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Milwaukee schools to lay off 354 teachers

Boo Radley said:
if that is the problem, address that problem
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but that's exactly what kaukauna is doing, didn't you READ the link everyone's talking about?

the district turned a $400000 deficit into 1.5M of surplus by getting teachers to contribute to their health care and pensions, by shopping around for coverage, by reducing teacher prep and increasing work week...

read much?
 
FilmFestGuy said:
I know that's the way you guys want it. Take education away from the poor, too. That way, they'll stay that way. It's already been done to college, why not elementary school, too!
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Do you think bankrupting the state helps, or hinders the poor? Do you think that breaking the corrupt power nexus between public sector unions and democrat politicians hurts the poor? Or does it significantly help everyone who pays the onerous taxes?
 
SheWolf said:
Kids are second to the budget...
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As they and every other group with wants should be. Let's privatized the schools. Lets take the average amount that a state pays per student per month and give to every parent a voucher for that amount of money for each of their children who attend school. The le the market decide what is to be taught and for what price. Let every parent decide how many dollars to spend on education and for the kind of education they want for their children.

Those who want the sciences can craft an offering that is heavy on science and light on socio-political correctness. The can become future leaders at all levels. Those who want the children to learn all sorts of essentially useless things can send their children to schools with those offerings. They can become tomorrow's followers.

The schools that offer the parent what the parent is willing to pay for will prosper. Others might not. Teachers will be paid based on their ability to generate profits for the schools where they teach. Everyone wins. The schools owners win. The teachers win. The parents win. The students win. The taxpayers win. Well, some politicians will win too, but only for making it happen.
 
Boo Radley said:
And who is thretening this? Seriously.
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Statists do every day. Many on this board who are liberal or with an undisclosed lean behave as if all property belongs to the state and the rich should not be allowed to keep so much of their property. This is a threat to all of us. It is the way tyranny begins and takes root in a society. It has already taken hold here. Just look around.

In a poll taken in the last few months about one-fourth of the likely votes align themselves with the philosophy of the one term Marxist president Obama. They believe that top down, centralized control of business by politicians is the right way to organize society. They believe, with him, in economic justice, meaning wealth redistribution. Meaning not so much equal opportunity before the law but equal outcomes regardless of decision or circumstance ought to drive our policies. This is the central core belief of Marxists. "From each according to his abilities. To each according to his need."

This failure to protect the right to keep the wealth one creates, to own and enjoy one's property, protected by society's laws rather than being threatened by societies laws, will harm us all. It is only a matter of time.
 
Boo Radley said:
without wrongly percieving everything as an attack
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a mindless sterotype
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just such a effort
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prominate democrats
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ignorance has it's consequences
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Only an idiot believes that money spend without a plan is proper
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the cuts will likely come on the wrong places
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bowing before the alter
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mindless sterotypes
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what we truely value
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your mindless sterotype effort
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you just dug into the sterotype
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nothing done to spend smarter, not more
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we should not accept these blind, untarget cuts
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I have at times took a second job
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how many times have the republcans won both the congress and presidency and accomplish nothing
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the democrats controling both congress and the presidency
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continuely just throw money
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Our larger problem is that we simply don't tackle problems outside of a political framework that divides us in to side, us and them, whoever us and them are
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That's good to here
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are you more sterotypical
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small patatoes
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Cutting will only be delt with effectively
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Nothing else will make a dent, and is a waste of energy
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dept chair, huh?

LOL!
 
haymarket said:
When the GOP was swept to major victories in November of 2010, we started to hear about their plans. I was about to take a job with the State Legislature and was in on lots of the inside machinations going on. Very early on, the idea took hold that the Republicans wanted all state employees to take a 10 to 20% cut in pay and to increase the amount they paid into health insurance. But - and this is key - they did NOT want any layoffs or cutbacks in service because that would have a negative impact upon the citizens. In a nutshell, the plan was to get the same work for less.
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I like this plan. With all pay and benefits considered public sector union members are paid way more than the private sector taxpayer who provides the money. It was time for a serious correction.
 
more cutting just to cut

TENS OF BILLIONS of cuts just to cut, indeed

California budget: Democrats pass austerity budget - Los Angeles Times

darn those politicians

all that cutting without a plan

just hurting all those kids

and doing it all for those corrupt lobbyists

where's the value, where the investment?

where's the revenue?

tsk tsk...

is this what we all have come to?

what's next?
 
PeteEU said:
and the GOP plan of making American's even dumber is going strong.. hey soon people will actually believe that Jesus rode dinos, the world is flat and the sun revolves around the Earth....

