Labor Unions Join Wall Street Occupiers for "Mass Rally'

danarhea said:

I think you hit the nail on the head here. When the Tea Party was out protesting, these people were supporting them, and talking about how lucky we are to be Americans, and have free speech. Now that the other side is doing the exact same thing, free speech has become anti-American to them. Ya know, I wonder which is worse - People protesting Obama being an African who is not qualified to be president, or people protesting the corruption that has become part and parcel of the banksters. Of course, Obama not being a citizen is worse. He is not a Republican.

Damn hypocrites make me want to puke.

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Why yes...the two are so comparible. The Tea Party is protesting out of control giovernment spending that has **** on your grandkids and dumped on them a 15.5 trillion dollar debt with no end in sight and the OWS protesters 'demand' free education, someone else pay off their debt, demand a 'livable' wage regardless of whether or not they work...gimme gimme gimme. I totally agree...****ing piece of **** whiny freeloaders...makes me want to puke.

The rich should pull their investments from the banks and markets. Watch the union retirement accounts along with everyone elses 401ks take a total dump. They should let all the 'socialists' carry the ball...take care of all the sniveling whiners out of your pocket. Frankly...I think it would be fun to watch.

And BTW...what was YOUR position on the Tea Party? What was yor little 'likers' position? Full on supportive right? I mean...surely no hypocrisy...

haymarket said:

this superb column should be read by all

Herman Cain doesn't realize that young people today do not lack initiative. They lack opportunity - chicagotribune.com

a taste

Those who claim they just do not get what is happening in these protests need to read this article with an open mind.

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As there is an increase in social programs, and the bureaucracies needed to run them, there will be a corresponding decrease in the amount of money available for Americans to spend and invest.

It is impossible to have both. Many Americans seem to want their previous lifestyles while adding further social programs, That is quite impossible. A new world has been created in the United States and the American people will have to adjust. As well, their freedoms will diminish because they'll have to align themselves and their lives according to these social programs. This should not have been unexpected as it is not a new thing.

These people should be protesting against the growth of big government and big business both aligning their forces. They would join with the Tea Party in recognizing the dangers of Big Government and what inevitably happens.

We have seen the government become involved with automobile industry, General Electric,and huge amounts of money being funneled to other companies and corporations (Solyndra being just one of them) which is the real danger, and the people know little about it. These 'investments' are always for the 'public good', and the people find themselves $15 trillion dollars in debt and few care how it is ever going to be repaid. And they won't care until there is no money left for their social programs. Then the real protests will begin.

Not until the OWS join forces with the Tea Party will real change come about.

Why yes...the two are so comparible. The Tea Party is protesting out of control giovernment spending that has **** on your grandkids and dumped on them a 15.5 trillion dollar debt with no end in sight

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It is comparable. Until I see them either want to revert the Bush tax cuts, want to take cuts in their Social Security, take cuts in their Medicare, or cut the Defense budget they are just as spoiled as a kid wanting free education.

All of those are the major drivers of government debt, all of those benefit the age demographic of the Tea Party, and all are off limits....unless you just want to cut those things for future generations.

Looks pretty selfish to me.

iliveonramen said:

It is comparable. Until I see them either want to revert the Bush tax cuts, want to take cuts in their Social Security, take cuts in their Medicare, or cut the Defense budget they are just as spoiled as a kid wanting free education.

All of those are the major drivers of government debt, all of those benefit the age demographic of the Tea Party, and all are off limits....unless you just want to cut those things for future generations.

Looks pretty selfish to me.

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Selfish ????

You dare to compare a young 18 yo kid that has paid no more than $500 in taxes his entire life to a senior that has paid tens of thousands into social security and medicare for 40+ years ?????

One is expecting something for nothing............. the other is expecting a return on their investment and a promise fulfilled.

And by the way, national defense is the number one responsibility of the federal government.

How about you quit the class warfare and age discrimination and demand the true solution.......... responsible government spending.

MaggieD said:

I agree with you (and the quote) completely.

