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Judge voids controversial Wisconsin union law

unless you are the employer, where the practice of this same right in the same basic way is labeled collusion and anti-competitive.

It depends on what they are trying to do I would suppose. Also, corporations in and of themselves have no rights; only individuals may possess rights. In the end, I view Unions the same way I view government. There is some amount of base need for them. We've seen what happens when you don't have them, and it's not the best of all outcomes. However, like government, it can grow and expand and ultimately stop serving the purpose for which is was created. And like government, we don't throw out the whole thing and say "not needed", we know anarchy doesn't actually work in the real world. Instead, we stand by their existence but note the double edged nature of the Union. While necessary, it is also necessary to regulate and keep them under control so that they best serve the purpose for which they were created.
 
It depends on what they are trying to do I would suppose. Also, corporations in and of themselves have no rights; only individuals may possess rights. In the end, I view Unions the same way I view government. There is some amount of base need for them. We've seen what happens when you don't have them, and it's not the best of all outcomes. However, like government, it can grow and expand and ultimately stop serving the purpose for which is was created. And like government, we don't throw out the whole thing and say "not needed", we know anarchy doesn't actually work in the real world. Instead, we stand by their existence but note the double edged nature of the Union. While necessary, it is also necessary to regulate and keep them under control so that they best serve the purpose for which they were created.

they are colluding in the market to produce an outcome more favorable to them, the same thing individuals are doing by joining a trade union.

one is a "right", the other is illegal.
 
they are colluding in the market to produce an outcome more favorable to them, the same thing individuals are doing by joining a trade union.

one is a "right", the other is illegal.

They're selling something which in innately theirs, their labor. They are trying to get the best price they can. Can Unions go too far and gain too much power? Yes, of course they can. It's a balance you're looking to strike between labor and company. If instead of saying that we should get rid of unions and rather say that we need to create competing unions, fine by me. But in the end, I don't necessarily see a problem with the base ability of people to associate with others to strengthen their barganing power in order to better argue labor compensation. Furthermore, I don't see anything particularly wrong with proper labor laws. We've gone the no union route, we've gone the laizie-fair route; we've seen the outcomes. There is need for some amount of government regulation, and that should come through in this case of Union/Company via federal contract arbitrators who can settle a case if Union and Company cannot come to an agreement on their own.
 
The Wisconsin Republican political leadership this year has squandered its numerical advantage through its contempt for the people and the law. The judicial branch today, set things straight at least temporarily, and, perhaps, through the political recall process, the people will soon straighten it out for the longer term.
 
The Wisconsin Republican political leadership this year has squandered its numerical advantage through its contempt for the people and the law. The judicial branch today, set things straight at least temporarily, and, perhaps, through the political recall process, the people will soon straighten it out for the longer term.

this will be done and over long before any recall.
 
The Wisconsin Republican political leadership this year has squandered its numerical advantage through its contempt for the people and the law. The judicial branch today, set things straight at least temporarily, and, perhaps, through the political recall process, the people will soon straighten it out for the longer term.
amen to that!
 
I wonder what she'd say about the coward legislators that ran away from their jobs??



Tim-

the ones who ended a contract instead of renegotiate it
i agree. very republican. very cowardly
 
I wonder what she'd say about the coward legislators that ran away from their jobs??

Are the people who voted for them recalling them for this "cowardice"?

I'm personally not a big fan of abuse of rules in legislatures.

But I doubt their constituents consider them cowards.
 
the reason madison is not the red hot issue she was, in my opinion, is cuz the collective bargaining brouhaha has kinda been lost in the WAVE of austerity that, inevitable, is sweeping the states and cities

the ram's the most recent, as predicted, in chicago

the day he was sworn in as the next daley the ram announced huge cuts

cuomo led the way, he said it (hard and mean), he meant it, he's doing it---with no new taxes

moonbeam mumbled his way to multi tens of bils, surrendering in the process his special election for what utopians like moonbeam prefer to call revenues

in ohio kasich outdid walker

in michigan governor snyder signed into effect what everyone calls budgetary "martial law," and bing and bobb, dem appointed outside managers, are slashing and restructuring in detroit---unilaterally (rachel maddow was all over it for a week)

there's chubby chris christie in trenton bullying the blues into submission

there's extremely democrat maryland, same trend

the massachusetts state assembly voted, 111 to 42, to cut collective bargaining for cops, teachers and other muni's

springfield, after raising income taxes two thirds, is now following this overwhelming anti-union suit

folks like you and me are just so insignificant in the face of forces so, as cole porter might sing, irresistable

the point is---madison may go this way, may go that, but in the big picture...

