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Atheists Believe In Miracles!

tosca1 said:
Let's straighten out something here:
Atheists are somewhat so confused. They mock believers of Creationists, and yet they don't realize that it's like the pot calling the kettle black.
Let it be out of the closet! Atheists believe in miracles! Like.........the miracle of EVOLUTION!
Click to expand...

If this is a serious question fix the word Creationists.
 
tosca1 said:
I'm talking about the evolution of the universe! The beginning! The Origin!


here, I just gave an explanation at the other thread.
Miracles are related to the supernatural, right? They are extraordinary events that came from the supernatural (GOD).


Let me re-post it here since it is about the same thing I'm pointing out. It's about the energy for Quantum Fluctuation:






Cosmological Argument - Discussion




So, there you go!

Even with your so-called quantum fluctuations - it still ends up with the SUPERNATURAL!


THUS, we come full circle, eh?

ATHEISTS BELIEVE IN MIRACLES!
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The word evolution means a specific thing. That it is often misued to mean development is unfortunate.

If you wish to talk strictly about the origin of the universe, what caused it all, then I cannot answer other than to say I don't know.

I can show you clear evidence of how the universe has developed, generally, over the last twelve and a half billion years. How the galaxies were far closer together and smaller and how they are slowly combining in a universe that is expanding. But the stuff before that I don't know.

I could link some Utube videos about it with scientists telling us what they know. It is all over my head though and since I have some physics education and you don't I think you will not get it.

I also know that those scientists don't know what happened at the very start of the universe. The time after the first second is all worked out but the very first moment is not known.

Can you cope with the idea of something being unknown?
 
weaver2 said:
If this is a serious question fix the word Creationists.
Click to expand...
:roll:



What question are you on about? There is no question.


Here: read it again:



Let it be out of the closet!

Atheists believe in miracles!

Like.........the miracle of EVOLUTION!





I didn't ask a question!

I made a STATEMENT!
 
Tim the plumber said:
The word evolution means a specific thing. That it is often misued to mean development is unfortunate.

If you wish to talk strictly about the origin of the universe, what caused it all, then I cannot answer other than to say I don't know.

I can show you clear evidence of how the universe has developed, generally, over the last twelve and a half billion years. How the galaxies were far closer together and smaller and how they are slowly combining in a universe that is expanding. But the stuff before that I don't know.

I could link some Utube videos about it with scientists telling us what they know. It is all over my head though and since I have some physics education and you don't I think you will not get it.

I also know that those scientists don't know what happened at the very start of the universe. The time after the first second is all worked out but the very first moment is not known.

Can you cope with the idea of something being unknown?
Click to expand...

Lol.

You're wrong. Evolution began at the very beginning! It had to! IF you understand it at all!



What?
You're saying too that the universe as we know it now - including everything on earth - just pop out in instant?

Lol. I believe in miracles - but I don't believe in that kind of miracle you're talking about! :mrgreen:




What you call, "development of the universe," is, EVOLUTION!



Here is an illustration:



Timeline of the Big Bang Theory

Working backwards from the current state of the Universe, scientists have theorized that it must have originated at a single point of infinite density and finite time that began to expand.
After the initial expansion, the theory maintains that Universe cooled sufficiently to allow the formation of subatomic particles, and later simple atoms.

Giant clouds of these primordial elements later coalesced through gravity to form stars and galaxies.
Click to expand...
Big Bang Theory: Evolution of Our Universe - Universe Today
 
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tosca1 said:
Lol.

You're wrong. Evolution began at the very beginning! It had to! IF you understand it at all!



What?
You're saying too that the universe as we know it now - including everything on earth - just pop out in instant?

Lol. I believe in miracles - but I don't believe in that kind of miracle you're talking about! :mrgreen:




What you call, "development of the universe," is, EVOLUTION!



Here is an illustration:




Big Bang Theory: Evolution of Our Universe - Universe Today
Click to expand...

