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Atheists, lets get real

if its man made nothing since the god would not exist if its real it would be hiding that it exists and everything about itself
Hiding that it exists?

You heard of Moses عليه السلام? Yes.

You heard of Jesus عليه السلام? Yes.

You heard of Muhammed صلى الله عليه وسلم? Yes.

So this excuse you made will not protect you on the Day of Judgment and your own body will witness against you.
 
Well, then how come the Bible says it is — the Bible is, according to you, the word of God and you don't believe these words in the Bible?

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bible says what?
 
if its man made nothing since the god would not exist if its real it would be hiding that it exists and everything about itself

He didnt hide anything, he told his people everything
 
no those kinds of gods are not disproved by a lack of communication ( not supported of course ) since they dont have the power or knowledge or desire to strike up a conversation

how do you know that?
 
It debunks a god who really cares about getting his message out clearly.

no it doesnt

theres no difference by God telling people directly and telling prophets to write down his word
 
bible says what?
That God created the earth before the sun.

Genesis 1:9-10 (The Third Day)
Then God said, "Let the waters below the heavens be gathered into one place, and let the dry land appear"; and it was so. God called the dry land earth, and the gathering of the waters He called seas; and God saw that it was good.

Genesis 1:16-18 (The Fourth Day)
God made the two great lights, the greater light to govern the day, and the lesser light to govern the night; He made the stars also. God placed them in the expanse of the heavens to give light on the earth, and to govern the day and the night, and to separate the light from the darkness; and God saw that it was good.

According to the bible, God created earth before our sun. How would you justify that? That sounds illogical.

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That God created the earth before the sun.



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apologetics time!

Did God Create Light Before the Sun? - Life, Hope & Truth

However, other biblical evidence suggests a different explanation for the light on the earth between Day 1 and Day 4 of the creation week: God could have created the sun and other heavenly bodies before Day 4, but “set them in the firmament of the heavens to give light on the earth” (Genesis 1:17) on Day 4 itself.

Proverbs 8 provides hints to this effect. This section of Scripture gives a parallel account of creation from a different viewpoint—that of Wisdom personified. After explaining in verse 23 that she was with God “from the beginning, before there was ever an earth,” Wisdom describes the establishment of clouds and fountains and limits for the sea in verses 28-29:

“When He established the clouds above, when He strengthened the fountains of the deep, when He assigned to the sea its limit, so that the waters would not transgress His command, when He marked out the foundations of the earth.”
 
Believe if you want to believe. Doesn't matter to me either way

But if your god lets these terrible things happen to innocent little children when all he has to do is lift a finger to stop it I have no use for him.

Don't give me that free choice garbage. Those starving little children have no choice.

God cares about us? Don't try to feed me that garbage.

There is no Christian caring god

Now we could be an alien experiment gone bad. That makes more sense.
 
Believe if you want to believe. Doesn't matter to me either way

But if your god lets these terrible things happen to innocent little children when all he has to do is lift a finger to stop it I have no use for him.

Don't give me that free choice garbage. Those starving little children have no choice.

God cares about us? Don't try to feed me that garbage.

There is no Christian caring god

Now we could be an alien experiment gone bad. That makes more sense.

Or you could look at the issue sensibly and logically, the way God does...with a goal in mind to solve the problem once and for all time...

Imagine that a teacher is telling his students how to solve a difficult problem. A clever but rebellious student claims that the teacher’s way of solving the problem is wrong. Implying that the teacher is not capable, this rebel insists that he knows a much better way to solve the problem. Some students think that he is right, and they also become rebellious. What should the teacher do? If he throws the rebels out of the class, what will be the effect on the other students? Will they not believe that their fellow student and those who joined him are right? All the other students in the class might lose respect for the teacher, thinking that he is afraid of being proved wrong. But suppose that the teacher allows the rebel to show the class how he would solve the problem.