there's really nothing anyone can do about it, it's physics

one thing no one i've heard has commented---this massive slashing of public payroll is gonna be a huge DOWNER on those monthly unemployment figures everyone always looks at

i speak, here, as a longtime california public school teacher (math)---i've never seen layoffs so deep and wide, they're just beginning, my industry is gonna be decimated
 
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Any privilege a union has is granted through law, not through constitutionally enumerated rights.

Save your fingers the effort Tessaesque, trying to discuss rights with Justabubba and some of these others is a waste of time. They believe that a Right is anything they think their favored group should have.
 
I wonder what she'd say about the coward legislators that ran away from their jobs??



Tim-

Probably the same thing she would say about the GOP filibustering and basically shutting down Washington, holding the nation hostage, while they sat on their hands and pouted thus bringing the business of governing to a screeching halt, because of that muslim, socialist, <fill-in-your-favorite Obama slur here> president from Kenya has made them all look like idiots.

Or... maybe not.
 
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Probably the same thing she would say about the GOP filibustering and basically shutting down Washington, holding the nation hostage, while they sat on their hands and pouted thus bringing the business of governing to a screeching halt, because of that muslim, socialist, <fill-in-your-favorite Obama slur here> president from Kenya has made them all look like idiots.

Or... maybe not.


Trolling again are we? tsk, tsk, tsk.....What a shame.


j-mac
 
Probably the same thing she would say about the GOP filibustering and basically shutting down Washington, holding the nation hostage, while they sat on their hands and pouted thus bringing the business of governing to a screeching halt, because of that muslim, socialist, <fill-in-your-favorite Obama slur here> president from Kenya has made them all look like idiots.

Or... maybe not.

At least filibustering is within the rules, and part of the job description. Can't filibuster from the hotel room in another state. They were cowards for not participating in the process of republican democracy! The system, as faulty as it may seem at times, works all the same! Voting no by virtue of sitting in a hotel room in another state could have been just the same as sitting in their congress seats. It's still going to be a no vote. All they did was delay the inevitable. Some people think they were making a "stand".. A stand for what? Oh I know, their constituents.. But wait.. Isn't that what they do when they, ya know.. Vote? :)


Tim-
 
Im sorry can someone explain to me why Republicans don't like Unions again...it confuses me. I only want a republican/conservative here to answer not any of you other people.
 
they plan to vote it again as part of the budget... also, it's going up the ladder in the court system. So, the fat lady has not even entered the building yet, let alone sung.

It still won't hold up, not in Federal Court, which struck down the law limiting the hotel workers union in Chicago.
 
Im sorry can someone explain to me why Republicans don't like Unions again...it confuses me. I only want a republican/conservative here to answer not any of you other people.

Depends. Except for one time, I have always voted Republican or Libertarian, and have always strongly supported unions, even though I personally don't want to be in one.
 
Im sorry can someone explain to me why Republicans don't like Unions again...it confuses me. I only want a republican/conservative here to answer not any of you other people.

When was it in your life that you really started to apply yourself? Was it when you were still living with your parents, or was it when you left, and ventured off on your own? Unions are vehicles of stagnation, think of entrophy. Unions bargain based on the lowest common denominator. They barter for mediocrity, and settle on function. The idea of the union is antithetical to individualism, an idea that we are the people, but we are individual people. There is strength in the unionized worker, that is for sure, but that strength comes at a price. That price is production! It's always about production, and performance. Unions avoid bargaining based on production and performance.



Tim-
 
cant find anthing recent on this. link please? Sounds interesting.

It IS interesting. Here is a link on the Federal Court ruling in Illinois, which will have an effect on efforts to bust union activities in Wisconsin, Ohio, Michigan, and other states. If the Wisconsin ruling goes to Federal Court, or if Walker passes his law again, which will also end up in Federal court, this ruling will be cited. Of course, this has not been tested at the Supreme Court level yet, and I predict that the case will go that far.
 
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the ones who ended a contract instead of renegotiate it
i agree. very republican. very cowardly

Very Republican? You forget that it was a Republican judge, appointed by Tommy Thompson, who made that ruling.
 
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