Timeline of the Big Bang Theory

Working backwards from the current state of the Universe, scientists have theorized that it must have originated at a single point of infinite density and finite time that began to expand.
After the initial expansion, the theory maintains that Universe cooled sufficiently to allow the formation of subatomic particles, and later simple atoms.

Giant clouds of these primordial elements later coalesced through gravity to form stars and galaxies.
Click to expand...

The quote does not use the word evolution.

Evolution is a process where a single pattern (life form) is repaeted (breeds) and then a selection process selects a few of the new ones to do the same again with. The inevitable mystakes in this process will result in a change in the pattern. The selection criteria will drive the way this goes.

That the word evolution is used badly, like it is done in the web page title, does not change this.

But that we don't know what started the universe is the real point. I don't know. Neither do you.
 
Rumpel said:
That's what I have been saying for ages!


Post an argument, not a video!
Click to expand...

Some people don't like to argue...music...the universal language...:2razz:

 
Tim the plumber said:
The quote does not use the word evolution.

Evolution is a process where a single pattern (life form) is repaeted (breeds) and then a selection process selects a few of the new ones to do the same again with. The inevitable mystakes in this process will result in a change in the pattern. The selection criteria will drive the way this goes.

That the word evolution is used badly, like it is done in the web page title, does not change this.

But that we don't know what started the universe is the real point. I don't know. Neither do you.
Click to expand...


Science says it's the BIG BANG!


I know you won't believe that coming from me.....

......but, surely, you'll believe Stephen Hawking?




The conclusion of this lecture is that the universe has not existed forever.

Rather, the universe, and time itself, had a beginning in the Big Bang, about 15 billion years ago.
Click to expand...
The Beginning of TIme - Stephen Hawking
 
tosca1 said:
Science says it's the BIG BANG!


I know you won't believe that coming from me.....

......but, surely, you'll believe Stephen Hawking?





The Beginning of TIme - Stephen Hawking
Click to expand...

So you are unwilling to look at the detail of evidence to see what they are talking about and just want to shout that you don't believe it. Ok, enjoy.
 
Tim the plumber said:
So you are unwilling to look at the detail of evidence to see what they are talking about and just want to shout that you don't believe it. Ok, enjoy.
Click to expand...

EH? You're talking about yourself? :mrgreen:


I'm citing one of your many gurus. That must've stumped you, eh?

Hahahahahaha
 
tosca1 said:
Let's straighten out something here:


Atheists are somewhat so confused. They mock believers of Creationists, and yet they don't realize that it's like the pot calling the kettle black.



Let it be out of the closet! Atheists believe in miracles! Like.........the miracle of EVOLUTION!














Click to expand...


Evolution is not exactly a "miracle." It's just fact, a simple boring fact.
 
Billions of theists also believe in evolution.
 
TheGoverness said:
Post an argument, not a video.

Evolution is not a "miracle". It's an incredibly detailed process. Miracles are stuff like turning water into wine, of which there's no evidence for. There's overwhelming evidence to support to scientific theory of evolution, which is why it's not in contention by scientists, or anyone that's taken an objective look at the data.
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You have to remember, she's using Craig as a source. Craig is more a theologian than a philosopher, and neither disciple prepares someone to be able to examine scientific information. He knows the words, but he does not understand the principles behind the words. He doesn't have to, because his motivation is to sell snake oil to the naive to help boost their faith. He is not worried about scientific accuracy. His motivation is different , purpose and audience are different that someone who is interested in scientific accuracy.
 
