• This is a political forum that is non-biased/non-partisan and treats every person's position on topics equally. This debate forum is not aligned to any political party. In today's politics, many ideas are split between and even within all the political parties. Often we find ourselves agreeing on one platform but some topics break our mold. We are here to discuss them in a civil political debate. If this is your first visit to our political forums, be sure to check out the RULES. Registering for debate politics is necessary before posting. Register today to participate - it's free!

Trump is Not Gassing Children

NeverTrump

NeverTrump

Exposing GOP since 2015
DP Veteran
Joined
Jan 21, 2013
Messages
25,357
Reaction score
11,557
Location
Post-Trump America
Gender
Male
Political Leaning
Moderate
While everyone was freaking out about Time Magazine....This wonderful person defended Swampy policies by saying this:

“President Trump is not gassing children. President Trump is not loading up train cars with illegal alien children and sending them to the death camps. Lady Liberty is in tears because the Democrats and the mainstream media would rather side with illegal alien invaders than stand alongside their fellow Americans.”
Click to expand...

Fox Radio Host Todd Starnes Defends Separating Migrant Families: ‘Trump is Not Gassing Children’
 
NeverTrumpGOP said:
While everyone was freaking out about Time Magazine....This wonderful person defended Swampy policies by saying this:



Fox Radio Host Todd Starnes Defends Separating Migrant Families: ‘Trump is Not Gassing Children’
Click to expand...

Yep, this was clearly an outrageously biased rebuttal:

In today’s airing of The Todd Starnes Show on Fox News Radio, the host condemned Democrats and the media for comparing Trump’s family separation policy to Nazi Germany, a claim echoed Tuesday night on Fox News.
Click to expand...

If those who violate US immigration laws are simply undocumented immigrants then are those that drive on US highways without a license, registration and/or insurance simply undocumented drivers?
 
Last edited:
ttwtt78640 said:
Yep, this was clearly an outrageously biased rebuttal:



If those who violate US immigration laws are simply undocumented immigrants then are those that drive on US highways without a license, registration and/or insurance simply undocumented drivers?
Click to expand...

They need to be separated from their cars as to not do anymore harm to this country, then we force them all to take public transportation, who cares if the trains are over capacity and constantly break down due to weight. Who cares if there isn't good public transportation throughout most of the country. They shouldn't have been driving w/o a license in the first place!!!!
 
Not gassing children is a rather low standard to set for a President. Or any normal person, really. It's certainly nothing to brag about.
 
ttwtt78640 said:
Yep, this was clearly an outrageously biased rebuttal:



If those who violate US immigration laws are simply undocumented immigrants then are those [who] drive on US highways without a license, registration and/or insurance simply undocumented drivers?
Click to expand...
Um, well, are then not? Not licenced. Not registred. Yet driving a car on U.S. roads. "Undocumented driver" seems like an apt description to me.
 
ttwtt78640 said:
Yep, this was clearly an outrageously biased rebuttal:

If those who violate US immigration laws are simply undocumented immigrants then are those that drive on US highways without a license, registration and/or insurance simply undocumented drivers?
Click to expand...

Driving without a license will get you a ride in a police car to be processed for arrest. If you have children with you they will be separated from you at least temporarily.
 
I actually googled this to make sure it wasn't satire/something from the onion that was picked up and reported on as the real deal.

Sadly, it doesn't appear to be satire.

That's setting the bar beyond low.
 
NeverTrumpGOP said:
They need to be separated from their cars as to not do anymore harm to this country, then we force them all to take public transportation, who cares if the trains are over capacity and constantly break down due to weight. Who cares if there isn't good public transportation throughout most of the country. They shouldn't have been driving w/o a license in the first place!!!!
Click to expand...

So, just so I understand, and correct me if I am wrong, you are attacking ttwtt78640's analogy and saying that rule of law can and should be done away with when the persons breaking the laws are only doing so because following the law is inconvenient.

People are crossing the border illegally for any number of reasons? It doesn't matter. They claim they are asylum seekers after being caught in order to avoid deportation, and we must take them at their word.

People drive without licenses and insurance? It doesn't matter. It was too inconvenient for them to obtain a license to purchase insurance in order to protect other people on the road from their lack of skill or potential negligence.

If I have grossly misstated the principles by which you believe society should operate, please correct me. But if I have not, I do not understand how you call yourself a political moderate. Because I simply do not understand how saying one large group of people (Central American illegal immigrants) should be placed above the law qualifies as a moderate stance.
 
