarded and even praised for doing it by a significant portion of the voting public.

I support ambition. I also think that the degree an individual desires to nurture their own greed should be up to the individual as long as they follow the rules. But I do not think that greed should be public policy. I think any roadblocks to unscrupulous greed are good roadblocks.

There is only so much pie. And the rich just keep taking more and more. That's called 'wealth distrubition." But some folks only think that's cool when the rich do it. I never quite understood that line of thinking.
 
Yeah, the government is the one who has failed to properly regulate corporate greed. You're right.

Greed cannot be regulated. That cliche should be dropped.

I don't blame them for sticking it up our collective asses when they can not only technically get away with it legally, but be rewarded and even praised for doing it by a significant portion of the voting public.

I have no idea who is sticking it up any ass nor who is praising or being praised for this action.
There is only so much pie.

That's not so, and the rest of your post is illogical because of that basic error.
 
Greed cannot be regulated. That cliche should be dropped.



I have no idea who is sticking it up any ass nor who is praising or being praised for this action.


That's not so, and the rest of your post is illogical because of that basic error.

I'm trying to work with you here Grant. I don't know how I could have made my opinions any more understandable.

Further, after reading several of your posts, I see no intellectual highground you possess to be judging anyones logic.

Just sayin.....
 
They have already turned America strongly to the left over the last generation and it became inevitable when the left took over the universities and the media.. I agree with you that this protest is just a front.


The Tea Party ambitions are more straightforward. They believe in the values of traditional America while the OWS appear to have little idea what traditional America even is.



I think that's really overstating the case. There are many in the middle who just want responsible government.



The middle, as usual, will decide the presidency but with the erosion of state rights, the enmeshed bureaucracy, the debt and the impossible entitlement programs, I doubt it will now make much difference. There will be a clashes, they will start in earnest this summer, and they will continue for a number of years. I'm not sure the republic can be saved.
Yu are actually making my point for me. Many of the Occupiers view there movement the same that you just described the Tea Party movement. In fact I have been told the exact same thing before by occupiers. Including the dire prediction at the end.

Unlike the Teaparty and the Ocuppiers I actually believe in the power of our Constitution to govern this country despite them and their movements. Not saying that it wont take work but I am not going to just throw my hands up in pessimism. Movements like the Tea party and the occupy movement only create conflict in an inorganic march to do doomsday. Which in the end is what both radical groups want. They believe that their version of America will grow up out of the ashes. But just like in every election they underestimate American patriotism and the fact that it defies party lines.
 
I'm trying to work with you here Grant. I don't know how I could have made my opinions any more understandable.

Further, after reading several of your posts, I see no intellectual highground you possess to be judging anyones logic.

Just sayin.....

I understand you have strong opinions but feel you' appear to be just letting your rage out rather than getting into specifics about what people can actually do to change things, something that could unite people into a common cause.

We can see people protesting from every direction but it all seems incoherent, just a strong and general dissatisfaction.

What do you think can be done to turn things around? What are the top three issues in your mind?
 
Yu are actually making my point for me.

Well I agree with many of your points.

Unlike the Teaparty and the Ocuppiers I actually believe in the power of our Constitution to govern this country

It's a great constitution and feel other countries should have adopted it as their own. It should be a source of inspiration everywhere. But it is always at the risk of being undermined and that seems to have been happening for a while now by Presidents and judges who feel they know better, or who follow the fashions of the day,
Not saying that it wont take work but I am not going to just throw my hands up in pessimism.

Movements like the Tea party and the occupy movement only create conflict in an inorganic march to do doomsday. Which in the end is what both radical groups want. They believe that their version of America will grow up out of the ashes. But just like in every election they underestimate American patriotism and the fact that it defies party lines.


I sincerely hope there are more Americans like you who share that attitude.
 
I understand you have strong opinions but feel you' appear to be just letting your rage out rather than getting into specifics about what people can actually do to change things, something that could unite people into a common cause.

We can see people protesting from every direction but it all seems incoherent, just a strong and general dissatisfaction.

What do you think can be done to turn things around? What are the top three issues in your mind?

Rage? Dude, I just got a brand new mercury outboard today. I'm happier than a pig wallowing is ****!

Honestly, not being the smartest fella on two legs, I don't have a clue as to what would actually turn this thing around. Way above my paygrade. I just know we can't depend on the GOP for any assistance as their voting base, by all appearances, prefers things to be business as usual and let the little man eat ****. I can't look towards the democrats for any solutions as they are so crooked they have to screw their shoes on each morning. But they (the dems) do seem to be more on the side of the common laborer/citizen than the GOP so I view them to be the lesser of the 2 evils. How much less? I truly can't say. But not much.

I probably wouldn't care as much if I hit the lottery or inherited a lot of old money. Money makes money. That's okay. But that should mean for everybody. While my money was being siphoned, the rich just got richer. Now I have less money to make money with. I worked very hard for that money too. Whatever made that possible, I want changed.

