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ATF director to resign, agency sources say

Councilman

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This is wrong Eric Holder is the one who's head should role in this case.

He had to have approved this.

Holder has been useless piece of garbage and has shown himself to be a racists.

Gun smuggling: ATF acting director to resign, agency sources say - latimes.com
By Richard A. Serrano and Kim Murphy, Los Angeles Times
June 21, 2011

The acting director of the federal Bureau of Alcohol, Tobacco, Firearms and Explosives is expected to step down because of a controversial gun-running investigation that allowed weapons to be sold to suspected agents of Mexican drug cartels, according to two sources inside the agency.

Kenneth E. Melson's resignation, which could happen as early as this week, is the most significant repercussion yet from a growing public outcry over the code-named Fast and Furious operation, under which ATF agents watched while straw purchasers acquired more than 1,700 AK-47s and other high-powered rifles from Arizona gun dealers and delivered them to others.

Hundreds of the weapons turned up at crime scenes in Mexico and the U.S., including in southern Arizona last December where a Border Patrol agent was shot to death.
 
For once, you're right. I don't really know or care about the specifics of this case...but if it can get Eric Holder to resign I'm all in favor of that. He is a ****ing horrible attorney general. I thought after John Ashcroft and Alberto Gonzales, we couldn't possibly do any worse, but Holder is certainly giving them a run for their money.
 
This is wrong Eric Holder is the one who's head should role in this case.

He had to have approved this.

Holder has been useless piece of garbage and has shown himself to be a racists.

Why do you see Holder as being responsible for this?
 
Also: At what point does stupidity become criminal? Because I think this whole plan was criminally stupid.
 
This is wrong Eric Holder is the one who's head should role in this case.

He had to have approved this.

Holder has been useless piece of garbage and has shown himself to be a racists.

rumor has it Obama wants to appoint a gun hating ATF Chicago office guy-who was part of some anti gun initiative with Bugsy Daily.

The ATF is an agency that really should not exist anyway when it comes to firearms
 
This is a good start. I sincerely hope that more heads roll based upon this enormous cluster-**** operation.
 
I doubt that Holder approved this operation. And to think the White House had anything to do with it is just pure stupidity. I'm actually even shocked that the director knew specifically of this operation. This was just carried out in the Phoenix area, and probably was ordered by someone at the top in Phoenix. Anyway, different people should have to resign, not the acting agency director. The SAC for their Phoenix field office should be one of them.

This operation had a good goal and was well intended, but to think that an agency as understaffed as ATF would be able to actually carefully monitor each of the firearms they decide to track rather than intercept is just ridiculous.
 
I doubt that Holder approved this operation. And to think the White House had anything to do with it is just pure stupidity. I'm actually even shocked that the director knew specifically of this operation. This was just carried out in the Phoenix area, and probably was ordered by someone at the top in Phoenix. Anyway, different people should have to resign, not the acting agency director. The SAC for their Phoenix field office should be one of them.

This operation had a good goal and was well intended, but to think that an agency as understaffed as ATF would be able to actually carefully monitor each of the firearms they decide to track rather than intercept is just ridiculous.

Battery-powered GPS trackers, apparently. Gee, I wonder what could go wrong!
 
So when is Darell Issa (R-Calif) going to resign over this?
 
I doubt that Holder approved this operation. And to think the White House had anything to do with it is just pure stupidity. I'm actually even shocked that the director knew specifically of this operation.

I'd be shocked if a plan to allow automatic weapons to flow to Mexican drug cartels was approved by anyone other than someone at one of the highest levels of government. It's sort of like Pakistan's intelligence service not knowing about Osama. Holder was either complicit or incompetent. There is no in-between.
 
From another embedded link at examiner--

ROGINSKY: But here's the interesting thing, Congressman. You have ‑‑ you can be an illegal immigrant right now who is legally not allowed to buy weapons, go to a gun show where there's no background checks because you guys won't mandate them. Buy a weapon and you can use it on the border.

So tell me again why you're not for gun control when in fact these are the kinds of policies that lead to these kinds of murders.

GOHMERT: There's no telling how many murders and shootings and assault I had as a judge, not one of them bought a weapon at a gun show.

Administration apologists working

Ok what kind of lame screwed up excuse is that? Agree with the gun laws or not, Operation GunWalker was wrong, dumb and dangerous. There is no excuse for it.

Addressing the top guy at Pheonix thing, do you really think a career bureaucrat is going to stick their neck out for an operation like that? Someone at the federal level had to have a say or approval for that kind of exposure if things went south; and they most certainly have. If administration big wigs didnt approve it, I bet they knew of it and did nothing to stop it.
 
Again you are very wrong. Administration big wigs had probably little to no idea of this. This probably went straight up to the ATF director and no further, primarily because of the way the operation was run. This is not something that would ever make it to the White House simply for the political protection of the administration.
 
Stepping down? That is not enough to satisfy me. When is he going to be indicted?
 
It was a cluster ****, so heads should roll. And at the higheswt level responsible. If this went to Holder, holder should resign. But it must be shown it did go to him.

And yes, it was criminally stupid. I don't what law it falls under, but stupidity that is going to cost lives should be criminal.
 
Stepping down? That is not enough to satisfy me. When is he going to be indicted?

Unfortunately no justice would be served from that. The SAC of their Phoenix field office, along with supervisory agents involved in this, are the ones who should take the big hit here.
 
Unfortunately no justice would be served from that. The SAC of their Phoenix field office, along with supervisory agents involved in this, are the ones who should take the big hit here.

Too often that is the case. But if prosecuted, I would like the top person facing charges and not those who were following the plan they were given.
 
Too often that is the case. But if prosecuted, I would like the top person facing charges and not those who were following the plan they were given.

