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Black unemployment: Highest in 27 years

TurtleDude said:
whatever, Haymarket. you whine about corporations and the rich and defend unions and bloated government
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Yes, I defend unions and union members and the good they do and have done for America and the world.

I defend good government as a positive benefit for society and a necessary institution for mankind. "Bloated" - perhaps you need to offer both a definition and evidence as it is a intentionally selected pejorative which means nothing by itself. Are you now an anarchist Turtle?

As to corporations and their powers - that is the struggle of this century. The corporations versus the people. We see what side you have come down on. I will stand with the people.
 
haymarket said:
Yes, I defend unions and union members and the good they do and have done for America and the world.

I defend good government as a positive benefit for society and a necessary institution for mankind. "Bloated" - perhaps you need to offer both a definition and evidence as it is a intentionally selected pejorative which means nothing by itself. Are you now an anarchist Turtle?

As to corporations and their powers - that is the struggle of this century. The corporations versus the people. We see what side you have come down on. I will stand with the people.
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You wouldn't know good government if it bit you in the ass. You love trillions in bull**** spending programs to create jobs, because government does it best right? No, businesses do it best, haymarket.
 
American said:
You wouldn't know good government if it bit you in the ass. You love trillions in bull**** spending programs to create jobs, because government does it best right? No, businesses do it best, haymarket.
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Is there an intellectual idea anywhere in that personal attack on me?
 
haymarket said:
Is there an intellectual idea anywhere in that personal attack on me?
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Is there an intellectual idea in any of your posts in this thread. You talk about good government like you think you know it like Thomas Jefferson did. I challenge you to produce a single post of yours (from this site) that comes close to what a founder like Thomas Jefferson ever thought. I'll talk about that with you.
 
Never met Jefferson - sorry.

I am reminded of President John F. Kennedy speaking before a gathering of over three dozen Nobel laureates in 1962 at the White House and he said it was the greatest gathering of brain power ever in the building - except when Jefferson dined alone.

I would never dare compare myself to Jefferson. And there is little intelligence or reason for you to attempt to do so either.
 
SE102 said:
Reconfirming the drawing yet again doesnt help your case.
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And constantly running from the truth in every thread that points out your party's devious intentions and placating of black failures doesn't help yours.

What the Democrats have done to the American black community is social genocide.
 
haymarket said:
Never met Jefferson - sorry.

I am reminded of President John F. Kennedy speaking before a gathering of over three dozen Nobel laureates in 1962 at the White House and he said it was the greatest gathering of brain power ever in the building - except when Jefferson dined alone.

I would never dare compare myself to Jefferson. And there is little intelligence or reason for you to attempt to do so either.
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George Washington never trusted Jefferson, and Adams had a strained relationship with him for years until both were nearing their death beds.

The three of them would have laughed at JFK or Obama ever sitting as president.
 
Erod said:
What the Democrats have done to the American black community is social genocide.
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So you're blaming Dems for black unemployment? Where's the personal responsibility you Cons talk about? Or are you just being racist and calling black people too dumb and can't think for themselves?

Also the fact you are equating unemployment with genocide is laughable. And hyper partisans like yourself wonder why they are never taken seriously and are laughed at.
 
SeattleRain said:

Tell me: How does a "small government" conservative even suggest "soft control", or "control" period, as an answer to anything?
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When religious observance was common in the US, it had a moralizing effect. There were plenty of people who did not follow the moral code they allegedly espoused, and there were plenty who did, even though they didn't believe it. Here's why.

For at least some of it's history, Christian preachers fairly consistently preached honesty, charity, compassion, etc. The Ten Commandments. As individuals, in private, there were, and are, and will be plenty of Christians who certainly stray from these teachings, and to put it bluntly, ****ed up. But they strove mightily not to do so publicly and that need and desire for privacy certainly did affect how much private hanky panky occurred.

The reason for avoiding individual, public bad behavior was because of the group displeasure. At one time, if a public official had an affair or a child out of wedlock, stole money, etc., he couldn't get elected. Yes, holding him accountable was hypocritical by many, but nonetheless, it was done. As a result, government and society was more moral. And the force behind it was religious preaching with the threat (and belief) that hellfire was the reward for breaking the rules.

As religious power waned, what was once publicly excoriated became tolerated, and eventually celebrated.

The decline of traditional morality, the attacks on Christianity, and the rise of tyranny as a result are not coincidences and are all linked, and that a moral society doesn't need a plethora of laws to keep it in line.
 
And now you have religious right politicians from very conservative, religious districts, like Louisiana's David Vitter, getting reelected after they've been caught cheating on their wives with hookers.
 
haymarket said:
Yes, I defend unions and union members and the good they do and have done for America and the world.

I defend good government as a positive benefit for society and a necessary institution for mankind. "Bloated" - perhaps you need to offer both a definition and evidence as it is a intentionally selected pejorative which means nothing by itself. Are you now an anarchist Turtle?

As to corporations and their powers - that is the struggle of this century. The corporations versus the people. We see what side you have come down on. I will stand with the people.
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So the choice is between bloated government and anarchy? Limited government, as proposed through the Founding Fathers, is not in play anymore?
 
