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Racist? Texas high school apologizes for fans' 'USA!' chant after basketball game

Any treatment of "race" as if it were real is racism, so YES, anyone expressing pride in their "race" is most definitely participating in racism.

Identifying the PERSON (as opposed to the action) as being a racist is quite another matter. I unclog my toilet from time to time, but I'm never mistaken for a plumber. To me, for someone to BE a racist is distinct from participating in racism. The vast overwhelming majority of people in the U.S. participate in racism. Only a select few within that pool, however, can be said to BE racists -- meaning people who go out of their way to treat "race" as if it were real in their social or professional role (and typically call for doing something about it). A random adult in damn near any city likely participates in racism. You have to look fairly hard, however, to find someone who IS a racist (that's their identity).

For me, such rare examples would include:

  • David Duke
  • Charles Murray
  • Louis Farrakhan
  • Julius Malema
  • Jared Taylor

etc.

Most participants in racism are complicit in -- rather than ideologically committed to -- racism. In other words, they go along with participating in racism because they have little to no means of easily accessing a nonracist alternative.

Moving on to the completely different issue of nationality, that requires a case-by-case analysis. Nationality is not the same thing as "race," nor even (as so frequently and falsely imagined) the same thing as one's country (which gets confusing, because there are some cases where it is officially treated as the same thing). Sometimes two or more of these coincide, sometimes they are different.

So is expression of "racial" pride automatically a racist sentiment/action? HELL yes. Is expression of nationalist pride automatically racist? No; we'd need more context.

If I am understanding you correctly, you are not differentiating between whites, blacks, or any other race, or american, indian, british or any other nationality. If you are considering anyone who has pride in their race a racist then I can respect that. My problem is really with people who act like black pride/brown pride ect are ok but white pride is wrong. Or people who fight and argue that people of other cultures have every right to display pride in their cultures and countries but the second an American displays it it is wrong. If the playing field is level then i have no problem. I am tired of seeing these dumb double standards.
 
First, go look up bigotry. Once you are familiar with the actual term and what it means, then try to make your argument jibe with what the word actually means. Second, your video contains no "timeline" or reference to any chronological order of events what so ever. You sure you are wide awake and not half asleep still?

If you've gone through this thread, I have posted and also used what others posted as definitions of Racism, Discrimination, Prejudice, and yes, Bigotry. If you want a definition, I suggest you read the thread.

You didn't address my earlier point. Why did the coach stop the chants if it was a regular thing that he heard?
 
If you've gone through this thread, I have posted and also used what others posted as definitions of Racism, Discrimination, Prejudice, and yes, Bigotry. If you want a definition, I suggest you read the thread.

You didn't address my earlier point. Why did the coach stop the chants if it was a regular thing that he heard?
I not only did address what I thought one reason the coach stopped the chant for might be, I linked it to your timeline comments made earlier. Before I understood you did not know what the words timeline or chronological really meant or that you could not provide any kind of source for. Maybe you should go through the thread again. Maybe twice so it sticks with you.

That whole "I used what others posted as definitions of Racism, Discrimination, Prejudice, and yes, Bigotry" dodge is particularly stupid when conjoined with your suggestion I read the thread. Because not one poster has supplied a definition for a single one of those words anywhere in the thread. So basically we are back to the fact that you don't have a clue what Bigotry is and you can't make your argument that chanting "USA" is bigotry make a lick of sense. Which was obvious the second you started using the word Bigotry. Yes, read the thread read a dictionary, understand what the words you are using actually mean before you start, ya know, using them?
 
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I not only did address what I thought one reason the coach stopped the chant for might be, I linked it to your timeline comments made earlier.

And I said you were incorrect. Watch it again:
High School Chant of 'USA! USA! USA!' Deemed Racist - War On Patriotism - Fox Nation

Where in the report said that the Coach reacted to "Alamo Whites"? It doesn't. School officials even go on record to say that the coach stopped the USA chant, and was commended for it.

If it was in fact a regular chant, the coach would not have acted the way he did, because he would have been to every game they played this year. It would have been another regular game for him. But that was not how it went down.

Are you going to keep saying that this was a regular chant? If so, I'd like to hear you support that claim.

