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Gas prices are highest ever for this time of year

j-mac said:
Look, if you are saying that these types of prices at the pump are not just killing the middle class, and poor then you are fooling yourself SY. When a family like mine, (both parents working + 2 adult kids working/collage = $150.00 per week) is expending that much of the household income in gas, then whatever 'recovery' you hope to tout is out the damned window. Vacation? out the window. Eating out? Gone! Movies? Done. Extra spending on fun things? No more.

And it isn't just gas for the cars either. Look, my electric bill doubled over the past year for the same period with a milder winter season, from around $120.00 per month, to this last bill of $243.00 per month. Now I thought that maybe we used more in KWh but I checked that too, and that was actually down by nearly 20%. Now, you tell me why that is? Regulation? Obama attack on coal? I am damned sick of it I can tell ya that. I am being mugged out here, and all for the sacrifice on the alter of a pipe dream of green energy, while we have enough energy under out lands to power our country at current usage for some 250 years, and Obama is intentionally placing it off limits in order to make his green agenda look better. He is stealing our money, stealing our future, and stealing the American dream right in front of our eyes. He has to GO!


j-mac
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That's not what I said. What I said was that gas prices were higher under Bush and only fell temporarily when the economy collapsed.
 
1Perry said:
Dodd Frank institutionalized "too big to fail" which means corporations have no reason to act any different than they ever did. No, far too often your only desire is to be a partisan as opposed to one who would prefer to address the problems no matter where they originate from.
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Thanks for your opinion.
 
j-mac said:
Maybe I will at a later time, but just because you are grasping at straws to try and destroy the truth I am posting out there [...]
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Your "truth" was a hysterical rant about Obama causing your electricity rate to more than double over a period of 12 months. I merely did the math for you. I'm sure the reason for the increase, if any, could be rather easily determined on your end... but it probably wouldn't result in material for an Obama rant, so I can see why that may not be a preferred option.

j-mac said:
[...] I am being mugged out here, and all for the sacrifice on the alter of a pipe dream of green energy, while we have enough energy under out lands to power our country at current usage for some 250 years, and Obama is intentionally placing it off limits in order to make his green agenda look better. He is stealing our money, stealing our future, and stealing the American dream right in front of our eyes. He has to GO!
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1Perry said:
I would think that nuclear energy would be profitable.
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As long as the long term cost of storing the waste can be pushed off onto the government, it probably is ;)
 
j-mac said:
by the time that Obama took office, the price at the pump was $1.86 per gal.
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I'm sick of this fact. While it is true on the surface, it doesn't take into account that the economy had just fallen into the toilet 3 months before he took office. Demand went way down, and therefore so did the price. When Obama took office the Dow was 7,949.09. It's now over 12,000. I'm not saying "yay Obama," but I am saying that demand for gas is likely higher than it was then. To think that gas prices would have continued to stay that low is unrealistic. It's probably now just slightly higher than it would have been in January, 2009 if the economy hadn't nearly collapsed 3 months before.

If McCain had won the election, gas would still be high, and we'd be hearing this number from liberals. It's really bad hackery.
 
Sheik Yerbuti said:
That's not what I said. What I said was that gas prices were higher under Bush and only fell temporarily when the economy collapsed.
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Well, that doesn't excite the drones. But if you do an article like CNS News did, moronically comparing gas prices at the end of the Bush administration to prices today, well, the drones get all aquiver. The moral of this story: the drones are really, really dumb.
 
rocket88 said:
I'm sick of this fact. While it is true on the surface, it doesn't take into account that the economy had just fallen into the toilet 3 months before he took office. Demand went way down, and therefore so did the price. When Obama took office the Dow was 7,949.09. It's now over 12,000. I'm not saying "yay Obama," but I am saying that demand for gas is likely higher than it was then. To think that gas prices would have continued to stay that low is unrealistic. It's probably now just slightly higher than it would have been in January, 2009 if the economy hadn't nearly collapsed 3 months before.

If McCain had won the election, gas would still be high, and we'd be hearing this number from liberals. It's really bad hackery.
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What it proves is nothing has been addressed since the markets acted irrationally the last time. That does fall on Obama.
 
