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HS Student Refuses To Recite Mexican Pledge Of Allegiance

Reg said:
That would be something students were forced to do.
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So homework is forced on students? Tests, quizzes, mid-terms, and finals are forced on to them?
 
Pinkie said:
Did you read the linked article? The students were also asked to learn "hispanic culture" (what a stupid term) and study Mexican Independence Day.
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How is "hispanic culture" a stupid term? There is a hispanic culture, just like there is a european, asian, and african culture.
 
Mr. Invisible said:
How is "hispanic culture" a stupid term? There is a hispanic culture, just like there is a european, asian, and african culture.
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In the literal definition of the word, Hispanic culture is a sub-set of European culture, as it derives from the word 'hispania', denoting the Iberian Peninsular.
 
Hatuey said:
Here's the point ludahai, it doesn't matter how much you scream this is indoctrination. It wasn't something kids were being forced to on a mass scale. It wasn't something they needed to do in order to remain in the school. It was an assignment. She didn't do it because she didn't like it? Good for her. Now she has an F. She's not being kicked out of class. She's not being told she can't come to school. She's not being ostracized by her community. She got an F. That's it.

Indoctrination is what christians do to their children. You know, force them to go to church. Force them to pray to some imaginary fairy. Force them to believe in something which makes no sense to rational adults. That my old friend, is indoctrination. Refusing to do school work? Lol, that's just life.
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You are way out of line here buddy. Have you ever even raised a child? I'd love to hear what you really know about it.
 
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spud_meister said:
In the literal definition of the word, Hispanic culture is a sub-set of European culture, as it derives from the word 'hispania', denoting the Iberian Peninsular.
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I dig where you are coming from, but Hispanic culture has definitely changed very much since the times of 20th century European imperialism/colonialism to the point where Latin America has its own unique culture.
 
Mr. Invisible said:
I dig where you are coming from, but Hispanic culture has definitely changed very much since the times of 20th century European imperialism/colonialism to the point where Latin America has its own unique culture.
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Then you need a new name for it that doesn't denote a connection to the Iberian Peninsular. :2razz:
 
My Spanish teacher was from Puerto Rico. I guess that would mean that our assignment would have been to recite the US pledge of allegiance in Spanish, though it never happened.
 
nota bene said:
Maybe she was. But we don't know much about Reyna Santos except that she is from Mexico herself and that, according to the student, she "loves Mexico." How old is she? If she's very young, maybe she was just fired up about the "Grito" (celebrated on 9-15):

Mexican Independence Day - 16 de Septiembre - Independence Day in Mexico

McAllen is a border town that has always been "porous." It's different down there from, say, an Ohio town. Remember David Hartley, the American jet skiier living in McAllen who was murdered last year on the shared lake?

What I mean is that there are tremendous tensions on the border. My bet is that the teacher is young and enthusiastic--this is her first year--and that with all the negative attention, she really regrets this assignment. Here's what the school district says:

Nothing wrong with Spanish class that riled parent | mcallen, parent, riled - McAllen ISD - TheMonitor.com
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Yea, I get the "it's different in Texas" thing...I do. I have friends in Arizona, and believe me, New York (where I grew up) is not insular.

I still think the teacher was wrong and what's worse is, I think the school district is wrong for backing her. Once a student complained/did not comply, it was possible for them both to pause and reflect. At that point, her inexperience, overenthusiasm for Mexico, and/or delight at Mexican Independence Day could have been revisited and she (the teacher) could have made things right.
 
spud_meister said:
In the literal definition of the word, Hispanic culture is a sub-set of European culture, as it derives from the word 'hispania', denoting the Iberian Peninsular.
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It's a nonsense word, as most Spanish speakers are in the Americas, and some are in Africa, the Caribbean, etc. There no homogenous "hispanic culture" anymore than there is any identifiable "white culture".

That's assuming you are even able to decide which Spanish speakers are and which are not white....the whole thing just dissolves in a bubbling caldron of bigotry, IMO.
 
The student, and her parents, can take the matter to school administrators if satisfaction is not achieved in the classroom .. and to the press if necessary.

Since this was a Spanish class, and indeed a number of countries speak Spanish as their principal language, the Spanish pledge of allegiance would have been academically appropriate.

Considering the region of the U.S. where this occurred, there is understandably political tension regarding illegal immigration and Mexican threats to annex parts of the U.S. for Mexico once sufficient infiltration occurs.

The teacher was at the very least insensitive to a political hot button that affects Americans and their jobs in the region.

I would be interested in knowing more about the teacher.
 
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as hatuey said, she can refuse and then not get credit for that "assignment".
 
Pinkie said:
Well, true, but that is not why I thought this was discussion-worthy. I agree with the student, -- the teacher went beyond her goal of teaching kids to speak Spanish and tried to force them to learn things about Mexico, including their pledge of allegiance.

Many people would like there to be no real boundary between the US and Mexico...as if all Mexicans have a right to live, work, and elsewise enjoy the benefits of being an American that the citizens of no other nation on Planet Earth has. We're attacked for calling illegal aliens "illegal aliens", and over and over, told that we MUST give the people from Mexico who are here but did not get our permission to enter "amnesty".

Whatever the teacher's POVs may be on immigration, she should not be abusing her position as a public HS Spanish teacher to foist them on her students.
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wow....i think you are reading way more into this than the article gives you. first of all, did you never study foreign cultures in school? i sure did. you are turning this into a rant about illegals with no background whatsoever. jesus, chill. by all means, let's not ever teach our children about other cultures.
 
