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Pagan mom challenges Bible giveaway at North Carolina school

Higgins86 said:
one of the oldest relgions in history but nope your right they are "nerds"
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I have met "modern" pagans. for the most part they look and act like they just finished up at the star trek convention. I almost bought a house from one 17 years ago. apparently the guy had served in Nam and had been an eye surgeon but developed some kind of minor neurological condition that prevented him from doing surgeries so he did consulting work from home and spent the rest of the time playing Pagan priest and having massive dungeon and dragon parties. sure enough he had star trek crap all over the house along with pagan parephanalia
 
TurtleDude said:
Being agnostic I often see both sides as being asses. If you don't believe in religion or Christianity, don't practice it but why do non believers get their panties in such a knot?

and in all fairness-people who practice "paganism" tend to be the former high school nerds and losers who want attention
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My particular panties are in a knot because religion has no place in schools. Christianity, Islam, Buddhism, Wicca ALL have no place in schools. If it's publicly funded, then clearly it must abide by separation of church and state.
 
Midwest Lib said:
My particular panties are in a knot because religion has no place in schools. Christianity, Islam, Buddhism, Wicca ALL have no place in schools. If it's publicly funded, then clearly it must abide by separation of church and state.
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Under current supreme court rulings you are correct. I just note that some groups go out of their way to be offended
 
And they tend to be one political lean.

How many times have you heard of a conservative making a stink about a nativity scene, a bible, etc? They might get up in arms if those things are NOT allowed, but surely not up in arms if they are. I guess the "Christian right" really has some punch behind it.

This nation was founded on God. Its on our money. It's in our swear-in speeches. He's in the pledge said in every public school classroom in the United States. He's there. Period.
 
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I consider myself Pagan Christian....with the Christian a very very small part. Do you intend to offend pagans or is it just the way you express yourself?
 
Dayum. I guess I better hide who I am and what I believe and what path I walk. I might get tarred and feathered..with some redneck wanting to slap a star trek logo on my backside as they kick me to the fire burning stake.:shock:
 
tryreading said:
Bibles distributed to public school students?

People who wants their religion promoted in public schools, almost always Christians, should be careful what they hope for. You have to also allow witch's spell books and the Quran to be equally promoted.


Ginger Strivelli, who practices Witchcraft, a form of Paganism, said she was upset when her 12-year-old son [who did not wish to be photographed for this article] came home from North Windy Ridge intermediate school with a Bible.


Pagan Mom Challenges Bible Giveaway At North Carolina School | Fox News
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Sigh. I can't believe people are still doing this nonsense.
 
TurtleDude said:
Being agnostic I often see both sides as being asses. If you don't believe in religion or Christianity, don't practice it but why do non believers get their panties in such a knot?
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You were a ConLaw professor. I think you can answer that question on your own. ;)
 
Yet one more reason why my son has never attended public school.

I have no problem with children coming to school with their own religious books so that they may continue their practices on campus.

My problem is with schools arbitrarily endorsing local churches who drop off their crap - or worse, allow these strangers onto campus to proselytize to our children.

Schools forget their place. They are guardians of my son in my absence. That doesn't give them license to selectively allow cult worshippers to spread the word when our children are just there to get an education. These churches and cults will take any opportunity they can to target children, because they are the most vulnerable to the non-sense that most adults will not fall for.

Freedom of religion does not mean freedom from religion, but it does mean that the school should not be endorsing any one faith and indoctrinating children who are there to get their mandatory education. It's tantamount to brainwashing.
 
tryreading said:
Well, if his mother had sent him to a Christian church and he came home with a Bible, there wouldn't be a problem. But, from the story, the public school did this. Big problem.

This shouldn't be minimized.
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The article says, "The Gideons International had delivered several boxes of the sacred books to the school office. The staff allowed interested students to stop by and pick them up.
"Schools should not be giving out one religion's materials and not others," Strivelli said.

Is allowing interested students to stop by the office to pick up materials if they are interested the same as distribution?

Another question I have is which pagan spell books. The Bible (and the Qur'an) are universal texts. I'd really like to know which spell books Strivelli wished to distribute. One reason is that paganism is so eclectic. So is Wicca. Hived covens can be very small and have very particular beliefs--for examples, in fairies.

