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McConnell Offers 'Backup' US Debt Limit Plan

rocket88 said:
I didn't make it up myself. I got from Jay Powell, Undersecretary of the Treasury under George H W Bush.

What If We Don't Make The Debt Ceiling Deadline? : NPR
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This is the actual report he's citing: http://www.bipartisanpolicy.org/sites/default/files/Debt Ceiling Analysis report.pdf

A funny little play on words on that interview, btw. Notice how he assumes we pay the FULL 99.2 billion in social security and medicare/medicaid, plus all unemployment benefits. If we cut around 10% from his "if you choose to pay" list (page 16), we can fund (in their entirety)...

The Department of Education
The Department of Labor
The Department of Justice
The Department of Energy
The Department of the Interior
Federal Transit Administration
....plus military active duty pay.

All of these would have gone completely unfunded in his projected scenario...and that's just on a 10% cut of his "must pay" budget. It doesn't even factor in the potential cost savings we can get from cutting down the programs on the red list. These are the kinds of choices you make.
 
The proper strategy for Obama to pursue here, if he wants to accomplish anything, is not to waste time negotiating w/the GOPers, but rather to dig up politically compromising information on them (i. e. is Boner boning someone else other than his wife? What about mcconnell?) and then use it as a threat to extort what we wants. I fail to understand why Obama, w/the spying resources of the NSA, has yet to compile an extramarital affairs database on all GOP pols.

Or if Obama doesn't want to do that, he should deal directly with the GOPerpols' sponsors. boner, mcconnell, etc. are working for them only, so why bother discussing things w/the employee instead of the employer?
 
solletica said:
The proper strategy for Obama to pursue here, if he wants to accomplish anything, is not to waste time negotiating w/the GOPers, but rather to dig up politically compromising information on them (i. e. is Boner boning someone else other than his wife? What about mcconnell?) and then use it as a threat to extort what we wants. I fail to understand why Obama, w/the spying resources of the NSA, has yet to compile an extramarital affairs database on all GOP pols.

Or if Obama doesn't want to do that, he should deal directly with the GOPerpols' sponsors. boner, mcconnell, etc. are working for them only, so why bother discussing things w/the employee instead of the employer?
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I find it very interesting that you would refer to this tactic as "proper."
 
danarhea said:
You are right. It never happened. In fact, under George Bush, the debt ceiling was raised 7 times.
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I didnt say that the debt ceiling wasnt raised. its been raised a crapload of times by previous presidents. I said the same folks screaming now about the need to raise the debt ceiling....were against it when another president was in office.
 
Just like Obama being against it when Bush was in office. Now hes all for it.
 
BamaBrat said:
Just like Obama being against it when Bush was in office. Now hes all for it.
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And republicans being for it when Bush was in office and now they are against it.

See what I did there?
 
BamaBrat said:
I didnt say that the debt ceiling wasnt raised. its been raised a crapload of times by previous presidents. I said the same folks screaming now about the need to raise the debt ceiling....were against it when another president was in office.
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Never happened
 
BamaBrat said:
I didnt say that the debt ceiling wasnt raised. its been raised a crapload of times by previous presidents. I said the same folks screaming now about the need to raise the debt ceiling....were against it when another president was in office.
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Give me a link and prove what you are saying. As a matter of fact, the last time the debt ceiling was raised under Bush, it was pretty much rubber-stamped by a Democratic House.
 
donsutherland1 said:
From CNBC:



News Headlines
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Let me start off by saying that I love Mitch McConnell's plan. I'm not usually his biggest fan, but this is an excellent idea. It will solve this debt standoff and prevent future standoffs.

Although the maneuver is creative, it would very likely be unconsitutional. Article I, Section 7 states:

Every bill which shall have passed the House of Representatives and the Senate, shall, before it become a law, be presented to the President of the United States; if he approve he shall sign it, but if not he shall return it, with his objections to that House in which it shall have originated, who shall enter the objections at large on their journal, and proceed to reconsider it. If after such reconsideration two thirds of that House shall agree to pass the bill, it shall be sent, together with the objections, to the other House, by which it shall likewise be reconsidered, and if approved by two thirds of that House, it shall become a law. But in all such cases the votes of both Houses shall be determined by yeas and nays, and the names of the persons voting for and against the bill shall be entered on the journal of each House respectively. If any bill shall not be returned by the President within ten days (Sundays excepted) after it shall have been presented to him, the same shall be a law, in like manner as if he had signed it, unless the Congress by their adjournment prevent its return, in which case it shall not be a law.

