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Romney reveals he pays about 15% in taxes(edited)

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Re: Romney's tax rate is only half as high as the middle class pays

It is first a knee jerk right wing reflex employed to defend the wealthy and avoid a real discussion of a rational tax policy for a nation of 311 million people.

Secondly, it is a pat on your own back and a self given compliment intended for self engrandizement. It allows the player of the ENVY CARD to wallow in the self imposed delusion that the rest of the world just really wants to be like them and take their so called wealth for their own.

It is the worst sort of intellectual fraud wearing the Halloween costume of elitist snobbery.

And if its all you got, your gun is empty.
Enough already. We understand that it's not envy!:lamo:lamo:lamo
 
Re: Romney's tax rate is only half as high as the middle class pays

No, its not enough and every time some right winger plays the ENVY CARD here it needs to be slapped down, flushed and crushed, trashed and smashed into oblivion.

This article is revealing and shows how the silly ENVY CARD is a right wing tactic being employed at the highest levels in addition to low levels like message boards

Romney: Questions about Wall Street and inequality are driven by `envy’ - The Plum Line - The Washington Post

In it , Mitt Romney plays the ENVY CARD and is taken to task for it. This is what needs to happen each and every time this silly tactic is offered in place of rational discussion on a national tax policy.

QUESTIONER: When you said that we already have a leader who divides us with the bitter politics of envy, I’m curious about the word envy. Did you suggest that anyone who questions the policies and practices of Wall Street and financial institutions, anyone who has questions about the distribution of wealth and power in this country, isenvious? Is it about jealousy, or fairness?
ROMNEY: You know, I think it’s about envy. I think it’s about class warfare. When you have a president encouraging the idea of dividing America based on 99 percent versus one percent, and those people who have been most successful will be in the one percent, you have opened up a wave of approach in this country which is entirely inconsistent with the concept of one nation under God. The American people, I believe in the final analysis, will reject it.​
QUESTIONER: Are there no fair questions about the distribution of wealth without it being seen as envy, though?
ROMNEY: I think it’s fine to talk about those things in quiet rooms and discussions about tax policy and the like. But the president has made it part of his campaign rally. Everywhere he goes we hear him talking about millionaires and billionaires and executives and Wall Street. It’s a very envy-oriented, attack-oriented approach and I think it will fail.
Romney was twice given a chance to nod in the direction of saying that concerns about these problems have at least some legitimacy to them, that they are about something more than mere envy or class warfare, and that they are deserving of a public debate. And this is the answer he gave. At a time when polls show rising public anxiety about these problems and what they mean for the country’s future — and at a time when Dems are preparing to run a campaign focused on economic unfairness and lack of Wall Street accountability while painting Romney as the candidate of the one percent — this seems like a pretty revealing and important moment.

The equivalent whine that teen age snotty girls use - "don't hate me because I'm beautiful", looks really stupid when it comes out of the mouth of somebody supposedly a business and economic leader who wants to be President of the USA?
 
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Re: Romney's tax rate is only half as high as the middle class pays

Romney's right! In Obama's presidencies abject failure, his campaign has appealed to class warfare. His obvious target has been the weaker minded among us who can be manipulated into believing that their lack of success is due to the super rich.

Damn, I forgot that it's not about envy!

Sorry.
 
Re: Romney's tax rate is only half as high as the middle class pays

This is perfect slapping down the whine about the ENVY CARD

To Romney, Detractors Suffer From Envy - The Daily Beast

Yet, like the snobby homecoming queen who thinks everyone hates her because they are jealous, Romney can’t see that it’s not his financial success in itself that is the problem. It’s that many people find his self-serving brand of capitalism—which was the hallmark of the recent economic collapse—repulsive.

Don’t blame the green-eyed monster. It’s simply that Americans are increasingly fed up with the behavior of the ultra-wealthy who have enriched themselves with no regard for the pile of middle class bodies they leave in their wake. In fact, a Pew poll released Wednesday discovered that two thirds of the public (66 percent) believes there are “very strong” or “strong” conflicts between the rich and the poor, up 19 points since 2009.

