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Republicans block Obama jobs bill

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Jryan said:
Republicans are controlling congress by filibustering, JESUS TAP DANCING CHRIST!!!!
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:shock: HE COULD WALK ON WATER AND TAP DANCE? i'm impressed!!!:mrgreen:
 
whysoserious said:
According to Gallup, job creation is on the rise and firings are dropping as well:
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Also, bls.gov shows that between September 2010 and September 2011, 1,739,000. That's almost 2 million in one year. And, per the previous report I posted, those numbers increasing more each month, yeah, I'd say it is very possible he can not only match Reagan's numbers but beat them.

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As for comparing recessions, I agree that the inflation probably made it difficult for every American, but this recession is not the same type of recession, so while some would have faired better in the 80's under Reagan, others are doing much worse. I already posted an entire article comparing the two recessions, if you recall. You're comparing the second half to a double dip recession to a recession that may double dip or may not - no one knows.
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For months now first time unemployment claims have been over 400,000 and that isn't going to create a net job gain. Obama has no economic policy to create 17 million jobs and small businesses which make up about 80% of the new hires aren't going to hire people with the overhang of Obamacare and the micromanaging of this Administration. Obama doesn't have a clue how to lead or manage anything as evidenced by the numbers I posted which no one has refuted. Doesn't matter how many jobs are created if their is a net job loss and since he took office it is 2.6 million.

Still no answer to the question, wonder why?
 
whysoserious said:
Again, he was fortunate to be in the second-half of a double dip recession, whereas Obama appears to have begun his presidency at the onset of a long-drawn out recession. They are not similar. However, Obama has not finished his term, so it isn't fair to criticize him just yet. At least give him a couple more quarters before you stand in judgment.

May I assume if GDP starts growing by 4% and more after this quarter you will support Obama?

*Edit to add:
Good night, I assume we will continue this discussion manana.
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Since that isn't going to happen including projections from his own Commerce Dept. it isn't something I am going to have to consider. I don't like Obama's policies at all nor his economic results.
 
Catawba said:
The unmanageable debt came from 30 years of deficit spending. They are related you know. The jobs plan pays for itself by eliminating some of the tax breaks for the wealthiest. All reports show they have the most water in their bucket due to 30 years of tax breaks that benefited them most. It will take an improved economy to reduce our deficit, jobs improve the economy.
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Per the WH website “To ensure that the American Jobs Act is fully paid for, the President will call on the Joint Committee to come up with additional deficit reduction necessary to pay for the Act and still meet its deficit target.” So, no the Joint Committee has NOT FOUND A WAY TO PAY FOR IT YET! Jobs created by moving money around are not sustainable but merely kicking the can.


Lets see a link to your source that you claim links a great strain on the economy based on the physical damage on 9/11?
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The original post about ‘great strain’ was not mine. Our discussion began from your disagreement that 9/11 put this strain on the economy. More specifically your position was ‘our over reaction to it’ to which I disagreed.

Your graph compares the lowest income earners to the highest income earners. My claim was the middle class tax rates have gone up over the last 30 years, while the tax rates for the most wealthy have gone down, as seen below:
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Your graph compares the ‘riches 400 people’ out of 315million against the middle class. Do you think this is represents a legitimate comparison? Wouldn’t comparing an extreme element to a median element usually reveal some great disparity? Essentially the comparison groups are extreme compared to each other.

Why trickle down economics has been incredibly unsuccessful:
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Your graph to support the ‘trickle down’ argument is the ‘increase in national debt’. I miss the correlation.