I just wish we could turn back the clock to the time when a man could go to work for 30 years, feed his family, retire next to a good fishin' hole. But there are forces at work that are making that American dream harder and harder to achieve. And a lot of those folks can be seen wearing flag lapel pins manipulating the dumbed down masses with issues like homosexuals, birth control and anything else that will divert our attention away from their special interest cronies who have their hands in my pockets.

I am not a radical. I am not a raging lunatic. I am not illogical. I just want what's mine to stay mine. And I will vote for a republican or a democrat that I think is looking out for my interests.
 
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protesters shouted and officers took out their batons after a demonstrator threw a glass bottle at the bus that police were using to detain protesters.
 
Rage? Dude, I just got a brand new mercury outboard today. I'm happier than a pig wallowing is ****!

That's good for you and the economy.
I just know we can't depend on the GOP for any assistance as their voting base, by all appearances, prefers things to be business as usual and let the little man eat ****. I can't look towards the democrats for any solutions as they are so crooked they have to screw their shoes on each morning.

Why has it come to the point where assistance is needed from any political party? Didn't friends and neighbors help each other out at one time? And now, what makes the situation worse, is that big corporations are being bailed out by the feds and the feds claim that they are helping the "little man". And people believe it! Too many undeserving people not only want this "assistance" but are getting it. It's become a can't fail society, which means that eventually everyone will fail together.

At one time corporations failed, as they should have, and people moved on to the more successful companies which took their place. Now, under crony capitalism, the feds will not only bail out these corporations they will give millions of dollars of taxpayer dollars, more assistance, to support untried companies, companies inextricably linked to political parties. And enough people buy into this craziness, to this lofty pie-in-the-sky rhetoric which precedes these billions being wasted, to keep them in power. And you wonder why you can never get ahead?

We can see that now in the "green industry" with many millions of dollars being siphoned off to political friends, but a majority of people seem to support this or they wouldn't be voting them in. These thieves who want to "save the planet" cannot even balance a budget, or even care to, and yet people still fall for it.

I probably wouldn't care as much if I hit the lottery or inherited a lot of old money. Money makes money. That's okay. But that should mean for everybody. While my money was being siphoned, the rich just got richer. Now I have less money to make money with. I worked very hard for that money too. Whatever made that possible, I want changed.

Government just got too big. Politicians convinced people that they could manage their lives for them, and now they do. But it's a service you're paying for, financially as well as psychologically. And Americans who want to change the system, who want less government, will be called "right wing extremists" or that the don't care about "the people". They will turn on each other, as we can see unfolding in front of us. This has all happened before.

It i said that people deserve the government they get. That may not always be true but in what was once a free democracy that would seem to be the case.

I just wish we could turn back the clock to the time when a man could go to work for 30 years, feed his family, retire next to a good fishin' hole. But there are forces at work that are making that American dream harder and harder to achieve.

It's big government, You work for them now and at the end of the day you'll have nothing to show for it. They're spending it twice as fast as they can take it in. Do you really believe they can help you?

The difference is that people in the western democracies are working ever longer to pay their taxes. At one time working one month per year was sufficient, and a man could support a wife and family, now you need to work several months to give the government what they want. And they will always want more in order to promise more services, more 'rights', so they can get elected and the bureaucrats and the unions can have job security, a benefit unavailable to "the little man".

The government is giving you services you often neither want or can afford but you're pretty much stuck with them and will pay for them anyway. If you can't pay them they'll just borrow the money from somewhere else and your children will pay them. They don't care.

And a lot of those folks can be seen wearing flag lapel pins manipulating the dumbed down masses with issues like homosexuals, birth control and anything else that will divert our attention away from their special interest cronies who have their hands in my pockets.

Or by a saying rude words on the airwaves . It's a circus.
I am not a radical. I am not a raging lunatic. I am not illogical. I just want what's mine to stay mine. And I will vote for a republican or a democrat that I think is looking out for my interests.

Then you might want a closer look at Paul Ryan's budget proposals. He'll take a lot of heat for sure but at least someone is trying to do something.

You seem to be doing all right looking after your own interests and that of your family but that is despite the government, not because of it. The government is far too involved in special interests to be effective anymore. While you want the government to look after your interests ultimately we know that politicians, especially those who are further away in Washington, will only look after their own. You'll get a little of the pork thrown your way occasionally but thats about it.
 
They were breaking the law.



That's what civil disobedience means. Did you ever read about the Boston Tea Party, or the Civil Rights Movement, or the Vietnam war protests?
 
That's what civil disobedience means. Did you ever read about the Boston Tea Party, or the Civil Rights Movement, or the Vietnam war protests?

