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Judge: Loughner can be made mentally fit for trial

Thunder

Thunder

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Judge: Loughner can be made mentally fit for trial - Yahoo! News

this psychotic schizophrenic...is actually going to stand trial for his crimes?

how can he be held accountable for crimes that he committed while totally bonkers, just because he is now being medicated by the govt. and has regained his marbles?

of course he is going go say he did it, he feels remorse for it, but he was out of his mind at the time.

just medicate this guy for life and he'll probably never hurt a fly.
 
Thunder said:
Judge: Loughner can be made mentally fit for trial - Yahoo! News

this psychotic schizophrenic...is actually going to stand trial for his crimes?

how can he be held accountable for crimes that he committed while totally bonkers, just because he is now being medicated by the govt. and has regained his marbles?

of course he is going go say he did it, he feels remorse for it, but he was out of his mind at the time.

just medicate this guy for life and he'll probably never hurt a fly.
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Even the insane make decisions. just not based on our social standards.
 
Thunder said:
he's gonna plead insanity, the jury and judge will agree. lets just save the red tape
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I say we give a 9mm handgun to Giffords and let her shoot him in the head. Then they'd be even.
 
Thunder said:
he's gonna plead insanity, the jury and judge will agree. lets just save the red tape
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Seriously? Let's all just skip due process?
 
Thunder said:
Judge: Loughner can be made mentally fit for trial - Yahoo! News

this psychotic schizophrenic...is actually going to stand trial for his crimes?

how can he be held accountable for crimes that he committed while totally bonkers, just because he is now being medicated by the govt. and has regained his marbles?

of course he is going go say he did it, he feels remorse for it, but he was out of his mind at the time.

just medicate this guy for life and he'll probably never hurt a fly.
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"Competent to stand trial" is a fairly/very low standard. The defendant must have some idea what the charges are and some ability to assist his counsel in his defense. (Note that he's being medicated against his will, which I find very interesting.)

Until he is declared competent, he can't take a plea. So, the trial or no trial decision point has yet to be reached....and when it is, there's no certainty he'll defend on legal insanity or that it'll be successful if he does. It very rarely is.

I'm too lazy to research the Arizona standard for legal insanity but most states use the M'naughton Rule: unable to tell right from wrong, essentially. Medically, he's certainly mentally ill but that doesn't correlate to an acquittal.

It's also possible (though too soon to tell) that the DA will refuse to offer a plea, because they want the death penalty -- that is essentially what just happened here in Cleveland, in the Anthony Sowell case.

Last but not least, if Loughner knew that going off his meds could result in violence and did so anyway WHILE SANE (legally), in some states, he's as guilty as any healthy person.
 
jamesrage said:
That scumbag should get the death penalty.He couldn't have been too insane if he researched what would happen if he got caught,which basically shows that he knew right from wrong.

Report: AZ Suspect Jared Loughner Researched Political Assassinations « Fox News Insider
http://www.nytimes.com/2011/01/27/us/27giffords.html
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It's not likely anyone who plans to the degree he did and also plans an escape is going to succeed on an insanity plea.

Personally, I think all the states need a "guilty but insane" verdict. Confine the defendant in a mental hospital for the criminally insane for as long as need be, and if they recover, move them to a prison to serve out their time.
 
Pinkie said:
It's not likely anyone who plans to the degree he did and also plans an escape is going to succeed on an insanity plea.
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The fact he researched what would happen proves that he knows right from wrong and that he knew that committing mass murder would get him into serious trouble.


Personally, I think all the states need a "guilty but insane" verdict. Confine the defendant in a mental hospital for the criminally insane for as long as need be, and if they recover, move them to a prison to serve out their time.
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States should have a "it doesn't matter if he is insane or not, he is still guilty and thus will get the same punishment anyone else who committed mass murder would get which is the death penalty or life without parole in a real prison" verdict.
 
The point, though, is that the states don't. The laws are what they are, and even a Jarod Loughner deserves and can benefit or suffer from the laws under which he committed his crimes..not what "should" or "could" be.
 
jamesrage said:
The fact he researched what would happen proves that he knows right from wrong and that he knew that committing mass murder would get him into serious trouble.
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Probably not, James. It's more likely that he was looking to emulate other political assasins. It's still damaging evidence if he tries on an insanity defense.

States should have a "it doesn't matter if he is insane or not, he is still guilty and thus will get the same punishment anyone else who committed mass murder would get which is the death penalty or life without parole in a real prison" verdict.
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If intent is no longer an element of the crime of murder, then the criminal law would be drastically changed. Accidents, even ones involving people having seizures or heart attacks, etc. would result in the same punishment as the most heinous murders. Our common sense of justice finds mercy for the child murderer, the retarded murderer, the murderer who was reckless but never intended to cause death, etc.

Doesn't mean all these people escape punishment...but even if I supported the death penalty, I'd reserve it for the blackest of crimes. So for me, I want a trial if Loughner is going to be executed.....I want to see whatever evidence there may be that he might have been able to control his behavior, and did not.
 
Jared Loughner has paranoid schizophrenia.
Mayo Clinic said:
With paranoid schizophrenia, your ability to think and function in daily life may be better than with other types of schizophrenia. You may not have as many problems with memory, concentration or dulled emotions.....