That whole "I used what others posted as definitions of Racism, Discrimination, Prejudice, and yes, Bigotry" dodge is particularly stupid when conjoined with your suggestion I read the thread. Because not one poster has supplied a definition for a single one of those words anywhere in the thread. So basically we are back to the fact that you don't have a clue what Bigotry is and you can't make your argument that chanting "USA" is bigotry make a lick of sense. Which was obvious the second you started using the word Bigotry. Yes, read the thread read a dictionary, understand what the words you are using actually mean before you start, ya know, using them?

I apologize, it was in the spin off thread that was made where all the definitions were posted. I didn't feel like regurgitating the definition since it has been repeated ad nauseum.

a Bigot - big·ot noun \ˈbi-gət\
: a person who is obstinately or intolerantly devoted to his or her own opinions and prejudices; especially : one who regards or treats the members of a group (as a racial or ethnic group) with hatred and intolerance

Now, you tell me how I was using it wrong.
 
And I said you were incorrect. Watch it again:
High School Chant of 'USA! USA! USA!' Deemed Racist - War On Patriotism - Fox Nation

Where in the report said that the Coach reacted to "Alamo Whites"? It doesn't. School officials even go on record to say that the coach stopped the USA chant, and was commended for it.

If it was in fact a regular chant, the coach would not have acted the way he did, because he would have been to every game they played this year. It would have been another regular game for him. But that was not how it went down.

Are you going to keep saying that this was a regular chant? If so, I'd like to hear you support that claim.



I apologize, it was in the spin off thread that was made where all the definitions were posted. I didn't feel like regurgitating the definition since it has been repeated ad nauseum.

a Bigot - big·ot noun \ˈbi-gət\
: a person who is obstinately or intolerantly devoted to his or her own opinions and prejudices; especially : one who regards or treats the members of a group (as a racial or ethnic group) with hatred and intolerance

Now, you tell me how I was using it wrong.
You didn't feel like repeating all of the definitions that are not in the thread? I mean that would take zero seconds to accomplish since there are none for you to repeat. Based upon this brain dead kind of stuff, which you just keep repeating, well, good day.
 
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You didn't feel like repeating all of the definitions that are not in the thread? I mean that would take zero seconds to accomplish since there are none for you to repeat. Based upon this brain dead kind of stuff, which you just keep repeating, well, good day.

So you're just taking a cheap shot? Telling me I didn't use the word correctly and not explaining how it was incorrect?

Thanks, for playing...or not.

EDIT: And you STILL haven't addressed the USA chant being a regular thing or not.
 
So you're just taking a cheap shot? Telling me I didn't use the word correctly and not explaining how it was incorrect?

Thanks, for playing...or not.

EDIT: And you STILL haven't addressed the USA chant being a regular thing or not.
What I am saying is good day because you just keep demonstrating that you not only won't or can't keep up with the conversation, or make your argument fit the definition, but it is obvious this is because you just want to argue. For the sake of argument, so you keep asking me to represent info already addressed. I'm not interested in pointing out to you over and over again, information that has been appearing on the same page of the scroll that you are acting like it is not already in. Over and over. Like wise you keep stating simple as hell falsehoods, referring to events that have not occurred in the thread, while missing comments and posts that are in the thread. You can call it a cheap shot or whatever else you want, I really could care less. IMO you offer only an truly idiotic argument which all of the above make for one great sized idiotic argument.

Look. Over there, some wet paint. I think I'll go watch it dry rather than waste another second indulging you.
 
What I am saying is good day because you just keep demonstrating that you not only won't or can't keep up with the conversation, or make your argument fit the definition, but it is obvious this is because you just want to argue. For the sake of argument, so you keep asking me to represent info already addressed. I'm not interested in pointing out to you over and over again, information that has been appearing on the same page of the scroll that you are acting like it is not already in. Over and over. Like wise you keep stating simple as hell falsehoods, referring to events that have not occurred in the thread, while missing comments and posts that are in the thread. You can call it a cheap shot or whatever else you want, I really could care less. IMO you offer only an truly idiotic argument which all of the above make for one great sized idiotic argument.

Look. Over there, some wet paint. I think I'll go watch it dry rather than waste another second indulging you.

What you pointed out was INCORRECT, as I have already told you and sourced it to you. YOUR unwillingness to correct your argument is your failing, not mine.
 
Hmmm, I didn't know that the USA consisted of white people only.

The message/implication was obvious, the hispanic students are not real Americans. This kind of ignorance needs to be stamped out everywhere it springs up. It's totally country to who we are and what we stand for as a country.

