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U.S.: In state of denial over taxes?

few (beside you) care what i do or don't agree with

the cbo says obamacare reduces the deficit 145B

at the cost of MORE THAN THREE QUARTERS OF A T in new taxes

it says what it says

grow up
 
haymarket said:
then we better and hurry up and pop the cap on FICA contributions removing that $106K top limit.
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no skin off MY teeth

LOL!

for decades, the argument against raising the cap or means testing benefits was that it was very important that social security remain an insurance and not a welfare program

let aarp vice president rother make the case, may 19:

A means test for their earned benefits would erode the popular support that has sustained these programs and made them so effective in helping older households. Making Social Security more like welfare would surely lead to weaker benefits — and a growing burden on young people to support struggling elders.
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Social Security, Medicare Are Not Welfare - Benefits - Programs - AARP

the idea of social security as managed retirement is, after all these years, illusion?

fdr's most enduring contribution is in essence welfare?

our longest serving president would be heartbroken to hear it
 
The Prof said:
few (beside you) care what i do or don't agree with

the cbo says obamacare reduces the deficit 145B

at the cost of MORE THAN THREE QUARTERS OF A T in new taxes

it says what it says

grow up
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Hmm. Well, I've read Elmendorf's letter and I see where he says that repealing ACA would increase the deficit by $360 billion over 20 years, but I don't see anything in there saying that it would increase taxes by more than $750 billion. Perhaps you could point out where it says that?
 
by now, you're boring the hell out of yourself

enacting H.R. 2 would probably yield, for the 2012-2021 period, a reduction in revenues in the neighborhood of $770 billion
 
The Prof said:
no skin off MY teeth

LOL!

for decades, the argument against raising the cap or means testing benefits was that it was very important that social security remain an insurance and not a welfare program

let aarp vice president rother make the case, may 19:



Social Security, Medicare Are Not Welfare - Benefits - Programs - AARP

the idea of social security as managed retirement is, after all these years, illusion?

fdr's most enduring contribution is in essence welfare?

our longest serving president would be heartbroken to hear it
Click to expand...

SS, Medicare are not welfare programs, if you are opposed to removing the cap then how about if we just redirect the tax cuts to the wealthy that SS funds were used to finance
 
EarlzP said:
SS, Medicare are not welfare programs...
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Because they are not means tested. Adding means testing and eliminating the cap changes them into welfare programs.
 
The Prof said:
by now, you're boring the hell out of yourself

enacting H.R. 2 would probably yield, for the 2012-2021 period, a reduction in revenues in the neighborhood of $770 billion
Click to expand...

Sorry if you find yourself so boring. I have to wonder why you bother posting if you don't want anyone to respond to you?

Anyway, revenue is not synonymous with taxes. Here is the breakdown of how the program is financed:

ACA_revenues.png
 
PzKfW IVe said:
Because they are not means tested. Adding means testing and eliminating the cap changes them into welfare programs.
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No, the increasing or eliminating the cap does not turn them into welfare programs. You are conflating means testing and the FICA cap.
 
the bowles simpson commission---that prestigious body the president hid behind for a year and then completely ignored in the only budget he's submitted to congress in 3 years, the budget his own senate defeated, 97 to 0---recommends that the ultimate FIX for social security is gonna have to require all four reforms

the cap, the means, the age, the bennies

Fiscal Commission Co-Chairs Simpson And Bowles Release Eye-Popping Recommendations | TPMDC

a program, especially one of such epic scale, that can't keep its fundamental promises is a ripoff
 
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cpwill said:
amazing. you mean a nation tapped it's abundant natural resources by drilling for oil and it made it's citizenry wealthier?

:shock: i'm astonished, simply astonished.
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If you would study up on the issue you would not be so astonished. The US produces more oil than either Norway or Canada. The problem is that we consume 25% of the oil on the planet.

Top 20 Oil-Producing Countries
 
j-mac said:
Very good, you can cut and paste. This however, doesn't mean you understand, or apply the clause properly.

J-mac
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That decision is made by the Supreme Court. And for the last 76 years they have held that SS is constitutional.
 