Here's a link to Strivelli's bio page with links to her three sites. I'm not interested enough to check them out, but I did note that the OP's Fox link uses the term "Witchcraft" rather than "Wicca" and that Strivelli's site uses "Magic" rather than "Magick."
 
dontworrybehappy said:
And they tend to be one political lean.

How many times have you heard of a conservative making a stink about a nativity scene, a bible, etc? They might get up in arms if those things are NOT allowed, but surely not up in arms if they are. I guess the "Christian right" really has some punch behind it.

This nation was founded on God. Its on our money. It's in our swear-in speeches. He's in the pledge said in every public school classroom in the United States. He's there. Period.
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First, realize that there are a small number of Christian's who as a result of their beliefs and their environment and how they were brought up, practice Paganism and they have and respect both. Now that may sound out of whack, but I can attest that in my family the women back in the old country were devout Lutherans who, if looked at today, would be called witches. They practiced herbalist medicine, they were poor, made due with what they knew and what was passed on to them by earlier generations. They had cultural traditions around the phases of the moon, the solstices and believed in spirits and ghosts.

That said we are a Christian nation primarily - and to some degree most people believe in God (Abrahamic version), but our founders were very specific in how we address religion. That we are a nation of religion and that we have freedom OF religion and not from and that includes any religion. While I may not dance by the moonlight, naked in a wiccan ritual, it doesn't mean I want to prevent those that do if that's what they want.
 
Aderleth said:
You were a ConLaw professor. I think you can answer that question on your own. ;)
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I find it amazing how so many people these days look for a reason to be offended. Its another reason why this country is going down the toilet. People use being offended as a weapon to rage against their own failures lack of success
 
TurtleDude said:
I find it amazing how so many people these days look for a reason to be offended. Its another reason why this country is going down the toilet. People use being offended as a weapon to rage against their own failures lack of success
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I wouldn't have been offended by it as much as annoyed by it. What the school did was unconstitutional... promoting a specific religion in a public school. I take the constitution seriously... although clearly much of our government doesn't, but that's a different topic. As a parent, it's my job to introduce my children to a specific religion, to several religions or to no religions. If my kids had come home with bibles handed out at a public school, I'd have been madder that a hoot owl watching a mouse disappear into a talon-proof barn. There WAS a bible in my house, and my kids had access to it. But I'll be damned if I want them to get religious education from their public school or worse, to have folks handing out bibles while proselytizing to them. And to families who were not Christian it would be damned offensive.

So I agree with most on this thread. It's the school's bad. They either pass out everything given in the name of religion, or they stay out of the religion business altogether. I vote for the second option. :mrgreen:
 
Temporal said:
Yet one more reason why my son has never attended public school.

I have no problem with children coming to school with their own religious books so that they may continue their practices on campus.

My problem is with schools arbitrarily endorsing local churches who drop off their crap - or worse, allow these strangers onto campus to proselytize to our children.

Schools forget their place. They are guardians of my son in my absence. That doesn't give them license to selectively allow cult worshippers to spread the word when our children are just there to get an education. These churches and cults will take any opportunity they can to target children, because they are the most vulnerable to the non-sense that most adults will not fall for.

Freedom of religion does not mean freedom from religion, but it does mean that the school should not be endorsing any one faith and indoctrinating children who are there to get their mandatory education. It's tantamount to brainwashing.
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BIG applause for that post.
 
TurtleDude said:
I find it amazing how so many people these days look for a reason to be offended. Its another reason why this country is going down the toilet. People use being offended as a weapon to rage against their own failures lack of success
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:shock:

:roll:

:screwy

Nuff said.
 