I want to GOP candidate who goes on TV after something like this and scolds the kids saying, THIS MUST END NOW.

The majority of kids probably don't have a racist bone in their body, but they went along with the crowd chanting. Appeal to this kids to DO THE RIGHT THING next time.
 
I always enjoy how extreme conservatives have no understanding of context. They just paint things in black or white, without examining the situation.


Puhleeze. the only reason to use such inflammatory language like "extreme" is a pure troll of the thread, something I would think a smart guy like you would steer clear of....But then again judging from your past participation on these boards...maybe not....

:shrug:


j-mac
 
The message/implication was obvious, the hispanic students are not real Americans. This kind of ignorance needs to be stamped out everywhere it springs up. It's totally country to who we are and what we stand for as a country.

I want to GOP candidate who goes on TV after something like this and scolds the kids saying, THIS MUST END NOW.

The majority of kids probably don't have a racist bone in their body, but they went along with the crowd chanting. Appeal to this kids to DO THE RIGHT THING next time.


You are so right....'USA' is sooooooo much more insulting than 'Alamo whites'....


j-mac
 
You are so right....'USA' is sooooooo much more insulting than 'Alamo whites'....


j-mac

As already pointed out...

IF such a chant was ALSO done, then it's also an instance of racism. So what? That has no bearing on whether or not the "USA" chant was/is a case of racism.

Let's see -- using my advanced math skills to count things up here --

1+1 doesn't equal ZERO.

1+1 would equal TWO.

I must be getting old; I find myself longing for the Good Ol' Days when I remember arguments being based upon some kind of substantive difference of principle instead of dramatic basic failures at logic and math.
 
Puhleeze. the only reason to use such inflammatory language like "extreme" is a pure troll of the thread, something I would think a smart guy like you would steer clear of....But then again judging from your past participation on these boards...maybe not....

:shrug:


j-mac

I use extreme because it's accurate. I have yet to see an extreme conservative understand context. Extreme conservatives paint things in black or white... heck, it's what defines them. Extreme liberals, too.

Now, show us that you are not an extreme conservative, j-mac, and demonstrate the context of chanting "USA, USA" in this particular situation.
 
You are so right....'USA' is sooooooo much more insulting than 'Alamo whites'....


j-mac


Red herring. Whether it was done first or done at all is irrelevant. Tell us the context of chanting "USA, USA" in this situation.
 
U.S. News - Racist? Texas high school apologizes for fans' 'USA!' chant after basketball game



Hmmm, I didn't know that the USA consisted of white people only.

What really burns my blood is that you can not possibly imagine the stuff my daughter has heard playing basketball and running in track meets at predominantly black schools, but MSNBC wouldn't be the least bit interested in a story like that.

Double standards run amuck.

I am sorry, but your double standards comment does not make sense. Do these black students at those meets should USA USA to denigrate the white people at the meets? No, because african americans are still americans. So your analogy is totally off.

These students were cheering USA USA because their opponents were mostly Latinos. Latinos most likely are not seen as "real" americans by those shouting USA USA. If they had been shouting Alamo Heights, Alamo Heights nobody would have complained or looked at their behaviour as done with a racial undertone.

Normally US team supporters shout the chant USA, USA if they are playing foreign teams. Just like dutch fans shout Holland, Holland when they are at games of the Dutch team and shout the name of their team when they are playing other dutch teams or other club teams.

So I rather disagree with you, this chant was at least in part done a racist chant.
 
I use extreme because it's accurate. I have yet to see an extreme conservative understand context. Extreme conservatives paint things in black or white... heck, it's what defines them. Extreme liberals, too.

Now, show us that you are not an extreme conservative, j-mac, and demonstrate the context of chanting "USA, USA" in this particular situation.


Well, I won't presume to know what is in the heads, or hearts of teens in the heat of a victory like that, in a charged atmosphere. Look, It probably isn't out of bounds to say that some of the kids were chanting that as a taunt with racial overtone, but who are you to say? Who is anyone to say unless they know the kids? I do however take offense at the label you seem quick to place on me personally in your attack calling me 'extreme' based on nothing but my participation in these boards over the years. You don't know me pal, and don't presume to know anything about what I am like in person, on a daily basis. All you have here are debates, and at times heated rhetoric that lead you to make a judgement based on nothing of substance really. Now, that is a truly in today's world a foolish thing to do, and or act like, but I am not perfect, and in the past have probably done the same at some point. So I forgive you for your foolish snap judgement of me, and trust that you will in the future take a little more thought of your words and how you use them, considering the position you hold here at dp.