Otherwise wonderful parents have very carefully created unrealistic expectations in their children. In the name of self-esteem, they have created arrogance. Then life hits 'em up the side of the head and they holler, "Not fair!!!!"

Subjective example #1: 22-year-old married and moved out of state. Anxious for a teaching job in Red Neck territory. I tough sell for a transplant. She sent out dozens of resumes; had a half-dozen or so interviews; and got the call from one of them telling her she'd gotten the job. Was she ecstatic? Did she feel fortunate? Uhhhhh, no. She said to the caller, "I'm going to discuss it with my husband and call you back." The caller said, "We had 200 applicants for this position. We're just going to move on." She was devastated. "That's not fair," she said. She's substituting all over the county this year.

Subjective example #2: Graduated last year. A teacher who wants to coach basketball at the college level. He can't find a job. Won't even apply for other positions. Lives at home with mom and dad who pay many of his living expenses as he holds out for his dream job. None of this "entry-level" crap for him. Hell, that's everybody's dream job. He's disallusioned. Ya' think??

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Subjective example #3: Degree in Electrical Engineering and degree in Math. Ran an air conditioning company for 18 years, before it was sold to a new owner, who ran it into the ground in less than a year. Took him seven months to obtain another job. Turned down for low paying jobs because he was "overqualified". Turned down for higher paying jobs because he was "unemployed", so there must have been something wrong with him, according to those who interviewed him. Interviewed by one recruiter, who was so impressed that he was introduced to the president of the company, and after that, his calls and emails were never returned. Dozens of resumes sent in, many applications made, and at least 5 interviews - This was each week for 7 months, before he was able to obtain another job.

This is ME!! The problem with a few of you here in this forum is that, according to what you post, you believe that the unemployed are unemployed because there is something wrong with them, when in actuality, they are unemployed because the job market at this time is an employer's market. There are many qualified people who are trying very hard to obtain another job. I saw them every time I went to an interview, lined up for that interview, just as I was. The job I finally obtained had more than 200 applications for it, and there were more than 50 interviews. I got lucky. The others weren't so lucky, but God damn it, they were not lazy people, and the insinuations from some of you that they are lazy are insulting. There are a lot of good people out of work through no fault of their own. But you won't understand until you lose your own job, and then have to hustle your asses off to find another one, like I did. But you know what? I would not wish that on you. I am not that kind of a douche bag. So, best wishes to you, and I hope what happened to me does not happen to you. I mean that.

Gill said:

Selfish ????

You dare to compare a young 18 yo kid that has paid no more than $500 in taxes his entire life to a senior that has paid tens of thousands into social security and medicare for 40+ years ?????

One is expecting something for nothing............. the other is expecting a return on their investment and a promise fulfilled.

And by the way, national defense is the number one responsibility of the federal government.

How about you quit the class warfare and age discrimination and demand the true solution.......... responsible government spending.

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Umm, this whole thread as well as other Wall Street threads have depicted the young unfavorable. It's a little late to take the "higher ground" after having to go through pages of "hippie no good no wanting to work selfish kids". I finally responded to it. I'm fine with keeping generational warefare out of the discussion yet it's repeatedly been brought up in every Wall St protest thread.

I think safety nets are a great thing. I think Defense is needed. I also think you should pay enough taxes to cover those expenses...true fiscal conservatism.

I don't care what taxes you paid, it obviously wasn't enough to fund the things you wanted, hence massive deficit in the Trillions. It's math. Now every conservative or Tea Party proposal seeks to remedy that by asking me to pay the same rate you did in SS/Medicare, and receiving less services when I finally retire. Hence, you want to close the debt entirely on my generations shoulders.
Your generation has paid the lowest income tax rates since the 1920's and you create a "Taxed Enough Already" group to protest any more taxes.

My generation will be paying off the deficit, my generation will be seeing less in services than we paid in and you can straight face call my generation the selfish ones....because they complain about not getting a job? Please.