Jehovah has done something similar to what the teacher does. Remember that the rebels in Eden were not the only ones involved. Millions of angels were watching. (Job 38:7; Daniel 7:10) How Jehovah handled the rebellion would greatly affect all those angels and eventually all intelligent creation. So, what has Jehovah done? He has allowed Satan to show how he would rule mankind. God has also allowed humans to govern themselves under Satan’s guidance.

The teacher in our illustration knows that the rebel and the students on his side are wrong. But he also knows that allowing them the opportunity to try to prove their point will benefit the whole class. When the rebels fail, all honest students will see that the teacher is the only one qualified to lead the class. They will understand why the teacher thereafter removes any rebels from the class. Similarly, Jehovah knows that all honesthearted humans and angels will benefit from seeing that Satan and his fellow rebels have failed and that humans cannot govern themselves. Like Jeremiah of old, they will learn this vital truth: “I well know, O Jehovah, that man’s way does not belong to him. It does not belong to man who is walking even to direct his step.”​—Jeremiah 10:23.

Why Does God Allow Suffering? — Watchtower ONLINE LIBRARY
 
no it doesnt

theres no difference by God telling people directly and telling prophets to write down his word
Do you accept then the Book of Mormon given by God to the Prophet Joseph Smith? Or the Koran given by God to Muhammad?

No? Then we have established that just because someone claims they are conveying the word of God, does not mean they are.

The point is though, that if a god did exist, there would be no reason for it to rely on prophets rather than directly communicating with each individual. It would be far more efficient and clear.

But if there are no gods, then such direct communication obviously wouldn’t occur, but people could falsely claim they received communication from a god. And we know people have made such false claims because not all the claims can be true. But they can all be false. So how, other than personal prejudice and comparing to what we already believe can we determine whether or not any particular claim is true?

In other words you can’t reject one claim because it conflicts with a claim you already believe without first establishing that the pre-existing claim is true.
 
Even assuming the attributed authorship of the synoptic gospels, did Matthew, Mark, Luke or John personally see and hear the events that occurred when Mary Magdalene visited the tomb? No. Then we do not have eyewitness accounts. We have second or third hand retellings at best.

And since all four accounts are different, we know that at least 3 are not accurate renditions of eyewitness accounts.

If you were a juror in a criminal case and were presented with four witness who did not see the crime take place but heard about it later from people who said they were there, and each of the four gives a different version of what the actual eyewitnesses saw, would you really consider that to be eyewitness testimony? Not a single judge would.

And speaking of evidence.. what is yours that the gospel authors “investigated everything and consulted with eyewitnesses,?” You don’t know that. The gospels don’t even claim that.

The empty Tomb in John:

20 Early on the first day of the week, while it was still dark, Mary Magdalene went to the tomb and saw that the stone had been removed from the entrance. 2 So she came running to Simon Peter and the other disciple, the one Jesus loved, and said, “They have taken the Lord out of the tomb, and we don’t know where they have put him!”

3 So Peter and the other disciple started for the tomb. 4 Both were running, but the other disciple outran Peter and reached the tomb first. 5 He bent over and looked in at the strips of linen lying there but did not go in. 6 Then Simon Peter came along behind him and went straight into the tomb. He saw the strips of linen lying there, 7 as well as the cloth that had been wrapped around Jesus’ head. The cloth was still lying in its place, separate from the linen. 8 Finally the other disciple, who had reached the tomb first, also went inside. He saw and believed.

Luke 1:1-4 has the following:

“Many have undertaken to draw up an account of the things that have been fulfilled among us, just as they were handed down to us by those who from the first were eyewitnesses and servants of the word. Therefore, since I myself have carefully investigated everything from the beginning, it seemed good also to me to write an orderly account for you, most excellent Theophilus, so that you may know the certainty of the things you have been taught.”

And where do you dedicated and revisionist Christ-deniers get off with your anti-resurrection nonsense anyway?

Did you not know that Jesus is risen in all four Gospels??

