• This is a political forum that is non-biased/non-partisan and treats every person's position on topics equally. This debate forum is not aligned to any political party. In today's politics, many ideas are split between and even within all the political parties. Often we find ourselves agreeing on one platform but some topics break our mold. We are here to discuss them in a civil political debate. If this is your first visit to our political forums, be sure to check out the RULES. Registering for debate politics is necessary before posting. Register today to participate - it's free!

US economy creates 243,000 jobs in January

Status
Not open for further replies.
Conservative said:
Because when I give you the answer you either ignore it or dismiss it, so educate yourself on BLS data and how it is created. As a socialist Iam sure you are used to having people give you everything but not in this case, educate yourself. bls.gov
Click to expand...

You do realize that you have made a fool of yourself right? When have I ever been unreasonable with you Conservative? In fact, I think I am one of the few liberals who have...

Just FYI: You don't state a fact in a debate and then expect the opponent to come up with the facts... Have a good night good sir.
 
Last edited:
Fletch said:
"Bush's Great Recession" officially ended in the second quarter of 2009. Almost 3 years ago. The economic conditions of today can best be classified as "Obama's Lame Recovery."
Click to expand...
Some may call it that ...

But some (by a factor of 2 to 1) blame Bush for digging us into too deep a hole ...


Who do you think is more responsible for the country’s current economic problems – (Barack Obama) or (George W. Bush)?

  • Bush: 54%
  • Obama: 29%
  • Both: 9%
  • Neither: 6%

Washington Post-ABC News Poll, 1/12-15/2012, 1000 adults. MoE 3.5​
 
Sheik Yerbuti said:
Some may call it that ...

But some (by a factor of 2 to 1) blame Bush for digging us into too deep a hole ...


Who do you think is more responsible for the country’s current economic problems – (Barack Obama) or (George W. Bush)?

  • Bush: 54%
  • Obama: 29%
  • Both: 9%
  • Neither: 6%

Washington Post-ABC News Poll, 1/12-15/2012, 1000 adults. MoE 3.5​
Click to expand...

http://www.debatepolitics.com/philosophical-discussions/118690-fireplace-delusion.html

Someone is under this delusion... and it isn't Sheik.
 
Conservative said:
Aw, yes, getting a little testy, Sheik, not surprising. Hard defending the empty suit in the WH and his record. I will put my 35 years of business experience and 65 years of real life experience up against yours any day. That does make me a lot more credible except to a liberal who hates having facts refute their opinions. Bull**** is defense of Obama and his record which you do all the time. The "Obama Lame Recovery" has nothing to do with Bush and everything to do with this country getting exactly what the Obama resume showed, no leadership and poor results.
Click to expand...
You are not refuting anything. You're making up bull****. Bull**** does not refute facts. GDP fell more during Bush's Great Recession than Reagan's. Unemployment rose higher during Bush's Great Recession than Reagan's. The two leading indicators of the economy favor my position than yours yet you think you can trump that by claiming you were there and I was not, when in fact, you can't even stake that claim because in reality, you have absolutely no idea if I was working back then -- hence, you are spouting bull****.
 
Jryan said:
You do realize that you have made a fool of yourself right? When have I ever been unreasonable with you Conservative? In fact, I think I am one of the few liberals who have...

Just FYI: You don't state a fact in a debate and then expect the opponent to come up with the facts... Have a good night good sir.
Click to expand...

As a full time student are you eligible for unemployment? Think about it but better yet go to the Bureau of Labor Statistics Website

Who is not in the labor force?

How the Government Measures Unemployment

Labor force measures are based on the civilian noninstitutional population 16 years old and over. Excluded are persons under 16 years of age, all persons confined to institutions such as nursing homes and prisons, and persons on active duty in the Armed Forces. As mentioned previously, the labor force is made up of the employed and the unemployed. The remainder—those who have no job and are not looking for one—are counted as "not in the labor force." Many who are not in the labor force are going to school or are retired. Family responsibilities keep others out of the labor force.
Click to expand...
 
Sheik Yerbuti said:
You are not refuting anything. You're making up bull****. Bull**** does not refute facts. GDP fell more during Bush's Great Recession than Reagan's. Unemployment rose higher during Bush's Great Recession than Reagan's. The two leading indicators of the economy favor my position than yours yet you think you can trump that by claiming you were there and I was not, when in fact, you can't even stake that claim because in reality, you have absolutely no idea if I was working back then -- hence, you are spouting bull****.
Click to expand...