For those who primarily get their income from inheritance and capital gains, they pay a lower effective tax rate on their total income than do the middle class.
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Did you miss my original post about the ‘apples/oranges’ comparison of wage income vs. capital gains? I guess not. What you miss is that the inheritance and capital gains taxes are ‘double taxes’. One cannot have income from capital gains until he first has income to invest and thus profit to incur capital gains taxes. This initial income is taxed at the income rate. The same is true on inheritance. I know you read the Politifact article which revealed this principal.
 
obvious Child;1059905426]When you argued that discouraged workers was doubling every month. Several of us tried to point out that the BLS data you were citing was cumulative. You refused to accept that at all. The problem is that by arguing that discouraged workers was doubling that the US population was doubling as well. You totally failed to read that chart properly and you got beaten rightfully into pulp for it.
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Never argued that at all, didn't know the answer, wrote BLS and got the answer, it is a monthly number NOT a cumulative number per the following

Published CPS levels are not cumulative, and the number of discouraged workers are displayed in thousands and are not seasonally adjusted.
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Guess you are wrong as well. Want me to make a big deal out of it like you have which of course has nothing to do with the thread topic?


Hardly; See my previous post you liar.
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Personal Attack or is calling someone a liar a sign of admiration?


Actually if we all just treated you like the clown you are, you wouldn't be a problem.
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Personal attack or is calling someone a clown a sign of admiration?

Wow. YOU STILL DON'T GET IT. Every month is the net total. Meaning that every month shows the net cumulative change. Seriously. You STILL DON'T understand the data you cite. That is embarrassing. I doubt you even know what cumulative means at this point.
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Every month is a stand alone number according to BLS


Really? Nothing Cumulative In your chart?
So every month shows an additional amount of discouraged workers? Not the TOTAL discouraged workers?
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Every month is a stand alone number so discouraged workers plus the "official" unemployed for September 2011 total over 15 million putting the unemployment rate at almost 9.8%

You are literally beyond hope here.
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Going to lose a lot of sleep over that one, another personal attack? Let someone else decide


So basically you just made up in your head what you think I argued putting absolutely no work into finding out what I actually said.

Basically you admit you are a liar. You don't know what I said, you just made it up and hoped it was what I said. The fact you keep doing this is an admission you are a compulsive liar.
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Personal attack unless calling someone a liar is a sign of admiration


See my post above this one. Liar.
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Personal attack, believe you got the word liar down pat. Interesting how anyone that disagrees with you is called a liar. How about attempting to prove the Obama numbers I have posted wrong?


You know, we point out your actual failures and that is your response.

You don't understand what cumulative is. You cannot read BLS data properly as evident in your own post where you claimed that the BLS data isn't cumulative yet you posted cumulative data. You don't know why chain, real and nominal are different. You haven't the faintest idea why deleveraging seriously changes a recession. And you expect us to take you seriously.

You basically make up things to attack us on when we cite very specific screw ups you have. WOW.
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So you took the time to respond, issue personal attacks and yet have not responded to the actual Obama data posted. According to you I cannot read BLS data correctly yet you have yet to prove that. Here are the Obama numbers as of Sept. 2011 so take a shot at proving them wrong

Obama economic results in 2011,
.4% GDP and 1.3% GDP growth in 2011(bea.gov)
2010 2011
I II III IV I II
3.9 3.8 2.5 2.3 0.4 1.3

25+ million unemployed or under employed Americans in 2011(bls.gov)
2.6 million fewer jobs(bls.gov)
4.2 trillion added to the debt in less than 3 years(U.S. Treasury Site)
Downgrade of the U.S. credit rating(S&P)
Rising Misery index 7.83 to 12.97 (The United States Misery Index By Year)
38-41% JAR and well over 50-55% disapproval ratings(Gallup)
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You haven't proven that I make anything up but you do use the word liar a lot which is a personal attack. Look forward to you proving the numbers I have posted as being wrong.
 
Every month is a stand alone number so discouraged workers plus the "official" unemployed for September 2011 total over 15 million putting the unemployment rate at almost 9.8%
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According to you, that puts unemployment at 5%.
 
Jryan said:
According to you, that puts unemployment at 5%.
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Where do you come up with that number. Obviously you need to learn how to calculate the unemployment number so let me help you

Labor Force 154.017 Million
Unemployed 13.992

Official Rate 13992/154017=9.08 or 9.1%

Now including Discouraged workers

Discouraged workers 1.037 million

Total Unemployed 139.992 + 1.037=15.029 million/154.017=9.76%
 
Jryan said:
According to you, that puts unemployment at 5%.
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WOW! By your calculation there are 300 million (15m/.05) in the work force...pretty incredible given the population is 315 million.
 