Every order, resolution, or vote to which the concurrence of the Senate and House of Representatives may be necessary (except on a question of adjournment) shall be presented to the President of the United States; and before the same shall take effect, shall be approved by him, or being disapproved by him, shall be repassed by two thirds of the Senate and House of Representatives, according to the rules and limitations prescribed in the case of a bill.

The reality is that Congress must authorize an increase in the debt ceiling. A maneuver in which the President vetoes Congress's disapproval of raising the debt ceiling will not provide that authorization in place of Congress. That Congress would fail to override the veto would not constitute authorization where authorization had not been set forth in legislation.
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Congress would have to authorize this solution in the first place...in essence this would BE the law: to make debt increases automatic unless a new law was passed to repeal it. Congress has automated things in the past. For example, the fact that social security payments are indexed to inflation and automatically increase each year is a similar type of "automatic" law. The Supreme Court has never found these unconstitutional.

And once again, kudos to Mitch McConnell (I think that may be the first time I've ever said that). Boehner offered only tepid support for this idea...but at least he didn't outright oppose it. I hope that Obama gets behind this, or some variant of it. It's a face-saving way out for everyone, and it prevents scary debt standoffs from arising in the future.
 
BamaBrat said:
Because voters have very short term memories. We forget that when a Rep ruled the white house, it was the democrats screaming that raising the debt ceiling was such a horrible thing to do. But now that a Dem rules the white house, seems they conveniently changed their minds. Same with Republicans...they all do it...each and every time... because we let them get away with it. Just like President Obama saying that not raising the debt ceiling was a lack of leadership and blah blah blah...hmmm...he conveniently forgot that when he got into office. Its why nothing ever gets done.
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However much democrats were screaming, they did not scream "Screw it; let the economy collapse because YES! we are that determined to **** you all over in favor of our rich buddies."
 
sangha said:
I am correct
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Deuce, Sangha - You are both right. When the debt ceiling was raised under Bush, there were some Democrats who pissed and moaned about it. However, the party as a whole voted overwhelmingly in support of it. Obama was one of those who pissed and moaned, but I never liked him anyways. LOL. On the other hand, the GOP is threatening to slice the throat of America if they don't get their way, and this appears to be the party as a whole, and that is the difference.
 
aaagghhh im so confused!!! BDBOOP...yes agree with that totally. It was very different...the tone...the talk....everything. The democrats didnt use the scare tactics and the "screw the little people" mentality that republicans are using right now. But a lot were against it and said so...(cannot post link, because i watched it on tape..interviews and such on some show I watched the other night) Republicans are totally being irresponsible right now and we are going to possibly pay the price.
 
and of course under bush the democrats voted for raising it...because it passed and was raised. multiple times.
 
BamaBrat said:
and of course under bush the democrats voted for raising it...because it passed and was raised. multiple times.
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The GOP isn't known as the party of "ruthless" for nothing.
 
danarhea said:
Deuce, Sangha - You are both right. When the debt ceiling was raised under Bush, there were some Democrats who pissed and moaned about it. However, the party as a whole voted overwhelmingly in support of it. Obama was one of those who pissed and moaned, but I never liked him anyways. LOL. On the other hand, the GOP is threatening to slice the throat of America if they don't get their way, and this appears to be the party as a whole, and that is the difference.
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True, but the reasons both Obama and Reid gave were not that they were opposed to any raising of the debt. Therefore, there is nothing hypocritical about their opposing one raising of the debt ceiling, while supporting another. Additionally, Obama admits that his opposition was a mistake. I don't recall any sitting republicans saying their support for raising the debt ceiling was a mistake
 
sangha said:
In both those videos, Obam and Reid explain that their objections are political, and not based on any ideological opposition to raising the debt
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Brilliant..........

........Their objections were political....but it was not based on politics..........

Liberalism at its finest........
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.
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When reminded that the Senate vote to raise the debt ceiling was a close 52-48, with Mr. Obama voting no, Mr. Gibbs said, “Well, we’ve had closer.” The vote was completely along party lines, with Republicans all voting yes and Democrats voting no.
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but hey, obama knew his vote wasn't needed

LOL!

the junior senator from illinois on the expensive blue carpet, march, 2006:

“Increasing America’s debt weakens us domestically and internationally. Leadership means that `the buck stops here.’ Instead, Washington is shifting the burden of bad choices today onto the backs of our children and grandchildren. America has a debt problem and a failure of leadership. Americans deserve better.”
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Obama on the Debt Limit: Then and Now - Washington Wire - WSJ
 
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