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Burglar's family awarded $300,000 in wrongful death suit

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AdamT said:
I would argue, most probably unsuccesfully, that it was self defense.
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Interesting. Especially considering that you obviously don't believe that. Then again that's probably part of why I have little respect for most criminal attorneys, on both sides of the ledger... No willingness to stand up for what you actually believe rather than what earns you a buck.
 
VanceMack said:
Dang! Thise news stories got it wrong! They said the business owners were on their own property when a meth addict armed with three knives broke in to their property. They didnt say they were wandering the streets just randomly shooting people. That changes EVERYTHING...
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Or you could describe it another way. There were these property owners who told the police a week ahead of time that they were going to shoot anyone they saw trespassing on their property. They saw the burglars and started screaming that they were going to get them, and shooting at them. As one fled over the fence with bullets whistling by his head, the other guy took shelter in a storage shed. The property owners riddled the shed with bullets, putting one through the door and into the burglar's heart. They then "concealed the rifle in the trunk of a car so well that a police detective initially missed it during a search."

Yep, sounds like self defense to me. :roll:
 
Tigger said:
Interesting. Especially considering that you obviously don't believe that. Then again that's probably part of why I have little respect for most criminal attorneys, on both sides of the ledger... No willingness to stand up for what you actually believe rather than what earns you a buck.
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A criminal attorney has the ethical responsibility to represent his client to the best of his ability. I would be guilty of malpractice if I didn't. That's how our criminal justice system works. The whole things seems to be a big mystery to y'all.
 
AdamT said:
Or you could describe it another way. There were these property owners who told the police a week ahead of time that they were going to shoot anyone they saw trespassing on their property. They saw the burglars and started screaming that they were going to get them, and shooting at them. As one fled over the fence with bullets whistling by his head, the other guy took shelter in a storage shed. The property owners riddled the shed with bullets, putting one through the door and into the burglar's heart. They then "concealed the rifle in the trunk of a car so well that a police detective initially missed it during a search."

Yep, sounds like self defense to me. :roll:
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I have never said self defense. I have said defense of property and business. You can slice it how you like...a meth addict armed with three knives broke into a business. He obviously picked the wrong business.
 
Why is this such a big deal?
 
VanceMack said:
I have never said self defense. I have said defense of property and business. You can slice it how you like...a meth addict armed with three knives broke into a business. He obviously picked the wrong business.
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Well, if you concede that it wasn't self defense then you are conceding that they should have gone to jail under Colorado law.
 
AdamT said:
Well, if you concede that it wasn't self defense then you are conceding that they should have gone to jail under Colorado law.
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I dont have to worry about judging them under Colorado law. Apparently, the Colorado prosecutor disagrees with you.
 
OscarB63 said:
my bad..I thought we were talking about the actual legal definition of "murderer" and not your own personal opinion on the matter :shrug:
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I was talking about the legal definition of murder. You were talking about whether or not someone has been convicted of murder, which is not the same thing.
 
So why was the criminal armed? Intent anyone?

I guess the reason for his hasty departure was from a sudden change of heart. Kind of like an atheist in a fox hole...
 
VanceMack said:
I dont have to worry about judging them under Colorado law. Apparently, the Colorado prosecutor disagrees with you.
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The prosecutor convened a grand jury, so I guess he had some reason to think there was a crime.
 
AdamT said:
The prosecutor convened a grand jury, so I guess he had some reason to think there was a crime.
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And then what happened?
 
AdamT said:
A criminal attorney has the ethical responsibility to represent his client to the best of his ability. I would be guilty of malpractice if I didn't. That's how our criminal justice system works. The whole things seems to be a big mystery to y'all.
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We understand how it OPERATES. Many of us just honestly disagree with the way it operates and don't believe it truly WORKS. I know that I could never work in that environment. I nearly got fired about four years ago for refusing to work on a project that I morally disagreed with.
 
Ikari said:
Yes, but they are presumed INNOCENT until proven guilty in a court of law.
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Apparently not if one is a suspected burglar trapped in a shed. Then they are presumed guilty and executed on the spot.
 
DiAnna said:
Apparently not if one is a suspected burglar trapped in a shed. Then they are presumed guilty and executed on the spot.
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kinda tough to dodge the whole guilty/not guilty thing huh?
 
Aderleth said:
I hope the story spreads to discourage business owners from behaving like thugs. Congratulations to them. Instead of being out a couple hundred bucks for a car stereo or two, they're out $260k. Clearly that was a wise decision they made.

Also, bean bag guns? Seriously?
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The ability of some to defend to serial thieves.... Oh, really...
 
Don't know if this issue has been addressed or not but what's the likelihood of the family of the deceased collecting the loot?

I know OJ moved to Florida to avoid payment of his civil suit.
 
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DiAnna said:
Apparently not if one is a suspected burglar trapped in a shed. Then they are presumed guilty and executed on the spot.
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Suspected burglar? Trapped? You make it seem like this guy was the victim. How about the people he hurt with his drug habit? What about the fact that he committed burglary while armed with several knives?

I really can't relate to this train of thought, that somehow the victim of a crime must wait to be attacked and even run away from a burglar. It's truly ridiculous.
 
AdamT said:
Yep, and I'm sure that VM and Oscar would agree that OJ wasn't guilty of murder.

Bottom line is that these guys killed someone when they didn't have to and they are paying the price. They got off easy. Meanwhile there's a three-year-old girl who's going to grow up without a father.
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Sometimes no father is better than a piece of **** father.
 
ludahai said:
The ability of some to defend to serial thieves.... Oh, really...
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Do you support the death penalty for theft?

Because that's essentially what you're doing.
 
Mathematician said:
Sometimes no father is better than a piece of **** father.
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This post is horrible in about a dozen different ways and I bet you're not aware of any of them.
 
Ikari said:
No, lawyers are notorious for kicking scientists off of juries.
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You made an excellent point that is a flaw in jury selection which I can't stand. Sometimes I wish that being at least 80 percentile with respect to IQ was necessary to get on a jury.
 
AdamT said:
Maybe he does. Maybe he's in there loading his gun, which for some reason he brought unloaded and stowed in such a way that he couldn't get to it without secreting himself in a closet. So what? If you see the door start to open you can still blow him away before he has a chance to fire, let alone aim and fire.
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Here's a simple question for you. If a robbery resulted in either the suspect or victim losing their life, who would you choose?
 
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