Playing the ENVY CARD is cheap and anti-intellectual in the extreme. We need a rational discussion about a national tax policy for 311 million Americans and that cannot happen when one side pats itself on the back and wallows in the delusion that everybody with a different opinion secretly wants to simply be like them.
 
Re: Romney's tax rate is only half as high as the middle class pays

Romney's right! In Obama's presidencies abject failure, his campaign has appealed to class warfare. His obvious target has been the weaker minded among us who can be manipulated into believing that their lack of success is due to the super rich.



Sorry.

There indeed is class warfare in this nation - as Warren Buffett has loudly stated - the wealthy have not only been waging class warfare upon the rest of us for quite a while now - they are happily winning that class warfare.
 
Re: Romney's tax rate is only half as high as the middle class pays

and this from SLATE emphasizes the serious economic questions that the right wing tries to gloss over with the fraudulent self serving charge of envy

This is the real issue here. There's a sense that a lot of us have that our public policy ought to be aiming to produce large gains for everyone. You often hear that for one reason or another the United States "can't afford" this or that. We "can't afford" to pay people Social Security benefits. We "can't afford" to build high-speed trains. We "can't afford" to give everyone early childhood education. But why can't we afford this stuff? Are we a poor country? No, we're not. We're one of the richest countries that's ever existed. Are we a poorer country than we used to be? No, we're not. But a very large share of the gains we've made over the past three decades have gone to a relatively small number of people. If the gains had been broadly shared, then the burden of paying for that basic infrastructure and public services would have to be very broadly shared. But the gains have been very concentrated, and so if we're going to afford that stuff, a large share of the revenue has to come from the people who've gotten the money.

That's not envy, that's math.

Excellent.

Of course, reality and facts will not stop the warriors of the right from hitting their own kneecaps with that little rubber hammer.
 
Re: Romney's tax rate is only half as high as the middle class pays

There indeed is class warfare in this nation - as Warren Buffett has loudly stated - the wealthy have not only been waging class warfare upon the rest of us for quite a while now - they are happily winning that class warfare.
Damn, I forgot that it's not about envy!
 
The median effective tax rate in the US is 27%. That's how much the typical American pays between state and federal taxes. Megamillionaire robber baron Mitt Romney, however, only pays 15%.

I was under the impression that the effective tax rate was 11%.
 
Re: Romney's tax rate is only half as high as the middle class pays

Damn, I forgot that it's not about envy!

How could you forget when you keep obsessing about it?
 
Re: Romney's tax rate is only half as high as the middle class pays

How could you forget when you keep obsessing about it?
Yeah, I'm the one looking for idiotic political blogs to prove I'm not envious. Well, as PT Barnum once said, "There's a sucker born every minute.":mrgreen:
 
Re: Romney's tax rate is only half as high as the middle class pays

Here is my opinion. Romney has paid taxes based on current laws and therefore has done nothing wrong. Just like Pelosi, Reid, Obama, etc.

Why do the "rich" who want to see change so they will pay more have to wait till the tax law is changed. Make a donation to the US today. Bet they don't. So this whole issue has turned politics of left vs right instead of what really needs to change in tax law.
It is also my opinion, everyone should pay something in federal taxes, everyone.
 
Re: Romney's tax rate is only half as high as the middle class pays

Yeah, I'm the one looking for idiotic political blogs to prove I'm not envious. Well, as PT Barnum once said, "There's a sucker born every minute.":mrgreen:

He quotes far left liberal blogs one minute, then laughs at someone for linking to a Fox News report the next.

It's called hypocrisy.
 
Re: Romney's tax rate is only half as high as the middle class pays

Here is my opinion. Romney has paid taxes based on current laws and therefore has done nothing wrong. Just like Pelosi, Reid, Obama, etc.

Why do the "rich" who want to see change so they will pay more have to wait till the tax law is changed. Make a donation to the US today. Bet they don't. So this whole issue has turned politics of left vs right instead of what really needs to change in tax law.
It is also my opinion, everyone should pay something in federal taxes, everyone.

You hit the nail on the head. Romney paid his taxes according to the law, did not "shelter" any money or funds from the tax code, and did nothing illegal.