Cutting education is the single dumbest thing any government can do. Children are the future and having a massive uneducated population has never helped any nation.. unless of course you want to be like India and China...
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And since when is the current state of education and proficiency of educating children evidence that more money, more teachers and more bureaucracy is what we need? We already spend more money than any country in the world on education. We are not cutting money that we truly need for education. We can educate our children better and with less money by changing our priorities not increasing budgets.
 
jambalaya said:
And since when is the current state of education and proficiency of educating children evidence that more money, more teachers and more bureaucracy is what we need? We already spend more money than any country in the world on education. We are not cutting money that we truly need for education. We can educate our children better and with less money by changing our priorities not increasing budgets.
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How about having a real plan to address those issues?
 
xpiher said:
What you aren't understanding is that they aren't allowed to cut their own position because they are established by local government. The over lap isn't created by the teachers union or the administration themselves, it created by localities demanding completely control over their area, even if that area only severs 200 students.
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Nonsense. I have voted local tickets for some thirty years now, and never once have I seen any initiative on any ballot that reads in terms of bloating the administration of a school system with $100K plus a year jobs, and golden parachute retirements.

These positions are ones created for teachers that move up the ranks toward retirement by connected union hacks that are draining our municipalities.

j-mac
 
Misterveritis said:
Statists do every day. Many on this board who are liberal or with an undisclosed lean behave as if all property belongs to the state and the rich should not be allowed to keep so much of their property. This is a threat to all of us. It is the way tyranny begins and takes root in a society. It has already taken hold here. Just look around.

In a poll taken in the last few months about one-fourth of the likely votes align themselves with the philosophy of the one term Marxist president Obama. They believe that top down, centralized control of business by politicians is the right way to organize society. They believe, with him, in economic justice, meaning wealth redistribution. Meaning not so much equal opportunity before the law but equal outcomes regardless of decision or circumstance ought to drive our policies. This is the central core belief of Marxists. "From each according to his abilities. To each according to his need."

This failure to protect the right to keep the wealth one creates, to own and enjoy one's property, protected by society's laws rather than being threatened by societies laws, will harm us all. It is only a matter of time.
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I actually believe this is a misinterpretation on your part. And anyone who uses the term Marxist to describe Obama is so far in delusional land that one has to question whether rational discussion is even possible.

However, I try. First off, the wealthy are not being deprived of their wealth. They are doing fine. Paying a few more percentage points of taxes is not depriving them of their wealth. It is not only dishonest to say it is, but more than a little silly. What we have is a budget problem all around that will require both spending cuts and tax increases. This is not marxist, or socialist, or any other ism. This is partical problem solving.

As for education, simply cutting funds, with no plan, is not really better than simply spending money with no plan. If you believe education is top heavy, then the trim should begin at the top, and not be teacher heavy. If you don't think teachers derseve retirement benefits, or that their benefits should merely be less than they presently are, work to limit those. But just throwing out cuts as mindlessly as some suggesting spending is does not look like anything better in my view.

Now, I suggest you step back from your excessive ideological delusion and try to see things more clearly. No one of any siginficance or seriousness is threatening what you claim.
 
j-mac said:
Ha! Me a corporate shill....I should tell my mom.....Look pal I am a middle class Commercial Truck driver. I am probably more the preverbal "working man" than any union hack. Don't you forget it.

j-mac
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I know that, but just like there were slaves who spoke to defend their masters, there are working folk who betrary their own, buyinh into something that hurts them, there are workers who vote agsint their interests, and defend those who really give them little to nothing in return. You, like to many republican voters, are fast to attack unions and working people, and slow to note problems with business and the onwership class. This is not new, but it does speak a certain lack of concern for the working person.

Google Image Result for http://uppitynegronetwork.files.wordpress.com/2010/07/uncle_ruckus.jpg
imgres
 
Boo Radley said:
I actually believe this is a misinterpretation on your part. And anyone who uses the term Marxist to describe Obama is so far in delusional land that one has to question whether rational discussion is even possible.

However, I try. First off, the wealthy are not being deprived of their wealth. They are doing fine. Paying a few more percentage points of taxes is not depriving them of their wealth. It is not only dishonest to say it is, but more than a little silly. What we have is a budget problem all around that will require both spending cuts and tax increases. This is not marxist, or socialist, or any other ism. This is partical problem solving.

As for education, simply cutting funds, with no plan, is not really better than simply spending money with no plan. If you believe education is top heavy, then the trim should begin at the top, and not be teacher heavy. If you don't think teachers derseve retirement benefits, or that their benefits should merely be less than they presently are, work to limit those. But just throwing out cuts as mindlessly as some suggesting spending is does not look like anything better in my view.

