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Police kill armed eighth-grader in Texas school

Frolicking Dinosaurs said:


This is the police radio during the shooting. I don't have the heart to listen to it, but it may help those who are wondering if the police action was or was not justified.
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I just listened to it, and wish that I hadn't....How sad.

j-mac
 
Road Warrior said:
Do you support making Middle Schools a Condition Hot, Weapons Free Zone?
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If we want a safe environment we should encourage all teachers and all administrators to carry weapons. Perhaps we could give them an additional monthly income in each month they can show they range qualified and carried their weapons.
 
Misterveritis said:
If we want a safe environment we should encourage all teachers and all administrators to carry weapons. Perhaps we could give them an additional monthly income in each month they can show they range qualified and carried their weapons.
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Just because you give a person the ability to carry a weapon, it doesn't mean they will have fortitude to use it. There is a reason they are in education, not the military/police. It would make more sense to have police patroling the school.

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The problem being that in our modern society, the majority of people do not have the fortitude to use a weapon. The fact that we have separate military and police does not excuse the fact that so many people are unprepared, both physically and psychologically, to defend themselves and others; it is in fact wholly inexcusable that we have allowed ourselves, as a society, to grow so soft.
 
Viktyr Korimir said:
The problem being that in our modern society, the majority of people do not have the fortitude to use a weapon. The fact that we have separate military and police does not excuse the fact that so many people are unprepared, both physically and psychologically, to defend themselves and others; it is in fact wholly inexcusable that we have allowed ourselves, as a society, to grow so soft.
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I don't see anything wrong with someone not having the fortitude. They have their way, I have mine.

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Chaddelamancha said:
I don't see anything wrong with someone not having the fortitude. They have their way, I have mine.
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If someone does not have the fortitude to use a weapon, then they are incapable of upholding their moral obligation to their families and their nation to defend them. These obligations are universal regardless of the existence of people whose full-time job is to provide for that defense.
 
Viktyr Korimir said:
If someone does not have the fortitude to use a weapon, then they are incapable of upholding their moral obligation to their families and their nation to defend them. These obligations are universal regardless of the existence of people whose full-time job is to provide for that defense.
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Assuming that using a weapon is the only way, which isn't the case. People can defend both the nation and their family without ever picking up a gun.

Also, my way is irrelevant.

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I love these "feel good" stories. This kid was going nowhere in a hurry.
 
Chaddelamancha said:
Also, my way is irrelevant.

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:ROFL: Yeah, ok there....I am sure it's a doozy....So menacing that you don't even want to reveal what the plan would be....heh, heh....



j-mac
 
j-mac said:
:ROFL: Yeah, ok there....I am sure it's a doozy....So menacing that you don't even want to reveal what the plan would be....heh, heh....



j-mac
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Don't be dumb, it doesn't help your argument any. I work hard and make money so I can have home in a nice neighborhood with a good security system.

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Viktyr Korimir said:
The problem being that in our modern society, the majority of people do not have the fortitude to use a weapon. The fact that we have separate military and police does not excuse the fact that so many people are unprepared, both physically and psychologically, to defend themselves and others; it is in fact wholly inexcusable that we have allowed ourselves, as a society, to grow so soft.
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Quoted because it really needs to be said again, and emphasized.

So many ills in our society today are a direct consequence of this cowardice and infortitude on the part of far too many Americans. We've let our government become our master rather than our servant, because we've become a nation of submissive cowards.

I think that the great men who founded this nation would be deeply ashamed of what we have allowed it and ourselves to become.
 
Aunt Spiker said:
Like teachers and staff - as well as anyone who walks onto campus?
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Anyone with a permit to carry a concealed pistol. This means we're automatically talking about citizens 21 and older who have passed a criminal background check by the Sharif's department, completed any training requirements of their state and have been issued the CCW permit by the State. We are not talking about teens or children. We are not talking about felons. We are not talking about any rifle. Other than that, it doesn't matter if the law-abiding non-violent citizen in question is a teacher, a parent, or an old man taking his dog for a walk.
Aunt Spiker said:
So we can turn our schools into an all out warzone - yeah, smart. I don't think that would help - it would just worsen our problems. Just because someoen HAS a permit to carry doesn't mean they know how to handle it or keep it out of the hands of others.
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Doesn't matter, it's a specifically enumerated Constitutional right. Law abiding citizens have more right to carry a pistol onto school grounds then women have the right to abort or gays to marry. You are more than 17x more likely to die from a doctor's mistake than a CCW holder's mistake.
 
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The police apparently shot him three times. That's not that much. I've seen recordings on those cop shows where men charge police with knives and get shot like two-dozen times. I'm siding with the police on this one.
 
Jerry said:
Doesn't matter, it's a specifically enumerated Constitutional right. Law abiding citizens have more right to carry a pistol onto school grounds then women have the right to abort or gays to marry.
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I don't think right to "bear arms" very specifically enumerates a right to carry a pistol on school grounds. You can argue that such a right is implicit from the broad wording, but you can just as easily infer a right to gay marriage from the broad wording of EP or the P&I clause.
 
Sad about this kid. I'm with the police on this one, though. Kid brought a gun to school, and pulled it on the cops when they arrived. I'd have shot the kid, too. His age becomes more or less irrelevant, in this situation. HE made the choice to cease being a child, and to become an enemy combatant, when I pulled out a fire arm. Guns are the great equalizer. Even in the hands of a 12,13,14, whatever age, year old. Plenty of bloody history with child soldiers to know this.

As for having teachers carry guns onto school grounds...I'm of mixed minds on this. Thing is, we say something like this under the assumption that a teacher is a balanced, moral, decent person. And I gotta say, this just isn't always the case. I'd say the ratio for teachers being a tad, or totally off, is the same as the ratio for students being a tad, or totally off. Meaning, it would be a wash, in my opinion. Seems to me, in most any school, there has to be at least ONE or two kids who's parents are police officers. Have THOSE parents/officers be the on duty cops at those schools. The idea that we should arm the very same people that are molesting, raping, misleading, kidnapping, and in other ways corrupting our youth is a bit disturbing to me.
 
Whatever a child does, they're still a child. It's not something that can be turned on and off.
 
Manc Skipper said:
Whatever a child does, they're still a child. It's not something that can be turned on and off.
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To a point I can agree, but this was not an 8-year-old, but an eighth grader. That eight grader should have had the sense to put the gun down instead of pointing at the police or, better yet, not bring a realistic gun to school.
 
Viktyr Korimir said:
The problem being that in our modern society, the majority of people do not have the fortitude to use a weapon. The fact that we have separate military and police does not excuse the fact that so many people are unprepared, both physically and psychologically, to defend themselves and others; it is in fact wholly inexcusable that we have allowed ourselves, as a society, to grow so soft.
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How many times have you had to defend yourself using a weapon where you live?
 
Oh my god this is so screwed up.

I feel really terrible for the cop that had to make that call. This is the sort of situation where no matter what you do, you go home with nightmares.

Assuming the report as we currently have it is correct, this sort of thing is insanely tragic. Part of me wonders why nobody noticed something was up before this happened, but so often the signs are so small with kids like this up until they do something like whip out a gun at school.
 
Ben K. said:
How many times have you had to defend yourself using a weapon where you live?
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Once in my own home. Three or four times while traveling, mostly in bus stations. A few cases where I needed a weapon to defend myself and didn't have one.
 
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