Seems that the norm is to complain symptoms, rather than finding a solution to the problem( see illegal immigration, taxes, health insurance, etc ).
 
Re: Romney's tax rate is only half as high as the middle class pays

Yeah, I'm the one looking for idiotic political blogs to prove I'm not envious. Well, as PT Barnum once said, "There's a sucker born every minute.":mrgreen:

Your repeated posts obsessing about justifying the right wing playing the ENVY CARD certainly prove that.
 
Re: Romney's tax rate is only half as high as the middle class pays

He quotes far left liberal blogs one minute, then laughs at someone for linking to a Fox News report the next.

It's called hypocrisy.

Since you appear to be criticizing my posts, please provide proof of your charges or have the decency to retract them.

If we have indeed fallen so far down the ideological rabbit hole that now someone wanting a rational discussion of national tax policy is tagged with being FAR LEFT it shows just how hopeless this situation has become.

Q: Why don't you defend the policy instead of making ad hominem attacks on me and others here who want a rational discussion of national tax policy?
A: Defending the tactics of the right by attacking their critics is the favored methodology as opposed to defending a indefensible policy which benefits a relatively small minority.
 
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Re: Romney's tax rate is only half as high as the middle class pays

Since you appear to be criticizing my posts, please provide proof of your charges or have the decency to retract them.

If we have indeed fallen so far down the ideological rabbit hole that now someone wanting a rational discussion of national tax policy is tagged with being FAR LEFT it shows just how hopeless this situation has become.

Q: Why don't you defend the policy instead of making ad hominem attacks on me and others here who want a rational discussion of national tax policy?
A: Defending the tactics of the right by attacking their critics is the favored methodology as opposed to defending a indefensible policy which benefits a relatively small minority.

Pot meet kettle.
 
Re: Romney's tax rate is only half as high as the middle class pays

Pot meet kettle.

Aside from using the cliche in a drive-by post devoid of substance, can you back that up?

What do you find wrong with asking someone to back up their charges made against another poster?
 
Re: Romney's tax rate is only half as high as the middle class pays

Aside from using the cliche in a drive-by post devoid of substance, can you back that up?

What do you find wrong with asking someone to back up their charges made against another poster?

Here's a few examples that were easily found:

haymarket said:
The very idea that there are thinking individuals in the nation who actually look to FOX for news is either laughter inducing or will drive one to tears.

haymarket said:
I am sure that there are some FOX viewers who simply like the way the network looks and their on-the-air personalities. I am also sure that there are FOX viewers who watch it for the ideological and partisan spin that you get which is obvious and at times rather blatant.

a statement like this from apdst
Anyone that watches FNC is just as informed as someone that watches CNN, or MSNBC.
is screaming for documentation. And, if true (and that is one gigantic IF) I wonder what it is that the FOX viewer is informed about? Birtherism? The evils of government? Obama and his TelePrompTer? Libertarian talking points?

haymarket said:
FOX is a proven partner of the right wing alliance in America. This whitewash or downplaying of violent and murdersome right extremism should surprise nobody.

And this one seems especially fitting.........

haymarket said:
Self induced denial is far worse.

You were correct for a change.
 
Re: Romney's tax rate is only half as high as the middle class pays

Well, now I'm thinking that Romney didn't know what he was talking about when he said "about 15%". Gingrich has released his 2010 tax forms:

The federal tax of $994,708 amounted to 31.7 percent of their $3,142,066 adjusted gross income.

More than three-quarters - $2,525,683 - of the Gingrichs’ personal income was from partnerships and so-called S corporations, and the couple reported $450,245 in traditional salary-type income.

I'd make a new thread about it, but for some reason, I can't post it. The textbox in New Posts will not allow me to copy/paste. Very strange.

Gingrich releases records showing nearly $1M in federal taxes paid on 2010 income – CNN Political Ticker - CNN.com Blogs

Please notice that his salary income is more than 4X greater than that of the CEO of Berkshire Hathaway, the third richest man in the world, Warren Buffett.