If you are still looking for a job, here's one for you.... you can get paid to camp out on Wall Street.

courtesy of a CraigsList help wanted ad. Pays pretty good too.

The Working Families Party (WFP) (Working Families) is New York's most energetic, independent and progressive political party. Formed in 1998 by a grassroots coalition of community organizations, neighborhood activists, and labor unions, we came together to build a society that works for all of us, not just Wall Street CEOs and the well-connected. WFP is independent from corporate and government funding and in-addition we are community based; community funded and equally uninfluenced by both major parties. Our agenda focuses on economic and social justice, corporate accountability, job creation, environmental protection, and investment in education and healthcare.

For the past twelve years the WFP has been at the fore front of progressive politics,

Leading the fight and helping to frame the debate. The WFP has a proud record of fighting for issues that matter and has been instrumental in implementing key pieces of legislation such as Raising New York's Minimum Wage, Enacting Living Wage Laws, Creating Thousands of Jobs In the Green Economy, Passing Healthcare Reforms on the Local Level, Fighting for Affordable Housing, Keeping Tuition Costs Low, A Progressive Tax Code, Reliable/Cost Effective Public Transit System, Public Financing Of Elections and Corporate Accountability . In addition, we have an unapologetic stance on supporting and pushing good candidates to enact progressive legislation

The WFP is seeking immediate hires.

Compensation: $350-$650 A Week Depending On Responsibility & Length Of Time On Staff

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FIGHT TO HOLD WALLSTREET ACCOUNTABLE NOW! MAKE A DIFFERNENCE GET PAID!

Gill said:

If you are still looking for a job, here's one for you.... you can get paid to camp out on Wall Street.

courtesy of a CraigsList help wanted ad. Pays pretty good too.



FIGHT TO HOLD WALLSTREET ACCOUNTABLE NOW! MAKE A DIFFERNENCE GET PAID!

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Not a good job. Lobbyists for oil companies and banks make much more.

iliveonramen said:

Umm, this whole thread as well as other Wall Street threads have depicted the young unfavorable. It's a little late to take the "higher ground" after having to go through pages of "hippie no good no wanting to work selfish kids". I finally responded to it. I'm fine with keeping generational warefare out of the discussion yet it's repeatedly been brought up in every Wall St protest thread.

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Obviously you aren't fine with keeping generational "warefare" (is that supposed to be welfare??) out of the discussion since you seem to think that young kids that haven't contributed anything to the country should get a free ride.

I think safety nets are a great thing. I think Defense is needed. I also think you should pay enough taxes to cover those expenses...true fiscal conservatism.

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Most of us think we are paying more than enough taxes to cover those "necessary" expenses.

I don't care what taxes you paid, it obviously wasn't enough to fund the things you wanted, hence massive deficit in the Trillions. It's math. Now every conservative or Tea Party proposal seeks to remedy that by asking me to pay the same rate you did in SS/Medicare, and receiving less services when I finally retire. Hence, you want to close the debt entirely on my generations shoulders.
Your generation has paid the lowest income tax rates since the 1920's and you create a "Taxed Enough Already" group to protest any more taxes.

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The massive deficit only happened in the past ten years. We had a fiscally irresponsible Republican in office that spent too much, followed by a maniac that thinks money grows on trees that took Bush's deficit and put it on steroids.

I paid enough taxes to fund more than what I wanted, but I didn't pay enough for all the wasted spending that government has become.

I suggest you do a little reading if you think my generation has paid the lowest income tax rates since the 1920s. No, I take that back........you need a class in reasoned thinking. I've paid taxes for over 40 years. Do you actually think rates were that low for that entire time??? When I started paying taxes, the marginal rate for $50,000 income was 54%. The only time it was higher was immediately after WW2 to pay for the cost of the war.

My generation will be paying off the deficit, my generation will be seeing less in services than we paid in and you can straight face call my generation the selfish ones....because they complain about not getting a job? Please.