Regards.

j-mac
 
Well, I won't presume to know what is in the heads, or hearts of teens in the heat of a victory like that, in a charged atmosphere. Look, It probably isn't out of bounds to say that some of the kids were chanting that as a taunt with racial overtone, but who are you to say? Who is anyone to say unless they know the kids? I do however take offense at the label you seem quick to place on me personally in your attack calling me 'extreme' based on nothing but my participation in these boards over the years. You don't know me pal, and don't presume to know anything about what I am like in person, on a daily basis. All you have here are debates, and at times heated rhetoric that lead you to make a judgement based on nothing of substance really. Now, that is a truly in today's world a foolish thing to do, and or act like, but I am not perfect, and in the past have probably done the same at some point. So I forgive you for your foolish snap judgement of me, and trust that you will in the future take a little more thought of your words and how you use them, considering the position you hold here at dp.

Regards.

j-mac

In bold. That's all you needed to say to demonstrate that you DO get the context of things... instead of making your ridiculous partisan hack comments towards progressives and liberals... something you do a lot... like here:

No, it isn't clear, and it is an unproven accusation that wouldn't hold up in ANY court room in the land. But I do love how Progressives/far leftists can now determine intent of thought through the mere reading of a slanted news story.


j-mac

You do it, you'll get it in return. Don't like that? Don't do it.
 
In bold. That's all you needed to say to demonstrate that you DO get the context of things... instead of making your ridiculous partisan hack comments towards progressives and liberals... something you do a lot... like here...


You didn't read far enough....I also said before, and after that....

Well, I won't presume to know what is in the heads, or hearts of teens in the heat of a victory like that, in a charged atmosphere. Look, It probably isn't out of bounds to say that some of the kids were chanting that as a taunt with racial overtone, but who are you to say? Who is anyone to say unless they know the kids?

See that, the bolded parts I added in from MY quote are what is called CONTEXT. How dare you attempt to lecture me on context, while pulling me OUT of context....You really are something dude....Get a clue would you.


You do it, you'll get it in return. Don't like that? Don't do it.


You really are full of yourself aren't you....? Pathetic.


j-mac
 
For the upteenth time:

Speculations which smear or defend the alleged intent of the specific chanters are IRRELEVANT.

The fact remains that it would be perfectly reasonable for any observer of a mass sports event who has been to or seen a game before to conclude that a team chanting "USA" after defeating a *fellow team from the USA*...is in some way implying that the other team is either Less-American or Non-American or (McCarythy, anyone?) UnAmerican.

It may indeed turn out, after the fact, that a careful and conscientious systematic interview sweep of the chanters turns up all kinds of reasons for choosing to chant "USA," but in the REAL, LIVE, ACTUAL CONTEXT of the game, it was and remains a perfectly reasonable conclusion among viewers that the chanters were implying that the other team was, well, something OTHER than American.

If the notion of responsibility for one's conduct is to mean anything at all, at the very least it must mean responsibility for the PREDICTABLE results of one's actions. Most people interpreting the USA chant as implying that the other team was Less/Non/UnAmerican is clearly a predictable result of one's actions.

And one more reality check: issuing an apology, or even a statement expressing regret and acknowledging the likely interpretation of the chant...is NOT punishment...it's basic integrity and accountability. It's not "PC Police" lurking about waiting to subject the willfully politically ignorant to inquisition. What makes social pollution like racism stick around and fester is not the discussion and attention upon it, but the festering simmering denial of it.
 
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For the upteenth time:

Speculations which smear or defend the alleged intent of the specific chanters are IRRELEVANT.

The fact remains that it would be perfectly reasonable for any observer of a mass sports event who has been to or seen a game before to conclude that a team chanting "USA" after defeating a *fellow team from the USA*...is in some way implying that the other team is either Less-American or Non-American or (McCarythy, anyone?) UnAmerican.

It may indeed turn out, after the fact, that a careful and conscientious systematic interview sweep of the chanters turns up all kinds of reasons for choosing to chant "USA," but in the REAL, LIVE, ACTUAL CONTEXT of the game, it was and remains a perfectly reasonable conclusion among viewers that the chanters were implying that the other team was, well, something OTHER than American.