Well then stop calling him a Nazi, Hitler or your other silly names.

Time magazine doing what it does... becoming meaningless garbage pushing the resistance story.
Phony story and phony cover.
 
Xelor said:
Um, well, are then not? Not licenced. Not registred. Yet driving a car on U.S. roads. "Undocumented driver" seems like an apt description to me.
Click to expand...

Should undocumented driving be ignored only so long as children are present in the vehicle or can everyone drive undocumented without any legal consequences? What you seem to ignore are that legal penalties for undocumented driving are not being protested yet the legal penalties for undocumented immigration are being protested.

We are all aware, or at least should be, that when folks, who happen to have minor children, are arrested and jailed that they get separated from their children - we do not place children in adult detention facilities and we do separate parents from their children when we put them in jail. When mommy or daddy is arrested and jailed, for DUI or shoplifting, there is, somehow, no claim that Nazi policies have caused that separation from their children.
 
LowDown said:
Driving without a license will get you a ride in a police car to be processed for arrest. If you have children with you they will be separated from you at least temporarily.
Click to expand...

Of course, yet why is that parent and child separation not called Nazi like by the left wing loons? Is that media bias too?
 
Serenity said:
I actually googled this to make sure it wasn't satire/something from the onion that was picked up and reported on as the real deal.

Sadly, it doesn't appear to be satire.

That's setting the bar beyond low.
Click to expand...

This isn't happening in a vacuum, though. In fairness, what he was referring to is the overt comparisons people have actually been making to what's happening at the border and the Nazis gassing children.

Such as:

Image-1.png


Nobody is being sent to Birkenau, or anything like Birkenau.

I don't know anything about Starnes, and I have no desire to defend him (or berate him) in general, but he didn't pull it out of thin air.
 
Manc Skipper said:
Not gassing children is a rather low standard to set for a President. Or any normal person, really. It's certainly nothing to brag about.
Click to expand...

That there is the post of the day
 
ttwtt78640 said:
Yep, this was clearly an outrageously biased rebuttal:



If those who violate US immigration laws are simply undocumented immigrants then are those that drive on US highways without a license, registration and/or insurance simply undocumented drivers?

Xelor said:
Oh. Why didn't Trump just lead with that last week? Well, that makes all the difference in the world. Nihil obstat then....:roll:

ttwtt78640 said:
Should undocumented driving be ignored only so long as children are present in the vehicle or can everyone drive undocumented without any legal consequences? What you seem to ignore are that legal penalties for undocumented driving are not being protested yet the legal penalties for undocumented immigration are being protested.
Click to expand...
Click to expand...
Click to expand...
  1. Red --> By all means, the cop can write the ticket while the child and parent/guardian remain together in the vehicle. Indeed, that tends to be what cops do when writing tickets for traffic infractions.
  2. Pink:
    • What you are ignoring is that driving w/out a licence and/or registration isn't a federal offense, except perhaps when one happens to do it in a national park, military base, or on a parkway. It is, however, without question in certain parts of the District of Columbia, to drive while unlicensed or drive an unregistered vehicle.
    • What you have failed to present is any credible quantitative evidence that parents and children are preponderantly and summarily separated in the wake of violating laws re: licenses and registrations.
  3. Tan:
    • I don't know that there are protests about the penalties for being an undocumented immigrant.
      • People are protesting that undocumented immigrants' who request asylum are having their children separated from them.
      • People are complaining that the Trump Admin is separating children from their asylum seeking parents and so perfunctorily keeping records of what children belong to what parents that reunifying the parents with their children is a procedurally difficult and protracted thing to achieve.
      • People are complaining about the modality of immigration law application under the Trump Admin, not about the existential application of immigration law.
    • I do know that you and others like you have used equivocation and/or oversimplification -- the latter being expected since Trump and most Trumpkins are simpletons -- to cast the nature of the protests as something they're not.
 
ttwtt78640 said:
Yep, this was clearly an outrageously biased rebuttal:



If those who violate US immigration laws are simply undocumented immigrants then are those that drive on US highways without a license, registration and/or insurance simply undocumented drivers?
Click to expand...

I think the hyperbole turns off people that aren't already Pro-Trump or anti-Trump. The separation of children from their parents was a real issue and the rage was real. I don't think calling detention of immigrants concentration camps and likening it provides any benefit other than a lot of "die commie" by Trumpers, "die fascists" by people on the left, and tuning out by everyone else.

But!