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If these folks occupying Wall Street get their way, your great-great-grandchildren will be paying your debt, that is if they last long enough. Nobody is calling anyone selfish because they can't get a job, they are selfish for thinking someone owes them something for nothing.

danarhea said:

Not a good job. Lobbyists for oil companies and banks make much more.

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Yeah, but those jobs require skills beyond organizing groups of gullible folks to sleep in a park.

I stuck this in another thread, but these number are from 2010 tax returns:

How Much Money Do The Top Income Earners Make By Percentage? | Financial Samurai

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For instance, the top 5% of all wage earners earn about 35% of all wages paid, yet pay over 58% of all wage taxes paid. That's pretty progressive.

Tell us what is fair libs. Tell us what the numbers should be. And "why" please.

And if the bitch is investment income, taxed at 15%, which is about equal to the progressive income rate already higher than the bottom 70% of wage earners pay, then tell us how much hgher that should go too, and why. And what will this do to the migration investment monies ?

Tis tis Tis did you forget about the Wall Street bailouts? Let's see GM was bailed out their incompetent CEO was fired compared with Wall street was bailed out their incompetent CEO's remained CEO's and are right back to huge salaries and bonuses.

We have seen the government become involved with automobile industry, General Electric,and huge amounts of money being funneled to other companies and corporations (Solyndra being just one of them) which is the real danger, and the people know little about it. These 'investments' are always for the 'public good', and the people find themselves $15 trillion dollars in debt and few care how it is ever going to be repaid. And they won't care until there is no money left for their social programs. Then the real protests will begin.

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The tea partiers should wake up and smell the dandelions they are no more representative of the people's needs they as Herman Caine would say have been brainwashed

Obviously you aren't fine with keeping generational "warefare" (is that supposed to be welfare??) out of the discussion since you seem to think that young kids that haven't contributed anything to the country should get a free ride

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Free ride? Large debts to get an education while needing an education in order to survive in the present economy, trillions in debt, a crumbling infrastructure, high unemployment, median incomes lower than they've been in decades. Don't worry, you guys have left things so that we'll be paying for a very long time. You can take solace in the fact you've screwed future generations.

Most of us think we are paying more than enough taxes to cover those "necessary" expenses.

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Okay, and that benefits the people that will be paying those debts down how? We're talking generations here. You guys are making blanket statments of my generation. Your generation did not bring in enough revenue to cover expenses. There was obviously not a political movement to run a balanced budget or you would.

The massive deficit only happened in the past ten years. We had a fiscally irresponsible Republican in office that spent too much, followed by a maniac that thinks money grows on trees that took Bush's deficit and put it on steroids.

I paid enough taxes to fund more than what I wanted, but I didn't pay enough for all the wasted spending that government has become.

I suggest you do a little reading if you think my generation has paid the lowest income tax rates since the 1920s. No, I take that back........you need a class in reasoned thinking. I've paid taxes for over 40 years. Do you actually think rates were that low for that entire time??? When I started paying taxes, the marginal rate for $50,000 income was 54%. The only time it was higher was immediately after WW2 to pay for the cost of the war.

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Yes, and 40 years ago the budgets were relatively balanced. The deficits grew in the 80's by around 300%...with a Republican President that pushed for tax cuts. Just think about what you typed out, after WW2, tax rates were high to pay for the cost of the war. Compare that to Bush whose voting demographic was overwhelmingly your generation and the fact he CUT taxes while we fought 2 wars. The only consistent thing that's happened since 1980's is taxes have gone down while deficits have gone up. We'll be paying for that. You're virtually charging future generations for your tax cuts.

If these folks occupying Wall Street get their way, your great-great-grandchildren will be paying your debt, that is if they last long enough. Nobody is calling anyone selfish because they can't get a job, they are selfish for thinking someone owes them something for nothing.

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No they won't, there would be tax increases to actually pay for our goods instead of these loopholes built into the tax code. There wouldn't be companies like GE payin 0% in taxes while shipping jobs overseas. The fact the avg tax rate of the top 400 richest households in America is 16%ish wouldn't exist. We'd actually be able to compete in a global economy because....we'd actually be educating our future rather than giving them a choice between poverty or poverty via student loan debt.