AdamT said:
Sorry if you find yourself so boring. I have to wonder why you bother posting if you don't want anyone to respond to you?

Anyway, revenue is not synonymous with taxes. Here is the breakdown of how the program is financed:

ACA_revenues.png
Click to expand...

Don't let sangha see your little chart. He still claims that the health care bill didn't cut Medicare.
 
PzKfW IVe said:
There is if you want to cash in any of the $2.6T in SSTF IOUs.
The money to make good on those IOUs can only come from the general fund or borrowing; either will increase the deficit.
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Raising the FICA cap and eliminating the Bush tax cuts for the wealthy does not increase the deficit. :sun
 
PzKfW IVe said:
Irrelevant to the issue -- you stated that the war in Iraq is the biggest part of the increase in the debt.
This is demonstrably false, as noted.
So... you're either lying, or you do not know any better.
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It is the biggest part of our recent debt, and without doubt the most wasteful.
 
sangha said:
The wars in Iraq and Afgh are the 3rd largest cause of the deficits and increase in the debt

deficit.jpg
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Thanks Sangha, people tend to forget this.
 
Gill said:
Don't let sangha see your little chart. He still claims that the health care bill didn't cut Medicare.
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It did not cut benefits, it cut waste in the program. I thought that is what we wanted? I much prefer that to cutting benefits to seniors that the GOP has proposed.
 
Catawba said:
It did not cut benefits, it cut waste in the program. I thought that is what we wanted? I much prefer that to cutting benefits to seniors that the GOP has proposed.
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Cutting payments to doctors cuts benefits to seniors. That's been well documented in this thread.
 
mpg said:
Your last two posts contradict each other in an obvious way.
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How so? Obama's recovery expense it dwarfed by the wars expense.
 
mpg said:
Cutting payments to doctors cuts benefits to seniors. That's been well documented in this thread.
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Thanks for your opinion.

"The government is overpaying private insurance companies. Part of the recent rise in Medicare costs – and in premiums for seniors – stems from extra subsidies to private insurance companies. Medicare Advantage is part of the Medicare program that allows beneficiaries to receive services via private plans. Policy changes, particularly in 2003, ratcheted up payment levels to private plans. The federal government pays private insurance companies on average 14 percent more for providing coverage to Medicare Advantage beneficiaries than it would pay for the same beneficiary in the traditional Medicare program. This overpayment is as high as 20 percent in certain parts of the country.1

The overpayments do not necessarily improve quality. There is no evidence that this extra payment leads to better quality for Medicare beneficiaries.2 Insurers, not seniors or the Medicare program, determine how these overpayments are used – and this includes marketing, profits, and other administraive costs.3 This means that seniors do not always get the full overpayments back in the form of extra benefits or improved quality care. In fact, because Medicare Advantage plans have flexibility to determine their own cost-sharing arrangements, seniors can end up spending more out-of-pocket under a Medicare Advantage plan, not less.4,5
Private plans contend that low-income and minority Medicare beneficiaries disproportionately rely on Medicare Advantage for benefits and that eliminating the overpayments would hurt them. In fact, most low-income, minority seniors obtain additional coverage through Medicaid, not Medicare Advantage. These “dual eligible” beneficiaries receive cost-sharing protection and extra benefits through the Medicaid program.

All seniors in Medicare subsidize private insurance companies. Overpayments to Medicare Advantage plans are a burden for all of America’s seniors. All Medicare beneficiaries pay the price of these excessive overpayments through higher premiums – even the 78 percent of seniors who are not enrolled in a Medicare Advantage plan.7 In fact, these subsidies will add $3.60 per month to premiums for all Medicare beneficiaries in 2010.8 This means that a typical couple in traditional Medicare will pay on average nearly $90 more next year to subsidize private insurance companies that do not provide their Medicare benefits."
http://www.healthreform.gov/reports/medicare/medicare.pdf
 
healthreform.gov...

LOL!

what a whitehouse whore
 
Gill said:
Don't let sangha see your little chart. He still claims that the health care bill didn't cut Medicare.
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That was a dishonest claim. I said it didn't cut benefits for seniors. If you think I said what you claim I said, the quote the post where I said that.
 
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