RAMOSS said:
You have to remember, she's using Craig as a source. Craig is more a theologian than a philosopher, and neither disciple prepares someone to be able to examine scientific information. He knows the words, but he does not understand the principles behind the words. He doesn't have to, because his motivation is to sell snake oil to the naive to help boost their faith. He is not worried about scientific accuracy. His motivation is different , purpose and audience are different that someone who is interested in scientific accuracy.
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William Lane Craig works for Houston Baptist University. He is required as terms of employment to believe in Jesus.

https://www.hbu.edu/publications/EmployeeHandbook/archive/Employee_Handbook_2013-08.pdf
it is resolved that all those who become associated with Houston Baptist University as a trustee, officer, member of the faculty or of the staff, and who perform work connected with the educational activities of the University, must believe in the divine inspiration of the Bible, both the Old Testament and New Testament, that man was directly created by God, the virgin birth of Jesus Christ, our Lord and Savior, as the Son of God, that He died for the sins of all men and thereafter arose from the grave, that by repentance and the acceptance of and belief in Him, by the grace of God, the individual is saved from eternal damnation and receives eternal life in the presence of God;


How could anyone who is serious about academic freedom and honesty work for an institution which not only requires you to believe in the existence of storybook characters as a term of employment, but also that anyone who doesn't agree with you is going to be tortured for all eternity?
 
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tosca1 said:
Let's straighten out something here:


Atheists are somewhat so confused. They mock believers of Creationists, and yet they don't realize that it's like the pot calling the kettle black.



Let it be out of the closet! Atheists believe in miracles! Like.........the miracle of EVOLUTION!














Click to expand...


Actually William Lane Craig has never come out against the theory of evolution so I don't see how he is being used to ague against it. Most of the stuff he talks about is about the cosmological argument. Like since the universe had a beginning, God must have made it.
 
tosca1 said:
Science says it's the BIG BANG!
I know you won't believe that coming from me.....

......but, surely, you'll believe Stephen Hawking?

The Beginning of TIme - Stephen Hawking
Click to expand...

From your link:

Since events before the Big Bang have no observational consequences, one may as well cut them out of the theory, and say that time began at the Big Bang. Events before the Big Bang, are simply not defined

Hawking, in your link, says the actions and existence of any being before the Big Bang is undefined. :lamo


Tim the plumber said:
So you are unwilling to look at the detail of evidence to see what they are talking about and just want to shout that you don't believe it. Ok, enjoy.
Click to expand...

You nailed it. Want a good laugh? See above.
 
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tosca1 said:
:roll:



What question are you on about? There is no question.


Here: read it again:



Let it be out of the closet!

Atheists believe in miracles!

Like.........the miracle of EVOLUTION!





I didn't ask a question!

I made a STATEMENT!
Click to expand...

The biggest and most profound statement, giving yo away, you are not ever aware of.

Shouting, does not make you right,
In fact it is an admission you are wrong, but trying to overpower the competition,
Because you cannot do it with actual facts and logic.
 
tosca1 said:
Let's straighten out something here:


Atheists are somewhat so confused. They mock believers of Creationists, and yet they don't realize that it's like the pot calling the kettle black.



Let it be out of the closet! Atheists believe in miracles! Like.........the miracle of EVOLUTION!














Click to expand...


It makes far more sense to believe that a deity plopped down a man ad a woman and cast them out of paradise to live lives of struggle, heartache and death as a test to see if they can buy into a bible story and if they don't, the deity will eternally torture them.
 
tosca1 said:
Let's straighten out something here:


Atheists are somewhat so confused. They mock believers of Creationists, and yet they don't realize that it's like the pot calling the kettle black.



Let it be out of the closet! Atheists believe in miracles! Like.........the miracle of EVOLUTION!














Click to expand...


Mutations aren't supernatural.


OM
 
Since evolution is harsh, driven by death, thereby leading to the extinction of 99.99999% of every species that ever lived so that less than 1 in 10 million survive to carry on their genes, it’s hardly a freaking miracle.
 
Yasureoktoo said:
The biggest and most profound statement, giving yo away, you are not ever aware of.

Shouting, does not make you right,
In fact it is an admission you are wrong, but trying to overpower the competition,
Because you cannot do it with actual facts and logic.
Click to expand...


Duh?

You latched on to my alleged "shouting" instead of addressing the reasons why I say atheists believe in miracles. Hmmmm.

Let me guess -


You didn't understand the OP, didn't you? The arguments went by......... waaaaaay above your head?
 
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