• This is a political forum that is non-biased/non-partisan and treats every person's position on topics equally. This debate forum is not aligned to any political party. In today's politics, many ideas are split between and even within all the political parties. Often we find ourselves agreeing on one platform but some topics break our mold. We are here to discuss them in a civil political debate. If this is your first visit to our political forums, be sure to check out the RULES. Registering for debate politics is necessary before posting. Register today to participate - it's free!

Federal Judge Orders Cincinnati Not To Ticket OWS'ers

Ikari said:
So what? You ain't got a right to not see every asshole out there. In fact, in any given day you're going to come across numerous nuisances and assholes. Just because these guys have gathered doesn't mean that we should try to find as many ways as possible to prevent them from gathering.
Click to expand...

The law has been the law for as long as I remember. Parks have always had closing hours. These people are violating a reasonable law. Time to start making them pay the fines or put their asses in jail. They are hurting some of the local businesses.
 
TurtleDude said:
The law has been the law for as long as I remember. Parks have always had closing hours. These people are violating a reasonable law. Time to start making them pay the fines or put their asses in jail. They are hurting some of the local businesses.
Click to expand...

It's after hours, how does that "hurt some local businesses"? You got data to back that up?
 
Ikari said:
It's after hours, how does that "hurt some local businesses"? You got data to back that up?
Click to expand...

1) because one local business holds wedding receptions and other parties

Data-I work near there. I hear what people are saying

and these people are whining that people like me are responsible for their failures. I see them as the enemy
 
TurtleDude said:
1) because one local business holds wedding receptions and other parties

Data-I work near there. I hear what people are saying

and these people are whining that people like me are responsible for their failures. I see them as the enemy
Click to expand...

Well I think you did a very good job misrepresenting the point of their protest. So then you heard from some guy that they are negatively impacting local businesses and for that reason we should enforce rules over them to interrupt their ability to assemble and protest? Not the best argument I've heard for this.
 
Ikari said:
Well I think you did a very good job misrepresenting the point of their protest. So then you heard from some guy that they are negatively impacting local businesses and for that reason we should enforce rules over them to interrupt their ability to assemble and protest? Not the best argument I've heard for this.
Click to expand...

The right to assemble and protest is not an unlimited right. There comes a point when other people's rights start being affected, so reasonable restrictions must be taken. These people protesting that their student loans should be forgiven don't have any right to harm others. Their right's don't supersede others.
 
Ikari said:
There's nothing that prevents them from changing those hours, is there?
Click to expand...

Jesus H. Christ, Ikari. You've lived in a rural area all your life or what? Hell YES there's a legitimate reason -- after dark, a park is used for criminal activity or is a magnet for kids who then are prey for criminals.

Inside a city, a green space/park is a criminal's playground....no open sight lines, few people around, those there for innocent reasons are off their guard, impossible to patrol, etc.
 
Ikari said:
Yes, or changing the hours to prevent protesting. There's no restriction on that restriction and they can do as they like.
Click to expand...

There obviously are existing restrictions on TIMES the parks can be used. You seem to think the OWS protests are some holy war and that these laws should be suspended for their benefit....the law doesn't make distinctions like this. You are suggest that the city discriminate against everyone BUT OWS protestors by allowing them to camp, and that, the constitution does prohibit.

Our government cannot prohibit our speech or assembly based on the CONTENT of our speech or reason for assembling.
 
TurtleDude said:
The law has been the law for as long as I remember. Parks have always had closing hours. These people are violating a reasonable law. Time to start making them pay the fines or put their asses in jail. They are hurting some of the local businesses.
Click to expand...

Which park are they in, Turtle?
 
Gill said:
The right to assemble and protest is not an unlimited right. There comes a point when other people's rights start being affected, so reasonable restrictions must be taken. These people protesting that their student loans should be forgiven don't have any right to harm others. Their right's don't supersede others.
Click to expand...

Would you also apply that logic to ALL rights or are there some you would say are unlimited?
 
TurtleDude said:
1) because one local business holds wedding receptions and other parties

Data-I work near there. I hear what people are saying

and these people are whining that people like me are responsible for their failures. I see them as the enemy
Click to expand...

So people who "hurt local businesses" are seen by you as the enemy. Does that also apply to Wal Mart who comes into communities and destroys local businesses?
 
Reg said:
The local law enforcement are ******s.
Click to expand...

As we've seen across the country throughout the whole "Occupy" debacle. Deputize me and the guys I do medieval re-enactment combat with and we'll clear these parks out in 20 minutes, tops. We'll also improve the local economy by putting money in the local hospital's pockets.
 
haymarket said:
Would you also apply that logic to ALL rights or are there some you would say are unlimited?
Click to expand...

I thought I was pretty clear............ a person does not have the right to inflict harm on another.

Plain enough for you ??
 
Pinkie said:
Which park are they in, Turtle?
Click to expand...

Piatt Park which is a couple blocks north of Fountain Square which is the center of downtown Cincinnati

Ikari sympathizes with the anti rich, anti capitalist nature of these people. I think for the most part-based on the interviews of the protestors, they are attention whores who want to be part of a cause even if they cannot articulate any logical goals or why stinking up a public park is going to make a difference. The good news is that the weather has been really crappy the last couple days so that might be why they ran off after 23 were arrested
 
TurtleDude said:
Piatt Park which is a couple blocks north of Fountain Square which is the center of downtown Cincinnati

Ikari sympathizes with the anti rich, anti capitalist nature of these people. I think for the most part-based on the interviews of the protestors, they are attention whores who want to be part of a cause even if they cannot articulate any logical goals or why stinking up a public park is going to make a difference. The good news is that the weather has been really crappy the last couple days so that might be why they ran off after 23 were arrested
Click to expand...