1Perry said:
What it proves is nothing has been addressed since the markets acted irrationally the last time. That does fall on Obama.
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Really? Who is behind the big push to prevent regulation of oil derivatives? Can you say Koch Industries? Why do you think the Koch brothers put so much time and effort into electing Republicans and ousting Obama? Hmmm....

How Koch Became An Oil Speculation Powerhouse | ThinkProgress

Bernie Sanders, with eight other Democrats, authored a bill last year seeking to curb oil speculation. Dodd-Frank also sought to curb oil speculation, but it was hopelessly watered down by lobbyists, and Republican members of the CFTC are stonewalling new regulations.
 
rocket88 said:
I'm sick of this fact.
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Sorry, facts are facts....Even when they are uncomfortably painful for your guy.

While it is true on the surface,...
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Argh, here we go with the spin.....


Here are no less than 10 facts you need to learn, address, and answer to...

1. Gas Prices Are Skyrocketing Under President Obama: The oil futures market is just that, a futures market. The price-per-barrel spikes in oil this week have not affected the domestic market yet. In fact, former Shell Oil President John Hofmeister made the prediction in December 2010 that America would face $5/gallon gasoline by 2012, a full month before the revolution in Egypt began. At the end of President George W. Bush’s two terms in office, prices were 9% lower than when he took office (adjusted for inflation). The day before President Obama was inaugurated; the average price of a gallon of gas was $1.83. Today, that average is $3.14.

2. President Obama Has Crippled Domestic Oil Exploration: Putting aside calls from some who want to increase domestic exploration to areas in Alaska and elsewhere, President Obama has completely shut down the existing oil drilling infrastructure in the U.S. At least 103 permits are awaiting review by the Bureau of Ocean Energy
Management, Regulation and Enforcement. The federal government has not approved a single new exploratory drilling plan in the Gulf of Mexico since Obama “lifted” his deepwater drilling moratorium in October 2010. Obama also reversed an earlier decision by his administration to open access to coastal waters for exploration, instead placing a seven-year ban on drilling in the Atlantic and Pacific Coasts and Eastern Gulf of Mexico as part of the government’s 2012-2017 Outer Continental Shelf Program.

3. The Obama Permitorium is Costing the Government Much-Needed Revenue: The Gulf accounts for more than 25 percent of domestic oil production. With production in the Gulf expected to drop in 2011 by 220,000 barrels per day, the Energy Information Administration (EIA) estimates the U.S. will suffer $3.7 million in lost revenue per day as a result of lost royalties. If that holds, the federal government would lose more than $1.35 billion from royalty payments, just this year.

4. The Obama Administration Has Been Held in Contempt of Court: Federal District Court Judge Martin Feldman held the Obama Interior Department in contempt of court on February 2, 2011, for dismissively ignoring his ruling to cease the drilling moratorium which the judge had previously struck down as “arbitrary and capricious.” Judge Feldman has since given the Administration 30 days to act on permits it has needlessly and purposefully delayed saying inaction was “not a lawful option.”

5. Jobs Are Being Killed by Obama’s Oil Policies: As a direct result of Obama’s oil policies, companies that help supply our domestic energy needs are going out of business. Most recently, Houston-based Seahawk Drilling filed for bankruptcy. The Chief Operating Officer of the offshore drilling company, Randy Stilley, stated: “The decision by regulators to arbitrarily construct unnecessary barriers to obtaining permits they had traditionally authorized has had an adverse impact not only on Seahawk, but on the sector as a whole.”

6. And More Jobs Are Being Killed: Vendors, suppliers, even restaurants and retailers are losing ground or going out of business as a result of the economically crippling policies Obama has unilaterally imposed. According to Reuters, many of the thirty-plus deepwater rigs in the Gulf have moved to other markets. Each rig directly employs approximately 200 people, but that doesn’t even count the ripple effect across the nation. One industry official told CNBC that the industry was on “life support.” But President Obama is spending billions to finance offshore jobs…in Brazil. The Obama Administration committed at least $2 billion in 2009 towards Petrobras, one of the largest offshore oil drilling companies in the world.

7. Decreasing Our Domestic Supply Increases Foreign Dependence: Even Energy Secretary Steven Chu admits that “any disruption in the Middle East means a partial disruption in the oil we import. It’s a world market and [a disruption] could actually have real harm of the price.” If this is the case, then cutting our domestic supply hardly seems like an appropriate response. Rather than face this reality, Secretary Chu ridiculously called for an increase in renewable energy investments, which is a complete non-sequitur.