EarlzP;1059862988]My vision of the federal government is to provide a country that responds to the needs of the majority of the people, let me give you some examples enforcement of the trade agreement, regulatory laws and enforcement of those laws to protect the consumer and the environment of the air, water and land masses

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What does the state govt. do then in your world. The role of the Central Govt. was to be limited and has expanded to what it is today. Interesting that we have a 3.7 trillion dollar govt. today that has been built on social engineering dollars all because of people like you not holding your state responsibile for results and expecting more out of the Federal Govt. than it was intended to do.

First as an employee I never felt over worked, I never felt that I could do more work in 8 hours then was possible, work output differs from one person to another, work ethics aside education and experience can tilt productivity.

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And it appears that you benefited from that hard wrok.

As a manager I felt it was part of my job use those assigned to me in the most productive way possible and to deal with less productive employees in a way that encouraged them to increase their productivity, I will give you a clue happy hands are busy hands

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Good, that is local responsibility and not Federal Responsibility. Sounds like you were a good manager and there are more like you than many want to acknowledge

I don't like to fight but when my back is against the wall those who are confronting me and leaving me little to no choice but to defend myself and those that I love will find l believe in doing what ever it takes to discourage them from a need to repeat the experience again, that said when companies or individuals steal from the people and get no protection from those who are supposed to protect them they may need to organize and use their numbers to convince those companies and individuals that they are capable of defending their selves and their families

What do I say it looks like the rebirth of the real Boston tea party, scary isn’t it

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When companies steal from the people they should be prosecuted to the fullest extent of the law. The problem here is too many people broad brush the problem and make it bigger than it really is. What exactly is going to be accomplished by the Wall Street protests? Wall Street doesn't make the laws.

Eighty Deuce said:

...And if the bitch is investment income, taxed at 15%, which is about equal to the progressive income rate already higher than the bottom 70% of wage earners pay, then tell us how much hgher that should go too, and why....

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FYI:

Capital gains tax in the United States - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

In 2008–2012, the tax rate on qualified dividends and long term capital gains is 0% for those in the 10% and 15% income tax brackets.

so if you pay yourself a $1 yearly salary from your corporation, and the rest of your income is from investments, you pay ZERO income tax. its good to be the king huh?

Gill said:

Yeah, but those jobs require skills beyond organizing groups of gullible folks to sleep in a park.

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I see. By your standards, oil companies and banks can have the government's ear, but ordinary people can't, because they are not as good? Who is the freakin' elitist now?

Eighty Deuce said:

If and when folks finally protest at such as the White House, it will be to get Obama to do more to redistribute the wealth. Bank it.

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They are in D.C. My money is on the belief that those in politics who think they have something to gain are actually going to be hurt. They can not play both sides of the fence here in addressing the complaints of the OWS crowd and those who financially support them.

Yes, there is a segment that are there for no other reason than to support Obama. That can not be the message though or it's completely dismissed. Despite what may be Obama's core beliefs, he can not act on them and he won't.

He'll make a bunch of speeches with all sorts of accusations but as we see with his Jobs Bill, nobody is listening to his speeches any longer. He acts or he gets further marginalized. He isn't going to act. He can't.

Thunder said:

FYI:

Capital gains tax in the United States - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

In 2008–2012, the tax rate on qualified dividends and long term capital gains is 0% for those in the 10% and 15% income tax brackets.

so if you pay yourself a $1 yearly salary from your corporation, and the rest of your income is from investments, you pay ZERO income tax. its good to be the king huh?

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Nonsense, Your short term rates are 10 and 15% respectively. Do you understand the difference between short term and long term ?

Show us what you believe to "not be fair", and why. As has been demonstrated, all taxes are progressively slanted as it is. Libs want it slanted even mor. How much more ? What will that remedy ? By how much /

danarhea said:

Not a good job. Lobbyists for oil companies and banks make much more.