But that's the thing. The chances of this plan being made up by the ATF acting director, who was the director of the US attorney's EO. That guy has absolutely zero law enforcement experience. This was probably a plan hatched by the Phoenix office, as the agents involved have testified to.
 
But that's the thing. The chances of this plan being made up by the ATF acting director, who was the director of the US attorney's EO. That guy has absolutely zero law enforcement experience. This was probably a plan hatched by the Phoenix office, as the agents involved have testified to.

The highest person who OK'd it should be responsible. It is one thing to present a stupid plan. It's another to OK one. If it has to go through you, you are expected to be smart enough to recognize stupid. If you're not, you should be held accountable.
 
Why should he? He has not say in the plan, except to know about. Just because they ****ed it up, doesn't put it at Issa's feet....except if you're a partisan hack.

Washington Post raises questions about Fast & Furious credibility - Seattle gun rights | Examiner.com

Never said it was put at Issa's feet. But despite what he has claimed, he was fully informed and could have stopped the program or made sure there were changes. He did nothing. He now comes after the fact an demands investigations in how on earth this could go on and bla bla... DUDE you were fully informed about it beforehand.. where were your objections then? If anyone is partisan then it is Issa and you.
 
Never said it was put at Issa's feet. But despite what he has claimed, he was fully informed and could have stopped the program or made sure there were changes. He did nothing. He now comes after the fact an demands investigations in how on earth this could go on and bla bla... DUDE you were fully informed about it beforehand.. where were your objections then? If anyone is partisan then it is Issa and you.

Similar occurred with Nancy Pelosi and the waterboarding, though she did make a pretty acceptable argument IMO that she could not speak publicly about it or go after anyone for it due to classification/security.

The highest person who OK'd it should be responsible. It is one thing to present a stupid plan. It's another to OK one. If it has to go through you, you are expected to be smart enough to recognize stupid. If you're not, you should be held accountable.
Right, but again, the agency acting director probably had nothing to do with specifically "approving it". Was he briefed on it? Sure, along with hundreds of other operations. The director of an agency is more than just a senior law enforcement official... those guys have to play politics 24/7 as well.
 
today:

The acting director of the federal Bureau of Alcohol, Tobacco, Firearms and Explosives is strongly resisting pressure to step down because of growing controversy over the agency's surveillance program that allowed U.S. guns to flow unchecked into Mexico, according to several federal sources in Washington.

Kenneth E. Melson, who has run the bureau for two years, is reportedly eager to testify to Congress about the extent of his and other officials' involvement in the operation, code-named Fast and Furious.

Melson does not want to be "the fall guy" for the program, under which ATF agents allowed straw purchasers to acquire more than 1,700 AK-47s and other high-powered rifles from Arizona gun dealers, the sources said.

"He is saying he won't go," said one source close to the situation, who asked for anonymity because high-level discussions with Melson remained fluid. "He has told them, 'I'm not going to be the fall guy on this.' "

Added a second source, who also requested anonymity: "He's resisting. He does not want to go."

Melson has an open invitation to appear on Capitol Hill. So far, he has not been given Justice Department approval to appear before Congress.

Federal gun surveillance: ATF chief resists pressure to step down - latimes.com

let him testify, eric, don't force him out without a hearing like shirley sherrod

what have you got to hide?
 
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today: Obama Administration Fires ATF Whistleblower - 'Fast And Furious' - Fox Nation

The Bureau of Alcohol, Tobacco and Firearms is being accused of retaliating against an agent who helped publicize the agency’s role in allowing thousands of guns to cross the U.S. border and fall into the hands of Mexican drug gangs.

The agent, Vince Cefalu, who has spoken out about the ATF's so-called "Project Gunrunner" scandal, says he was served with termination papers just last week, and he calls the move politically motivated.

“Aside from Jay Dobyns, I don't know of anyone that's been more vocal about ATF mismanagement than me,” said Cefalu, a senior special agent based in Dublin, Calif. “That's why this is happening.” Dobyns, an ATF special agent based in Tucson, has appeared several times on Fox News to discuss the scandal.

Cefalu first told FoxNews.com about the ATF’s embattled anti-gun smuggling operation in December, before the first reports on the story appeared in February. “Simply put, we knowingly let hundreds of guns and dozens of identified bad guys go across the border,” Cefalu said at the time.

Since then, Cefalu’s claims have been vindicated, as a number of agents with first-hand knowledge of the case came forward. The scandal over Project Gunrunner led to congressional hearings, a presidential reprimand – Obama called the operation “a serious mistake” – and speculation that ATF chief Ken Melson will resign.

Yet last week, Cefalu, who has worked for the agency for 24 years, was forced to turn in his gun and badge. He can appeal but will be on “paid administrative leave” during the process.
 
But you would however agree that there needs to be a Special Prosecuter appointed....I mean that is the only reasonable course of action.

I doubt that Holder approved this operation. And to think the White House had anything to do with it is just pure stupidity. I'm actually even shocked that the director knew specifically of this operation. This was just carried out in the Phoenix area, and probably was ordered by someone at the top in Phoenix. Anyway, different people should have to resign, not the acting agency director. The SAC for their Phoenix field office should be one of them.

This operation had a good goal and was well intended, but to think that an agency as understaffed as ATF would be able to actually carefully monitor each of the firearms they decide to track rather than intercept is just ridiculous.
 
today: Weapons linked to controversial ATF strategy found in Valley crimes

surprised?

there are quite a few of em, naturally

what's more, it wasn't mr melson and atf which found these doj moved assault rifles at crime scenes in arizona

no, it was investigative work done by A-B-C

the administration's answer?

FIRE the whistle blower

transparency, anyone?

competence?
 
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