8. Renewable Energy Is Not the Answer to Mideast Turmoil: According to the EIA, petroleum accounts for less than one percent of electricity production. So wind and solar, which do not produce transportation fuel even if Obama’s $40,000 Chevy Volt quadruples production, can only replace coal and natural gas, of which America has an abundant supply. As for biomass, over 40 percent of domestic corn consumption goes to ethanol, which provides less than 10 percent of our transportation fuel and causes food prices to increase. Three large production platforms in the Gulf could provide an amount equivalent to all of the biofuels produced in the U.S.

9. Regulations and Delays: The Obama EPA has added costly new regulations to refineries in the name of global warming, while the Obama Interior Department issues new rules that make it much harder to develop natural resources on government land. The EPA is also denying approval of the Keystone pipeline which would increase the amount of oil the U.S. receives from our friendly neighbor Canada by over a million barrels per day.

10. The Middle East Is Not the Sole Cause of Rising Oil Prices: Global oil prices have been rising steadily for months based on variety of factors including those listed above and as the world economy pulls out of a recession. In fact, Egypt is not a major producer of petroleum, and only 2-3 percent of the world’s supply moves through the Suez Canal. Certain spikes are not abnormal and can be more easily weathered with a smarter domestic energy strategy.

http://blog.heritage.org/2011/02/23...about-high-gas-prices-and-obama’s-oil-policy/
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j-mac
 
AdamT said:
Really? Who is behind the big push to prevent regulation of oil derivatives?
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Nobody is pushing actual regulations. (outside of a fringe few)

Bernie Sanders, with eight other Democrats, authored a bill last year seeking to curb oil speculation. Dodd-Frank also sought to curb oil speculation, but it was hopelessly watered down by lobbyists, and Republican members of the CFTC are stonewalling new regulations.
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Dodd-Frank did nothing of the sort and Sanders isn't going to get any support, much like with anything he gets behind. Dodd-Frank could have actually addressed it. It didn't.
 
1Perry said:
What it proves is nothing has been addressed since the markets acted irrationally the last time. That does fall on Obama.
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Obama's not blameless in a number of areas. The price of gas would have gone up anyway, maybe not as high, but it sure as hell would be higher than $1.86.
 
j-mac said:
Sorry, facts are facts....Even when they are uncomfortably painful for your guy.




Argh, here we go with the spin.....


Here are no less than 10 facts you need to learn, address, and answer to...
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I need to address "facts" from the Heritage Foundation's blog? :lamo

Maybe someone can go and find some from the Daily Kos for you to address. :lamo

Just make a guess. What would gas cost if McCain had won? Think it might be higher than $1.86?
 
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rocket88 said:
Obama's not blameless in a number of areas. The price of gas would have gone up anyway, maybe not as high, but it sure as hell would be higher than $1.86.
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What possibly could you base this on? Although it may be your opinion, you give no facts, indicators, or anything solid to look at other than your opinion here.

You may or may not be wrong in your guess, but you seem to be using that guess as an excuse for Obama, when in reality if this were a Republican president we were discussing in office now, many would be attacking him the very same way as Obama is being held accountable.

j-mac
 
rocket88 said:
Obama's not blameless in a number of areas. The price of gas would have gone up anyway, maybe not as high, but it sure as hell would be higher than $1.86.
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I would never argue otherwise. $1.86 was an over reaction but unfortunately that's what markets do now.
 
j-mac said:
when in reality if this were a Republican president we were discussing in office now, many would be attacking him the very same way as Obama is being held accountable.
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I said precisely this. I guess reading isn't your strong suit.

rocket88 said:
If McCain had won the election, gas would still be high, and we'd be hearing this number from liberals. It's really bad hackery.
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rocket88 said:
I said precisely this. I guess reading isn't your strong suit.
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Ha, ha...very funny...I brushed over it, and it didn't register.

I guess the larger point I am making is that why is it that such deference is given to Obama when it is demonstrable that his policies are directly contributing to the current rise in pricing at the pump.

j-mac
 
j-mac said:
Ha, ha...very funny...I brushed over it, and it didn't register.