The angel said to the women, “Do not be afraid, for I know that you are looking for Jesus, who was crucified. He is not here; he has risen, just as he said. - Matthew 28:5-6

Don’t be alarmed,” he said. “You are looking for Jesus the Nazarene, who was crucified. He has risen! He is not here. - Mark 16:6

...but the men said to them, “Why do you look for the living among the dead? He is not here; he has risen! - Luke 24:5-6

At this, she turned around and saw Jesus standing there, but she did not realize that it was Jesus. 15 He asked her, “Woman, why are you crying? Who is it you are looking for?” Thinking he was the gardener, she said, “Sir, if you have carried him away, tell me where you have put him, and I will get him.” 16 Jesus said to her, “Mary.” - John 20:14-16

John 20: Jesus Appears to His Disciples

19 On the evening of that first day of the week, when the disciples were together, with the doors locked for fear of the Jewish leaders, Jesus came and stood among them and said, “Peace be with you!” 20 After he said this, he showed them his hands and side. The disciples were overjoyed when they saw the Lord.

What's more, the earliest mention of the resurrection of Jesus was an oral creed, not a Biblical verse. And you don't have to like that one either!!

Earliest Mention of the Resurrection of Jesus Christ << The Righter Report

Jesus is Risen Indeed!!!
 
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While the right wing 'fundy' groups say that they were eye witnesses, the evidence is very strong they were not. There is no real reason to accept the traditional attributions of the authors of those gospels

There's absolutely no reason to believe you have the first clue what you're talking about. You have a history of nonsense and lying postings.
 
There's absolutely no reason to believe you have the first clue what you're talking about. You have a history of nonsense and lying postings.

Except, of course, i have given scholarly sources, and the only counter to those sources was far right sources that assume the Bible is inerrant.
 
The empty Tomb in John:

20 Early on the first day of the week, while it was still dark, Mary Magdalene went to the tomb and saw that the stone had been removed from the entrance. 2 So she came running to Simon Peter and the other disciple, the one Jesus loved, and said, “They have taken the Lord out of the tomb, and we don’t know where they have put him!”

3 So Peter and the other disciple started for the tomb. 4 Both were running, but the other disciple outran Peter and reached the tomb first. 5 He bent over and looked in at the strips of linen lying there but did not go in. 6 Then Simon Peter came along behind him and went straight into the tomb. He saw the strips of linen lying there, 7 as well as the cloth that had been wrapped around Jesus’ head. The cloth was still lying in its place, separate from the linen. 8 Finally the other disciple, who had reached the tomb first, also went inside. He saw and believed.

Luke 1:1-4 has the following:

“Many have undertaken to draw up an account of the things that have been fulfilled among us, just as they were handed down to us by those who from the first were eyewitnesses and servants of the word. Therefore, since I myself have carefully investigated everything from the beginning, it seemed good also to me to write an orderly account for you, most excellent Theophilus, so that you may know the certainty of the things you have been taught.”

And where do you dedicated and revisionist Christ-deniers get off with your anti-resurrection nonsense anyway?

Did you not know that Jesus is risen in all four Gospels??

The angel said to the women, “Do not be afraid, for I know that you are looking for Jesus, who was crucified. He is not here; he has risen, just as he said. - Matthew 28:5-6

Don’t be alarmed,” he said. “You are looking for Jesus the Nazarene, who was crucified. He has risen! He is not here. - Mark 16:6

...but the men said to them, “Why do you look for the living among the dead? He is not here; he has risen! - Luke 24:5-6

At this, she turned around and saw Jesus standing there, but she did not realize that it was Jesus. 15 He asked her, “Woman, why are you crying? Who is it you are looking for?” Thinking he was the gardener, she said, “Sir, if you have carried him away, tell me where you have put him, and I will get him.” 16 Jesus said to her, “Mary.” - John 20:14-16

John 20: Jesus Appears to His Disciples

19 On the evening of that first day of the week, when the disciples were together, with the doors locked for fear of the Jewish leaders, Jesus came and stood among them and said, “Peace be with you!” 20 After he said this, he showed them his hands and side. The disciples were overjoyed when they saw the Lord.