Pinkie said:
It's a nonsense word, as most Spanish speakers are in the Americas, and some are in Africa, the Caribbean, etc. There no homogenous "hispanic culture" anymore than there is any identifiable "white culture".

That's assuming you are even able to decide which Spanish speakers are and which are not white....the whole thing just dissolves in a bubbling caldron of bigotry, IMO.
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The problem isn't the word, it's how you use it. Hispanic, as a word, should apply to people from Spain, Portugal, Andorra and Gibraltar, and so 'Hispanic culture' is the the combined cultures of those 3 nations and 1 British territory, not a single homogeneous culture, but an umbrella term for the numerous cultures of the Iberian Peninsular (much in the same way white culture is used to denote all cultures of European, or European settled countries, not a single culture). It's the misapplication of it by Americans to refer to people from Spanish speaking countries that the confusion begins.
 
Pinkie said:
Yes, I applaud the student.

I'm just alarmed and offended by the teacher and school district, that they thought this was an appropriate assignment.
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There's a lot that goes on in schools these days that I just look at and go...really????
 
I'm honestly baffled by the entire premise of this thread. :shock:

What exactly is the problem here? Reciting the words to another country's anthem or pledge in a language class has no patriotic meaning whatsoever. The words will only mean something to those with emotional ties to the country in question. I can't even begin to grasp what that sudent's objections actually are. Did she think she was magically becoming a Mexican citizen by reciting the words? I mean WTF is wrong with some people's brains?? :shock:
 
liblady said:
as hatuey said, she can refuse and then not get credit for that "assignment".
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That seems simple enough.

There is, of course, another way to look at the matter: the teacher could simply have wanted to emphasize that Spanish-speaking people in the region belong to Mexico, should be reciting the Mexican pledge of allegiance, and should be living in Mexico, not the U.S.

We probably lack sufficient information here to know.

Whether the teacher was spinning a liberal message or a conservative one, or was merely ignorantly insensitive to a regional hot-button issue, it would have been more academically appropriate and politically neutral for the assignment to have been to recite the Spanish pledge of allegiance.

Regardless, operating under the guise of an academic focus on "hispanic culture in the region" is not a valid excuse for the teacher's behavior.

The student was given an alternative assignment, one that appeared to require considerably more effort than reciting the Mexican pledge. More appropriate would have been to recite the Spanish pledge, considering that, linguistically speaking, Spain is the language foundation origination of "hispanic culture in the region".

Absent of any liberal or conservative oriented malice on the part of the teacher, the student should not have been punished for being more aware than her teacher.

Both liberals and conservatives would do well to be less political party-animalistic and more understanding in their response to these matters.
 
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liblady said:
wow....i think you are reading way more into this than the article gives you. first of all, did you never study foreign cultures in school? i sure did. you are turning this into a rant about illegals with no background whatsoever. jesus, chill. by all means, let's not ever teach our children about other cultures.
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Of course I studied world cultures....back then, it was prolly called something else. Lord knows what.

You can conclude my inferences about the intent of the teacher and the school are baseless. Obviously, I disagree. Not that this is my main objection to all this, but I have Cuban-American friends who've taken blow-back because they've been mistaken for illegal Mexican aliens by idiots. Likewise, Puerto Ricans, Mexican-Americans, etc.

If you can't see the racism inherent in the illegal immigration issue, I can't help you. If you think this teacher did not wander off the reservation, well, that's your opinion.

T'aint mine.
 
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Both liberals and conservatives would do well to be less political party-animalistic and more understanding in their response to these matters.
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Did you mean to direct this at me, as well as others on this thread? I'm not being snarky; I'm curious. Can you explain how, if so?

BTW, I loved the rest of your post. I think you are 100% correct.
 
Pinkie said:
Of course I studied world cultures....back then, it was prolly called something else. Lord knows what.

You can conclude my inferences about the intent of the teacher and the school are baseless. Obviously, I disagree. Not that this is my main objection to all this, but I have Cuban-American friends who've taken blow-back because they've been mistaken for illegal Mexican aliens by idiots. Likewise, Puerto Ricans, Mexican-Americans, etc.

If you can't see the racism inherent in the illegal immigration issue, I can't help you. If you think this teacher did not wander off the reservation, well, that's your opinion.

T'aint mine.
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i just don't understand why you've tied a teacher asking her SPANISH class to memorize the mexican pledge to illegal immigration. quite a stretch.
 
liblady said:
i just don't understand why you've tied a teacher asking her SPANISH class to memorize the mexican pledge to illegal immigration. quite a stretch.
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I don't think so, obviously. I've already laid out my reasoning in other posts, so if you've read the entire thread, I bounce this back to you. What's so preposterous about inferring an intent to promote the interests of illegal Mexican aliens in the US in that teacher's assignment?
 
Hatuey said:
She has the right to refuse to do the assignment and her teacher has the right to fail her. It was an assignment for class not something students were being forced to do.
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This assignment amounts to a English teacher making students wash her car for a grade. It is not related what so ever to the subject she teaches.
 
Pinkie said:
I don't think so, obviously. I've already laid out my reasoning in other posts, so if you've read the entire thread, I bounce this back to you. What's so preposterous about inferring an intent to promote the interests of illegal Mexican aliens in the US in that teacher's assignment?
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it's preposterous because you have not one whit of evidence. but, as you said, it's your opinion.
 
jamesrage said:
This assignment amounts to a English teacher making students wash her car for a grade. It is not related what so ever to the subject she teaches.
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When you're a statist, you support the state position to the death. Damn the children or reason.
 
American said:
When you're a statist, you support the state position to the death. Damn the children or reason.
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American...I've seen that word here on DP, but nowhere else that I recall. What is a "statist"?
 
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