Now, I suggest you step back from your excessive ideological delusion and try to see things more clearly. No one of any siginficance or seriousness is threatening what you claim.
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The government does not tell districts how to spend money. It is up to districts to decide what to do with budget cuts or budget increases. I would prefer that we do not give the government extraneous power to dictate how districts spend. We should be demanding that the districts educating our children and our neighborhoods meet our requirements. We should be demanding that they go back to the drawing board when they come out with news that they're cutting 300 teachers to make up for the budget gap. Some districts have dealt with mutli-million dollar shortfalls without firing teachers at all....and without the government telling them how to manage their funds.
 
j-mac said:
Well, exactly my point....When these boards convene to make their cuts, How much would you like to bet that a majority of them in cases like these are liberal bureaucrats that instead of really taking into account the drivers of education like overly redundant administration like themselves they instantly knee jerk to teachers to cause the uproar in the first place.

j-mac
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Actually, my experience has been that liberals are more supportive of teachers and that school boards are more conservative.
 
I said this about the right wing plan to attack the working class

in a nutshell, the plan was to get the same work for less.
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and the Prof replied
horrors
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Glad to see you agree. If working people agree to perform the same jobs for 20% less it means a drastic lowering of the standard of living for scores of millions of Americans. And I am sure than nobody wants to see that outside of the elitist class who views workers as a combination of necessary nuisance and mere fodder anyways.
 
j-mac said:
Well, then you must be all happy then when the union, and the corrupt shills they install use you as pawn's in their cynical game of politics...Good thing its only your job, but hey, they'll be happy to give you more talking points, and boogey men to attack.

j-mac
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All teachers aren't in unions and all unions aren't evil.
 
Misterveritis said:
I like this plan. With all pay and benefits considered public sector union members are paid way more than the private sector taxpayer who provides the money. It was time for a serious correction.
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Of course you do. Stevie Wonder could see that coming. A far right wing plan to weaken and possible destroy the working class in America gets support from far right extremists who share those far right goals.

And in other breaking news: the sun sets in the west tonight.
 
Boo Radley said:
I actually believe this is a misinterpretation on your part. And anyone who uses the term Marxist to describe Obama is so far in delusional land that one has to question whether rational discussion is even possible.
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Wow! :shock: Is this how you tend to address anyone whom may have serious disagreements with you? Name call, and pettiness first? It is certainly acceptable to argue that Obama is not a hardcore Marxist, but that doesn't by any means rule out that a heavy portion of his ideological stance relies heavily on tenants of Marx, if not outright Communism. Obama uses buzz wording like 'Social Justice', and 'Collective Salvation' sprinkled in with a host of speeches I believe designed to lull the listener to sleep while his chin is still jutted outward in Moussalli fashion. Deny it as you so arrogantly, and obviously will, but the people see, and are not sleeping any longer.

However, I try. First off, the wealthy are not being deprived of their wealth. They are doing fine. Paying a few more percentage points of taxes is not depriving them of their wealth. It is not only dishonest to say it is, but more than a little silly. What we have is a budget problem all around that will require both spending cuts and tax increases. This is not marxist, or socialist, or any other ism. This is partical problem solving.
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The dishonest part is that where you want the American people to believe once again that you will actually do both as you say. The track record on this shows a different story, and you my misguided friend are arguing to leave the drug addict in charge of the Pharmacy.

Now, I suggest you step back from your excessive ideological delusion and try to see things more clearly. No one of any siginficance or seriousness is threatening what you claim.
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Beautiful, you end it just as you started with insult, and arrogance. You need to understand that significance, and seriousness are not trademarks of the liberal alone. People can disagree with you, and that doesn't make them any less serious, nor significant in their argument. So how's about you drop the BS eh?

j-mac
 
Misterveritis said:
I like this plan. With all pay and benefits considered public sector union members are paid way more than the private sector taxpayer who provides the money. It was time for a serious correction.
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The public sector worker pays taxes also.
 
Layla_Z said:
The public sector worker pays taxes also.
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With the added benefit of getting to elect their own boss, whom they will negotiate their pay with....hmmmm...Not a real good roadmap for remaining honest now is it?

j-mac
 
j-mac said:
With the added benefit of getting to elect their own boss, whom they will negotiate their pay with....hmmmm...Not a real good roadmap for remaining honest now is it?

j-mac
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You only get to help elect the board if you live in the district where you teach, which not all teachers do. Also, you get one vote, that is certainly no guarantee that you get the best school board. I don't know what you mean by honest. Do you think that teachers shouldn't be able to vote for school board members? I'd actually trust the teachers' judgement on what is best for the school.
 
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