What's more, the earliest mention of the resurrection of Jesus was an oral creed, not a Biblical verse. And you don't have to like that one either!!

Earliest Mention of the Resurrection of Jesus Christ << The Righter Report

Jesus is Risen Indeed!!!
So you agree that the accounts of what happened at the tomb are not identical and were not eyewitness accounts.

And note that John says Jesus first appeared to Mary inside the tomb, Matthew says to the women after they left the tomb, Luke says to Cleopas and another disciple, and 1 Corinthians says to Peter. At least three of those are false.

But somehow you want to ignore all the inconsistencies and focus only on the fact that they all say Jesus was resurrected.
And you accused me of bias? And of course no account saying he wasn’t resurrected would have been accepted. And when the Romans did produce an “Acts of Oilate” (propaganda to refute the Christian stories), Christians produced their own Acts of Pilate (incorporated into the Gospel of Nicodemus) to rebut. So we know that early Christians did produce false “scripture” to support their claims (Mary, Peter, Gospel of the Hebrews, Infancy Gospel of Thomas, Arabic Infancy Gospel, etc).
 
No it doesn't. For a disbelieving folk, you people have a ton of presumptions about God.

You speak like: "there can be no god because He hasn't shown Himself to me."

What you would be saying (in the above example) is that, "God, if He existed, would have to show Himself to me. That would be His intention." and to say that about something you deny exists in the first place is foolish.

At the very least you could, for arguments sake, accept the scriptures as a basis for what God is. If you say, "There is no biblical God because...." and then say something that contradicts the Bible, about the biblical God, you're talking nonsense.

If there is a god this god does not communicate one clear message directly to everyone. That is a fact.
 
no it doesnt

theres no difference by God telling people directly and telling prophets to write down his word

There is a huge difference. It is called human error. God communicating directly right now is more accurate than translations of ancient texts.
 
Hiding that it exists?

You heard of Moses عليه السلام? Yes.

You heard of Jesus عليه السلام? Yes.

You heard of Muhammed صلى الله عليه وسلم? Yes.

So this excuse you made will not protect you on the Day of Judgment and your own body will witness against you.

i have and no god has told me it has anything to do with any of them

means while an all powerful all knowing being would have no use of them to talk to any one else in the 1st place
 
rainbows were created by God

no god has claimed that humans have claimed a god created them after it flooded the entire planet except for a guys family and a boat and some animals which is bull****
 
So you agree that the accounts of what happened at the tomb are not identical and were not eyewitness accounts.

And note that John says Jesus first appeared to Mary inside the tomb, Matthew says to the women after they left the tomb, Luke says to Cleopas and another disciple, and 1 Corinthians says to Peter. At least three of those are false.

But somehow you want to ignore all the inconsistencies and focus only on the fact that they all say Jesus was resurrected.
And you accused me of bias? And of course no account saying he wasn’t resurrected would have been accepted. And when the Romans did produce an “Acts of Oilate” (propaganda to refute the Christian stories), Christians produced their own Acts of Pilate (incorporated into the Gospel of Nicodemus) to rebut. So we know that early Christians did produce false “scripture” to support their claims (Mary, Peter, Gospel of the Hebrews, Infancy Gospel of Thomas, Arabic Infancy Gospel, etc).

You do realize the accounts you mention are speaking of different times...Jesus’ encounter with Mary Magdalene...his appearing twice to his apostles and at the 2nd time when Thomas was present and was convinced...John also tells of Jesus’ appearance at the sea of Galilee, on which occasion he asked Peter three times whether he loved him or not...John 21:1-24...
 
how do you know that?

because if i have not spoken to you then its either because i cant do it even if i wanted to i dont know to do it even if i would want to or i dont want to or some combination of those 3 and that holds for every one else
 
no it doesnt

theres no difference by God telling people directly and telling prophets to write down his word

yes their is people writing down words may not have anything to do with a god at all


its like saying theirs no difference between you posting on hear and any of us saying we are just passing along private messages from you
 
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