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Yeah, a lot of them in the video look like they'd make persuasive lobbyists, if cleanliness and clarity of thought is overlooked.

EarlzP said:

Tis tis Tis did you forget about the Wall Street bailouts? Let's see GM was bailed out their incompetent CEO was fired compared with Wall street was bailed out their incompetent CEO's remained CEO's and are right back to huge salaries and bonuses.

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Great! The taxpayers will now be held responsible for incompetent CEO's and the government will take over the business. It must be great to live in a country where nobody, apart from incompetent CEOs, can fail.

danarhea said:

I see. By your standards, oil companies and banks can have the government's ear, but ordinary people can't, because they are not as good? Who is the freakin' elitist now?

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Huh... I didn't Gill say they weren't good enough, or that ordinary people cannot gain the governments ear... just making stuff up doesn't do much Dan, nor does adding your own accusations when there's nothing to base it on. :shrug:

Originally Posted by EarlzP

Tis tis Tis did you forget about the Wall Street bailouts? Let's see GM was bailed out their incompetent CEO was fired compared with Wall street was bailed out their incompetent CEO's remained CEO's and are right back to huge salaries and bonuses.

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Great! The taxpayers will now be held responsible for incompetent CEO's and the government will take over the business. It must be great to live in a country where nobody, apart from incompetent CEOs, can fail.

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Please be patient I just had dinner onions, peppers, potatoes and sausage and my brain is unable to digest your reply.

Taxpayers=government you know we elect them good or bad. We the taxpayers are in charge. So I am trying to under stand what you have written "typed" do you think that CEO's who ran businesses that failed on their watch should be fired? or Should they be bailed out and given large salaries and bonuses?

Do you work? What would happen to you if you did not do your job? If you say you would have been given a large salary and big bonus please tell me where you work there are 14 million Americans who are looking for jobs.

Ockham said:

Huh... I didn't Gill say they weren't good enough, or that ordinary people cannot gain the governments ear... just making stuff up doesn't do much Dan, nor does adding your own accusations when there's nothing to base it on. :shrug:

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Thanks... just read his post and was scratching my head trying to figure out what the hell he was talking about and how he got that from my post.

danarhea said:

Subjective example #3: Degree in Electrical Engineering and degree in Math. Ran an air conditioning company for 18 years, before it was sold to a new owner, who ran it into the ground in less than a year. Took him seven months to obtain another job.

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Were you willing to move to where the jobs are? Many are not.
I hire plenty of EEs, MEs and other hard sciences types (physics and mathematics mostly). But I only hire the ones who are willing to move to where the work is.

1Perry said:

They are in D.C. My money is on the belief that those in politics who think they have something to gain are actually going to be hurt. They can not play both sides of the fence here in addressing the complaints of the OWS crowd and those who financially support them.

Yes, there is a segment that are there for no other reason than to support Obama. That can not be the message though or it's completely dismissed. Despite what may be Obama's core beliefs, he can not act on them and he won't.

He'll make a bunch of speeches with all sorts of accusations but as we see with his Jobs Bill, nobody is listening to his speeches any longer. He acts or he gets further marginalized. He isn't going to act. He can't.

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Oh, he could. What's money, when one has the power to make much, much more? You see, the compromise that will be made of all this mess is, we leave big business alone, and we raise the taxes on the wealthy. The substance dulled masses will clamber to offer applause, individuals with wealth will act hurt, the republicans will claim it's a blow against freedom, justice, and the american way, and Obama will make a pretty speech when it's all done, congratulating all of us, congress, and himself, for being able to come together in solidarity, and get things done in a crisis. And then, 3 - 6 years later, we'll be right back where we were, huge deficit, even higher income gaps between rich and not rich, and higher costs of living, forcing those that were once middle class into the "poor" bracket. Why? Because those wealthy folks, if the way business is conducted in this country is not changed, can pretty much do whatever they want. We have anti trust laws, true, but they are largely ineffectual, when you have some companies that own enough other companies to control entire branches of our economy.