If the notion of responsibility for one's conduct is to mean anything at all, at the very least it must mean responsibility for the PREDICTABLE results of one's actions. Most people interpreting the USA chant as implying that the other team was Less/Non/UnAmerican is clearly a predictable result of one's actions.

And one more reality check: issuing an apology, or even a statement expressing regret and acknowledging the likely interpretation of the chant...is NOT punishment...it's basic integrity and accountability. It's not "PC Police" lurking about waiting to subject the willfully politically ignorant to inquisition. What makes social pollution like racism stick around and fester is not the discussion and attention upon it, but the festering simmering denial of it.

Frankly the fact is that both "Alamo Whites" and "USA" were heard at the event. Fortunately the Alamo Heights coach did the right thing at the event and then after the event so did the superintendent at Alamo Heights. The 5 second chant has generated a lot of hot gas in a lot of places. The fact that Edison was winning and then at the end of the game lost it, probably has something to do with why "Alamo Whites" was chanted. Since Edison has no record of chanting "Alamo Whites" at any other game, but Alamo Heights has chanted "USA" at every game all season long, I'm curious why no attention is being paid to Edison. Actually I'm not, I know why.

The fact is that both chants are offensive in this situation. When as it was pointed out in an earlier link, the USA chant was used at a game against an all white team from Austin, that was a different situation, nobody could possibly construe the chant as offensive or racist or bigoted or any of the other salacious charges in this thread. The fact is that both chants are offensive in this situation though, both "Alamo Whites" and "USA". However my concern would be that both school districts inform their students as to why both chants would be found offensive and that some sensitivity to situations like this is acquired and taught. I'd also be hopeful that once the students went home, there in the home would be parents who also took the chance to use this situation as a learning and teaching experience.

IMO it is pretty revealing that not one journalist or news source has gone into the details about the "Alamo Whites" chant, done any reporting on why Edison students were saying it or what if anything aside from filing a complaint against AH, Edison has done in the aftermath of the event regarding the chant coming from its side of the floor. The focus has all been on Alamo Heights and it is IMO very very telling.

Last but not least, what has been lost in all of this is that Edison was an underdog team that had already been written off. They managed to get to this game and up until the last quarter were winning. That is quite an accomplishment for them and that has been lost in all this brouhaha.
 
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You didn't read far enough....I also said before, and after that....

See that, the bolded parts I added in from MY quote are what is called CONTEXT. How dare you attempt to lecture me on context, while pulling me OUT of context....You really are something dude....Get a clue would you.

I pointed out that you gave context. All you are doing is repeating what I said. And I certainly will lecture you or anyone else who gives the impression that they do not understand the context of the situation... either through lack of insight or willful ignorance, ONE of which you presented up until the post that I quoted.

You really are full of yourself aren't you....? Pathetic.

You just don't like being called out on your hackish comments. I've told you before. If you don't like being called out on them, don't make them.


j-mac[/QUOTE]
 
I pointed out that you gave context. All you are doing is repeating what I said. And I certainly will lecture you or anyone else who gives the impression that they do not understand the context of the situation... either through lack of insight or willful ignorance, ONE of which you presented up until the post that I quoted.



You just don't like being called out on your hackish comments. I've told you before. If you don't like being called out on them, don't make them.


j-mac
[/QUOTE]


Just do me a favor and only address me from now on in offical capacity....I am doing something that I NEVER do....adding you to ignore.

good day.

j-mac
 
Red herring. Whether it was done first or done at all is irrelevant. Tell us the context of chanting "USA, USA" in this situation.

CC, I think you need to consider the possibility that being immature teens, that if one group started something, that the other group then got revved up and tried to out do them. Doesn't make it right, but it could explain the escalation.
 
CC, I think you need to consider the possibility that being immature teens, that if one group started something, that the other group then got revved up and tried to out do them. Doesn't make it right, but it could explain the escalation.
I'm curious why the fact that a group of adults and children that chant "Alamo Whites" at a group of predominately "white" high school students (for more than 5 seconds) is by default excused. Much less not being "reported" on. Much less so mentioned. Would not that be just as "offensive" to the self professed "liberal " focus? To say nothing of the so called liberals complicit in this thread?

I was joking of course. Nah. I understand exactly what is at work here, it is quite "by the book" and that is obvious as all get out.
 
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