To those who have consistently claimed in this post that their effective tax rate is 15% or even higher, please do the math on your own tax return so you don't continue to look foolish. Here's his tax return: http://www.newt.org/sites/newt.org/files/GingrichIncomeTaxReturn.pdf

Take Line 60 of your own return and divide it by Line 37. Thanks.
 
Re: Romney's tax rate is only half as high as the middle class pays

Well, now I'm thinking that Romney didn't know what he was talking about when he said "about 15%". Gingrich has released his 2010 tax forms:



I'd make a new thread about it, but for some reason, I can't post it. The textbox in New Posts will not allow me to copy/paste. Very strange.

Gingrich releases records showing nearly $1M in federal taxes paid on 2010 income – CNN Political Ticker - CNN.com Blogs

Please notice that his salary income is more than 4X greater than that of the CEO of Berkshire Hathaway, the third richest man in the world, Warren Buffett.

To those who have consistently claimed in this post that their effective tax rate is 15% or even higher, please do the math on your own tax return so you don't continue to look foolish. Here's his tax return: http://www.newt.org/sites/newt.org/files/GingrichIncomeTaxReturn.pdf

Take Line 60 of your own return and divide it by Line 37. Thanks.

Mine's never been above 10.7%.
 
Re: Romney's tax rate is only half as high as the middle class pays

Here's a few examples that were easily found:







And this one seems especially fitting.........



You were correct for a change.

How is criticizing the lack of fair journalism on FOX not a fit subject for debate? And how is someone using shoddy journalism from that source not a fit subject for debate.
 
Re: Romney's tax rate is only half as high as the middle class pays

How is criticizing the lack of fair journalism on FOX not a fit subject for debate? And how is someone using shoddy journalism from that source not a fit subject for debate.

How is criticizing the lack of fair journalism in Slate and the Daily Beast not a fit subject for debate??? And how is someone using shoddy journalism from those sources not a fit subject for debate ??
 
Re: Romney's tax rate is only half as high as the middle class pays

Since you appear to be criticizing my posts, please provide proof of your charges or have the decency to retract them.


So now anyone whom dares to criticize a posting from you needs to include any and all previous posting from you that brings one to the conclusion that they have of your posts? Is that how you proceed when being critical of another poster in here that is opposing you ideologically? Not from what I have seen from you, but that is just my opinion so I won't be giving you several thousand links of your own words. So, if "decency" is what you seek now, I applaud that, and will look for you to set that standard.

If we have indeed fallen so far down the ideological rabbit hole that now someone wanting a rational discussion of national tax policy is tagged with being FAR LEFT it shows just how hopeless this situation has become.

Yes, it is true that the ideological sides of any particular argument have widened, and entrenched deeper into their own views without any real willingness to accept the others points of view as being even remotely valid. Do you think that is a problem that is only suffered by your opponents? Or can you step back and possibly look and see that this was possibly intentionally stoked for political purposes on both sides at different times?

Q: Why don't you defend the policy instead of making ad hominem attacks on me and others here who want a rational discussion of national tax policy?

We ought to scrap the current tax codes. Eliminate the IRS, and make tax policy simpler. Example, Everyone, and I do mean everyone should pay say a flat 15% on income, and instead of withholding from paychecks they should have to send it in three days before any election.

A: Defending the tactics of the right by attacking their critics is the favored methodology as opposed to defending a indefensible policy which benefits a relatively small minority.

Are you really saying that the liberal left doesn't do this exact same thing? Or is it that you are only bitching about a particular tactic, commonly used, because you find that tactic effective, but only if you can use it?

j-mac
 
Re: Romney's tax rate is only half as high as the middle class pays

How is criticizing the lack of fair journalism in Slate and the Daily Beast not a fit subject for debate??? And how is someone using shoddy journalism from those sources not a fit subject for debate ??

By all means - if I use something from those sources and you find something wrong in it, present what you think is wrong and the evidence as to why.
 
Re: Romney's tax rate is only half as high as the middle class pays

How is criticizing the lack of fair journalism in Slate and the Daily Beast not a fit subject for debate??? And how is someone using shoddy journalism from those sources not a fit subject for debate ??

By all means - if I use something from those sources and you find something wrong in it, present what you think is wrong and the evidence as to why.
 
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