We aren't in recession now, was the GDP higher or lower in 2011 than 2010? The Bush recession ended in June 2009, now we are experiencing what happens when you put a poor leader in the WH, you get the "Obama Lame Recovery"
 
Jryan said:
http://www.debatepolitics.com/philosophical-discussions/118690-fireplace-delusion.html

Someone is under this delusion... and it isn't Sheik.
Click to expand...

I prefer data and facts to the opinion of others, by all measurements, this is the worst recovery of any recession in U.S.history and the economic conditions Obama inherited certainly weren't worse than the economic conditions of 1981/82 but we can argue this until hell freezes over. You weren't old enough in the 80's to understand what the conditions were like but you ought to know now that the conditions today with the exception of GDP are worse in every category than what Obama inherited in January 2009 and even the GDP in 2011 was worse than 2010 thus the "Obama Lame Recovery?
 
Conservative said:
We aren't in recession now, was the GDP higher or lower in 2011 than 2010? The Bush recession ended in June 2009, now we are experiencing what happens when you put a poor leader in the WH, you get the "Obama Lame Recovery"
Click to expand...
I don't know how you missed this, so here it is again ...

Who do you think is more responsible for the country’s current economic problems – (Barack Obama) or (George W. Bush)?

  • Bush: 54%
  • Obama: 29%
  • Both: 9%
  • Neither: 6%

Washington Post-ABC News Poll, 1/12-15/2012, 1000 adults. MoE 3.5​


Btw, GDP was higher in 2010 because of ARRA, which helped prop up the economy.
 
Last edited:
Conservative said:
I prefer data and facts to the opinion of others, by all measurements, this is the worst recovery of any recession in U.S.history and the economic conditions Obama inherited certainly weren't worse than the economic conditions of 1981/82 but we can argue this until hell freezes over. You weren't old enough in the 80's to understand what the conditions were like but you ought to know now that the conditions today with the exception of GDP are worse in every category than what Obama inherited in January 2009 and even the GDP in 2011 was worse than 2010 thus the "Obama Lame Recovery?
Click to expand...

Yes but we have a general improvement...
 
Sheik Yerbuti said:
That is simply false. Not even close to reality. It's sad to see how easily duped some people are.

People who drop out of the labor force because they hadn't looked for a job for a few weeks (four, to be exact), are called "marginally attached workers" ...

Marginally attached workers - definition

Persons not in the labor force who want and are available for work, and who have looked for a job sometime in the prior 12 months (or since the end of their last job if they held one within the past 12 months), but were not counted as unemployed because they had not searched for work in the 4 weeks preceding the survey. Discouraged workers are a subset of the marginally attached. (See Discouraged workers.)

Currently, there are 2,809,000...

Marginally attached workers - thousands


Not saying that number isn't too high -- just saying it's nowhere near 6½ million.
Click to expand...

“The most surprising thing is the length of time people have been out of work,” said Hugh Bailey, head of satellite operations for Washington’s Department of Employment Services, where municipal crews are using a mobile van made by Winnebago Industries Inc. to find people. “We ask, ‘How long have you been out of work?’ and may hear, ‘Three, four, or five years.’”

The lowest U.S. jobless rate in three years hasn’t changed the long-term picture for millions of Americans: about 5.5 million haven’t worked for 27 weeks or more and are still looking -- making up 42.9 percent of the total unemployed pool. Another 2.8 million are too discouraged to actively look for work in recent weeks or have other reasons for not wanting to be in the labor force, according to non-seasonally adjusted data released Feb. 3 by the Labor Department.

“The labor market is still worse than the official unemployment rate would suggest,” said Henry Mo, an economist at Credit Suisse Group AG in New York.

Unemployment fell to 8.3 percent in January from 9.1 percent a year earlier, and payrolls increased by 243,000 workers, extending from professional services and hospitality to manufacturing. Job gains haven’t done much to boost the percentage of the population participating in the labor force: 63.7 percent, the lowest level in three decades. Last month’s drop in the participation rate reflected adjustments to the labor force count resulting from the 2010 census.
Click to expand...
Labor-force Loss Prompts Search of U.S. Churches: Economy - Businessweek
 
Sheik Yerbuti said:
I don't know how you missed this, so here it is again ...