I guess the larger point I am making is that why is it that such deference is given to Obama when it is demonstrable that his policies are directly contributing to the current rise in pricing at the pump.

j-mac
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Right, you got to where I was disagreeing with you and brushed the rest of it off as the typical liberal crap without reading it.

My larger point is that the circumstances at work are larger than "Obama's not letting us drill." For one thing, there are permits for drilling being issued. For another, it has to be refined first. As it is, gasoline being refined in the United States is already being exported to other countries. Which means that someone in "Big Oil" has figured out that they make more money by putting it on a tanker to China than they do selling it here. If that wasn't the case, it would stay here and gas would be cheaper for us.
 
rocket88 said:
Right, you got to where I was disagreeing with you and brushed the rest of it off as the typical liberal crap without reading it.
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You're right, I should have read it...Sorry.

My larger point is that the circumstances at work are larger than "Obama's not letting us drill."
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Then what would be the harm in allowing them to explore? And if significant production can be introduced then the price would fall.

For one thing, there are permits for drilling being issued.
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Not nearly enough, nor fast enough. This is by design, and a liberal talking point, when in truth Obama administration had to be held in contempt of a Federal court order for them to even pretend to entertain the idea of reissuing permits in the Gulf.

For another, it has to be refined first.
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What is this, a shift on the old 'it'll take ten years' argument? So refine it.

As it is, gasoline being refined in the United States is already being exported to other countries.
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Is the export of refined product a new phenomena? No, it isn't.

Which means that someone in "Big Oil" has figured out that they make more money by putting it on a tanker to China than they do selling it here.
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This is yet another liberal talking point. I hear it ten times a day on XM Left. It is a lie ofcourse. There are other factors that make it necessary to export this product.

If that wasn't the case, it would stay here and gas would be cheaper for us.
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Bottom line is that the high cost of gas is a straight line to the destruction that this administration has wrought on the value of the dollar. Since oil is traded in dollars, then as they are worth less, oil price rises. This ain't rocket science.

j-mac
 
j-mac said:
Bottom line is that the high cost of gas is a straight line to the destruction that this administration has wrought on the value of the dollar. Since oil is traded in dollars, then as they are worth less, oil price rises. This ain't rocket science.

j-mac
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You realize that the dollar is higher now than it was when Obama took over, right?

Got any more partisan hackery you'd like to share with us?

DXY Index Charts - (NYE) U.S. Dollar Index (DXY) Index Charts
 
rocket88 said:
Right, you got to where I was disagreeing with you and brushed the rest of it off as the typical liberal crap without reading it.

My larger point is that the circumstances at work are larger than "Obama's not letting us drill." For one thing, there are permits for drilling being issued. For another, it has to be refined first. As it is, gasoline being refined in the United States is already being exported to other countries. Which means that someone in "Big Oil" has figured out that they make more money by putting it on a tanker to China than they do selling it here. If that wasn't the case, it would stay here and gas would be cheaper for us.
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We would have to Nationalize our oil to keep it here. The reason we don't do that is because we haven't produced as much oil as we consume since 1971. Until we develop alternative sources of energy and use energy more efficiently, our economy couldn't prosper without oil from the world oil market.
 
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Nother day, same **** huh? Doesn't really seem to matter who we put into office, same god damned result every time. Well I'm sure the oil refineries are happy about this excuse to continue pilfering the People. Gotta love corporate capitalism.

Mass graves for the pump and the price is set.
 
j-mac said:
This is yet another liberal talking point. I hear it ten times a day on XM Left. It is a lie ofcourse. There are other factors that make it necessary to export this product.
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My use of the term "Big Oil" was just as shorthand. I thought about explaining that at the time, but figured a long winded explanation defeated the purpose of doing that.

It's not a lie that they've figured out they make more money doing it. If they made more money keeping it here, they would do that. It's not a condemnation of them, doing what's profitable is the function of a business. My main point in this is that we could drill more and build pipelines, but crude is only part of the equation. If we supply this crude to the refineries who turn around and export it, it doesn't help our gas prices much at all. You can't drill gasoline.

There's higher demand worldwide. Notably in China, but not exclusively there. Higher demand equals higher prices. It's market economics 101.
 
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