The Civil Rights movement was intended to be non violent, much like the Tea party in fact, just as its leader, Martin Luther King Jr., repeatedly said. His message and objectives were clear.

It s completely unfair to the history of the Civil Rights movement to associate them at all with the OWS crowd, whose message, however inarticulate, has already been repeatedly made.
 
The Civil Rights movement was intended to be non violent, much like the Tea party in fact, just as its leader, Martin Luther King Jr., repeatedly said. His message and objectives were clear.

Yep, just like the Occupy movement across the country, and it was inspiring to see the Civil Rights Veterans express solidarity with the Occupy Movement:


Council of Elders - Occupy Wall Street - Statement of Solidarity

"As veterans of the Civil Rights, Women’s, Peace, Environmental, LGBTQ, Immigrant Justice, labor rights and other movements of the last 60 years we are convinced that Occupy Wall Street is a continuation, a deepening and expansion of the determination of the diverse peoples of our nation to transform our country into a more democratic, just and compassionate society—a more perfect union. We believe that the rapidly expanding and racialized impoverishment of our population, the rise of mass incarceration, the celebration of the culture of war and violence all create the bitter divisions among the peoples of our nation and throughout the world. Indeed, we believe such developments among us ultimately diminish the quality of life for all humanity, beginning with our own children who watch as we lower the priority for their care and education.

We applaud the miraculous extent to which the Occupy initiative has been non-violent and democratic, especially in light of the weight of violence under which the great majority of people are forced to live, including joblessness, foreclosures, unemployment, poverty, inadequate health care, etc. Among the Council of Elders, we place the highest value on the role of compassion and non-violent action in our personal and organizational lives. From that hard-won grounding in the humanizing movements of the 20th century we seek to support and join with Occupy Wall Street in contributing to the dreams and visions of many in this nation for a beloved community, a multi-generational, multi-racial, compassionate, democratic society with equality, liberty and justice for all—always searching for partners in the creation of a more peaceful, sustainable world, a world with living, loving and growing space for all of our children."

National Council of Elders
 
Yep, just like the Occupy movement across the country, and it was inspiring to see the Civil Rights Veterans express solidarity with the Occupy Movement:


Council of Elders - Occupy Wall Street - Statement of Solidarity

"As veterans of the Civil Rights, Women’s, Peace, Environmental, LGBTQ, Immigrant Justice, labor rights and other movements of the last 60 years we are convinced that Occupy Wall Street is a continuation, a deepening and expansion of the determination of the diverse peoples of our nation to transform our country into a more democratic, just and compassionate society—a more perfect union. We believe that the rapidly expanding and racialized impoverishment of our population, the rise of mass incarceration, the celebration of the culture of war and violence all create the bitter divisions among the peoples of our nation and throughout the world. Indeed, we believe such developments among us ultimately diminish the quality of life for all humanity, beginning with our own children who watch as we lower the priority for their care and education.

We applaud the miraculous extent to which the Occupy initiative has been non-violent and democratic, especially in light of the weight of violence under which the great majority of people are forced to live, including joblessness, foreclosures, unemployment, poverty, inadequate health care, etc. Among the Council of Elders, we place the highest value on the role of compassion and non-violent action in our personal and organizational lives. From that hard-won grounding in the humanizing movements of the 20th century we seek to support and join with Occupy Wall Street in contributing to the dreams and visions of many in this nation for a beloved community, a multi-generational, multi-racial, compassionate, democratic society with equality, liberty and justice for all—always searching for partners in the creation of a more peaceful, sustainable world, a world with living, loving and growing space for all of our children."

National Council of Elders

Is there a "movement" this group hasn't been a part of?

MLK was the leader of the Civil Rights Movement while these people have been, like they admit, part of every movement to come down the pike over the last 60 years . Here it is.

We are veterans of the Civil Rights, Women’s, Peace, Environmental, LGBTQ, Immigrant Justice, labor rights and other movements of the last 60 years.

They are a part of the Noam Chomsky crowd,
 
That's what civil disobedience means. Did you ever read about the Boston Tea Party, or the Civil Rights Movement, or the Vietnam war protests?

Yeah I have and I remember the people in the civil tights movement as being very peaceful and the local population as the problem and as for the Vietnam Protestors led by Kerry snd Fonda I remember leaving the base after a 10 month deployment and the scumbag protestors spitting at us and calling us names. There favorite statement was something to the effect was and I paraphrase: How many babies did you kill today? Maybe you were there............
 
Yep, just like the Occupy movement across the country, and it was inspiring to see the Civil Rights Veterans express solidarity with the Occupy Movement:


Council of Elders - Occupy Wall Street - Statement of Solidarity

The Council of Elders, a newly organized, independent group of leaders from many of the defining American social justice movements of the 20th century....


National Council of Elders

Just for your edification, and education....