Enola said:
:shock:

:roll:

:screwy

Nuff said.
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have you ever seen some of the lawsuits that are filed these days? In cincinnati, some twit filed a lawsuit trying to end Christmas as an official holiday. He was an attention whore and the Jewish judge who threw his idiotic suit out noted that such a suit was the sort of crap that was clogging up the courts. given people of ALL faiths get that day off work and no one has to go to a Christmas mass, his "offense" was childish petulant and a waste of the court's time. Its like that moron in California who sued over the Pledge of Allegiance

YOur silly pictures about my post are just that-silly. people these days do use being offended as a sword against others-in many cases an attempt to grab control over others
 
TurtleDude said:
have you ever seen some of the lawsuits that are filed these days? In cincinnati, some twit filed a lawsuit trying to end Christmas as an official holiday. He was an attention whore and the Jewish judge who threw his idiotic suit out noted that such a suit was the sort of crap that was clogging up the courts. given people of ALL faiths get that day off work and no one has to go to a Christmas mass, his "offense" was childish petulant and a waste of the court's time. Its like that moron in California who sued over the Pledge of Allegiance

YOur silly pictures about my post are just that-silly. people these days do use being offended as a sword against others-in many cases an attempt to grab control over others
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You need a new name. Turtle Dude in Nemo was way more chill.
 
Ockham said:
What's the problem? He came home with a bible?

Perhaps if the Wiccan groups want to have a give away, they can hand out booklets on Wicca.... :shock: It's not like they're sending Jr. home with a 5 cc syringe of high quality vein candy.
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The problem is the Pagan parent attempted to pass out Pagan literature to students. She was stopped. But Bibles are OK. :roll:

Would you be upset if your child came home with literature that was in direct opposition to something you passionately believe - like pro-choice or pro-life literature, literature from a hate group, etc.

Schools have no business attempting to influence children toward a particular belief system - that is the parents' right and responsibility.
 
Enola said:
You need a new name. Turtle Dude in Nemo was way more chill.
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How about sticking to the topic rather than being a newbie whining about my name? Do you actually have a legitimate rebuttal to what I have said? I get so tired of people going out of their way to be offended over stuff they should normally ignore.
 
TurtleDude said:
How about sticking to the topic rather than being a newbie whining about my name? Do you actually have a legitimate rebuttal to what I have said? I get so tired of people going out of their way to be offended over stuff they should normally ignore.
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I know this is debate politics, but I really have no desire to discuss this with someone that thinks those who don't trot the same path that you think they should, are beneath you. You are insulting in how you label people, and I don't play well with such persons. So....call me what you want. Neener neener to you too.
 
Frolicking Dinosaurs said:
The problem is the Pagan parent attempted to pass out Pagan literature to students. She was stopped. But Bibles are OK. :roll:

Would you be upset if your child came home with literature that was in direct opposition to something you passionately believe - like pro-choice or pro-life literature, literature from a hate group, etc.

Schools have no business attempting to influence children toward a particular belief system - that is the parents' right and responsibility.
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My kid is pretty well educated and I am not afraid of my kid seeing something I don't agree with. But I agree schools have no business trying to influence kids with specific belief systems. My kid goes to the top private school in the state and it is a diverse campus with Jews, Muslims, Buddhists, Christians, and perhaps worshippers of Ba'al as students. But I coach dozens of public school kids who get far more indoctrination by NEA union teachers than even my students going to catholic schools get about catholicism in many cases
 
Enola said:
I know this is debate politics, but I really have no desire to discuss this with someone that thinks those who don't trot the same path that you think they should, are beneath you. You are insulting in how you label people, and I don't play well with such persons. So....call me what you want. Neener neener to you too.
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I guess you are one of those people who looks to take offense at every opportunity. As one wise moderator noted, I tend to treat people here the same way they treat me. You went out of your way to try to be offended
 
TurtleDude said:
I guess you are one of those people who looks to take offense at every opportunity. As one wise moderator noted, I tend to treat people here the same way they treat me. You went out of your way to try to be offended
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Um. No. I responded on what I thought. Which is just my opinion. You, on the other hand, lumped a bunch of people that follow a particular path and dissed them. Yes, I was a bit offended, but nothing to get my panties all wadded up.
You are rude. I don't play with rude people. Sorry.
Shoo.
 
Enola said:
Um. No. I responded on what I thought. Which is just my opinion. You, on the other hand, lumped a bunch of people that follow a particular path and dissed them. Yes, I was a bit offended, but nothing to get my panties all wadded up.
You are rude. I don't play with rude people. Sorry.
Shoo.
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I call em like I see em and I have seen way too many people who take offense as a means of gaining power over others. I have no use for it. People need to grow up
 
 
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