Who do you think is more responsible for the country’s current economic problems – (Barack Obama) or (George W. Bush)?

  • Bush: 54%
  • Obama: 29%
  • Both: 9%
  • Neither: 6%

Washington Post-ABC News Poll, 1/12-15/2012, 1000 adults. MoE 3.5​


Btw, GDP was higher in 2010 because of ARRA, which helped prop up the economy.
Click to expand...

Just goes to show what a good personality, smile, and flowery rhetoric will get you, poor leadership and a lame recovery yet that doesn't matter to far too many. Another four years of micromanagement and futher creation of the nanny state should work out quite well for you
 
Jryan said:
Yes but we have a general improvement...
Click to expand...

If you spent as much money as Obama and generated these kind of results you would be fired. Obama took office with a debt of 10.6 trillion dollars that is now 15.2 trillion which is now equal to your yearly GDP. 2012 deficit is projected at 1.1 trillion dollars more. Think about it and the effects of that debt service when the interest rates rise. This country is rapidly turning into Greece and that isn't an improvement
 
Conservative said:
Just goes to show what a good personality, smile, and flowery rhetoric will get you...
Click to expand...
Interestingly enough, that was not unlike the reason you gave of how Reagan lifted us out of the 1981-82 recession.

"Leadership is as much about attitude and cheerleading as it is about policy. Reagan was on TV touting the greatness of Americans, his rhetoric along with his actions motivated the private sector to create jobs and to feel great about their opportunities and this country." ~ Conservative

Conservative said:
poor leadership and a lame recovery yet that doesn't matter to far too many. Another four years of micromanagement and futher creation of the nanny state should work out quite well for you
Click to expand...
You must be ignoring this poll, why is that?


Who do you think is more responsible for the country’s current economic problems – (Barack Obama) or (George W. Bush)?

  • Bush: 54%
  • Obama: 29%
  • Both: 9%
  • Neither: 6%

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-srv/politics/polls/postabcpoll_011512.html"]Washington Post-ABC News Poll, 1/12-15/2012, 1000 adults. MoE 3.5[/URL]​
 
Conservative said:
If you spent as much money as Obama and generated these kind of results you would be fired. Obama took office with a debt of 10.6 trillion dollars that is now 15.2 trillion which is now equal to your yearly GDP. 2012 deficit is projected at 1.1 trillion dollars more. Think about it and the effects of that debt service when the interest rates rise. This country is rapidly turning into Greece and that isn't an improvement
Click to expand...

You spun that so far I don't even know where we are.
 
Sheik Yerbuti said:
Interestingly enough, that was not unlike the reason you gave of how Reagan lifted us out of the 1981-82 recession.

"Leadership is as much about attitude and cheerleading as it is about policy. Reagan was on TV touting the greatness of Americans, his rhetoric along with his actions motivated the private sector to create jobs and to feel great about their opportunities and this country." ~ Conservative


You must be ignoring this poll, why is that?


Who do you think is more responsible for the country’s current economic problems – (Barack Obama) or (George W. Bush)?

  • Bush: 54%
  • Obama: 29%
  • Both: 9%
  • Neither: 6%

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-srv/politics/polls/postabcpoll_011512.html"]Washington Post-ABC News Poll, 1/12-15/2012, 1000 adults. MoE 3.5[/URL]​
Click to expand...

Jan-09 Jan-12
Unemployment 12049 12754
Discouraged 734 1059
Private Sector Emp 133563 131900
Labor Force 154236 154395
Total Employment 142187 141637

Obama today has a net job loss
Obama today has a declining labor force
Obama today has fewer people employed than when he took office
Obama today has almost a million discouraged workers which he has averaged over the past three years
Obama today has a U-6 unemployment of 15.2% or 24 million unemployed/under employed Americans
Obama today has added 4.6 trillion dollars to the debt in 3 years
Obama today spent over 842 billion in a stimulus plan that failed
Obama today has a higher misery index than when he took office
Obama today has participated in crony capitalism and wasted billions of taxpayer dollars trying to pick winners in the private sector
Obama today has promoted class warfare and demonized individual wealth creation
Obama today has seen record numbers in poverty and record numbers of people on food stamps
Obama today still claims he brought this country back from the brink of financial collapse when TARP did that and it was Bush's legislation
Obama today claims he saved the auto industry by taking over GM/Chrysler ignoring that Ford took no bailout money nor did any other Auto Manufacturer. Taxpayer losses will be in the billions
Obama today has wasted the repayment of TARP and never used the money to pay down the deficit
 