Dickieboy said:
WOW! By your calculation there are 300 million (15m/.05) in the work force...pretty incredible given the population is 315 million.
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Right, GW Bush snuck back into the WH and repealed all those child labor laws so now we have ALL Americans in the work force for you know how evil GW Bush was. I am trying to figure out what labor a new born and child under the age of 5 can actually do?

Wondered where he got the 5% from so thanks for clarifying.

This is the same person who claims that the GOP Controls the Senate because they can filibuster legislation
 
Conservative said:
Wondered where he got the 5% from so thanks for clarifying.
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Given the shape of the current education system (or lack of learning) does it surprise you that such simple mathematics calculation is performed incorrectly?
 
Dickieboy said:
Given the shape of the current education system (or lack of learning) does it surprise you that such simple mathematics calculation is performed incorrectly?
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Not at all and that is part of the problem. There seems to be an ideology out there today that ignores the very foundation upon which this country was built. Millions of voices however aren't being heard although the polls show it. A large majority of Americans are of the opinion that America is in decline and the poor leadership of this Administration who is more focused on dividing and promoting class warfare is to blame. In addition here is an excellent article on the subject and explanation as to why. Liberals and Obama supporters will ignore it because of the author but it is the content that matters.

Bill O'Reilly: America in Decline - Talking Points - The O'Reilly Factor - Fox News
 
Conservative said:
Not at all and that is part of the problem. There seems to be an ideology out there today that ignores the very foundation upon which this country was built. Millions of voices however aren't being heard although the polls show it. A large majority of Americans are of the opinion that America is in decline and the poor leadership of this Administration who is more focused on dividing and promoting class warfare is to blame. In addition here is an excellent article on the subject and explanation as to why. Liberals and Obama supporters will ignore it because of the author but it is the content that matters.

Bill O'Reilly: America in Decline - Talking Points - The O'Reilly Factor - Fox News
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O'Reilly? :lamo :lamo :lamo

Working together to solve larger problems doesn't mean we're not slef relient. O'Reilly has rarely ever gottne anything right. When will people stop listening to talking heads, entertainers who give next to nothing any real thought? If' you're listening to any of them, taking any of them seriously, be it Beck, O'Reilly, Maddow or Oberman, you are the problem.
 
Boo Radley said:
O'Reilly? :lamo :lamo :lamo

Working together to solve larger problems doesn't mean we're not slef relient. O'Reilly has rarely ever gottne anything right. When will people stop listening to talking heads, entertainers who give next to nothing any real thought? If' you're listening to any of them, taking any of them seriously, be it Beck, O'Reilly, Maddow or Oberman, you are the problem.
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As predicted, attack the messenger and ignore the message. what exactly in that message is inaccurate? Did you bother to even read the article?

Exactly right! Self reliance doesn't exist in today's world as there aren't any consequences for failure in the liberal world

The answer is the decline in self-reliance. If you understand history, you know that America was founded on the independent principles of honor and hard work. After we achieved independence from England, the federal and state governments basically stepped aside allowing businesses and communities to grow without much interference. If you failed, there was no safety net. You were on your own. And so the folks became strong out of self-preservation.

Read more: Bill O'Reilly: America in Decline - Talking Points - The O'Reilly Factor - Fox News
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Conservative said:
As predicted, attack the messenger and ignore the message. what exactly in that message is inaccurate? Did you bother to even read the article?

Exactly right! Self reliance doesn't exist in today's world as there aren't any consequences for failure in the liberal world
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I didn't ingore the message. It's BS, too silly for any thinking person to accept. it misses the point, and doesn't think beyond the talkingpoint they know their audience will swallow with no further thought. Like I said, if you're accepting these types of things, you are the problem.
 