There are some very disturbing trends. Trump associates immigrants with gangs and calls them an infestation. That dehumanizing language is scary. When people stop seeing them as people fleeing very violent countries and instead violent animals taking over our country a lot of things unacceptable becomes acceptable. Human empathy gets shut off. A lot of bad things have happened in history when that type of rhetoric is used. It festers, multiplies, and bounces around in the rightwing blogosphere until you end up with people supporting detestable policies.

There's some very concerning things happening under this President. From day one his platform has been the worst of rightwing populism. The hate of the left (trig the libs!) and racism/nativism. Yeah, trump isn't gassing people but he sure doesn't seem to empathize with them or treat them like human beings.
 
Xelor said:
  1. Red --> By all means, the cop can write the ticket while the child and parent/guardian remain together in the vehicle. Indeed, that tends to be what cops do when writing tickets for traffic infractions.
  2. Pink:
    • What you are ignoring is that driving w/out a licence and/or registration isn't a federal offense, except perhaps when one happens to do it in a national park, military base, or on a parkway. It is, however, without question in certain parts of the District of Columbia, to drive while unlicensed or drive an unregistered vehicle.
    • What you have failed to present is any credible quantitative evidence that parents and children are preponderantly and summarily separated in the wake of violating laws re: licenses and registrations.
  3. Tan:
    • I don't know that there are protests about the penalties for being an undocumented immigrant.
      • People are protesting that undocumented immigrants' who request asylum are having their children separated from them.
      • People are complaining that the Trump Admin is separating children from their asylum seeking parents and so perfunctorily keeping records of what children belong to what parents that reunifying the parents with their children is a procedurally difficult and protracted thing to achieve.
      • People are complaining about the modality of immigration law application under the Trump Admin, not about the existential application of immigration law.
    • I do know that you and others like you have used equivocation and/or oversimplification -- the latter being expected since Trump and most Trumpkins are simpletons -- to cast the nature of the protests as something they're not.
Click to expand...

Indeed, there are differences between laws including the penalties for violating them and the jurisdictions responsible for their enforcement. The point was that separation of parent and child is quite common when the parent is incarcerated for a criminal offense.

The root cause of the problem with federal immigration law enforcement is the congressional lack of adequate funding/resources. Despite Trump's stated desire to enforce the immigration laws fully, equally and fairly he, as past presidents, are forced to face the reality - that is mission impossible with the given funding/resources and most resign themselves to the fact that only a subset of violators can be detected and among that group only a subset of them can be successfully prosecuted, removed or deported.
 
Last edited:
SMTA said:
Yea, Trump is not Hitler......yet.
Click to expand...

People have been saying that since before the election. When will it begin?
 
That should be Trump’s slogan in the next election. “At least I don’t gas children”.
 
Skeptic Bob said:
That should be Trump’s slogan in the next election. “At least I don’t gas children”.
Click to expand...

Not sure what people find funny about the holocaust. Well it was mostly only Jooos anyway I guess.
 
iliveonramen said:
I think the hyperbole turns off people that aren't already Pro-Trump or anti-Trump. The separation of children from their parents was a real issue and the rage was real. I don't think calling detention of immigrants concentration camps and likening it provides any benefit other than a lot of "die commie" by Trumpers, "die fascists" by people on the left, and tuning out by everyone else.

But!

There are some very disturbing trends. Trump associates immigrants with gangs and calls them an infestation. That dehumanizing language is scary. When people stop seeing them as people fleeing very violent countries and instead violent animals taking over our country a lot of things unacceptable becomes acceptable. Human empathy gets shut off. A lot of bad things have happened in history when that type of rhetoric is used. It festers, multiplies, and bounces around in the rightwing blogosphere until you end up with people supporting detestable policies.

There's some very concerning things happening under this President. From day one his platform has been the worst of rightwing populism. The hate of the left (trig the libs!) and racism/nativism. Yeah, trump isn't gassing people but he sure doesn't seem to empathize with them or treat them like human beings.
Click to expand...

I agree fully that dehumanizing folks is a hateful tactic but what else can you call equating Trump immigration policy with Nazism or racism? What is the only appropriate and just reaction to Nazism or official racism? It is surely not engaging in a reasonable policy debate. Once you switch from discussing policy differences and simply resort to labeling those that enact policies that you disagree with as being inhuman (Nazis or racists) then it is no longer time for mere discussion.
 
Skeptic Bob said:
That should be Trump’s slogan in the next election. “At least I don’t gas children”.
Click to expand...

You’re close, Bob. Trump’s next election slogan should be, “I don’t gas children, I just terrorize and traumatiz their minds.”
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top Bottom