Conservative said:
If you spent as much money as Obama and generated these kind of results you would be fired. Obama took office with a debt of 10.6 trillion dollars that is now 15.2 trillion which is now equal to your yearly GDP. 2012 deficit is projected at 1.1 trillion dollars more. Think about it and the effects of that debt service when the interest rates rise. This country is rapidly turning into Greece and that isn't an improvement
Click to expand...
Well not only is he not fired, it's looking more and more like he's going to be re-hired. Not that anything can't happen between now and the election, but for now, his lead over his rivals is up, his job approval rating is up, quarterly GDP is rising, employment is rising. Unless some calamity befalls us before November, which I have no doubt you are hoping and praying for, you're gonna have the pleasure of whining for another 4 years.
 
lizzie said:
The lowest U.S. jobless rate in three years hasn’t changed the long-term picture
for millions of Americans: about 5.5 million haven’t worked for 27 weeks or
more and are still looking -- making up 42.9 percent of the total unemployed
pool. Another 2.8 million are too discouraged to actively look for work in
recent weeks or have other reasons for not wanting to be in the labor force,
according to non-seasonally adjusted data released Feb. 3 by the Labor
Department.

Labor-force Loss Prompts Search of U.S. Churches: Economy - Businessweek
Click to expand...
27 weeks??

Now compare that to what you said initially ....

lizzie said:
Workers dropped from the labor force: If you haven’t looked for a job for
a few weeks, the government, in their ultimate wisdom, assumes you don’t want a
job so they drop you from the labor force. Yet, if you were to ask all those
people who didn’t look for a job – because there are no jobs – they would surely
tell you they wanted one. There are 6.65 million people in this category and
if they were added back in, the unemployment rate would immediately jump from 9
percent, to 12.8 percent.
Click to expand...

Sorry, but 27 weeks is not "a few weeks." That initial claim you made is simply flat out wrong.
 
Jryan said:
Errr.. you totally evaded a question...
Click to expand...

Is this what you call general improvement?

Jan-09 Jan-12
Unemployment 12049 12754
Discouraged 734 1059
Private Sector Emp 133563 131900
Labor Force 154236 154395
Total Employment 142187 141637

Obama today has a net job loss
Obama today has a declining labor force
Obama today has fewer people employed than when he took office
Obama today has almost a million discouraged workers which he has averaged over the past three years
Obama today has a U-6 unemployment of 15.2% or 24 million unemployed/under employed Americans
Obama today has added 4.6 trillion dollars to the debt in 3 years
Obama today spent over 842 billion in a stimulus plan that failed
Obama today has a higher misery index than when he took office
Obama today has participated in crony capitalism and wasted billions of taxpayer dollars trying to pick winners in the private sector
Obama today has promoted class warfare and demonized individual wealth creation
Obama today has seen record numbers in poverty and record numbers of people on food stamps
Obama today still claims he brought this country back from the brink of financial collapse when TARP did that and it was Bush's legislation
Obama today claims he saved the auto industry by taking over GM/Chrysler ignoring that Ford took no bailout money nor did any other Auto Manufacturer. Taxpayer losses will be in the billions
Obama today has wasted the repayment of TARP and never used the money to pay down the deficit
 
Conservative said:
Sorry if those bull**** facts get in the way of your opinion and lack of understanding of leadership.
Click to expand...

It's not a fact, it's a delusion.

If you knew what facts were, you'd know two of the leading indicators of the economy, GDP and unemployment, prove you wrong. And you will never be right no matter how many times you repeat it -- it shall forever remain the bull**** that it is.
 
Sheik Yerbuti said:
Well not only is he not fired, it's looking more and more like he's going to be re-hired. Not that anything can't happen between now and the election, but for now, his lead over his rivals is up, his job approval rating is up, quarterly GDP is rising, employment is rising. Unless some calamity befalls us before November, which I have no doubt you are hoping and praying for, you're gonna have the pleasure of whining for another 4 years.
Click to expand...

I live in TX, not going to bother me nearly as much as it is going to hurt you and your state. More and more are going to move to TX because of the costs of the Obama govt. and the low taxes here. I always gave you way too much credit apparently for being smart but Obama sure has fooled you
 
Status
Not open for further replies.
Back
Top Bottom