SeattleRain said:
The one with no Religious Dogma. The progressive one. But I dont see why you're bringing "white" into the issue. People who dont believe in God dont hate whites lol, nor do they hate heterosexuals. As far as the "christian" part, well yeah, why would secular progressives want hard core Christians moving in? Christians wouldn't want secular progressives moving into the neighborhood and bring Satan with them either so big deal. But you added those other two under the Secular Progressive option for what reason? It's not even a realistic scenario. Why would all races be included EXCEPT whites?
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You are confusing the issues again. The influence of religion in America is not in the writing of our laws. It is in shaping the conduct of our citizens.
 
Erod said:
And constantly running from the truth in every thread that points out your party's devious intentions and placating of black failures doesn't help yours.

What the Democrats have done to the American black community is social genocide.
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Nice way to rehash that you must be correct in every instance.
Whatever youve done willingly to your own mind is intellectual suicide.
 
AdamT said:
And now you have religious right politicians from very conservative, religious districts, like Louisiana's David Vitter, getting reelected after they've been caught cheating on their wives with hookers.
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AdamT...AdamT - When the rules are simply determined, without a foundation, they aren't anchored in one spot. They'll rise and fall with popular sentiment. And as we've seen, the standards are continually challenged and allowed to slip a little, then a little more, and more, ad infinitum. We have public behavior today which would have been so scandalous 50 or 60 years ago that the person would have had to go into hiding and change their name. Not now.

Everyone is free to make their own assessments and conclusions as to whether or not religious influence in public life is good or bad, and whether it is good with one religion and not another. But I don't think their can be any doubt that religion is much more effective at shaping positive public morals than secularism.
 
ric27 said:
AdamT...AdamT - When the rules are simply determined, without a foundation, they aren't anchored in one spot. They'll rise and fall with popular sentiment. And as we've seen, the standards are continually challenged and allowed to slip a little, then a little more, and more, ad infinitum. We have public behavior today which would have been so scandalous 50 or 60 years ago that the person would have had to go into hiding and change their name. Not now.

Everyone is free to make their own assessments and conclusions as to whether or not religious influence in public life is good or bad, and whether it is good with one religion and not another. But I don't think their can be any doubt that religion is much more effective at shaping positive public morals than secularism.
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The real difference in politics now, as opposed to then, isn't that politicians were more moral back in the day. The real difference is that the press today publishes all of the dirt that used to get passed over with a wink and a nod.
 
Erod said:
George Washington never trusted Jefferson, and Adams had a strained relationship with him for years until both were nearing their death beds.

The three of them would have laughed at JFK or Obama ever sitting as president.
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And I am sure the would have ridiculed lots of things they would see in the last 100 years like Black folks or females voting and sitting among them as equals.

btw - the next time you speak with those three men could you please ask about those stupid three cornered hats and find out what was up with them?
 
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Grant said:
So the choice is between bloated government and anarchy? Limited government, as proposed through the Founding Fathers, is not in play anymore?
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Are cliches and hollow bumper sticker slogans now back in fashion?
 
AdamT said:
The real difference in politics now, as opposed to then, isn't that politicians were more moral back in the day. The real difference is that the press today publishes all of the dirt that used to get passed over with a wink and a nod.
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Given the choice between a quasi-Christian society vs. one with no moral or ethical structure vs. one based on any other religion ...would you give, the nod to the quasi-Christian society?

Why or why not?
 
ric27 said:
Given the choice between a quasi-Christian society vs. one with no moral or ethical structure vs. one based on any other religion ...would you give, the nod to the quasi-Christian society?

Why or why not?
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It's a false choice. I would give the nod to the one with the moral and ethical structure that didn't depend on a faerie tale.
 
AdamT said:
It's a false choice. I would give the nod to the one with the moral and ethical structure that didn't depend on a faerie tale.
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AdamT - Of all the mass marketed belief systems, it is my considered opinion that Christianity is the least intrusive, the least malevolent thing out there. Certainly it's the only belief system that will allow for a discussion like the one we're having about it here...or not?
 
ric27 said:
AdamT - Of all the mass marketed belief systems, it is my considered opinion that Christianity is the least intrusive, the least malevolent thing out there. Certainly it's the only belief system that will allow for a discussion like the one we're having about it here...or not?
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Can't say I'm an expert on comparative religion, but Buddhism seems pretty unobtrusive and not particularly malevolent. Relgious texts are generally ambiguous enough that you can use them to say whatever you want to say, and the Christian texts are not an exception.
 
AdamT said:
Can't say I'm an expert on comparative religion, but Buddhism seems pretty unobtrusive and not particularly malevolent. Relgious texts are generally ambiguous enough that you can use them to say whatever you want to say, and the Christian texts are not an exception.
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AdamT - Even of you don't believe in God, not far down your line, the people from which you received your moral compass did.
 
ric27 said:
AdamT - Even of you don't believe in God, not far down your line, the people from which you received your moral compass did.
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And even farther down the road people developed a moral compass and then wrote it into religious texts.
 
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