Boo Radley said:
I didn't ingore the message. It's BS, too silly for any thinking person to accept. it misses the point, and doesn't think beyond the talkingpoint they know their audience will swallow with no further thought. Like I said, if you're accepting these types of things, you are the problem.
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Why specificly is it silly and misses the point. You believe people today are self reliant like our forefathers? You believe there are consquences in the liberal world for poor choices and failure? You think taking personal responsibility for your own life is silly? Or personal responsibility for poor choices?

More from the article

Since then, America has evolved into a country of two minds. Self-reliance remains the key to economic success, but for those who don't want to compete in the marketplace, or simply can't, the federal government has become their lifeblood. The collapse of the family has led to massive entitlement spending on children and single mothers. In addition, the liberal belief that the feds have a moral obligation to provide for the have-nots has led to massive debt. That, in turn, has weakened our economy and robbed America of power, thus the decline.

President Obama and to lesser extents Presidents Bush and Clinton before him believed in imposing social and worldwide justice using the U.S. Treasury. But the American worker cannot keep up with the tax burden that imposes, so now we're in trouble.


Read more: http://www.foxnews.com/on-air/oreilly/2011/10/26/bill-oreilly-america-decline#ixzz1bu2fAtVB
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Boo Radley said:
I didn't ingore the message. It's BS, too silly for any thinking person to accept. it misses the point, and doesn't think beyond the talkingpoint they know their audience will swallow with no further thought. Like I said, if you're accepting these types of things, you are the problem.
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Actually your post typifies and confirms the EXACT message...’America has evolved into a country of two minds’. How exactly are you NOT ‘accepting these types of things’ and are not ‘part of the problem’?
 
Conservative said:
Why specificly is it silly and misses the point. You believe people today are self reliant like our forefathers? You believe there are consquences in the liberal world for poor choices and failure? You think taking personal responsibility for your own life is silly? Or personal responsibility for poor choices?

More from the article
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Yes, I do. We enter forts to work against the natives. We raised barns and house together. We have alays had ways to help the poor and the infirmed. One way or another, we've always worked together to solve problems. When we didn't, people suffered. O'Reilly is just playing to the myth, and not the reality.
 
Boo Radley said:
Yes, I do. We raised barns and house together. We have alays had ways to help the poor and the infirmed.
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Your response seems to confirm that you do agree with the article. "The foundation of America's growing power was a code of conduct...neighborly charity."
 
Boo Radley said:
Yes, I do. We enter forts to work against the natives. We raised barns and house together. We have alays had ways to help the poor and the infirmed. One way or another, we've always worked together to solve problems. When we didn't, people suffered. O'Reilly is just playing to the myth, and not the reality.
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How did our forefathers get help? They did help each other and it wasn't the govt. that forced it which is contrary today as this govt. is dividing people and making it tougher for individuals to help each other. When taxes go up, contributions to charities goes down. When govt. divides and demonizes people thus creating dependence then self reliance is reduced as the incentive to take care of one's self is reduced.

It is this govt. that wants expanded control over individual personal responsibility issues and that plays right into the content of this article, self reliance is a declining trait and the promotion of the ideology of two types of people, the haves and the have nots which of course blames the haves for not helping the have nots. How is that not the decline in America.
 
Boo Radley said:
O'Reilly? :lamo :lamo :lamo

Working together to solve larger problems doesn't mean we're not slef relient. O'Reilly has rarely ever gottne anything right. When will people stop listening to talking heads, entertainers who give next to nothing any real thought? If' you're listening to any of them, taking any of them seriously, be it Beck, O'Reilly, Maddow or Oberman, you are the problem.
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Who on earth would take Bill "I'll do it live!" O'Reilly seriously? :lamo
 
pbrauer said:
Who on earth would take Bill "I'll do it live!" O'Reilly seriously? :lamo
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Aw, the diversion continues, it isn't the messenger it is the content of the message. Keep ignoring the decline of self reliance and divison of this country into class which of course means greater control for the Federal Govt. and decline of the state government. The liberal elite keep their power because of people like you
 
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