Yep, I figure this will come to a quick end when the weather turns cold in a few weeks. Long range forecasts are calling for another extremely cold and snowy winter over much of the country.

Another simple way to end it would be for all the corporate owned wi-fi signals to be locked or turned off so that the protestors couldn't use their Chinese made corporate smart phones to communicate.
 
TurtleDude said:
Ikari sympathizes with the anti rich, anti capitalist nature of these people.
Click to expand...

That's certainly a lie on a few fronts. The main contention of OWS isn't completely "anti-capitalist" (there are likely those elements in there, but not completely composed there of), the whole of it certain is anti-corporate capitalism; the economic system we currently have (not free market capitalism). I don't sympathize with anti-rich sentiments either; I sympathize with freedom and liberty and the ability of people to exercise their rights to their maximum. Please don't lie.
 
Last edited:
Gill said:
The right to assemble and protest is not an unlimited right. There comes a point when other people's rights start being affected, so reasonable restrictions must be taken. These people protesting that their student loans should be forgiven don't have any right to harm others. Their right's don't supersede others.
Click to expand...

And what rights did they infringe upon?
 
Pinkie said:
Jesus H. Christ, Ikari. You've lived in a rural area all your life or what? Hell YES there's a legitimate reason -- after dark, a park is used for criminal activity or is a magnet for kids who then are prey for criminals.

Inside a city, a green space/park is a criminal's playground....no open sight lines, few people around, those there for innocent reasons are off their guard, impossible to patrol, etc.
Click to expand...

That insult didn't address the question, did it now? Jesus H. Christ Pinkie, if you're going to quote my post and bitch about it; at least get the subject matter right.
 
Pinkie said:
There obviously are existing restrictions on TIMES the parks can be used. You seem to think the OWS protests are some holy war and that these laws should be suspended for their benefit....the law doesn't make distinctions like this. You are suggest that the city discriminate against everyone BUT OWS protestors by allowing them to camp, and that, the constitution does prohibit.

Our government cannot prohibit our speech or assembly based on the CONTENT of our speech or reason for assembling.
Click to expand...

I know that. You seem to have missed what I said. Try reading, come back when you figure out what was written.

BTW, a lie on your part is that you claim I think that the OWS protests are some holy war. I do not. I simply believe in freedom and liberty and thus upholding our rights, including protest and assembly, to their maximum. My contentions on protest are not limited to OWS. It's all protest, dissent, assembly, redress, etc.

What can I say, I love freedom.
 
Ikari said:
That's certainly a lie on a few fronts. The main contention of OWS isn't completely "anti-capitalist" (there are likely those elements in there, but not completely composed there of), the whole of it certain is anti-corporate capitalism; the economic system we currently have (not free market capitalism). I don't sympathize with anti-rich sentiments either; I sympathize with freedom and liberty and the ability of people to exercise their rights to their maximum. Please don't lie.
Click to expand...

no one has the freedom to violate reasonable restrictions on public park uses

and what do those clowns want

I watched them

Tax the rich

Get rid of debt

etc

disgusting scum
 
Ikari said:
What can I say, I love freedom.
Click to expand...

What can I say, I prefer LAW & ORDER, and would like to see the people being PAID to ensure it either be FIRED or FORCED to do something about it.
 
TurtleDude said:
no one has the freedom to violate reasonable restrictions on public park uses

and what do those clowns want

I watched them

Tax the rich

Get rid of debt

etc

disgusting scum
Click to expand...

Their desire to get rid of the debt makes them disgusting scum? Mmm...interesting.

I think that "reasonable restrictions" shouldn't always override rights; particularly assembly and protest given the importance to those in terms of keep the Republic. I'd rather take a temporary nuisance hit with protesters in a part at night than excuse government force against the exercise of a right. That's just the way I typically side when it comes to rights.

What they want is for people to pay attention to the world around them. That's why they're engaged in a magnitude protest. The main contention is that there is extreme mixing of State and Corporate entities and interests which have brought an end to free market and installed instead corporate capitalist. In this system the government is employed to selectively promote certain entities above others and also leads to the closing down of competition and economic mobility. And on that front, they have a point.
 
Tigger said:
What can I say, I prefer LAW & ORDER, and would like to see the people being PAID to ensure it either be FIRED or FORCED to do something about it.
Click to expand...

Well you're a self admitted authoritarian, so I don't care what you think. Fascists don't influence my decisions.
 
Ikari said:
Well you're a self admitted authoritarian, so I don't care what you think. Fascists don't influence my decisions.
Click to expand...

I can't speak for Fascists, but once we get an Authoritarian government in place, it will most definitely influence your decisions, unless you want to be spending time somewhere that makes Alcatraz look like DisneyLand.
 
Tigger said:
I can't speak for Fascists, but once we get an Authoritarian government in place, it will most definitely influence your decisions, unless you want to be spending time somewhere that makes Alcatraz look like DisneyLand.
Click to expand...

I'd probably be the latter, or dead. But with luck I would have at least killed as many of you folk as possible.
 
Ikari said:
I'd probably be the latter, or dead. But with luck I would have at least killed as many of you folk as possible.
Click to expand...

Yeah probably one of those two. Of course I'm not sure how much success you'd have against that Predator UAV when it comes to your home, but hey you can always try. ;-)
 
Last edited:
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top Bottom