The term "social justice" is now commonly used by leftist activists, clergy, educators, judges, and politicians to describe the goal they seek to achieve with many of their policies. No precise definition of "social justice" is ever offered by the left. Instead, the term is always used in a vague way -- as if everyone already knows, or should know, what the seemingly well-intentioned phrase "social justice" means.

So, what exactly is "social justice"?

Social justice is the complete economic equality of all members of society. While this may sound like a lofty objective, what it really means is that wealth should be collected by the government and evenly distributed to everyone. In short, social justice is communism. It is rooted in the Marxist idea that the money people make and the property they own do not rightfully belong to the people who make the money and own the property.

Karl Marx's ultimate criticism of capitalism is its recognition of private property. The reason private property is so evil, Marx contended, is that it is a function of economic class warfare. In other words, "the rich" use the concept of private property to oppress "the poor." In order to understand this convoluted thought process, Marx's view of money must be examined, since money is the means by which private property is acquired.

According to Marx, money is really a "collective product" that belongs to everyone. His reasoning, as described in The Communist Manifesto, is that money can be made only "by the united action of all members of society." Factory owners, for example, cannot manufacture goods by themselves. Rather, the factory owners need workers to run the machines that produce goods. Consequently, in Marx's mind, when the manufactured good is sold, the worker has as much right to the proceeds of that sale as the factory owner does.

Archived-Articles: What Exactly Is 'Social Justice'?

j-mac
 
Just for your edification, and education....



j-mac


We know what the far right thinks about the Occupy movement, but thanks for the Marxist mongering just the same.


i put more stock in the support by the Civil Rights groups and Veterans.

Religious leaders, Occupy Chicago celebrate King

"Rally speakers emphasize similarities between civil rights leader's message then and protest movement today
January 15, 2012|By Ryan Haggerty, Chicago Tribune reporter
Religious and civil rights leaders joined forces Sunday with the Occupy Chicago movement, urging those fighting for economic and political equality to remember the passion and purpose with which the Rev.Martin Luther King Jr. helped change the country.

King's message and "solutions for a community and a nation in crisis are as relevant today as when he uttered them some 40-plus years ago," said the Rev. Dwight Gardner, the keynote speaker Sunday afternoon at a rally and public meeting at The Peoples Church of Chicago in the Uptown neighborhood."

Civil rights leaders, Occupy Chicago join forces on eve of Martin Luther King Jr. Day - Chicago Tribune


U.S. Vets, Suffering From Unemployment and Homelessness, Support Occupy Protests

"Chapters of Iraq Veterans Against the War have engaged in Occupy movements across the nation as representatives of the organization. They say they are part of the 99 percent and share the sentiments of the movement.

"There's a lot of solidarity with the Occupy movement," said Matt Howard, who was a Marine from 2001 to 2006 and served two tours in Iraq. "A lot of the same issues that the veteran population is contending with is linked with the Occupy protests in terms of economic equality and a disappearing middle class."

Howard, who has marched with the protesters in San Francisco, says he links the issues the demonstrators are protesting to the heavy costs of the wars in Iraq and Afghanistan and the cost of repairing the mental and physical wounds of vets through the Department of Veteran Affairs.

"The 1 percent have profited during times of war," Hughes said. "If you're profiting during a time of war, what does that make you? Everyone else is losing, everyone else is struggling financially, service members and vets are just one part of that struggle for survival while the one percent is profiting. We call those war profiteers and I don't know when in our country that's been OK. That's one reason while Scott was out there."

U.S. Vets, Suffering From Unemployment and Homelessness, Support Occupy Protests - ABC News
 
lol Thats ok since it is also equated that "everyone on the right are Nazis."

Actually, in here it seems that the left are being on the defensive by regular delusional accusations that NAZIism is on the left along with communism simply because "socialism" is in the name of the Nationalist Socialist Party. And once it's in your name then it is a stone cold fact. Like Patriot Act. Must be very patriotic and the Democratic Republic of Korea meaning they are really a democratic republic and all.
 
Actually, in here it seems that the left are being on the defensive by regular delusional accusations that NAZIism is on the left along with communism simply because "socialism" is in the name of the Nationalist Socialist Party. And once it's in your name then it is a stone cold fact. Like Patriot Act. Must be very patriotic and the Democratic Republic of Korea meaning they are really a democratic republic and all.
I get what you are saying, but none the less many people on the Left equate the Right with Nazism as well. I would imagine it is because of that assumed relationship between the Right and Nazism that the Right is pointing out the word Socialist in Nazism. Of course the Left does not equate Communism anymore than the Right equates fascism. Which the Left started the fascism accusation because of the Communist accusations. Tit for tat. But thats how it goes when people slander each other. Both side are trying to assert that the other leads to worse things. Not necessarily that they are that bad now. Just that they have the potential to be bad. So the accusations go back and forth no matter what the reality is.
 
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