Delusions and hallucinations are the symptoms that make paranoid schizophrenia most distinct from other types of schizophrenia.
* Delusions. In paranoid schizophrenia, a common delusion is that you're being singled out for harm. For instance, you may believe that the government is monitoring every move you make or that a co-worker is poisoning your lunch. You may also have delusions of grandeur — the belief that you can fly, that you're famous or that you have a relationship with a famous person, for example. You hold on to these false beliefs despite evidence to the contrary. Delusions can result in aggression or violence if you believe you must act in self-defense against those who want to harm you.
* Auditory hallucinations. An auditory hallucination is the perception of sound — usually voices — that no one else hears. The sounds may be a single voice or many voices. These voices may talk either to you or to each other. The voices are usually unpleasant. They may make ongoing criticisms of what you're thinking or doing, or make cruel comments about your real or imagined faults. Voices may also command you to do things that can be harmful to yourself or to others. When you have paranoid schizophrenia, these voices seem real. You may talk to or shout at the voices.
* Other symptoms:
Anxiety
Anger
Emotional distance
Violence
Argumentativeness
Self-important or condescending manner
Suicidal thoughts and behavior
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Paranoid schizophrenia: Symptoms - MayoClinic.com

The ability to research how to kill or the consequences of killing do not necessarily mean that this man was not totally convinced by his delusions or auditory hallucinations that he must kill Gifford in self-defense. That he now has remorse is a pretty good indication that he was operating under a delusion that he now realizes was bogus.
 
This whole thing still smells fishy. But this is comming from someone that doesn't take news reports as truth.

A judge was meeting with an congresswoman off the recods and was assinated. Maybe this is some sorta huge clue. A judge teaming up with someone whos platform is congress on your street corner.

Many of the orignal news reports where confictling when it comes to the facts that matters. (multiple suspects or lone suspects. Shots fired. Types of guns used. Types of guns found.)

Until I see a the (supposed exsisting) video of Loughner pulling the trigger I will be scepticle he did it.
 
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dirtpoorchris said:
This whole thing still smells fishy. But this is comming from someone that doesn't take news reports as truth.

A judge was meeting with an congresswoman off the recods and was assinated. Maybe this is some sorta huge clue. A judge teaming up with someone whos platform is congress on your street corner.

Many of the orignal news reports where confictling when it comes to the facts that matters. (multiple suspects or lone suspects. Shots fired. Types of guns used. Types of guns found.)

Until I see a the (supposed exsisting) video of Loughner pulling the trigger I will be scepticle he did it.
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Well, I applaud your enthusiasm for the "innocent until proven guilty" standard. I think you are almost the only one who doesn't think he did it, though.
 
Pinkie said:
Well, I applaud your enthusiasm for the "innocent until proven guilty" standard. I think you are almost the only one who doesn't think he did it, though.
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I think that I don't know if he did it or not. I only know that alot of people have said he did it.
 
dirtpoorchris said:
I think that I don't know if he did it or not. I only know that alot of people have said he did it.
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I think it really is admirable you can keep such an open mind. It's what we're supposed to do....but most of us can't.

In this case, I can't.
 
Thunder said:
Judge: Loughner can be made mentally fit for trial - Yahoo! News

this psychotic schizophrenic...is actually going to stand trial for his crimes?

how can he be held accountable for crimes that he committed while totally bonkers, just because he is now being medicated by the govt. and has regained his marbles?

of course he is going go say he did it, he feels remorse for it, but he was out of his mind at the time.

just medicate this guy for life and he'll probably never hurt a fly.
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Wait, I thought this guy was a Right Wing extremist, who shot a Democrat congress critter, because he was told to buy Sarah Palin, or something.
 
apdst said:
Wait, I thought this guy was a Right Wing extremist, who shot a Democrat congress critter, because he was told to buy Sarah Palin, or something.
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Loughner is a well-documented schizophrenic. His thought processes wouldn't make sense to anyone but him.
 
I don't think "insanity" should get you out of going to trial.... it can, however, be used as a defense or mitigating factor.

I think we all know he's guilty ( well, all minus 1 or 2 people in the nation).. but a trial still needs to happen to give him his day in court.
( i'm not a fan of locking a person away for life in a mental ward without a trial)

it's doubtful he'll fry...he should, but he probably won't.
personally, I feel that if you don't know that mass murder is wrong... you really need to exit the gene pool for good.
 
Pinkie said:
"Competent to stand trial" is a fairly/very low standard. The defendant must have some idea what the charges are and some ability to assist his counsel in his defense. (Note that he's being medicated against his will, which I find very interesting.)

Until he is declared competent, he can't take a plea. So, the trial or no trial decision point has yet to be reached....and when it is, there's no certainty he'll defend on legal insanity or that it'll be successful if he does. It very rarely is.

I'm too lazy to research the Arizona standard for legal insanity but most states use the M'naughton Rule: unable to tell right from wrong, essentially. Medically, he's certainly mentally ill but that doesn't correlate to an acquittal.

It's also possible (though too soon to tell) that the DA will refuse to offer a plea, because they want the death penalty -- that is essentially what just happened here in Cleveland, in the Anthony Sowell case.

Last but not least, if Loughner knew that going off his meds could result in violence and did so anyway WHILE SANE (legally), in some states, he's as guilty as any healthy person.
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It doesnt help him that he shot a well liked Congresswoman...this guy has zero breaks coming....he was sane enough to plan to get a gun and be where she was in public and attempt to kill her...
 
I dont get how this is a shock to anyone... Uhhh yea he is going on trial... Its quite normal...
 
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